DFerry needs to make a BOLD Move to improve our Talent

[Rip2137]

The thing I hate about stuff like this is that people get enamored with guys playing out of their mind in their free agency year (Turner, Lowery) or guys who put up big numbers on bad teams and people think that will translate to a GOOD team.

Also, the undervaluing of Al Horford is kinda laughable here.

Teague and Horford have GREAT contracts. Those are the guys you keep. You don't trade for guys with bad contracts with worse on court performance and/or equal performance.

With that said, the bold move would be moving Horford and Teague for Westbrook and Nick Collison.

OKC gets a starting point in Teague, a big in Horford(although he would still be playing Center)


We get a right on the verge superstar and shot creator, a do it all center in Nick Collison.

Westbrook
Carroll
Korver
Milsap
Collison

Teague
Thabo
Durant
Ibaka
Horford

Why would OKC move Westbrook? Well, one they need a better big and I think between Teague and Reggie they would feel they have enough coverage at the point.

Now to be clear, I am not a FAN of this trade, just saying if you want a bold move, there's one. I think the massive upgrade the Thunder would get a Center would outweigh the slight losses they are taking at the point. And we get "That guy"

[PandaKidd]

^^^ interesting.

I would do that trade in a heartbeat. However, Westbrook wont fit this system either. They need a pass first PG not a shoot first. I would do it to get the Superstar talent here. But it would prob be shortsighted as if WB blows a knee out we are worse off than before

[Rip2137]

Toni parker is not and never has been a pass first point guard. I don't know why people think that this system needs a pass first guy.

If anything, Parker has been a guy that penetrates and forces defenses to collapse after he repeatedly scores on them.

Manu was more the pass first shooting guard there but Parker is a scoring point guard.

[parson]

diesel, you're saying we should trade Horford for just anybody because Horford's not on the court. Lousy logic.

Actually, I don't think Parson... Your name sake... Is just anybody. Nor doI think that of Asik. Ask is a true big who is a shot blocker and rim protector plus he rebounds. We have to quit lying to ourselves about what Horford does.

Your argument was that we're winning without Horford so any addition is justified.

So you're saying that giving up Horf and Schroeder for Asik and Parson is an overpay by us. Uhm... Neither of those guys are playing regular minutes for us right now... and we're still some good without them.

[parson]

And I'm probably the only guy who is not a Westbrook fan. With Durant, he should be getting double figures in assists. His selfishness shouts out at me whenever I see him shoot 42.4% from the field and 30.9% on 4 and a half 3s a game. He simply should be taking better shots (fewer, smarter shots) with the offensive weapons he has at his disposal.

[azuresou1]

Westbrook is not a terribly efficient scorer, but he can put up superstar volume, and he's actually one of the best passers in the league when you take into account turnovers... I have him ranked 5th after CP3, Parker, Wall, and Rondo. He's also an elite rebounder for a guard, and an excellent defender.

I trade for Westbrook any day, and you know how high I am on Al.

[PandaKidd]

Toni parker is not and never has been a pass first point guard. I don't know why people think that this system needs a pass first guy.

If anything, Parker has been a guy that penetrates and forces defenses to collapse after he repeatedly scores on them.

Manu was more the pass first shooting guard there but Parker is a scoring point guard.

Ehh, TP averages 7 APG, id have to go look, but Im pretty sure hes more efficient at scoring.

EDIT

.424 RW
.509 TP

Ok so maybe TP isnt Pass FIRST, but hes more of a traditional style PG than RW IMO. WB should have 15 ast per game playing next to Durant

[Rip2137]

I'm not a fan of Westbrook either. I think he has been robbing us of all time greatness with freezing out Durant at times. I honestly think Durant could have been a 35+ point per game scorer with a good point guard, which was why I was thinking the Thunder should have traded Westbrook to New Orleans for Chris Paul.

But his shots are selfish now because Durant is on the court and he isn't the best option. On a team where he is "the man" those shots turn into aggressive offense by your best player. He is a rich mans monta ellis, for sure, but still, I think he would do well on a team where it isn't glaringly obvious that he should be passing instead of shooting.

[Jamaaliver]

I'm not a fan of Westbrook either. I think he has been robbing us of all time greatness with freezing out Durant at times.

I agree wholeheartedly, RIP. I cringe everytime he runs a possession where no one else touches the ball. Which happens waaaaaaay too often. That's the reason they had to run James Harden (a natural SG) at point in 4th quarters. Westbrook could not be depended on to run legit offensive sets in crunchtime.

Russ Westbrook is a blockhead, too. Great player...terrible point guard. If I was OKC, I'd have traded traded Westbrook and kept Harden instead.

Westbrook for Rondo plus change seems like a win-win for both sides.

[Jamaaliver]

Westbrook is not a terribly efficient scorer, but he can put up superstar volume, and he's actually one of the best passers in the league when you take into account turnovers... I have him ranked 5th after CP3, Parker, Wall, and Rondo. He's also an elite rebounder for a guard, and an excellent defender.

I trade for Westbrook any day, and you know how high I am on Al.

You have John Wall ranked ahead of Rondo, Westbrook AND Lillard?

Ewwww.

[azuresou1]

Russell Westbrook has a higher AST% than Tony Parker, so I don't know why we're suddenly saying he can't pass. I'm aware the 15 APG is an exaggeration but he's regularly one of the best setup guys in the league.

[azuresou1]

Westbrook is not a terribly efficient scorer, but he can put up superstar volume, and he's actually one of the best passers in the league when you take into account turnovers... I have him ranked 5th after CP3, Parker, Wall, and Rondo. He's also an elite rebounder for a guard, and an excellent defender.

