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On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking.

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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#41 » by Moochthemonkey » Sun Mar 2, 2014 9:59 am

Ring_Wanted wrote: but no player ever is going to play bad on purpose.


Exactly, end up of debate. Since the players and coaches are the only ones who can actually affect the result of the game, tanking will always be a concept argued amongst fans but not so much one that can directly be proven. Of course, there is the semantic issue as rsavaj initially pointed out, losing on purpose vs. building a crap roster where losses *should* come organically. Look at the game threads last year, or the year before, or the the year before that- a tanker of the second definition wouldn't get upset when their team wins a game they weren't "supposed" to win (look at the Spurs game last year, believe it or not, there were suns fans on this forum that were mad when Wes Johnson hit the three to take it into overtime). Dead horse, sorry. But just clarifying to make a point.

But really, designing a poor roster, or tearing it down on purpose is something any GM should be able to do without being called out for it. It looks really ugly, but it's a respectable path for your franchise and in my opinion there is nothing dishonest in implementing such strategy considering the nature of the NBA.


I don't think there was anything dishonest about what Colangelo said/planned. On the other hand the Sixers could have been a bit more graceful in how they handled things over the summer. Otherwise, I don't think anyone here was the least bit upset when Gortat (good deal as it included a pick), Scola (turned out to be a great deal for us, but looked like low-value at the time), and Butler (for practically nothing) were traded. As all other rebuilding teams too, they clear out the vets to give more time for lesser-experienced players. Development trumps winning although in some cases they can go hand in hand as they did with this years raptors and suns.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#42 » by RunDogGun » Sun Mar 2, 2014 3:48 pm

Ring_Wanted wrote:
RunDogGun wrote:
SF88 wrote:Ok, fine lets forget tanking for a minute then.

Do you admit that GMs intentionally construct rosters which are supposed to suck so that they can get a better draft pick?


That's tough to answer.

I think the answer is a resounding yes. GMs realize their roster can't compete and do moves to gain flexibility and future assets. It's been going on forever, and only recently it's been labeled as a negative thing, which is kind of hypocritical in my opinion, since the system not only allows it, but to some extent it even 'forces' you to go that way. 'Force' in the sense that you know you are going nowhere and it makes no sense to preserve an statu quo that can't be discernibly improved, at least with relative ease due to the rules in place.


But what you are saying doesn't answer that question. I would not say GM's intentionally make rosters to suck to with the draft in mind a whole year before the draft. Do some GM's clear cap and go with new young players? Sure. Does every GM secretly and sometimes publicly hope to win the lotto? Sure.

But the question in the way it was worded was leading to the dishonesty in which you later brought up, which I still feel is tough to answer and even know. What looks like a bad move that would hurt the team in one season to someone from the outside, might not be a bad move for that team. So far only BC has said anything close to that, and even his words make it is sound on the up and up.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#43 » by Sunsdeuce » Sun Mar 2, 2014 4:30 pm

So some here think coaches don't try and lose games. Lol, guess what you favorite team and coach tried to lose games. There is so much some of you don't understand and refuse to see. Basketball is sports and not everything is on the up and up. Wake up!!

2005-06 Phoenix Suns
"In 2006, the Phoenix Suns gave the Los Angeles Lakers an easy win late in the regular season to try to assure a matchup with the Lakers in the postseason, according to Jack McCallum in “Seven Seconds or Less.” McCallum was a Sports Illustrated writer who spent the 2005-06 season as an unofficial “assistant coach” for the Suns, and he provided this insight on how the coaching staff manipulated the standings:
The Suns believe that the Lakers' transition defense is close to nonexistent and will provide an open highway for the Nash-led fast break, so this was the matchup they wanted. [Suns coach Mike] D'Antoni couldn't precisely orchestrate it -- not in an eighty-two-game season -- but the coach had benched [Steve] Nash and Raja Bell for that late-season game, all but assuring a Laker win that would help them beat out the Sacramento Kings, who were in eighth place.
The Suns' scheme almost backfired, as the Lakers took a 3-1 lead in the series and nearly closed Phoenix out before the Suns famously rallied to take three straight and advance."
http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blog ... esktop&wjb
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#44 » by RunDogGun » Sun Mar 2, 2014 5:58 pm

Sunsdeuce wrote:I'm done writing about this topic.

You should stick with this. :D
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#45 » by Sunsdeuce » Sun Mar 2, 2014 6:13 pm

RunDogGun wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:I'm done writing about this topic.

