Rondo Trade Rumors & Ideas (update pg 8)

[TA42]

To draft who?

Embiid, Parker, or Wiggins? Who else would be taken in the top 3?

What if two of them don't enter the draft as both Embiid and Parker have stated?

They always say they're considering staying....

That said, why stay when you're projected to be the #1 or #2? You can only hurt you draft stock by going back to school for a year and potentially having an off-year or injury. It's not like they're a fringe lottery player.

I can maybe see staying if the team with the top pick is just an awful situation but still.....you're taking a big chance.

[bigboi]

Rondo would been nice on Houston. Just imagine if they put him in a 08-09 type of role. Team would beat OKC IMO and come out the West

[sully00]

Being realistic if the Celtics were a .500 team in the West you could say they are just a few pieces away but being sub .500 in the East you have a lot of rebuilding to do,

I don't know about that. From my perspective most teams that are .500 or sub .500 are more than a few pieces away. I think, in theory, it's easier for the Celtics to sell FA's as a .500 team in the East because chances are you're fighting for the 5-8 seed whereas in the West you have no shot at the playoffs. In fact, I can't even name the last time the West had a sub .500 playoff team. The East has one practically every season.

Th west is a much tougher conference, being sub .500 in the East means you are worst than your seeding suggests, you would have to go by winning percentage of the entire league to get a true gauge of where you are. Most teams that acquire a star and become contenders are already knocking at the door or in the playoffs. You are not going to be a playoff team next season it's highly unlikely.

Boston is trying to lose games and they have won 19 if Ainge would stop sabotaging the roster they would make the playoffs this year. This comes down to what Rondo wants and he says he wants to be the star of a team. He has been in the playoffs his whole career but was a co star he wants the lead role.

If he wanted out then he would tell them so and they would probably be motivated to deal him, that hasn't happened.

This team is probably more than a year or two away from contending for a title but if their focus is on winning games and the GM treats the off season that way they can make the playoffs.

[sully00]

Embiid, Parker, or Wiggins? Who else would be taken in the top 3?

What if two of them don't enter the draft as both Embiid and Parker have stated?

They always say they're considering staying....

That said, why stay when you're projected to be the #1 or #2? You can only hurt you draft stock by going back to school for a year and potentially having an off-year or injury. It's not like they're a fringe lottery player.

I can maybe see staying if the team with the top pick is just an awful situation but still.....you're taking a big chance.

Because of the new CBA and how it is impacting how GM's handle their roster. The first two years of a rookie deal are guaranteed so if your the number one pick you are guaranteed 10.9 mil but if you bust that is it now. In the past teams would just pay the extra 13 mil for the next two years to try and salvage it but now they are breaking guys off after one year like we saw in Boston. Jan Vessley could go from 6 pick to career over in two years.

So sure it is a lot of money don't get me wrong but if your not ready, and Embiid may not be, then it may be worth waiting another season so that things don't get derailed to start your career. I think staying for your Junior is risky for sure but your sophomore is something different. Keep in mind Embiid didn't start the year as this preordained top pick like Wiggins and Parker it is a different animal.

There is talk that Parker is slipping on teams rankings. They really question is athleticism so while some teams may have him 1 others have him at 5 he may say he wants spend another year at Duke.

My point is how do you trade Rondo for a non certainty. There is no way to know who will have the top 3 picks having the worst record only guarantees the 4th pick and you don't know who is going to be in the draft and their health at that time.

Too many variables, if your trading Rondo for a draft pick you need to know what the pick is who is available.

[chum]

To draft who?

Embiid, Parker, or Wiggins? Who else would be taken in the top 3?

What if two of them don't enter the draft as both Embiid and Parker have stated?

Obviously you will be disappointed, but you will still be positioned to land the best talent available.

[sully00]

Embiid, Parker, or Wiggins? Who else would be taken in the top 3?

What if two of them don't enter the draft as both Embiid and Parker have stated?

Obviously you will be disappointed, but you will still be positioned to land the best talent available.

How about you just keep Rondo until you know who and what you are trading for?

