Raps trying to trade us Lowry...

[K_ick_God]

very happy.
When I first heard they wanted to trade Lowry I was happy, I mean how much would they want for an expiring player that they didn't want anyway?
Now that I know the answer, I'm happy they nixed this deal.
a young talent on a rookie contract, a backup point gaurd on an excellent deal, and a 1st round pick is way too much for 2/3 of a season of kyle lowry.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baske ... z2nKlw4rRq

" According to a source familiar with the talks, Dolan had second thoughts about trading for Lowry and was also — what else? — enraged that details of the proposed deal had been leaked to the media.

According to several reports, the Knicks were prepared to trade Raymond Felton and Metta World Peace plus Iman Shumpert or Tim Hardaway Jr. or a 2018 first-round pick. The Raptors preferred the first-round pick, but Dolan — who negotiated the Carmelo Anthony trade with Raptors GM Masai Ujiri when Ujiri was with the Denver Nuggets — got cold feet about trading a future asset"

Article doesn't say that though. Says ONE of those young assets or the pick. Uses OR in that sentence -- Wojina had the proposed deal right.


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[mamadontcry]

The problem with Lowry isn’t that he’s a bad player, because he’s not. Unfortunately, he’s also not a really good one, either. He does play with a chip on his shoulder, but that comes with both positives and negatives, and those negatives are often too much to bare. His decision making, especially when times get tough, is often poor, and he is far too willing to get into a shooting match when the smart thing to do is get the ball inside.

The best point guards are generally smart, calm under fire and mature beyond their years, and none of that describes Lowry. A tough point guard oozing with attitude and with always something to prove might be entertaining for the fans, but that rarely translates into winning.

simple concept but our trio has no clue how to do it.

rudy deserves to spend the rest of his career playing in china.
demar is doing his best rudy impression without the defense or rebounding.
and lowry is doing his best raymond felton impression.
- See more at: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=1287519#sthash.xk2Q7pDc.dpuf

agree with the OP's diagnosis. Lowry is very unsure of his passing ability, especially passing forward. He's a poor pick and roll PG, one of the worst I have ever seen. Last night, he bounced a pass to a rolling Jonas but the pass was slow and late, and the play busted. However, Lowry yelled and gestured angrily at Jonas, when as I saw it, the pass was bad. Lowry should be a high end backup on a contender, a role in which he'd be perfect. On a developing team, he's a bad influence, and on a Casey developing team where there is too little offensive structure, he's downright counter-productive at times. - See more at: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=1287274#sthash.hc8IHdDg.dpuf

KL is not a good PG against set defences, not at all. I agree that he's not an accurate lead passer, particularly while on the move, and his entry passes aren't great. I wonder if he can see over the D. He needs to be used like a 3rd option, to have the ball kicked and reversed to him or to attack on the secondary break. He's good at making good, aggressive, quick decisions against scrambling Ds but he's the wrong guard for us because we rarely break, period (except, of course, when Rudy goes coast to almost coast), we don't have a pivot to play through (yet) and we don't have a wing to run PnR. - See more at: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=1287274&start=15#sthash.gCoAU30f.dpuf

It hit him sometime this summer, when he was finally healthy and relaxed and away from the grind of a disastrous NBA season.
Kyle Lowry came to understand just how bad his first season with the Raptors was, how he might have let down his teammates, his coaches and himself and he’s going into this season promising better things.
“It was a disappointment in general, in everything,” the veteran point guard said of his first season in Toronto. “My play, my body, just everything. It was just a bad year for me.Lowry’s 2012-13 season was a disappointment from start to finish. He got banged up in training camp and that set him back; he got out of shape and never got truly fit; he was trying to figure out a new coach and it didn’t work.It was at times abysmal, at times frustrating to teammates and left coaches scratching their heads. http://www.thestar.com/sports/raptors/2 ... ronto.html

not the first time

I think Thibs never wanted Lowry anyway.

