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GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+

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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#381 » by dlts20 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:49 am

Illmatic21 wrote:
dlts20 wrote:
Illmatic21 wrote:He averaged 26ppg against teams with absolutely no interior defense. Against good defensive teams, Wall still doesn't have the skillset to consistently break down defenses and score. He really needs to work on his scoring game this summer, he simply doesn't have any go to moves.

I disagree. Ive seen him have big games against the best defenses. Its more of aggression. Just like he's had low scoring games against bad defensive teams also.

With all that being said. Ill say it over and over again. The system hurts Wall. He would be a much better scorer, attacker in a better p&r system. Also, I would still like to see either Harringto start or play more with Wall. Either change the system or get him a stretch 4.

That lack of 'aggression' comes from not having any reliable scoring moves. Early in a game Wall will check if his jumper is on that day.. if it's not, then he'll just fall back and stop trying to break down the defense.

He has no subtlety or polish to his scoring game, other than his carry/crossover he doesn't know how to set defenders up or get to where he wants on the floor.

Wall always says "I'm going to be aggressive" but half the time he says that he doesn't actually do it, because he can't. Once he sees that defenses are playing him a certain way, he loses confidence in his abilities to attack.

If Chris Paul said "I"m gonna drop 40 tonight" he would go out and do it. His game is so much more advanced than Wall's, he's constantly probing and trying to set up the defense. He has a reliable midrange game, he can post up other guards and turn over either shoulder. He can get to the lane at will, not because of pure athleticism but from his misdirection and quickness. Wall rarely ever shows that ability. And Paul takes 3 fewer FGA/g than Wall, yet still gets to the line more.

Wall's offense is a lot better than it was when he came into the league, but it's still the main weakness holding him back from being a truly great player.

you downplay Wall way way too much. So many of our fans do. He averaged 23ppg for the last 2 months of last season on 45% shooting and was dropping 47 on Mephis and nearly 40 on Indy. Some of the best defenses. This year he is averageing 20ppg. He won POW with 3 straight games over 31 in November, he aveaged nearly 22ppg on 45% shooting in December, he averaged 20.5 & 9ast in Feb on 45% shooting, he just won POW averageing 25 & 10 despite playing in a crap system that is made exactly for the opposite kinda player he is.

He has more to his game then you give him credit for and would show it in a different system. He would own a p&r, attacking the rim non stop, and splitting double teams all day if Witt ran it better or if he didnt play with 2 low post bigs. He finishes at the rim way better thn Westbrook & Rose. He doesnt play in these stat systems like Dragic or the Lakers, and stuff like that.

Add to that he plays on a team where no one can create for themselves so he has to walk the fine line of getting everyone involved while being the leading scorer and thats with a coach who basically tells him to fall back anytime he tries to score alot even though he's clearly a pass 1st guy. Even now when you say he's not doing this or that, its because teams do all tehy can to stop him. If he was so bad at scoring for himself they wouldnt guard him the way they do. They tried to trap him all day tonight. Why do that if he cant score?
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#382 » by Sluggerface » Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:49 am

Wizardspride wrote:
Illmatic21 wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:Tell me about it.

That's the one thing I don't like about this board. :nonono:

The "best team in the NBA" had just lost 3 in a row, they were far from unbeatable. Obviously Miami is the better team. But a lot of people are annoyed by the fact that we had a chance to win the game and the way we lost exposed a lack of competence from the coach, and very poor play from some of the players.

I'm not happy with the loss either but the name calling just doesn't sit well with me.

Calling people baboons etc....yeah, not cool.

I think what really irks me is the bipolar nature of some of our fans.

One moment John is the next great PG and the next moment people call him names and want him traded.

It's not easy out on the court and sometimes people screw up.

It is what it is.

But with that being said, Wittman leaves much to be desired as a coach....I'll be the first to admit that.


I'm personally not interested in becoming just like a nihilist defeatist Knicks fan that just goes along with every decision there terrible organization makes just because.

Wittman needs to go, this isn't up for debate. There have been numerous articles this season from organizations not even associated inside the DMV, (even NBA.com) bringing Wittman's inefficiencies to light.