I trade for Westbrook any day, and you know how high I am on Al.

You have John Wall ranked ahead of Rondo, Westbrook AND Lillard?

Ewwww.

In passing. People sleep on John Wall because he has a broken jumpshot which prevents him from really going ham, unlike, say, Lillard or Kyrie.

[Rip2137]

John wall is clearly a better point guard than Westbrook and Lillard. But as much as I hate Rondo's stat padding, I still say he is a better point than Wall(that's not really an insult either. John Wall is really freaking good...just with no jumpshot).

[azuresou1]

I'd say Rondo is a better pure passer, but Wall gets so many better passing angles that it makes up for his (slightly) worse passing.

People don't respect Wall's jumpshot but at least they nominally play him so he doesn't get completely free looks at the baskets, which gives him driving lanes. With his speed, he can get into those driving lanes, which opens up passing angles since defenders need to help.

Many teams play so far back on Rondo just daring him to shoot, that his slashing lanes are much rarer. His quickness is thus largely negated.

[Jamaaliver]

John wall is clearly a better point guard than Westbrook and Lillard.

Clearly a better Point Guard? The architects of Team USA Basketball might disagree...

An argument can be made. But I'm not so sure it's clear cut.

Though Wall participated in minicamps with Team USA for the past two summers, he got stuck in a logjam of talent at his position, with former league MVP Derrick Rose; all-stars Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Russell Westbrook, Stephen Curry and Kyrie Irving; and last year’s rookie of the year, Damian Lillard, all being named to the roster. Wall is one of two American-born No. 1 overall picks in the past 11 years not to receive an invitation to Team USA. The other...is Greg Oden,

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/wizards-team-usa-extends-an-invite-to-beal-but-not-wall-who-vows-to-use-it-as-motivation/2014/01/26/432b5404-86e6-11e3-a5bd-844629433ba3_story.html

[Jamaaliver]

Many teams play so far back on Rondo just daring him to shoot, that his slashing lanes are much rarer. His quickness is thus largely negated.

I fear this will be Dennis' greatest challenge the rest of his career.

Mike, PM me regarding that issue we spoke about last week.

[Damu]

I like the idea of Melo or Kevin Love... They are game changers and with the talent here, the system and positioning Ferry has placed the Hawks in I think that would be a winning recipe.

Pierce, Lowry, Deng are not game changers good players but Pierce is old and not going to carry anything. Lowry is he really that good or is he having a good year? Deng is good but that's it he is good!

[Rip2137]

John wall is clearly a better point guard than Westbrook and Lillard.

Clearly a better Point Guard? The architects of Team USA Basketball might disagree...

An argument can be made. But I'm not so sure it's clear cut.

Though Wall participated in minicamps with Team USA for the past two summers, he got stuck in a logjam of talent at his position, with former league MVP Derrick Rose; all-stars Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Russell Westbrook, Stephen Curry and Kyrie Irving; and last year’s rookie of the year, Damian Lillard, all being named to the roster. Wall is one of two American-born No. 1 overall picks in the past 11 years not to receive an invitation to Team USA. The other...is Greg Oden,

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/wizards-team-usa-extends-an-invite-to-beal-but-not-wall-who-vows-to-use-it-as-motivation/2014/01/26/432b5404-86e6-11e3-a5bd-844629433ba3_story.html

That means nothing. It means he doesn't have a great jumpshot and they are looking more for guys that are useful on the perimeter. Derrick Rose is enough point guard without a jumpshot. Damian Lillard isn't even a point guard, Russell Westbrook only averages the 6 assist he does now because he is passing to Durant( he would realistically be around 4-5 a game). There is no way anyone can make an argument that either of those guys are better POINT GUARDs than John Wall

[Jamaaliver]

There is no way anyone can make an argument that either of those guys are better POINT GUARDs than John Wall

Yikes!

[diesel50]

diesel, you're saying we should trade Horford for just anybody because Horford's not on the court. Lousy logic.

Actually, I don't think Parson... Your name sake... Is just anybody. Nor doI think that of Asik. Ask is a true big who is a shot blocker and rim protector plus he rebounds. We have to quit lying to ourselves about what Horford does.

Your argument was that we're winning without Horford so any addition is justified.

So you're saying that giving up Horf and Schroeder for Asik and Parson is an overpay by us. Uhm... Neither of those guys are playing regular minutes for us right now... and we're still some good without them.

Saying that we're still good without Horf is not saying grab anybody. That's a bit extreme. I'm saying that these players are tradable and if we can get good Value back like Parson/Asik... Those guys added to what we already have may make us strong contenders. Remember, the title says a BOLD Move to IMPROVE talent. What's more Bold than to trade for a guy who is on the verge of being a star...And a long needed Big?

For Years, a Horf Smoove combo has looked really good in the regular season. However, it's in the playoffs that we found our problem. Teams would shot down our transition scoring and we would be reliant on half court offense. Horf is not a guy who will exceed in Half Court offense. He doesn't have a goto move. Moreover, we will have the same problem with DMC, Korver on the floor together. Not enough outside scoring. Look at the makeup of San Antonio. At the end of the day, when they are not going through Duncan, They have a host of three point shooters that kill teams for falling back and clogging the lane. With that wide open lane, the PG has room to work. Parker is one of the best drivers in the game because he never has a clogged Lane. You put Parson/Korver on the perimeter... we're drilling teams. That's about 18 apiece outside and more room for Sap and Teague to work.