[red96]

Rondo would been nice on Houston. Just imagine if they put him in a 08-09 type of role. Team would beat OKC IMO and come out the West

I don't see how the Rockets could have Rondo play the same role he did in 08. That Celtics team and this Rockets team aren't similarly constructed. That 08 Celtics had good shooters from the 2-4 spot for Rondo. The rumored Rondo trade takes the Rockets best shooter who would be replaced by one whos streaky at best and below average at everthing else. And Rondo would be starting in front of a better shooter then himself. The Rockets would become league worst at 3pt% and ft% by far. Not ideal for Harden and especially Howard. The Rockets would have to find somekind of replacement for Parsons for a Rondo deal to make sense imo.

[Captain_Caveman]

Houston fan here. Over on our side most people have given up on Rondo, it was probably a false rumor is what we are hearing. That being said, I understand not wanting to just give away Rondo, he is a great player. At this point though it seems like Ainge is holding him hostage for a bit too much. This will waste a couple of his prime years, this guys deserves to be on a contender. Being realistic if the Celtics were a .500 team in the West you could say they are just a few pieces away but being sub .500 in the East you have a lot of rebuilding to do, I think he should be allowed to go play for a ring somewhere, I think he's earned that. Anyway, you guys are grade A fans the total opposite of the Lakers crazies and best organization in NBA history. I just wanted to offer my two cents, hope I don't get flamed too much, thanks.

Wanting a lottery pick and a decent prospect for Rondo isn't asking too much, IMO.

Rockets fans vastly overrate their role players, IMO.

No one is overrating anyone, this becomes less about Houston and more about Rondo himself. The teams he would want to stay with really don't have those things so if Ainge wants to trade him, there would have to be a third weaker team involved with the type of picks you guys want, they also would want a good player in exchange for that. You run the risk of Rondo simply leaving for nothing.

I look at it like this. 95% of your success this year is due to having two healthy top 10-15 players. None of the rest of it matters much at all. Coaching, chemistry, role players, depth. You'd have the same record either way, and would still be a second round victim in the playoffs. Orlando already built the same team around Howard (stretch 4 and a bunch of 3-point chuckers, with one guy that can drive), and it's not how you win titles. Simply put, like the Howard Magic, the Rockets aren't man enough. Rondo is. That little **** is fearless, and your team not only needs his playmaking, you need his moxie. All the locker room good vibes in the world aren't going to get you past the real teams you will meet in the playoffs.

It's true that Rondo is a flight risk, for both us and any team trading for him, but in your case, it really doesn't matter if you aren't giving up Harden or Howard for him. The rest is replaceable parts when you get down to it. And even if Rondo leaves a contending Rockets team in 2015, you'd still have max cap room to replace him with. I understand that the current plan involves max cap room and *then* resigning Parsons, but I don't know that you guys will ever have the need to be paying a 4th option the $10-12m a year he may command.

[sam_I_am]

Can we finally lock this over bloated and pointless thread? Rondo isn't getting traded.

[red96]

Wanting a lottery pick and a decent prospect for Rondo isn't asking too much, IMO.

Rockets fans vastly overrate their role players, IMO.

No one is overrating anyone, this becomes less about Houston and more about Rondo himself. The teams he would want to stay with really don't have those things so if Ainge wants to trade him, there would have to be a third weaker team involved with the type of picks you guys want, they also would want a good player in exchange for that. You run the risk of Rondo simply leaving for nothing.

I look at it like this. 95% of your success this year is due to having two healthy top 10-15 players. None of the rest of it matters much at all. Coaching, chemistry, role players, depth. You'd have the same record either way, and would still be a second round victim in the playoffs. Orlando already built the same team around Howard (stretch 4 and a bunch of 3-point chuckers, with one guy that can drive), and it's not how you win titles. Simply put, like the Howard Magic, the Rockets aren't man enough. Rondo is. That little **** is fearless, and your team not only needs his playmaking, you need his moxie. All the locker room good vibes in the world aren't going to get you past the real teams you will meet in the playoffs.

It's true that Rondo is a flight risk, for both us and any team trading for him, but in your case, it really doesn't matter if you aren't giving up Harden or Howard for him. The rest is replaceable parts when you get down to it. And even if Rondo leaves a contending Rockets team in 2015, you'd still have max cap room to replace him with. I understand that the current plan involves max cap room and *then* resigning Parsons, but I don't know that you guys will ever have the need to be paying a 4th option the $10-12m a year he may command.