Being an apologist is counter productive to the best decision this team can make to improve, which is letting go of Randy Wittman.

At this point, I want Wit gone more than I do Ernie, and I never thought I would ever say that.
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#383 » by Wizardspride » Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:51 am

Sluggerface wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:
Illmatic21 wrote:The "best team in the NBA" had just lost 3 in a row, they were far from unbeatable. Obviously Miami is the better team. But a lot of people are annoyed by the fact that we had a chance to win the game and the way we lost exposed a lack of competence from the coach, and very poor play from some of the players.

I'm not happy with the loss either but the name calling just doesn't sit well with me.

Calling people baboons etc....yeah, not cool.

I think what really irks me is the bipolar nature of some of our fans.

One moment John is the next great PG and the next moment people call him names and want him traded.

It's not easy out on the court and sometimes people screw up.

It is what it is.

But with that being said, Wittman leaves much to be desired as a coach....I'll be the first to admit that.


I'm personally not interested in becoming just like a nihilist defeatist Knicks fan that just goes along with every decision there terrible organization makes just because.

Wittman needs to go, this isn't up for debate. There have been numerous articles this season from organizations not even associated inside the DMV, (even NBA.com) bringing Wittman's inefficiencies to light.

Being an apologist is counter productive to the best decision this team can make to improve, which is letting go of Randy Wittman.

At this point, I want Wit gone more than I do Ernie, and I never thought I would ever say that.

Completely agree with you.

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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#384 » by dlts20 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:54 am

Ive been saying I would get rid of Witt before Ernie. The problem is I still dont trust them to bring the right guy in to fit Wall
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#385 » by GhostsOfGil » Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:56 am

I'll just say this and call it a night.. While I'm sure there were adjustments Wittman could have made on the offense end, I credit Miami's defense over Witt's lineup failures.
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#386 » by nuposse04 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:59 am

Wizardspride wrote:
Illmatic21 wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:Tell me about it.

That's the one thing I don't like about this board. :nonono:

The "best team in the NBA" had just lost 3 in a row, they were far from unbeatable. Obviously Miami is the better team. But a lot of people are annoyed by the fact that we had a chance to win the game and the way we lost exposed a lack of competence from the coach, and very poor play from some of the players.

I'm not happy with the loss either but the name calling just doesn't sit well with me.

Calling people baboons etc....yeah, not cool.

I think what really irks me is the bipolar nature of some of our fans.

One moment John is the next great PG and the next moment people call him names and want him traded.

It's not easy out on the court and sometimes people screw up.

It is what it is.

But with that being said, Wittman leaves much to be desired as a coach....I'll be the first to admit that.


Calling him that is over the top on my part. So for that I should apologize and I do,

but that doesn't take away from him being a moron of the highest order. This team will never have a chance at developing into anything worth while with him at the helm. So to some degree, I want his incompetence highlighted in the playoffs. If the national media picks up on the fact we win in spite of our coach, less chance he's retained.

And nobody wants Wall traded, bad game...yah...but he's got to show up better for big time games.
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#387 » by dlts20 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:00 am

GhostsOfGil wrote:I'll just say this and call it a night.. While I'm sure there were adjustments Wittman could have made on the offense end, I credit Miami's defense over Witt's lineup failures.

I agree. They turned it up like great team and then on Offense they had 3 great scorers who all took turns at different points making big plays one on one. Cant take nothing away from them but I feel we matchup pretty well and would make it a fun series
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#388 » by MikeTheKid » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:02 am

Jimmy Recard wrote:
MikeTheKid wrote:
Jimmy Recard wrote:Eh, can't be too mad. No Nene, shooters off all night. Ariza with his worst night of the year. Wall 2/8 with 7 turnovers. And we were still in it late, against a desperate Miami team at home that had to win.

Miami are gonna get spanked by the Pacers in the ECF.


Pacers have been azz too lately

Heat better hope LeBron is superhuman against the Pacers. Look what Gooden did to them tonight. Imagine what Hibbert, West, Scola, Mahimni, Bynum will do to their frontline.