You should stick with this. :D

You should stick to band practice.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#46 » by Moochthemonkey » Sun Mar 2, 2014 8:25 pm

Sunsdeuce wrote:So some here think coaches don't try and lose games. Lol, guess what you favorite team and coach tried to lose games. There is so much some of you don't understand and refuse to see. Basketball is sports and not everything is on the up and up. Wake up!!

2005-06 Phoenix Suns
"In 2006, the Phoenix Suns gave the Los Angeles Lakers an easy win late in the regular season to try to assure a matchup with the Lakers in the postseason, according to Jack McCallum in “Seven Seconds or Less.” McCallum was a Sports Illustrated writer who spent the 2005-06 season as an unofficial “assistant coach” for the Suns, and he provided this insight on how the coaching staff manipulated the standings:
The Suns believe that the Lakers' transition defense is close to nonexistent and will provide an open highway for the Nash-led fast break, so this was the matchup they wanted. [Suns coach Mike] D'Antoni couldn't precisely orchestrate it -- not in an eighty-two-game season -- but the coach had benched [Steve] Nash and Raja Bell for that late-season game, all but assuring a Laker win that would help them beat out the Sacramento Kings, who were in eighth place.
The Suns' scheme almost backfired, as the Lakers took a 3-1 lead in the series and nearly closed Phoenix out before the Suns famously rallied to take three straight and advance."
http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blog ... esktop&wjb


Usually when one talks about tanking- it implicates a long term plan to lose.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#47 » by Sunsdeuce » Sun Mar 2, 2014 8:41 pm

Moochthemonkey wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:So some here think coaches don't try and lose games. Lol, guess what you favorite team and coach tried to lose games. There is so much some of you don't understand and refuse to see. Basketball is sports and not everything is on the up and up. Wake up!!

2005-06 Phoenix Suns
"In 2006, the Phoenix Suns gave the Los Angeles Lakers an easy win late in the regular season to try to assure a matchup with the Lakers in the postseason, according to Jack McCallum in “Seven Seconds or Less.” McCallum was a Sports Illustrated writer who spent the 2005-06 season as an unofficial “assistant coach” for the Suns, and he provided this insight on how the coaching staff manipulated the standings:
The Suns believe that the Lakers' transition defense is close to nonexistent and will provide an open highway for the Nash-led fast break, so this was the matchup they wanted. [Suns coach Mike] D'Antoni couldn't precisely orchestrate it -- not in an eighty-two-game season -- but the coach had benched [Steve] Nash and Raja Bell for that late-season game, all but assuring a Laker win that would help them beat out the Sacramento Kings, who were in eighth place.
The Suns' scheme almost backfired, as the Lakers took a 3-1 lead in the series and nearly closed Phoenix out before the Suns famously rallied to take three straight and advance."
http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blog ... esktop&wjb


Usually when one talks about tanking- it implicates a long term plan to lose.

Lol, sure buddy!! Tanking games and tanking seasons. It's still tanking.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#48 » by Sunsdeuce » Sun Mar 2, 2014 8:44 pm

When tankers tell the truth
APRIL 16, 2012 2:25:28 PM PDT
By Royce Webb

NBA teams have been tanking for decades to improve their draft position (and for other reasons), and NBA insiders have talked about tanking for decades -- in fact, over the years the NBA itself has recognized the potential for tanking and dealt with it in various ways, including altering the draft system multiple times to try to prevent it. Meanwhile, as the discourse about tanking has gone public, there have been thousands of articles written about the problem, including by such writers as Sam Smith and Bill Simmons.

HoopIdea on tanking

Tanking: Far worse than you think
OKC is not a role model
Jeff Van Gundy's tanking fix
The five-year lottery
Get rid of the draft
Bill Simmons vs. tanking
Tanking hurts fans
Parity through paying rookies more
Does tanking even work?
Fix tanking: Grading on a curve

HoopIdea has carried forward this discussion as part of our effort to improve the game. As we said on Day 1 of HoopIdea: Basketball is the best game ever. Now let’s make it better.

To make the game the best it can be, we want to make sure that when fans show up or watch on TV, both teams are always trying to win. And the NBA does, too. As Joel Litvin, the NBA’s president for basketball operations, told Howard Beck of The New York Times in 2008: “If we ever found a team was intentionally losing games, we would take the strongest possible action in response.”