Lowry has a huge ego, hero-ball tendencies at the wrong moments (late game), doesn't always listen to the coach (ie. Last year with Casey for a majority of the season, and with the rockets) - all that doesn't fly with Thibs. - See more at: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=1289557#sthash.mGLNhFVE.dpuf

So wasn't all Bargnani fault at the end in Craptorsland

[Sark]

Lowry is overrated. Do not want.

Would rather just fire Woodson before making a deal for new pieces.

[K_ick_God]

Pretty much a certainty that Knicks would match Lin if they could do it all over. Some of us knew they'd regret it while it was happening.


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[Anotha Knicks fan]

whew

Dolan nixes deal

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baske ... -1.1546553

Knicks brass met following Wednesday’s win over Chicago and had decided to move forward with the deal, but by early Thursday afternoon, Dolan suddenly had second thoughts.
“There are two problems,” the source said. “Dolan didn’t like that someone from his group leaked it to the media, and the other problem is the Knicks seem to have too many (people)involved with making decisions.”

Several things to take from this... One, this is possibly the first time that I can actually rejoice over a decision James Dolan has overlorded. If the trade was as reported and included too many of our assets (a future first, or Shump, or THJ) then it was overpaying for a piece that wasn't going to put us over in the first place.

Two, it's a step in the right direction that they are acknowledging we have a problem at point, and need to fix it. (at least one of the very many problems)

Three, Um... So this was ok'ed? Mills is not earning a vote of confidence from me if he spearheaded, and accepted to these terms.

Finally, although it is speculation on the author's point, I really hope that they are noticing the bolded part. We really need to clear house out there, and start fresh. We've got a lot of holdovers from past eras, and need fresh perspective.

[K_ick_God]

^But we don't know what protections were on the pick if there were some. Protections never get reported accurately -- sometimes not even after the trade is official.


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[Im Coming Home]

Good sign.. we aren't giving Shump up for just anyone.. I'm happy.

The New York Knicks are pursuing Toronto point guard Kyle Lowry with a package of Raymond Felton, Metta World Peace and a 2018 first-round draft pick, league sources told Yahoo Sports. The Knicks refused a Raptors proposal that would've included Iman Shumpert and Felton, sources told Yahoo Sports. WIthout a first-round pick or Shumpert, there is no traction for a deal. The Knicks have no appetite for including Shumpert or rookie Tim Hardaway Jr. in a package.

Yahoo! Sports - See more at: http://hoopshype.com/rumors/tag/new_yor ... ffjYZ.dpuf

[mamadontcry]

If we just could push for Rondo somehow. That's my dream

[JBreezeNY]

whew

Dolan nixes deal

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baske ... -1.1546553

God bless you Based Dolan

[Anotha Knicks fan]

^But we don't know what protections were on the pick if there were some. Protections never get reported accurately -- sometimes not even after the trade is official.


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Personally, it doesn't matter what protection the pick has. If it's included, the scales are tilted in their favor. Only way I'd accept a protection is if it's top 59 protected, and even then! lol

Lowry is not that much of a difference for us to mortgage any future in. 2018 is the next generation's players.


I mean, that player can be as early as a current ninth grader (with a year of college) or as late as a Junior in high school. Who knows what the team will look like then, and if we will need our "lotto" picks to continue building, or those late 1st rounders to fill up the team.

[polo007]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/knicks-pursuing-trade-for-kyle-lowry-204933654.html

The New York Knicks are pursuing Toronto point guard Kyle Lowry with a package of Raymond Felton, Metta World Peace and a 2018 first-round draft pick, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

The Knicks refused a Raptors proposal that would've included Iman Shumpert and Felton, sources told Yahoo Sports. WIthout a first-round pick or Shumpert, there is no traction for a deal. The Knicks have no appetite for including Shumpert or rookie Tim Hardaway Jr. in a package.