That's why I'm not too worried about them playing like crap now, once Bynum is inserted there gonna be nasty in the interior and Hibbert can stay fresh with Mahinmi and Bynum both getting time
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#389 » by dlts20 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:08 am

you guys can sleeep all you want on the Heat. Indy is big but most of them arent dominant. I mean Hibbert shoots worst than PG's from the field. Who are they going to guard when Miami spaces the floor? Miami still has the 2 best guys on the floor. Yes Wade is better at his best than George is. Miami is still clearly the team to beat to me. Besides, Miami can go a lil bigger if they want. They just like the mismatches that this lineup brings but if they get down in a series, they have bigger lineups to go to
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#390 » by Wizardspride » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:08 am

nuposse04 wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:
Illmatic21 wrote:The "best team in the NBA" had just lost 3 in a row, they were far from unbeatable. Obviously Miami is the better team. But a lot of people are annoyed by the fact that we had a chance to win the game and the way we lost exposed a lack of competence from the coach, and very poor play from some of the players.

I'm not happy with the loss either but the name calling just doesn't sit well with me.

Calling people baboons etc....yeah, not cool.

I think what really irks me is the bipolar nature of some of our fans.

One moment John is the next great PG and the next moment people call him names and want him traded.

It's not easy out on the court and sometimes people screw up.

It is what it is.

But with that being said, Wittman leaves much to be desired as a coach....I'll be the first to admit that.


Calling him that is over the top on my part. So for that I should apologize and I do,

but that doesn't take away from him being a moron of the highest order. This team will never have a chance at developing into anything worth while with him at the helm. So to some degree, I want his incompetence highlighted in the playoffs. If the national media picks up on the fact we win in spite of our coach, less chance he's retained.

And nobody wants Wall traded, bad game...yah...but he's got to show up better for big time games.

Fwiw, I feel the same way about Wittman.

He has no "feel" for the game at all. Especially when it comes to offense.

He has cost us 7-10 games by himself. :(

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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#391 » by MikeTheKid » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:10 am

Sluggerface wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:
Illmatic21 wrote:The "best team in the NBA" had just lost 3 in a row, they were far from unbeatable. Obviously Miami is the better team. But a lot of people are annoyed by the fact that we had a chance to win the game and the way we lost exposed a lack of competence from the coach, and very poor play from some of the players.

I'm not happy with the loss either but the name calling just doesn't sit well with me.

Calling people baboons etc....yeah, not cool.

I think what really irks me is the bipolar nature of some of our fans.

One moment John is the next great PG and the next moment people call him names and want him traded.

It's not easy out on the court and sometimes people screw up.

It is what it is.

But with that being said, Wittman leaves much to be desired as a coach....I'll be the first to admit that.


I'm personally not interested in becoming just like a nihilist defeatist Knicks fan that just goes along with every decision there terrible organization makes just because.

Wittman needs to go, this isn't up for debate. There have been numerous articles this season from organizations not even associated inside the DMV, (even NBA.com) bringing Wittman's inefficiencies to light.

Being an apologist is counter productive to the best decision this team can make to improve, which is letting go of Randy Wittman.

At this point, I want Wit gone more than I do Ernie, and I never thought I would ever say that.


Great post man, I pretty much agree 1000% and thats kinda why I paused from posting in GT just to watch and see what guys are doing. Trust me I want Ernie gone on a flying chariot outta here faster than Jordan left but Wittman needs to go first, his schemes are still so elementary.

And the Wall hate should stop, if it wasnt for him bustin azz good and bad this season we'd be SOL right now with pitch forks begging for EG to be fired (Which trust me I still want badd but probably wont happen), but lets not forget hes *bleepin* 22 years old
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#392 » by long suffrin' boulez fan » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:11 am

Man, is there a more deplorable franchise than the Heat?

Whining, preening, store -bought team. And that friggin' piped in crowd noise. That is as bush league as it gets.