Given that, it’s worth noting that tanking has been confessed to dozens of times off the record and a surprising number of times on the record:

2006-07 Boston Celtics
In 2007, with Greg Oden and Kevin Durant as the big lottery prizes, several teams were openly questioned about apparent tanking, including the Boston Celtics, Milwaukee Bucks and Memphis Grizzlies, the three teams that ended up with the best chance of drafting Oden or Durant.

In one notorious game late in the season, the Celtics, playing at home, led the woeful Bobcats 69-51 late in the third quarter -- and managed to lose the game by eight points, enhancing their draft positioning. Of course, Celtics coach Doc Rivers denied tanking charges. As Steve Bulpett reported in the Boston Herald: “Rivers insisted there was nothing sinister about leaving Paul Pierce (game-high 23 points) on the bench for the fourth quarter and letting the quintet of Sebastian Telfair, Ryan Gomes, Gerald Green, Allan Ray and Leon Powe stay on the parquet as the lead -- still at 10 with nine minutes left in the game -- disappeared.”

In the final week of the season, the Celtics and Bucks, both maneuvering for the best possible draft position, played each other and gave DNPs to high scorers Paul Pierce, Al Jefferson, Wally Szczerbiak, Michael Redd and Mo Williams.

After the game, the Associated Press reported:
Ryan Gomes had 13 through three quarters, but watched from the bench in the fourth as Boston clinched the worst record in the Eastern Conference and second worst in the league.

"I probably (would have played), but since we were in the hunt for a high draft pick, of course things are different," Gomes said. "I understand that. Hopefully things get better. Now that we clinched at least having the second-most balls in the lottery, the last three games we'll see what happens. We'll see if we can go out and finish some games."
2002-03 Cleveland Cavaliers
Did the 2002-03 Cavs tank to get LeBron James?

At the time, many assumed they did. John Lucas, who coached the team from 2001 to 2003, admitted somewhat bitterly that he went along with the apparent conspiracy: "They trade all our guys away and we go real young, and the goal was to get LeBron and also to sell the team," Lucas told AOL FanHouse in 2010. "You can't fault the Cavaliers for wanting to get LeBron. It was hard to get free agents to come there."

Lucas pointed out that before the 2002-03 season, Cavs management traded their three leading scorers and received almost nothing of value in return. Of course, Gordon Gund, the Cavs’ owner at the time, denied Lucas’ claims that the Cavs were tanking to get LeBron, the local hero.

Ricky Davis was one of the beneficiaries of the Cavs’ questionable moves -- in 2002-03, after several key teammates had been traded away, he led Cleveland by far in minutes, field goal attempts, scoring, assists and steals.

Yet he, too, told AOL Fanhouse that the Cavs were losing on purpose: "It was tough on [Lucas]. They were forcing him to lose and I know it's nothing he wanted to do. It's just the position he was forced in. But it's tough. ... It worked, whatever they did [to get James] so it's hard to knock them. They got what they wanted. But it was hard on Luke."

2005-06 Phoenix Suns
In 2006, the Phoenix Suns gave the Los Angeles Lakers an easy win late in the regular season to try to assure a matchup with the Lakers in the postseason, according to Jack McCallum in “Seven Seconds or Less.” McCallum was a Sports Illustrated writer who spent the 2005-06 season as an unofficial “assistant coach” for the Suns, and he provided this insight on how the coaching staff manipulated the standings:
The Suns believe that the Lakers' transition defense is close to nonexistent and will provide an open highway for the Nash-led fast break, so this was the matchup they wanted. [Suns coach Mike] D'Antoni couldn't precisely orchestrate it -- not in an eighty-two-game season -- but the coach had benched [Steve] Nash and Raja Bell for that late-season game, all but assuring a Laker win that would help them beat out the Sacramento Kings, who were in eighth place.
The Suns' scheme almost backfired, as the Lakers took a 3-1 lead in the series and nearly closed Phoenix out before the Suns famously rallied to take three straight and advance.

2005-06 Minnesota Timberwolves
The most spectacular tank job in recent memory occurred on April 19, 2006, in a Minnesota-Memphis game that is still a common punch line around the league.

Earlier that month, Chicago Tribune NBA writer Sam Smith had called out the Timberwolves and the league:
The NBA should take a look at this one in the interest of the game's integrity and paying customers. Minnesota needs to have one of the top 10 poorest records to keep its draft pick. Otherwise, it goes to the Clippers from the Sam Cassell-Marko Jaric deal.

