Rank our top 5 players this season

therealbig3 · Post #1 » by **therealbig3** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:16 pm

Taking on-court performance, playing time, and missed games into account, who have been our top 5 players this season, in order? Mine:

1. Paul Pierce - his leadership has been huge, he's played in 58 of our 63 games, and his production is still really good (14/5/3 on 58% TS in under 29 mpg)...his move to PF and the defense he's been providing there is one of the key turnarounds for the team.

2. Joe Johnson/Deron Williams (tie) - both of these guys have been insanely up and down all year. Johnson was carrying us early, but has gone through stretches where he has REALLY struggled, and his style of play can be extremely frustrating. Deron has been better since the ASB, but there hasn't been the flipping of the switch that we saw last year, and yeah, he's struggled with injuries this year, but he also goes through way too many games where he's passive as hell and becomes invisible. Johnson has played more games (61/63 vs 47 out of 63), but I feel like Deron has been the clearly better player when he has played.

4. Kevin Garnett - his missed games (49 games played) and his playing time (21 mpg) are the only reasons he isn't higher on the list. He doesn't do a lot of things well anymore...he was never a great post scorer, but now that's non-existent. He can't finish around the rim anymore. Early on, he was flat out horrible, because he couldn't play defense at PF anymore, he was bricking all of his shots, and he was making some really poor decisions with the basketball. But since moving to C, he's been Celtics Kevin Garnett, but with a lot less minutes. Money midrange shooting, great passing, great screen-setting, and ELITE defense (DPOY-caliber per minute). This has included being a great leader and communicating with the other players on defense, which has resulted in an improvement from everyone, most notably Deron Williams.

5. Shaun Livingston - He's only missed 1 game all year, and he's stepped in as a starter and has given us a great dynamic with Deron. He's limited offensively, but often times, he's the only guy that's willing to be aggressive and attack the basket, in stark contrast to when Deron plays passively. And his defense has been excellent. He's not perfect, he makes mistakes defensively, most often committing some dumb fouls, but he's guarded guys like Durant and LeBron and has done a great job of limiting them. In the 2nd win against Miami, he drew LeBron's 6th foul on a drive, which effectively won us the game, and in last night's game, he deflected and ultimately stole the game-deciding inbounds pass. His versatility is one of the biggest reasons we've been able to have success going small. He can defend 1-3, and his length allows us to switch on almost everything.

Kirilenko WOULD be up there, but he's just missed way too many games.

Prokorov · Post #2 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 5:21 pm

Pierce - His leadership alone makes him our MVP. when we play hard we can play with anyone and pierce has these guys playing with effort and emotion. on top of that statistically he is right there with anyone on this team

Livingston - has been unreal for us defense and has been a huge boost offensively as well. best BBIQ on the team other then maybe kirilenko, has everyone in the right spots and is one of the few guys on this team that drives to the rim in the half court. he has been a huge glue guy for us and allows us to to deron on SG's at times

Joe Johnson - Carried us on his back for a huge stretch in januray that turned our season around. has again hit a ton of clutch shots this season and while his offense has gone into coma's at times he has been strong defensively all year

Kevin Garnett - i'd have him higher but he doesnt play as many minutes. but when he is on the floor he has been elite defensively. im disappointed he hasnt brought any leadership, and has been ugly offensively at times, but he has been a huge part of our success and really trasnformed us into a defensive minded team

i dont think we really have a 5th. everyone else has been so up and down, so incosnistent, and so bad at times i cant really put them on here. Deron was less then average for 60% of the season and we played some of our best ball without him. kirilenko missed a ton of the season. mirza has been ice cold as often as red hot. Anderson has been steady and a bulldog but not really a big impact. Blatche has been the usually good blatche bad-blatche weve grown accustomed to. had thornton been here all year he might get it but not after 6 games or so

lkitt0804 · Post #3 » by **lkitt0804** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:24 pm

Prokorov wrote: Deron was less then average for 60% of the season and we played some of our best ball without him.

We are 23-9 in 2014. Deron's missed 5 games in 2014. Say we did win all 5 games he was out we'd be 18-9 which is a .667 percentage. That's some pretty good basketball.

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exculpatory · Post #4 » by **exculpatory** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:26 pm

On the beach. Will think about it & write something later. LOL.

lkitt0804 · Post #5 » by **lkitt0804** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:29 pm

1) PP
2) Livingston
3) JJ
4) Deron
5) Blatche/Mirza

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Prokorov · Post #6 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:34 pm

lkitt0804 wrote:
Prokorov wrote: Deron was less then average for 60% of the season and we played some of our best ball without him.

We are 23-9 in 2014. Deron's missed 5 games in 2014. Say we did win all 5 games he was out we'd be 18-9 which is a .667 percentage. That's some pretty good basketball.