Between that and the fuzzy picture on 'le plus," I have a massive headache.
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#393 » by Illmatic21 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:16 am

dlts20 wrote:
Illmatic21 wrote:
dlts20 wrote:I disagree. Ive seen him have big games against the best defenses. Its more of aggression. Just like he's had low scoring games against bad defensive teams also.

With all that being said. Ill say it over and over again. The system hurts Wall. He would be a much better scorer, attacker in a better p&r system. Also, I would still like to see either Harringto start or play more with Wall. Either change the system or get him a stretch 4.

That lack of 'aggression' comes from not having any reliable scoring moves. Early in a game Wall will check if his jumper is on that day.. if it's not, then he'll just fall back and stop trying to break down the defense.

He has no subtlety or polish to his scoring game, other than his carry/crossover he doesn't know how to set defenders up or get to where he wants on the floor.

Wall always says "I'm going to be aggressive" but half the time he says that he doesn't actually do it, because he can't. Once he sees that defenses are playing him a certain way, he loses confidence in his abilities to attack.

If Chris Paul said "I"m gonna drop 40 tonight" he would go out and do it. His game is so much more advanced than Wall's, he's constantly probing and trying to set up the defense. He has a reliable midrange game, he can post up other guards and turn over either shoulder. He can get to the lane at will, not because of pure athleticism but from his misdirection and quickness. Wall rarely ever shows that ability. And Paul takes 3 fewer FGA/g than Wall, yet still gets to the line more.

Wall's offense is a lot better than it was when he came into the league, but it's still the main weakness holding him back from being a truly great player.

you downplay Wall way way too much. So many of our fans do. He averaged 23ppg for the last 2 months of last season on 45% shooting and was dropping 47 on Mephis and nearly 40 on Indy. Some of the best defenses. This year he is averageing 20ppg. He won POW with 3 straight games over 31 in November, he aveaged nearly 22ppg on 45% shooting in December, he averaged 20.5 & 9ast in Feb on 45% shooting, he just won POW averageing 25 & 10 despite playing in a crap system that is made exactly for the opposite kinda player he is.

He has more to his game then you give him credit for and would show it in a different system. He would own a p&r, attacking the rim non stop, and splitting double teams all day if Witt ran it better or if he didnt play with 2 low post bigs. He finishes at the rim way better thn Westbrook & Rose. He doesnt play in these stat systems like Dragic or the Lakers, and stuff like that.

Add to that he plays on a team where no one can create for themselves so he has to walk the fine line of getting everyone involved while being the leading scorer and thats with a coach who basically tells him to fall back anytime he tries to score alot even though he's clearly a pass 1st guy. Even now when you say he's not doing this or that, its because teams do all tehy can to stop him. If he was so bad at scoring for himself they wouldnt guard him the way they do. They tried to trap him all day tonight. Why do that if he cant score?

I'm not downplaying Wall, he is an outstanding player. I'm just pointing out the areas where he has room for improvement.

Those 40 point games were when he was on a hot streak with his jumper and teams had no idea what to expect from him. That isn't the case anymore. Wall has looked pretty bad against Indiana and Memphis this season. He is averaging 20ppg yes, but on 52.3% TS which is awful. A guy like Kyle Lowry could probably put up those same numbers if given the shot attempts.

Wall is never going to be a #1 scorer, but you still wish he had better individual scoring ability, because it would help elevate the team in certain games and certain situations. It just seems like there are a lot of point guards who are more versatile, more efficient scorers than Wall. For someone with his individual talent and athleticism, it's kind of disappointing.

I posted in another thread that Wall's rim % has a lot to do with fastbreak points. We all know damn well that Wall misses a ton of easy layups, he's not that awesome a finisher at the rim.

The reason why teams trap him so hard is because he's the head of the snake, and good defenses have been able to 'cut off' that head with much success in his career. He's a guy who's viewed around the league as a one-trick pony, scoringwise. Teams know that if they just cut off his driving lanes they have a pretty good chance at neutralizing him (and also forcing him into TOs), and it's happened too often against good teams this season.