I agree with you for the most part about the impact of a star player, but you can't discount fit skillset wise. KG/PP/Ray games complimented each others almost perfectly. Say the Celtics landed Iverson instead of Allen, would the results have been the same? Of course not.

If you have the best player in the league like Wade/Lebron together it doesn't really matter as much. If not, complementary skillsets are still a necessity.

[RondoToKG]

I'm glad we held onto Rondo.

[soxfan2003]

No one is overrating anyone, this becomes less about Houston and more about Rondo himself. The teams he would want to stay with really don't have those things so if Ainge wants to trade him, there would have to be a third weaker team involved with the type of picks you guys want, they also would want a good player in exchange for that. You run the risk of Rondo simply leaving for nothing.

I look at it like this. 95% of your success this year is due to having two healthy top 10-15 players. None of the rest of it matters much at all. Coaching, chemistry, role players, depth. You'd have the same record either way, and would still be a second round victim in the playoffs. Orlando already built the same team around Howard (stretch 4 and a bunch of 3-point chuckers, with one guy that can drive), and it's not how you win titles. Simply put, like the Howard Magic, the Rockets aren't man enough. Rondo is. That little **** is fearless, and your team not only needs his playmaking, you need his moxie. All the locker room good vibes in the world aren't going to get you past the real teams you will meet in the playoffs.

It's true that Rondo is a flight risk, for both us and any team trading for him, but in your case, it really doesn't matter if you aren't giving up Harden or Howard for him. The rest is replaceable parts when you get down to it. And even if Rondo leaves a contending Rockets team in 2015, you'd still have max cap room to replace him with. I understand that the current plan involves max cap room and *then* resigning Parsons, but I don't know that you guys will ever have the need to be paying a 4th option the $10-12m a year he may command.

I agree with you for the most part about the impact of a star player, but you can't discount fit skillset wise. KG/PP/Ray games complimented each others almost perfectly. Say the Celtics landed Iverson instead of Allen, would the results have been the same? Of course not.

If you have the best player in the league like Wade/Lebron together it doesn't really matter as much. If not, complementary skillsets are still a necessity.

Even in the case of Wade-Lebron since they don't compliment each other well on offense, it did cost them 1 championship and it almost cost them a 2nd if they weren't save by the SA mini meltdown and Allen coming through in the clutch. Lebron much better off with prime/near prime Ray Allen then near prime Wade but on a different sort of team Wade may be better then even prime Allen. As Lebron/Wade have both acknowledged their games were very similar and neither of them are great floor spacers. Lebron has expanded his a bit which has helped but the Heat playing better with very old Ray Allen in the lineup last year in the playoffs then much younger -- albeit battling knee issues -- Wade was very telling.

[Captain_Caveman]

Yeah, but let's be real... the only thing you need to win a title in this league is three top 25 players and... well... thats it. Spent the last 3 days listening to Rockets fans brag about Parsons being the 7th best SF as if that matters in a league where the 7th best SF is closer to 30th best than they are to 4th best. Jeff Green is probably the 8th best SF and most Celtics fans don't care if he lives or dies. At the end of the day, getting that 3rd top 25 player in Rondo for the spare parts they had to offer would have been a steal for Houston, and if most of their homer fans don't get that, that's on them.

As with the Asik Sweepstakes (lol), just some truly putrid basketball takes from Rockets fans this past week. Reading that clutchfans thread with a bunch of nippleheads trying to sort out semi-legit trade rumors was like watching ten monkeys **** a football.

[chum]

What if two of them don't enter the draft as both Embiid and Parker have stated?

Obviously you will be disappointed, but you will still be positioned to land the best talent available.

How about you just keep Rondo until you know who and what you are trading for?

This whole discussion was based on the hypothetical of trading Rondo for a 50% return and guaranteeing our pick was top 3 compared to keeping Rondo and picking 8-10.

[humblebum]

The NBA is the simplest and most difficult professional sport in terms of how to build a champion. Caveman is right, ELITE top 10-15 talent is ALL THAT MATTERS.

Everything else on your roster is essentially cogs in the machine, spare parts. Sure, if you have ELITE role players like Fisher, Horry, Kukoc, Ray Allen, James Posey, etc. that will help you perhaps win multiple championships or set records but at the end of the day you could replace those guys with somewhat lesser guys and still be a champion in the Association.