In a 103-95 loss to the Jazz at home on Friday, [Kevin] Garnett sat out the fourth quarter after making all of his third-quarter shots. Garnett had 13 rebounds through three quarters, and Minnesota was outrebounded 18-6 in the fourth.

It's reminiscent of the game-throwing days before the draft lottery was started.
In the final game of the season, the Wolves sat Garnett and Ricky Davis, and then turned the game against Memphis into a joke by inserting Mark Madsen and letting him fire away. In six seasons, Madsen had made only one 3-pointer in nine attempts. But in that game he tossed up seven 3-pointers and missed them all -- they were his only 3-point attempts of the season. The Wolves lost the game in double overtime (Madsen started the second overtime with three 3-point bricks in less than a minute) and secured the draft pick.

After the game, Wolves coach Dwane Casey didn’t deny that the team was less than serious about winning the game: "The guys were having fun with it. For what we've been through this season, I thought the guys deserved it. I hope what we did didn't make a mockery of the game."

Was it a victimless crime? By securing a top-10 draft position, the Timberwolves prevented the Clippers from receiving the draft pick that became 2007 Rookie of the Year Brandon Roy (a future three-time All-Star whom the Wolves traded to Portland on draft night). And the Memphis win put the unfortunate Grizzlies (who also might have been motivated to lose the game) into a more difficult playoff bracket -- the Grizzlies started the postseason on the road and were swept by Dallas in the first round rather than having home-court advantage over a struggling Denver Nuggets team (which lost its first-round series to the Clippers).

On the flip side, the draft pick that did not go to the Clippers in 2006 eventually became the pick that allowed L.A. to acquire Chris Paul from New Orleans in 2011 -- and the Timberwolves will not get to use their own lottery pick this season, in part because of that infamous night in 2006.

1996-97 Boston Celtics
One of the most notorious years for tanking was 1997. It’s widely believed that the San Antonio Spurs tanked the season by holding out David Robinson longer than necessary to secure a higher draft pick, which became the most coveted player available, Tim Duncan. In fact, to many, this is one of the most incredibly successful tank jobs in NBA history, in part because the Spurs were already a very good team, and they have won four titles and counting with Duncan leading the way. But to our knowledge, no one involved has admitted that the Spurs were tanking.

The same year, though, the Boston Celtics did indeed tank, according to longtime Celtic M.L. Carr, who coached the team from 1995 to 1997. In 1996-97, the Celtics fell from 33 wins the previous season to 15 wins.

According to Mark Cofman of the Boston Herald, in 2001:
Carr suggested his last season as Celtics coach in 1996-97, during which the team suffered through a franchise-worst 15-67 record, was a tank job designed to deliver the incoming coach (Rick Pitino) with strong draft position. "That was part of the orchestration," said Carr, an obvious indictment of the entire organization and its part in encouraging a losing season in an attempt to get the first overall pick (Tim Duncan). As it turned out, the Celtics lost out on Duncan and settled for the third and sixth overall picks.
Pitino’s tenure as Boston coach would be a great disappointment, and he often lamented that he had taken the job with the expectation that the Celtics would get Duncan.

1983-84 Houston Rockets
Why do we have a draft lottery? Because of what happened in 1984.

In his book “Tip-Off,” a thorough account of the pivotal 1984 NBA draft, Filip Bondy dedicates a chapter to tanking entitled “Embracing Defeat.”

The ’84 draft included Hakeem Olajuwon, Sam Bowie, Michael Jordan, Sam Perkins and Charles Barkley. Bondy recounts some of the odd behavior of the Houston Rockets, who appeared to be maneuvering for the right to draft Olajuwon, a star at the University of Houston, with Jordan as a nice Plan B. (The right to make the first choice in the draft was decided by coin flip.)

As the Rockets nosedived, everyone noticed.

"Weird things were happening. A lot of funny stuff going on, leaving a dark mark on the integrity of the game," said Pat Williams, then the general manager of the Philadelphia 76ers.

According to Dr. Jack Ramsay, then coach of the Portland Trail Blazers, "There was a lot of reason for concern, for suspicion."

As reported by Bondy, it was Frank Layden, the former Utah Jazz coach, who spilled the beans on the Rocket science: "They were losing on purpose. That was told to me by one of their executives, that it was a business decision. And that’s why we went to the lottery system. It’s still going on a little bit today, anyway."