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alot of the games we won early this year he did not play well in. he has been an average or worse PG for the majority of the season.. to his credit he has come on strong the past 6 games or so. but he certainly hasnt been anything great overall this year

lkitt0804 · Post #7 » by **lkitt0804** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:42 pm

Prokorov wrote:
lkitt0804 wrote:
Prokorov wrote: Deron was less then average for 60% of the season and we played some of our best ball without him.

We are 23-9 in 2014. Deron's missed 5 games in 2014. Say we did win all 5 games he was out we'd be 18-9 which is a .667 percentage. That's some pretty good basketball.

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alot of the games we won early this year he did not play well in. he has been an average or worse PG for the majority of the season.. to his credit he has come on strong the past 6 games or so. but he certainly hasnt been anything great overall this year

I agree with this but to say we played some of our best basketball with out him is a little miss leading. He has certainly been below average (for his standards and what he is being paid) all year. I hope that his resurgence means that he is getting healthy or that Kidd, PP, and KG has finally gotten to him.

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Prokorov · Post #8 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:43 pm

lkitt0804 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
lkitt0804 wrote:
We are 23-9 in 2014. Deron's missed 5 games in 2014. Say we did win all 5 games he was out we'd be 18-9 which is a .667 percentage. That's some pretty good basketball.

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alot of the games we won early this year he did not play well in. he has been an average or worse PG for the majority of the season.. to his credit he has come on strong the past 6 games or so. but he certainly hasnt been anything great overall this year

I agree with this but to say we played some of our best basketball with out him is a little miss leading. He has certainly been below average (for his standards and what he is being paid) all year. I hope that his resurgence means that he is getting healthy or that Kidd, PP, and KG has finally gotten to him.

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he was either out injured or playing limited during our 9-1 run in january.

he is having the worst season of his career outside of his rookie season

lkitt0804 · Post #9 » by **lkitt0804** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:02 pm

Prokorov wrote:
lkitt0804 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
alot of the games we won early this year he did not play well in. he has been an average or worse PG for the majority of the season.. to his credit he has come on strong the past 6 games or so. but he certainly hasnt been anything great overall this year

I agree with this but to say we played some of our best basketball with out him is a little miss leading. He has certainly been below average (for his standards and what he is being paid) all year. I hope that his resurgence means that he is getting healthy or that Kidd, PP, and KG has finally gotten to him.

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he was either out injured or playing limited during our 9-1 run in january.

he is having the worst season of his career outside of his rookie season

I'm not disagreeing with you that this is the worst year of his career. In January he went 15/6.5 missing 5 games. We did go 6-2 in January when he did play and he averaged 33 minutes a game in that stretch. The 15/6.5 is certainly below what I would expect out of a max player but I think he's played a bigger role in our 2014 turn around than you think.

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Prokorov · Post #10 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:19 pm

lkitt0804 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
lkitt0804 wrote:
I agree with this but to say we played some of our best basketball with out him is a little miss leading. He has certainly been below average (for his standards and what he is being paid) all year. I hope that his resurgence means that he is getting healthy or that Kidd, PP, and KG has finally gotten to him.

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he was either out injured or playing limited during our 9-1 run in january.

he is having the worst season of his career outside of his rookie season

I'm not disagreeing with you that this is the worst year of his career. In January he went 15/6.5 missing 5 games. We did go 6-2 in January when he did play and he averaged 33 minutes a game in that stretch. The 15/6.5 is certainly below what I would expect out of a max player but I think he's played a bigger role in our 2014 turn around than you think.

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what were we in januray without him? 5-0? our best basketball came with him injured or coming off the bench. guy has been a monumental disappointment

lkitt0804 · Post #11 » by **lkitt0804** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:25 pm

Prokorov wrote:
lkitt0804 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
he was either out injured or playing limited during our 9-1 run in january.

he is having the worst season of his career outside of his rookie season

I'm not disagreeing with you that this is the worst year of his career. In January he went 15/6.5 missing 5 games. We did go 6-2 in January when he did play and he averaged 33 minutes a game in that stretch. The 15/6.5 is certainly below what I would expect out of a max player but I think he's played a bigger role in our 2014 turn around than you think.

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what were we in januray without him? 5-0? our best basketball came with him injured or coming off the bench. guy has been a monumental disappointment

We were 4-1 with out him in january. During our 10-1 stretch in january we were 6-0 with him. He was 16/6.5 playing 34 min a game shooting 52% from the field during that 10-1 stretch. Yes I agree he has been a disappointment this season and I hated his body language and lack of defense all year. But you can't say he hasn't played a role in our success in 2014.

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Prokorov · Post #12 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:37 pm

lkitt0804 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
lkitt0804 wrote:
I'm not disagreeing with you that this is the worst year of his career. In January he went 15/6.5 missing 5 games. We did go 6-2 in January when he did play and he averaged 33 minutes a game in that stretch. The 15/6.5 is certainly below what I would expect out of a max player but I think he's played a bigger role in our 2014 turn around than you think.