Knicks owner Jim Dolan is sensitive to the public perception that Toronto general manger Masai Ujiri bamboozled New York in the Carmelo Anthony trade, and the chance of getting panned for giving up too much in a deal for Lowry has become a hurdle in these talks, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

Several teams are pursuing Lowry, but the Knicks' most direct competition for him could come from the Brooklyn Nets, who are also exploring the possibility of a deal, league sources said. Brooklyn has resisted the inclusion of its 2020 first-round pick in a package, nor one of its top young players, including rookie Mason Plumlee, sources said.

Within the Knicks, there's hesitance on including the draft pick, but there's no chance a deal for Lowry could get done without it, sources said. Nevertheless, there's still doubt on how long New York will keep a pick on the table, sources said.

Toronto officials have been scouting and calling European contacts on Bojan Bogdanovic, a 24-year-old shooting guard with whom the Nets own the rights, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

[aq_ua]

A Nets trade makes no sense - Deron just came back and looks ok, Shawn Livingston has been a great backup and Tyshawn Taylor is there as well. Not sure where Lowry would fit in with all that.

[K_ick_God]

Stands to reason that if they refused to include Shump, then they also insisted on AT LEAST lottery protection for the pick.

Good.

Here's to that -- a new era, under Mills, of only giving up the absolute minimum we have to before agreeing to any trade.


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[EchelonNYK]

This one doesn't appears to be heading anywhere.

[Kenyon009]

Stands to reason that if they refused to include Shump, then they also insisted on AT LEAST lottery protection for the pick.

Good.

Here's to that -- a new era, under Mills, of only giving up the absolute minimum we have to before agreeing to any trade.


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You understand the pressure to get better? There's no pick this year and Melo can walk. I would rather trade Shumpert, someone that's been on the block for quite some time, along with a first than wait around. Lowry can turn this franchise into a playoff team. Winning now is a priority not developing Shumpert but winning now.

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[K_ick_God]

Sort of off topic but Isola quotes a "Knicks source" as saying the"Knicks" have too many people making decisions.

Whoever he's taking to couldn't really be high up at all if they're even there. You don't talk about your own employer in the 'third person' like that do you?


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[Hijinks]

I'm not gonna read all the 50 pages, that went up since i last visited (you guys are crazy!!! ). So the last thing is that the proposed deal was nixed by Dolan but they are still in negotiations?

props to dolan for not wanting to give up another pick. must be a first.

[The Lamma]

A Nets trade makes no sense - Deron just came back and looks ok, Shawn Livingston has been a great backup and Tyshawn Taylor is there as well. Not sure where Lowry would fit in with all that.

Exactly why I think either Proky is pretending to be interested or Ujiri is just using them to drive the price up. Dolan doesn't want to be outdone by Prok, and both Ujiri and Prok have interest in the Knicks getting fleeced.

[Buggin Out]

Stands to reason that if they refused to include Shump, then they also insisted on AT LEAST lottery protection for the pick.

Good.

Here's to that -- a new era, under Mills, of only giving up the absolute minimum we have to before agreeing to any trade.


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You understand the pressure to get better? There's no pick this year and Melo can walk. I would rather trade Shumpert, someone that's been on the block for quite some time, along with a first than wait around. Lowry can turn this franchise into a playoff team. Winning now is a priority not developing Shumpert but winning now.

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GTFO, bare minimun you are getting is 2018 with lotto protection. Maybe we will include a second pick swap in 2020

[Kenyon009]

Stands to reason that if they refused to include Shump, then they also insisted on AT LEAST lottery protection for the pick.

Good.

Here's to that -- a new era, under Mills, of only giving up the absolute minimum we have to before agreeing to any trade.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

You understand the pressure to get better? There's no pick this year and Melo can walk. I would rather trade Shumpert, someone that's been on the block for quite some time, along with a first than wait around. Lowry can turn this franchise into a playoff team. Winning now is a priority not developing Shumpert but winning now.

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GTFO, bare minimun you are getting is 2018 with lotto protection. Maybe we will include a second pick swap in 2020

So the Raptors are taking on more years of a worse player for a bad luck opposed to just letting him expire? You GTFO.

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