Official Trade Thread - Part XXV

[GeeWiz]

Otto for Len, Noel, Kanter, any of those guys. Again, I'd target Len or Noel with their rookie deals, but in this draft class, we should have swung for the fences with Noel or Len. I mean, the Suns or 6ers would have to consider it with Plumlee emerging and Evan Turner leaving, opening up things for Embiid possibly. Or do they put Noel at the 4? Either way, I'd do any of these trades, not any of that Illyasova crap.

Why? Philly wasn't doing the trade they made for Otto freaking Porter. Noel was universally the #1 pick before the injury. The Suns have a smart FO. They had Len as their #1 rated prospect.

Well, this 'Otto freaking Porter' you speak of had an extremely successful college career for one of the most respected programs in the nation, and has yet to be given an opportunity to prove his worth in the NBA. Why you hate Otto is beyond me, but hes an unknown in the NBA. you never know who may bite.


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[nate33]

I'm comfortable with Porter over Len. I just don't trust big men with foot issues, and Len wasn't really that good in college anyhow.

My issue is Porter over Noel. Noel put up some fantastic numbers in college, which surely would have gotten better as he filled out. He may have had trouble adapting to the NBA because he has a center's skills in a power forward's frame, but we are fortunate enough to have 3 players (Nene, Gortat and Seraphin) who have power forward skills in a center's frame. We could have accommodated Noel and utilized him even before he matured enough physically to move over to full time center. I think he will pan out much like Ibaka or Henson.

[verbal8]

Otto for Len, Noel, Kanter, any of those guys. Again, I'd target Len or Noel with their rookie deals, but in this draft class, we should have swung for the fences with Noel or Len. I mean, the Suns or 6ers would have to consider it with Plumlee emerging and Evan Turner leaving, opening up things for Embiid possibly. Or do they put Noel at the 4? Either way, I'd do any of these trades, not any of that Illyasova crap.

Why? Philly wasn't doing the trade they made for Otto freaking Porter. Noel was universally the #1 pick before the injury. The Suns have a smart FO. They had Len as their #1 rated prospect.

Well, this 'Otto freaking Porter' you speak of had an extremely successful college career for one of the most respected programs in the nation, and has yet to be given an opportunity to prove his worth in the NBA. Why you hate Otto is beyond me, but hes an unknown in the NBA. you never know who may bite.

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I don't think it is realistic that Porter gets dealt for someone in the same draft class this year. Down the road I could see teams wanting to exchange young players with similar production for better fit and to get a look at them before having to deal with an extension.

However I think the more likely deal is to exchange a player with more time on their rookie deal for one who has demonstrated more production.

[Upper Decker]

Otto for Len, Noel, Kanter, any of those guys. Again, I'd target Len or Noel with their rookie deals, but in this draft class, we should have swung for the fences with Noel or Len. I mean, the Suns or 6ers would have to consider it with Plumlee emerging and Evan Turner leaving, opening up things for Embiid possibly. Or do they put Noel at the 4? Either way, I'd do any of these trades, not any of that Illyasova crap.

Why? Philly wasn't doing the trade they made for Otto freaking Porter. Noel was universally the #1 pick before the injury. The Suns have a smart FO. They had Len as their #1 rated prospect.

Well, this 'Otto freaking Porter' you speak of had an extremely successful college career for one of the most respected programs in the nation, and has yet to be given an opportunity to prove his worth in the NBA. Why you hate Otto is beyond me, but hes an unknown in the NBA. you never know who may bite.

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This means absolutely nothing right now. Just off the top of my head, Ed Obannon, Pearl Washington, Walter Berry, Dennis Hopson, Adam Morrison, Steve Alfred. These are all guys who were better than Porter in college and played for respected college programs but busted in the NBA.

[GeeWiz]

Why? Philly wasn't doing the trade they made for Otto freaking Porter. Noel was universally the #1 pick before the injury. The Suns have a smart FO. They had Len as their #1 rated prospect.

Well, this 'Otto freaking Porter' you speak of had an extremely successful college career for one of the most respected programs in the nation, and has yet to be given an opportunity to prove his worth in the NBA. Why you hate Otto is beyond me, but hes an unknown in the NBA. you never know who may bite.

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This means absolutely nothing right now. Just off the top of my head, Ed Obannon, Pearl Washington, Walter Berry, Dennis Hopson, Adam Morrison, Steve Alfred. These are all guys who were better than Porter in college and played for respected college programs but busted in the NBA.

True. I was just throwing around ideas, who knows if any of these teams would do it. But if I'm Pheonix, Plumlee has been doing awfully well this year and Len hasnt been able to get on the court much.


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[mhd]

Utah fans are offering Marvin Williams on the trade board by gauging his value.

Marvin+Kanter for Maynor+Ves+Singleton+Porter.