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what were we in januray without him? 5-0? our best basketball came with him injured or coming off the bench. guy has been a monumental disappointment

We were 4-1 with out him in january. During our 10-1 stretch in january we were 6-0 with him. He was 16/6.5 playing 34 min a game shooting 52% from the field during that 10-1 stretch. Yes I agree he has been a disappointment this season and I hated his body language and lack of defense all year. But you can't say he hasn't played a role in our success in 2014.

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until the last 6 games he hasnt. he was bad in january outside of a couple games where he came off the bench. we played our best without him. until these last 6 games he has been a detriment to the team

therealbig3 · Post #13 » by **therealbig3** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:47 pm

Uh, he's actually been quite good for the last 12 games, not 6.

Prokorov · Post #14 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:53 pm

therealbig3 wrote:Uh, he's actually been quite good for the last 12 games, not 6.

no he hasnt.

MGrand15 · Post #15 » by **MGrand15** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:53 pm

Prokorov wrote:
lkitt0804 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
what were we in januray without him? 5-0? our best basketball came with him injured or coming off the bench. guy has been a monumental disappointment

We were 4-1 with out him in january. During our 10-1 stretch in january we were 6-0 with him. He was 16/6.5 playing 34 min a game shooting 52% from the field during that 10-1 stretch. Yes I agree he has been a disappointment this season and I hated his body language and lack of defense all year. But you can't say he hasn't played a role in our success in 2014.

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until the last 6 games he hasnt. he was bad in january outside of a couple games where he came off the bench. we played our best without him. until these last 6 games he has been a detriment to the team

Why do you completely ignore facts and people's arguments then just repeat what you said before? What's the point of posting?

We were 6-0 in January with him. In 2014, he's missed 5 games and we've gone 23-9.

Even when he came off the bench, he was playing well and the team was playing well - but he was still a major part of that success. He wasn't warming the bench.

We DID not play our best stretch of basketball in those 5 games he missed. We have not played our best basketball without Deron. Stop saying that. It's not true. None of the numbers back you up. Nothing backs you up. You could've said you made a mistake once the records were brought up and admitted you misremembered.

Don't give him credit for these last 6 games like he's been playing wildly different than before. There's little to no difference man. Slightly better on defense and that's it.

A detriment to the team? :lol:

That might be the most ridiculous thing I've seen posted here - and this board is full of funny stuff.

Prokorov · Post #16 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:56 pm

MGrand15 wrote:We DID not play our best stretch of basketball in those 5 games he missed.

yes, we did. and it saved out season.

A detriment to the team? That might be the most ridiculous thing I've seen posted here - and this board is full of funny stuff.

lol, says the biggest homer on this board. you can argue alot of things, but to argue dwill has not beena detriment is simply idiotic. he has been a below average point gaurd this year while making the max, missing time to injury, sulking, and giving low effort, losing confidence like a little whiny girl, and having long stretches where he gets outplayed by the scrubs of the league.

he has been excellent the last 6 games. problem is he has been below average the last 60

Sorry, but im simply not letting you get off the hook defending deron williams season when he has arguable not been a top 15 PG this season. had he givne us anything this year we'd have 10 more wins

DarkXaero · Post #17 » by **DarkXaero** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:58 pm

Why do you guys bother arguing with Prokorov over D-Will? It's not worth it.

therealbig3 · Post #18 » by **therealbig3** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:59 pm

Prokorov wrote:
therealbig3 wrote:Uh, he's actually been quite good for the last 12 games, not 6.

no he hasnt.

So we're going to ignore the fact that he played well against Utah, GS, LA, Denver, and Milwaukee? He was also probably the only one doing anything in the Portland game. He didn't play poorly in any of those games, and was actually really good in 3 of them (Utah, GS, and especially LA).

His game against Miami last night was worse than any of those games...if we're going to give him credit in that game for running the offense well and making nice passes, then the same could be said for those games too.

Prokorov · Post #19 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:00 pm

therealbig3 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
therealbig3 wrote:Uh, he's actually been quite good for the last 12 games, not 6.

no he hasnt.

So we're going to ignore the fact that he played well against Utah, GS, LA, Denver, and Milwaukee? He was also probably the only one doing anything in the Portland game. He didn't play poorly in any of those games, and was actually really good in 3 of them (Utah, GS, and especially LA).

His game against Miami last night was worse than any of those games...if we're going to give him credit in that game for running the offense well and making nice passes, then the same could be said for those games too.

he played well in LA. the other he did not. especially utah and milwaukee.

Prokorov · Post #20 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:02 pm

DarkXaero wrote:Why do you guys bother arguing with Prokorov over D-Will? It's not worth it.

there is nothing to argue. he has been average or worse this season. that isnt debateable. be honest with yourself. take off the homer glasses. do you really think he has been good this season? do you think he has been a top 15 PG this season?

be honest.

the problem is this board has lowed the bar so much for williams that its impossible for him to be criticized. all he has to do is "be agressive and look to score" and regardless of the result people here say he played a good or even great game.

im sorry, this isnt youth soccer. it takes more then trying to score to be a good player.