Bondy writes: "The NBA’s image suffered a severe blow that spring from all the suspicious losing. … The league was so concerned about the perceived chicanery that its board of governors instituted a lottery system weeks after the 1984 draft to assure such nonsense would never happen again."

Then again: As we’ve seen above, the lottery does not assure that tanking ended in 1984. Not even close.

Furthermore, these are hardly the only cases in recent NBA history, and HoopIdea will continue to bring tanking to light.

Tags: Boston Celtics, Phoenix Suns, Minnesota Timberwolves, Cleveland Cavaliers, Houston Rockets, HoopIdea, Royce Webb
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#49 » by Moochthemonkey » Sun Mar 2, 2014 9:03 pm

Sunsdeuce wrote:
Moochthemonkey wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:So some here think coaches don't try and lose games. Lol, guess what you favorite team and coach tried to lose games. There is so much some of you don't understand and refuse to see. Basketball is sports and not everything is on the up and up. Wake up!!

2005-06 Phoenix Suns
"In 2006, the Phoenix Suns gave the Los Angeles Lakers an easy win late in the regular season to try to assure a matchup with the Lakers in the postseason, according to Jack McCallum in “Seven Seconds or Less.” McCallum was a Sports Illustrated writer who spent the 2005-06 season as an unofficial “assistant coach” for the Suns, and he provided this insight on how the coaching staff manipulated the standings:
The Suns believe that the Lakers' transition defense is close to nonexistent and will provide an open highway for the Nash-led fast break, so this was the matchup they wanted. [Suns coach Mike] D'Antoni couldn't precisely orchestrate it -- not in an eighty-two-game season -- but the coach had benched [Steve] Nash and Raja Bell for that late-season game, all but assuring a Laker win that would help them beat out the Sacramento Kings, who were in eighth place.
The Suns' scheme almost backfired, as the Lakers took a 3-1 lead in the series and nearly closed Phoenix out before the Suns famously rallied to take three straight and advance."
http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blog ... esktop&wjb


Usually when one talks about tanking- it implicates a long term plan to lose.

Lol, sure buddy!! Tanking games and tanking seasons. It's still tanking.


Depends. The purpose of tanking is to acquire better draft position- that's not done by a single game, especially by a team that has already clinched the playoffs.

Not that I condone what the Suns did though (see what almost what happened)
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#50 » by Sunsdeuce » Sun Mar 2, 2014 9:31 pm

Moochthemonkey wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:
Moochthemonkey wrote:
Usually when one talks about tanking- it implicates a long term plan to lose.

Lol, sure buddy!! Tanking games and tanking seasons. It's still tanking.


Depends. The purpose of tanking is to acquire better draft position- that's not done by a single game, especially by a team that has already clinched the playoffs.

Not that I condone what the Suns did though (see what almost what happened)

The point of that was coaches are in on losing games too. Players arent innocent either. Just because they show up doesn't mean they try when they are on the court. Many documented moments in sports of players throwing games. What I am trying to say is that things aren't always as rosey as people are led to believe. I think we can all agree there is a lot of corruption in almost everything in today's world.

Tanking, whether on a large scale or small scale happens. Does it hurt a product, sure it does. This year is a great example of how it hurts the product. There are more below average teams than above average. It's widely known which teams are tanking their season especially knowing this is a really good draft.

If teams didn't try and tank there would be no need for a draft lottery system. Although the draft lottery is still not effective in stopping tanking, The draft lottery has to be reworked. It's obvious that the NBA knows that tanking is a major problem. They recently proposed a set draft spot for each team each year. If there was no problems with teams trying to tank there would be no lottery or again trying change the draft structure to discourage tanking. The commish knows tanking happens and that is why they are trying to change the draft system yet again.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#51 » by b-ball forever » Sun Mar 2, 2014 10:51 pm

lol, mucho sensitivity over word definition going on in here. :lol:

"Tanking" is a colloquial term, and like many colloquial terms, the word has several meanings.

Just like "killing it" can mean both "performing dominantly" or "taking the fun out of", or like "nigg@" can mean both "my man" or "dirty black bastard", the term "tanking" can be used for both : "players/coaches purposefully throwing games" AND "management throwing together a young crappy team that will lose even if the players do their best to try winning".