We get rid of Maynor, get an expiring stretch PF in Marvin, and get Kanter as a young big. Utah gets Porter as a cheap young wing, and saves a bit of cash this year.

[hands11]

How about this, Alex Len for Otto. Len hasn't played much due to Injuries and the emergence of Miles Plumlee.

Kind of like a make up draft.

#3. I want Otto.. no wait. I changed my mind. We want Len. Can we swop now ? #3 for #5. Had we done a trade down draft day we should have been able to pick up some extra assets. But maybe Len is worth the #3 now after we let PHX medical staff fix him up some. And Len cost less.

Or Kanter. #3 for #3. Only its two years later and he cost 2M more then Otto next year.

Kanter. Len. If they can keep Trevor A, these would be moves to consider. Wonder what Trevor A is telling them. I assume they are checking in with him to see what he thinks. Maybe they need to win a few more games first. If they were a couple games over .500 and looking legit with Wall, Beal, Webster and Trevor A getting it done, you would think maybe he would want to stay for fair price. Specially if they keep Nene off the bench and add another young tall big center to help out.

Which would you think is best. Kanter or Len ?

[hands11]

So because Porter is not as athletic, he has a brighter future? Last I checked, he's not a contestant for Mr. Universe himself. And based on production, Noel as a freshman was equal to Porter as a sophomore.

As time passes... I think every team that passed on Noel will regret it. 19 year olds do tend to gain weight and bulk and strength... as time passes. Even 20 year old Porter will get bigger... as time does what?

Well, the one guy EVERYONE is regretting not taking is Giannis. Considering his age, he'll likely be the best player in this draft.

If/when he grows to 7 feet, I'm salivating thinking of the length of that Milwaukee frontcourt with Hansen and Sanders. Can't wait for Sanders to finally play. It's going to be hard to keep the worst record in the NBA.

Very. I expect them to start winning.

I liked the idea of us getting Zaza from them. But he just had a foot injury. A fracture. That's scary on a man his size 6-11 275. At 29, he could still recover but he isn't probably going to be one that makes it into this 36 age range. But if not for that, I think he would have been a nice fit here. 5M for 2 more years. Not someone to trade Otto for but maybe something else we have.

[Dark Faze]

Word on REALGM is that The Grizz are looking for an athletic SF.

Here's a trade I like:

Trevor Ariza and Chris Singleton for Tayshaun Prince, Ed Davis and their 2014 1st.

They get a defensive minded athletic project in Singleton that they can develop and a playoff ready guy who could contribute a ton for their team next year when they are healthy again. Conley/Allen/Ariza/Zbo/Gasol would be absolutely lethal defensively.

We take on Princes awful contract (two years 7.2 mil), get a young PF project/potential starter in Ed Davis and more importantly a 2014 first.

The pick is 10th right now but likely will get a bit worse as Gasol is due back before the all-star break and Trevor would add wins to them. I'd project the pick to be at worst 21st, but we've seen that there's starting caliber in the bottom half of the first round all the time, could trade up, etc.

I think its a great trade for both squads.

Prince would basically just warm the bench and be a vet presence that could direct Porters development.

[Upper Decker]

Utah fans are offering Marvin Williams on the trade board by gauging his value.

Marvin+Kanter for Maynor+Ves+Singleton+Porter.

We get rid of Maynor, get an expiring stretch PF in Marvin, and get Kanter as a young big. Utah gets Porter as a cheap young wing, and saves a bit of cash this year.

I'd happily do this. Marvin would be a solid rotation forward. Can play the stretch-4. Washington would have a bevy of catch and shoot wings who all play average or better defense. That's really cause issues for other teams. Beal, Ariza, Webster, and Williams are all shooting .398 or better beyond the arc.

[LyricalRico]

Trevor Ariza and Chris Singleton for Tayshaun Prince, Ed Davis and their 2014 1st.

Not a fan of taking on Prince, and I'm not convinced MEM would part with a pick considering their lack of depth and need to start planning for the future. What if we let them keep their pick and we get Bayless instead of Prince?

[Dark Faze]

Planning for the future? They aren't going to start planning to build through the draft when they are already very competitive with the best teams in the West. I'm certain they'd give up the pick if we took on Tayshauns contract, which I'm willing to do as I very much doubt we're doing anything in free agency beyond extending Gortat and or keeping Ariza.

Stomaching Tayshaun is a small price to pay for seeing what we have in young pieces like the pick, Porter and Davis imo

And if we suck bad enough without Ariza we get to keep our pick this year

[LyricalRico]

Planning for the future? They aren't going to start planning to build through the draft when they are already very competitive with the best teams in the West.

I would have agreed with you before the season, but they're under .500 right now. Yes they've got guys hurt, but it's always tough to gain ground in the west and especially this year. And then they have to make a decision on Randolph next summer. I'm just saying, maybe they try to get a wing without giving up a pick.

