GT #51: Wizards @ Grizzlies 8 PM CSN

[dlts20]

I disagree with both of you. I think Sheed was the best player and most meaningful. He was the only guy out the group who was dominant on both sides of the ball, had a fealess attitude, can dominate the post, and shoot with range while being a very good defender.

[Dat2U]

Its almost like he doesn't know what to do when Beals get hot.

TA or Webster being hot doesn't seem to affect him.
He was the same way with Crawford. If Crawford played well, Wall didn't.

What the last team what won a titles with their two best players being the PG and SG ?

Detroit Pistons.

IMO Ben Wallace was their MVP in that title run, or at least 1b to Billups. He was like prime Rodman on steroids.. possibly literally

If the Wiz had prime Wall/Beal/top 10 pf/Ben Wallace + depth, that's a team that would contend imo. The key is finding that transcendent player to add to Wall and Beal. Whether it's a scorer (ie Durant) or a dominant defensive anchor/rebounder (like Wallace)

My bad, I should have been clear. The Bad Boy Pistons with Isaiah Thomas & Joe Dumars.

[jivelikenice]

The problem tonight was Passive John showed up. You know....that guy that walks it up, cheats too much on defense, plays lazy, dribbles in place for half the shot clock, and settles for too many long jumpers. The problem is he's now a max player and that type of effort level and approach is unacceptable. Wall to me is right behind that top group of pgs in the debate. He's an all star but he's not a franchise player. But to me has has the ability to be a franchise player where most of those guys don't. Why? Because he could dominate a game scoring, passing, or defensively....and every game or two he goes on a 5 minute run or so where all three are clicking together and he imposes his will on a game.

The problem is franchise players impose their will throughout games and show up nightly. When sign a max deal you should accept a responsibility to strive for that. Is Wall satisfied with being an all star? Why do we see efforts like this so often versus guys he should be able to dominate?


.

[Illmatic21]

Detroit Pistons.

IMO Ben Wallace was their MVP in that title run, or at least 1b to Billups. He was like prime Rodman on steroids.. possibly literally

If the Wiz had prime Wall/Beal/top 10 pf/Ben Wallace + depth, that's a team that would contend imo. The key is finding that transcendent player to add to Wall and Beal. Whether it's a scorer (ie Durant) or a dominant defensive anchor/rebounder (like Wallace)

My bad, I should have been clear. The Bad Boy Pistons with Isaiah Thomas & Joe Dumars.

Ahhh, gotcha.

[jivelikenice]

I don't see an issue with Wall/Beal excelling together. You saw flashes of it last season and in the preseason. They've just been off alternatively. Wall has had big games where beal got a lot of FGAs too. Today was an exception though because Beal was so on fire that we basically stopped running an offense and just let Beal run behind screens/ picks while the other four guys stood around. Passive John also showed up which didn't help matters.

[JWizmentality]

You know what our problem is? We have no more lunch pale players. Nobody who brings it every night on a consistent basis. Gone are the Antonio Daniels and James Singletons. Sure Nene is a decent player, but can't rebound, can't make a layup and his FT line adventures are a thing of legend. And is it just me or do most of our close games seem to hinge on Nene FTs?

Gortwat is the most undeserving player of a menacing nickname I've ever seen. He's softer than a wet tampon, and yes I say tampon because he should only be referenced under all things pu$$Y.

Ariza is streaky as hell, he's either on or off, and Beal is in the same boat, but it seems someone has duct taped his switch to off. Try to yank that sucker too hard and he breaks!

Then we have Wallstar, our fearless leader whose jumpshot really hasn't gotten that much better, except in his own mind and refuses to use his best ability to his advantage.

I should mention the coach but we don't have one, and the bench is about as useful as tits on a chicken. Then we have the grandmaster architect of this super treadmill. Ernie G who now is stuck with trading away assets to clean up his own sh*t stain!

WTF freakin Maynor man....Maynor!!!! I'm soooo mofo tired of getting butt f*cked by players making less than half of his salary!!!

Sent from my LG-VM696 using Tapatalk 2

Why you no complain when we beat Thunder and Trail Blazers ?

That's just it! We are the biggest c*cktease!
Sent from my LG-VM696 using Tapatalk 2

[MikeTheKid]

You know what our problem is? We have no more lunch pale players. Nobody who brings it every night on a consistent basis. Gone are the Antonio Daniels and James Singletons. Sure Nene is a decent player, but can't rebound, can't make a layup and his FT line adventures are a thing of legend. And is it just me or do most of our close games seem to hinge on Nene FTs?

Gortwat is the most undeserving player of a menacing nickname I've ever seen. He's softer than a wet tampon, and yes I say tampon because he should only be referenced under all things pu$$Y.

Ariza is streaky as hell, he's either on or off, and Beal is in the same boat, but it seems someone has duct taped his switch to off. Try to yank that sucker too hard and he breaks!