Tanking can also mean epic failing, so Lindsey Hunter was clearly tanking last year as well per se. Apparently tanking can be used to define "sucking ===D" too, so Richard Jefferson of the Jazz is also one hell of a tanker!!!

Adam Silver was obviously referring to players/coaches throwing games in his interview (whether or not he is right), while Colangelo and that GM who admitted that there was tanking going on in the NBA this offseason, or most of the fans who want their team to go young were referring to management tanking via roster construction.

At the end of the day, it really isn't a big issue how the word is used.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#52 » by SDC » Mon Mar 3, 2014 3:47 am

the sixers play like having the worst point differentials matter in breaking a tie for league worst record. THIS IS NOT THE EPL!
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#53 » by SDC » Mon Mar 3, 2014 3:48 am

do we get to play the sixers again? #automaticwin
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#54 » by BurningHeart » Mon Mar 3, 2014 4:05 am

This whole thread is why basketball is a joke.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#55 » by jcsunsfan » Mon Mar 3, 2014 8:38 am

Funny how people deny ranking exists by changing the definition of the word. Going young is not necessarily tanking. Purposefully planning to try to get a better draft pick is. It is possible for the GM to be tanking while the coach and players are not.

Yes tanking exists and it has for years. The draft lottery itself is an admission of that fact. If teams did not tank a draft based upon record alone would work just fine.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#56 » by Revived » Thu Mar 13, 2014 5:19 am

jcsunsfan wrote:Funny how people deny ranking exists by changing the definition of the word. Going young is not necessarily tanking. Purposefully planning to try to get a better draft pick is. It is possible for the GM to be tanking while the coach and players are not.

Yes tanking exists and it has for years. The draft lottery itself is an admission of that fact. If teams did not tank a draft based upon record alone would work just fine.

Exactly.

Look at the two teams with most rings in the NBA history. The Lakers and Celtics are both tanking cause they know the kids in this draft have superstar potential.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#57 » by NaturalBuns » Thu Mar 13, 2014 5:52 am

SF88 wrote:
jcsunsfan wrote:Funny how people deny ranking exists by changing the definition of the word. Going young is not necessarily tanking. Purposefully planning to try to get a better draft pick is. It is possible for the GM to be tanking while the coach and players are not.

Yes tanking exists and it has for years. The draft lottery itself is an admission of that fact. If teams did not tank a draft based upon record alone would work just fine.

Exactly.

Look at the two teams with most rings in the NBA history. The Lakers and Celtics are both tanking cause they know the kids in this draft have superstar potential.


Lakers are not tanking that roster just sucks.
Howard left them and Kobe and Nash have been hurt.

Boston is forsure ranking though
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#58 » by jcsunsfan » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:18 am

NaturalBuns wrote:
SF88 wrote:
jcsunsfan wrote:Funny how people deny ranking exists by changing the definition of the word. Going young is not necessarily tanking. Purposefully planning to try to get a better draft pick is. It is possible for the GM to be tanking while the coach and players are not.

Yes tanking exists and it has for years. The draft lottery itself is an admission of that fact. If teams did not tank a draft based upon record alone would work just fine.

Exactly.

Look at the two teams with most rings in the NBA history. The Lakers and Celtics are both tanking cause they know the kids in this draft have superstar potential.


Lakers are not tanking that roster just sucks.
Howard left them and Kobe and Nash have been hurt.

Boston is forsure ranking though


Kobe could play, but he will sit the rest of the year. That's tanking.

The Suns probably should right now too. If they can let Minny pass them they would end up with 13, 14, 18, and 29. If they keep trying and make the playoffs pushing Minny out it will be 18, 20, 29.

I've been a Suns fan too long to worry about having 1 playoff series when there is that kind of cache for the future available.
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Re: On Bryan Colangelo, rebuilding, and tanking. 

Post#59 » by Revived » Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:38 am

Bogut was asked how he felt about the "killer lineup" of Green with Stephen Curry, Klay Thompson and Andre Iguodala.

“It’s great," said Bogut. "Our defense is really moving and clicking. People say our scoring will struggle with that lineup, last night they didn’t. It’s definitely a lineup I like playing with consistently,” said Bogut, who then remarked on the Warriors’ point total against Utah (130).

“Season high, yeah. Albeit against a team that is somewhat tanking. But yeah, it’s very, very interesting.”

Hmm so even an NBA player a legit starting C for a West playoff team thinks that teams tank in this league.

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