I agree that our system/coaching doesn't suit Wall's game, but he still needs to improve his individual skillset if this team is ever going to go far. Wall is one of the most inefficient starting PGs and has been since he came into the league, we've seen some progress but it's still a point of weakness.
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#394 » by dlts20 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:25 am

His J is not great. May never be even though he has improved. Still, I see a Wade type rim guy. I truly think he would get to the rim a ton in a different system to where his FG% would go up, his FT attempts would go up, and he would be a major handful because of his passing abiltiy on top of that.

I still cant believe people are on this Lowry bandwagon. Wall's numbers are better acrross the board bu he's winning. The funny thing is Lowry just literally had like 15 games where he shot like 33% from the field and all of the Raps fans still loved him. That would never happen with Wall. All we would do is talk about how much he sucks. Dont get it twisted, Im a crtic too when he's not aggressive. I just didnt feel that was fully the case tonight because I felt like he got us great looks and the Offense flowed until the late 4th. There were other games where he was passing non stop and no one else could get good looks while the O looks like crap. Thats when I rip him and he makes me mad but tonight I feel like he had the O on point for the most part against a motivated Heat team but most guys were off.

Gortat has been money at the rim over the last month but he was 1-7 in the 1st quarter with pretty much all great looks from Wall and easy finishes. Ariza & Web were wide open on a ton of Wall passes. He defers too much sometimes and we got away with it because Ariza's been hot but he needs to step it back up now, especially the next game. His hometown team who ware hot and we need a home win. He has to go hard. Thats one of the games I think he made me mad last time. In Charlotte at his hometown and he didnt go hard. Thats when I rip him. He better do it this game
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#395 » by dlts20 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:26 am

long suffrin' boulez fan wrote:Man, is there a more deplorable franchise than the Heat?

Whining, preening, store -bought team. And that friggin' piped in crowd noise. That is as bush league as it gets.

Between that and the fuzzy picture on 'le plus," I have a massive headache.

yes and then they have the band wagon Heat fans that are even worst.
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#396 » by jivelikenice » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:48 am

Miami did a great job trapping Wall and forcing turnovers but he HAS to be more aggressive. Two FT attempts in three games is unacceptable. His FTAs per game is at a career low and on a month by month basis it continues to decrease. He's had a very good season but he's becoming either too passive, falling in love with the J, or going for the homerun (bypassing layup attempts at the rim for kickouts for 3). Unfortunately our coach doesn't know any better and won't address this.
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#397 » by FAH1223 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 4:45 am

I'm not impressed with this Heat team. They don't seem like they'll be able to last 3 rounds to get back to the Finals. Unless LeBron averages 35 and 10 throughout the postseason.
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#398 » by Kanyewest » Tue Mar 11, 2014 4:56 am

Wizards could have come on top but have to give the Heat credit for their defense. Wall's bad turnover habits continued from the Bucks game to this one. The Heat's defense stepped up in the 4th quarter even though the Wizards gave a pretty good effort after a slow start in the game. It really would have helped if the Wizards had Nene especially in a game like this where the referee's swallowed their whistles on both ends of the court (except for Dwayne Wade).

If either Wall or Ariza stepped up more on the scoring end the Wizards could have won. Still, it's not easy playing in Miami against the Heat's defense. At least Gortat, Webster, Miller, and Gooden played well. Beal did his usual thing- hitting some 3s and taking a lot of mid range contested 2s. Have to hope those shots start falling at a higher rate
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#399 » by jivelikenice » Tue Mar 11, 2014 5:23 am

Can anyone explain why Otto played 3 minutes, scored a bucket and grabbed a board, and never got back in?
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Re: GT #63: Wizards (33-29) @ HEAT (43-17) 7:30 PM CSN+ 

Post#400 » by Kanyewest » Tue Mar 11, 2014 5:29 am

jivelikenice wrote:Can anyone explain why Otto played 3 minutes, scored a bucket and grabbed a board, and never got back in?


Webster was already in the game for Beal and Ariza picked up his 2nd foul in the 1st quarter.

On one possession, Porter was guarding LeBron, the Wizards overhelped and Allen got a wide open 3. Porter then switched onto Allen who eventually got an open 3 pointer off a few screens at the end of the quarter.

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