Then we have Wallstar, our fearless leader whose jumpshot really hasn't gotten that much better, except in his own mind and refuses to use his best ability to his advantage.

I should mention the coach but we don't have one, and the bench is about as useful as tits on a chicken. Then we have the grandmaster architect of this super treadmill. Ernie G who now is stuck with trading away assets to clean up his own sh*t stain!

WTF freakin Maynor man....Maynor!!!! I'm soooo mofo tired of getting butt f*cked by players making less than half of his salary!!!

Sent from my LG-VM696 using Tapatalk 2

Why you no complain when we beat Thunder and Trail Blazers ?

We did Ballboy!!!

[hands11]

Its almost like he doesn't know what to do when Beals get hot.

TA or Webster being hot doesn't seem to affect him.
He was the same way with Crawford. If Crawford played well, Wall didn't.

What the last team what won a titles with their two best players being the PG and SG ?

Detroit Pistons.

IMO Ben Wallace was their MVP in that title run, or at least 1b to Billups. He was like prime Rodman on steroids.. possibly literally

If the Wiz had prime Wall/Beal/top 10 pf/Ben Wallace + depth, that's a team that would contend imo. The key is finding that transcendent player to add to Wall and Beal. Whether it's a scorer (ie Durant) or a dominant defensive anchor/rebounder (like Wallace)

Point is, you have to go all the way back to the Piston to find an example of that model working.

I said it when we had Gil signed to an even worse contract and I'll say the same now. Its not a good model for a team. Just like CP3s contract is going to crush the LACs. D Rose's contract will do the same in CHI

At least Walls isnt as bad as those two.

[Dat2U]

Detroit Pistons.

IMO Ben Wallace was their MVP in that title run, or at least 1b to Billups. He was like prime Rodman on steroids.. possibly literally

If the Wiz had prime Wall/Beal/top 10 pf/Ben Wallace + depth, that's a team that would contend imo. The key is finding that transcendent player to add to Wall and Beal. Whether it's a scorer (ie Durant) or a dominant defensive anchor/rebounder (like Wallace)

Point is, you have to go all the way back to the Piston to find an example of that model working.

I said it when we had Gil signed to an even worse contract and I'll say the same now. Its not a good model for a team. Just like CP3s contract is going to crush the LACs. D Rose's contract will do the same in CHI

At least Walls isnt as bad as those two.

If you really think CP3s contract is the biggest problem for the Clips, then I don't know what to tell you. It's yet another silly observation based of some flimsy anecdotal research.

[dckingsfan]

I'm looking at the game now on replay and I swear I'm not seeing what others are seeing. Grizz game planned beautifully against Wall. They took away everything from him. He had no room whatsoever to operate as Marc Gasol was in mid-season form. The way Gasol was keying on him it was almost like they were playing a box and 1. Game would have been a complete blowout if not for Beal playing out of his mind. He was the biggest reason the game was even close, second being the Grizzlies offensive meltdown most of the 4th... Gortat's foul trouble was a killer, especially the 2nd quarter. Seraphin is such a downgrade on both sides of the court, one Calathes drive on Wall led to an easy two because Seraphin didn't show at all on the pick & roll. I also thought Wittman had no real answer offensively to Grizz basically daring the Wizards to beat them from deep without the drive and kick option and the lack of a legit pick & roll with Gortat saddled with foul problems.

Nights like tonight I can really see the coaching difference.

I'm not seeing the questionable effort from Wall others are seeing. Wall looks completely out of sorts. A mix of passivity after he realizes he isn't getting in the paint and awkwardly forcing the issue when he feels he hasn't done enough. I chalk it up to a bad stretch. Defensively, it's all about falling back into poor habits (bad positioning & not moving his feet) as he's done often this year rather than taking someone lightly or being hungover (which would be hard since it was a travel day).

Hey Dat, watch it again - but don't watch any of the offensive sequences, turn your head. Now watch his defensive effort. Not positioning, effort. And then watch the last couple of minutes of the game. He just isn't bringing it all game long. He is on cruise control. That is why he has been punked by the scrubs.

[dangermouse]

Less than a month ago we were praising Wall and chiding Beal for his poor play.

If we can get them both to go off at the same time, watch out league. I think at least some of the blame lies in the coaching. Wall is definitely in a slump right now though.

[Zonkerbl]

Detroit Pistons.

IMO Ben Wallace was their MVP in that title run, or at least 1b to Billups. He was like prime Rodman on steroids.. possibly literally

If the Wiz had prime Wall/Beal/top 10 pf/Ben Wallace + depth, that's a team that would contend imo. The key is finding that transcendent player to add to Wall and Beal. Whether it's a scorer (ie Durant) or a dominant defensive anchor/rebounder (like Wallace)

My bad, I should have been clear. The Bad Boy Pistons with Isaiah Thomas & Joe Dumars.