[Rafael122]

Ariza + Singleton for Ed Davis + Bayless + Koufos

PG - Wall/Bayless/Maynor
SG - Beal/Rice
SF - Webster/Porter
PF - Nene/Davis/Booker
C - Gortat/Koufos/Vesely/Seraphin

I'd probably flip Vesely and Maynor and get a shooting guard.

[LyricalRico]

^ Maynor+Vesely for Courtney Lee? Or add Seraphin and go after Marcus Thornton?

Not sure what else might be out there, Raf.

[Dark Faze]

Posted this in the Free Agency thread but he's a great trade candidate as well:

Damn...gotta wonder if we could pull a Martell Webster on Jordan Hill from the Lakers...His advanced stats are unbelievable this year and were really good last year as well...the only problem being games played during his career...couldn't stay healthy...but if you could buy low on him he'd be an absolute steal if he could get right:

16.2 ppg, 14 rpg, 2 apg, 2 bpg 58% FG 21.7 PER, 61% TS, 122ortg 104 drtg salary: 3.5

The Lakers probably won't extend him and don't want to take on any additional salary so I'm not sure how we'd swing it

[nuposse04]

Posted this in the Free Agency thread but he's a great trade candidate as well:

Damn...gotta wonder if we could pull a Martell Webster on Jordan Hill from the Lakers...His advanced stats are unbelievable this year and were really good last year as well...the only problem being games played during his career...couldn't stay healthy...but if you could buy low on him he'd be an absolute steal if he could get right:

16.2 ppg, 14 rpg, 2 apg, 2 bpg 58% FG 21.7 PER, 61% TS, 122ortg 104 drtg salary: 3.5

The Lakers probably won't extend him and don't want to take on any additional salary so I'm not sure how we'd swing it

I still don't know why they don't utilize him more. Just cause he can't shoot as well as say...Wesley johnson?

I almost PREFER his style of game oppose to Gortat. He's considerably younger and probably a much better defender. I know the Lakers have dreams of getting guys like Love or Melo (lol) so he might be attainable on a longer term deal. I think giving Hill say, 4 32 million dollar deal while paying Ariza would be far better moving forward. Then again Hill plays against B squads half the time so his numbers could be inflated.

*forgot, isn't he injury prone? might be one reason he can't get a long term deal and I'm an idiot.

[nate33]

I almost PREFER his style of game oppose to Gortat. He's considerably younger and probably a much better defender. I know the Lakers have dreams of getting guys like Love or Melo (lol) so he might be attainable on a longer term deal. I think giving Hill say, 4 32 million dollar deal while paying Ariza would be far better moving forward.

It's not that simple. We'd have to renounce Bird Rights on both Gortat and Ariza to have the cap room to sign Hill.

[nuposse04]

^^Well poop, didn't know we'd have to renounce rights on BOTH guys :/ I'm prolly overhyping Hill though. While he is absolutely effective he does have an injury issue. Although I think his lack of games played early in his career is more a function of just being in bad situations. I think a JJ Hickson-esque contract is very fair to him. And if for w/e reason we don't keep Gortat, I think Hill isn't a terrible consolation prize.

[fishercob]

Gotta be careful with big man with foot injuries. That said, I do like the idea of trading Otto for a big man on a rookie deal. Ideally, it would be somebody in this draft class or the next. The long term goal is to have a guy develop so that he's starting caliber in 2016, but still on a cheap rookie deal. Then set up our cap situation so that we have max cap room in 2016 to go along with Wall, Beal and Good Young Big.

Porter for Noel would be ideal. Or Porter for a high potential big man in this draft class (McGary? Vonleh?). I still can't believe we didn't draft Noel in the first place. He'd be great alongside Nene or Gortat.

I can believe it. A weightless big with little offensive skill who relies on athleticism to affect the game sustained a major knee injury (and he another major leg injury in high school, right?). So to reach his potential, Noel needs to develop some offensive skill. He needs to get strong enough to battle in the post in the NBA (because he's sure as hell not going to be guarded away from the hoop). But in developing that strength, he has to avoid putting on too much weight to put a stress on his frame AND maintain or improve his athleticism so he can rebound and contest shots against NBA athletes.

Noel seems like a super-risky prospect to me. As time passes, I expect to be more and more comfortable with Porter as our choice.

So because Porter is not as athletic, he has a brighter future? Last I checked, he's not a contestant for Mr. Universe himself. And based on production, Noel as a freshman was equal to Porter as a sophomore.

As time passes... I think every team that passed on Noel will regret it. 19 year olds do tend to gain weight and bulk and strength... as time passes. Even 20 year old Porter will get bigger... as time does what?

Noel's injury history is of much greater concern than Porter's and his position is much more physically taxing.