I was on the trade Rondo bandwagon for years, but ALL SIGNS point to him wanting to be "the guy" in Boston after playing second fiddle to the vets, and ALL SIGNS point to Ainge wanting to keep Rondo.

I think the only question is HOW QUICKLY will Ainge look to make moves to put the Celtics in contention. I hope it happens in the upcoming season but it's probably more realistic to look a couple years ahead for the big moves.

[Stadium5]

The NBA is the simplest and most difficult professional sport in terms of how to build a champion. Caveman is right, ELITE top 10-15 talent is ALL THAT MATTERS.

Everything else on your roster is essentially cogs in the machine, spare parts. Sure, if you have ELITE role players like Fisher, Horry, Kukoc, Ray Allen, James Posey, etc. that will help you perhaps win multiple championships or set records but at the end of the day you could replace those guys with somewhat lesser guys and still be a champion in the Association.

I was on the trade Rondo bandwagon for years, but ALL SIGNS point to him wanting to be "the guy" in Boston after playing second fiddle to the vets, and ALL SIGNS point to Ainge wanting to keep Rondo.

I think the only question is HOW QUICKLY will Ainge look to make moves to put the Celtics in contention. I hope it happens in the upcoming season but it's probably more realistic to look a couple years ahead for the big moves.

Being rumored in trade rumors year after year isn't a sign that he wants to keep Rondo, It's a sign that he'll give him away for only the right price and nothing less

[bigboi]

Rondo would been nice on Houston. Just imagine if they put him in a 08-09 type of role. Team would beat OKC IMO and come out the West

I don't see how the Rockets could have Rondo play the same role he did in 08. That Celtics team and this Rockets team aren't similarly constructed. That 08 Celtics had good shooters from the 2-4 spot for Rondo. The rumored Rondo trade takes the Rockets best shooter who would be replaced by one whos streaky at best and below average at everthing else. And Rondo would be starting in front of a better shooter then himself. The Rockets would become league worst at 3pt% and ft% by far. Not ideal for Harden and especially Howard. The Rockets would have to find somekind of replacement for Parsons for a Rondo deal to make sense imo.

Houston was rumored to be going after Deng as well and I assume that Lin would be traded for a piece. Although Rondo's shooting is bad, he does provide a grittiness and leadership to the team. If Deng was traded for then, the 08-09 Rondo comparison would be more valid. Dwight would be the KG of the situation, Harden the Pierce and Deng the Allen. Rondo would be the glue guy to put it all together. If all went well then that team would come out the West and could very well be the best team in the West

[LarsV8]

At the end of the day, getting that 3rd top 25 player in Rondo for the spare parts they had to offer would have been a steal for Houston, and if most of their homer fans don't get that, that's on them.

Meh,

Plenty of more opportunities to pick up top 25 players over the next year and a half. Rockets real weakness is defensive rebounding right now. Rondo doesn't really help in that area, plus probably not enough time to gel for the playoffs anyway.

[ryaningf]

Top takeaways from all this drama:

1. Woj, Sean Deveney and to a lesser extent Sam Amick are the only national guys I trust when it comes to speculation about the Cs. Deveney has been writing articles since last summer about how Rondo wasn't getting traded, that the Cs wanted to build with him, etc. He basically laughed off the Sacramento rumor when it came out and wondered why something shot down 2 months ago suddenly had legs. In the midst of all the Houston/Boston hype, Woj is like "I haven't heard anything about Rondo" and then Amick's classic "HOU and BOS haven't even talked". The rest of the dudes out there, talking Spears, Stein, Broussard, they got played this deadline.

2. Who else got played? Those half-assed insiders at Clutchcity. There's no doubting they've had good info in the past and I believe they're probably close to a player or an agent, but you know what, once you start putting up inside info on a site year after year and your source gets wind that you're putting it out there you just open yourself up to getting mouthpieced by that same source for ulterior reasons and that's what happened here.

3. Speaking of Clutchcity, the human waste facility of Internet message boards. 10 minutes reading a thread there is tantamount to hitting yourself with a hammer. 98% gif-spouting numbnuts with only 1 or 2 people who know what the f they're even talking about. in other words, the perfect fanbase to appreciate a fake superstar like Dwight Howard.

[VeryMuchWoke]

Is there anything to be made of this?

@BaxterHolmes: Rondo declined to talk to reporters today.