Duh!

Lol, younguns.

[pancakes3]

If you let every major superstar guard you draft walk because you refuse to sign them to a max contract, your franchise will collapse before you have a chance to sign that generational big man to lead you to a championship.

[Illmatic21]

Detroit Pistons.

IMO Ben Wallace was their MVP in that title run, or at least 1b to Billups. He was like prime Rodman on steroids.. possibly literally

If the Wiz had prime Wall/Beal/top 10 pf/Ben Wallace + depth, that's a team that would contend imo. The key is finding that transcendent player to add to Wall and Beal. Whether it's a scorer (ie Durant) or a dominant defensive anchor/rebounder (like Wallace)

Point is, you have to go all the way back to the Piston to find an example of that model working.

I said it when we had Gil signed to an even worse contract and I'll say the same now. Its not a good model for a team. Just like CP3s contract is going to crush the LACs. D Rose's contract will do the same in CHI

At least Walls isnt as bad as those two.

Who said that was our model, though? I think most Wiz fans recognize that we won't contend in this NBA without adding another piece. And that piece would most likely have to be better than Wall, or at least 1b to him. Obviously we haven't acquired that transcendent player yet, so the only thing we can hope for is that Wall/Beal can elevate the franchise to the point of being a desirable FA destination.

[Higga]

Can we fire Wittless yet?

[jivelikenice]

Hands, I think your concern about being built around 2 guards is overblown.

1. This team isn't winning a title built around only 2 guards. A frontcourt piece will be needed if we're going to take that next step

2. Two guards can work together just fine. Wall & Beal showed good chemistry in SL and last season in a limited sample size. In the 10 games that John scored 25+, Brad has averaged 15.7 FGA per game. H'es just shot poorly.

3. On the other hand, John does seem to struggle when Beal is scorching and our offense defaults to Beal running off and behind screens with the other 3 players standing around. Wall is clearly a rhythm player and seems to struggle staying in the flow when he's just standing there. I think that's a coaching problem though and not a player fit problem. If Brad is scorching, let him bring it up some too and use the attention he's drawing to fascilitate somewhat. With the way he played yesterday, you could really stretch out a defense and open things up if you have off the ball movement and more motion. Randy's offense is too simple though. Its "Hey, Brad is hot. Let's feed him and step aside 10 straight possessions".

4. Lastly it comes down to pecking order. The Splash brothers work because they're prioritized in the offense. In our offense Gortat needs his touches, Nene needs his touches, Ariza gets his touches and then over dribbles the ball, and then you have Wall/Beal. All 5 guys want shots and hold the ball. Ariza is clearly outplaying Wesbetr but the reason he fit well was because there was no wasted movement. He either shot it, drove, or passed it...

A coach with a clear offensive identity who can clarify roles is needed. Nene played better yesterday but he bogs things down. Does GS allow Bogut to do that? To me, the offense should run through Wall/Beal/Gortat. Nene should anchor the 2nd unit and Ariza needs to do what he's doing, minus over dribbling.

[Kanyewest]

I'm looking at the game now on replay and I swear I'm not seeing what others are seeing. Grizz game planned beautifully against Wall. They took away everything from him. He had no room whatsoever to operate as Marc Gasol was in mid-season form. The way Gasol was keying on him it was almost like they were playing a box and 1. Game would have been a complete blowout if not for Beal playing out of his mind. He was the biggest reason the game was even close, second being the Grizzlies offensive meltdown most of the 4th... Gortat's foul trouble was a killer, especially the 2nd quarter. Seraphin is such a downgrade on both sides of the court, one Calathes drive on Wall led to an easy two because Seraphin didn't show at all on the pick & roll. I also thought Wittman had no real answer offensively to Grizz basically daring the Wizards to beat them from deep without the drive and kick option and the lack of a legit pick & roll with Gortat saddled with foul problems.

Nights like tonight I can really see the coaching difference.

I'm not seeing the questionable effort from Wall others are seeing. Wall looks completely out of sorts. A mix of passivity after he realizes he isn't getting in the paint and awkwardly forcing the issue when he feels he hasn't done enough. I chalk it up to a bad stretch. Defensively, it's all about falling back into poor habits (bad positioning & not moving his feet) as he's done often this year rather than taking someone lightly or being hungover (which would be hard since it was a travel day).

Hey Dat, watch it again - but don't watch any of the offensive sequences, turn your head. Now watch his defensive effort. Not positioning, effort. And then watch the last couple of minutes of the game. He just isn't bringing it all game long. He is on cruise control. That is why he has been punked by the scrubs.

Yup. And Memphis changed up its defense especially to take the ball out of Bradley Beal's hands.

[dckingsfan]

Can we fire Wittless yet?

Not until we fire EG

[mohammed10]

Can we fire Wittless yet?

Not until we fire EG

Why not just do a two-fer? Can 'em both!