Grunfeld a Great GM. Proves Doubters Wrong

[dckingsfan]

Jan had no NBA level skills. Not one. He couldn't dribble, shoot, pass, or play post defense at an NBA level....

Other than that Ms. Lincoln, how was the play?

[dckingsfan]

Clearly millie isn't from the FO or he would have stopped digging a bigger, deeper hole for EG

[Illuminaire]

Jan had no NBA level skills. Not one. He couldn't dribble, shoot, pass, or play post defense at an NBA level....

Other than that Ms. Lincoln, how was the play?

(-.-)

I swear, my tombstone is going to read

"Beloved By His Family,
Would Have Drafted
Leonard And Faried"

[Nivek]

This team needed a backup point guard due to Maynor not being fully recovered from the ACL tear in his right knee.

1. Even if this was the ONLY reason Maynor played badly this season, it would be evidence of Grunfeld doing a poor job. He should have known the status of Maynor's knee and how it was likely to affect his play.
   
2. Blaming Maynor's play on his knee is highly revisionist. No one talked about Maynor being a decent backup IF his knee healed. Plus, Maynor's ACL injury was in January of 2012. ACL recovery is 9-12 months. That would mean roughly January 2013. In fact, he returned to the floor in November 2013, which suggests his recovery was routine, and perhaps went better than normal.
   
3. We KNOW Grunfeld thought Maynor had solved the team's backup PG problems because HE SAID SO just before training camp:
   
   We wanted to upgrade our backup point guard position and Eric [Maynor] has been with us now, three weeks in a row. He’s very solid, very steady. He brings a little poise to the game. He knows how to play. So we feel we’ve upgraded that position.
   
   Click to Mike Lee's story where the quote appears.
   
   
4. The facts are that Maynor was a poor NBA player BEFORE his knee injury. He was worse after returning from the knee injury. That he was bad this season was unsurprising to anyone doing basic analysis of his career performance, and/or his performance last season.

[ptptpt]

In ten years of having Ernie as a GM he has built two playoff teams with mild postseason success. Its a decent resumé, not a good one.

It's not even decent. The Wizards have the 3rd worst collective record of the last 10 years. 27 of the 29 other teams in the NBA have done better than Grunfeld during this time period. How can that be construed as anything other than abject failure?

Call me an optimist I guess. He built playoff teams in NY and in god forsaken Milwaukee and he's done it here. Not saying that those teams have done anything of significance but it doesn't necessarily mean he's bad. He's not a complete destroyer like Joe Dumars, nor is he incompetent like Elgin Baylor and Wes Unseld have been in the past. He can do some things right. Just not enough of them.

I don't like Ernie. I can't believe I am defending the guy. I want him gone just like everybody else. But I can't say that he's the worst GM I have experienced or seen. He's just painfully mediocre.

[closg00]

You have to admire Miley's propaganda skill-craft, he might even be Ernie Grunfeld himself.

[Illuminaire]

He's not a complete destroyer like Joe Dumars,

It amuses me whenever someone defends Ernie by saying something like that. (I don't mean that as an attack on you, Jayscott. But it does make me chortle, and then sigh, and then facepalm. Roughly in that order.)

In his tenure with Detroit, Joe Dumars has seven seasons with 50 or more wins. During that span of time his team never failed to reach the Eastern Conference Finals, and won an NBA Championship.

If you want to say Dumar was lucky and the last six years have proven how poor a GM he really is... that's fine. He's been really bad over that time. Horrendously bad, and deserved to be fired years ago. After all, Joe Dumar's winning percentage over his six worst years is an incredible 1% different than EG's win percentage over his entire time with the Wizards, including those one-and-done playoff glory years.

Can't we all just agree that EG is bad at his job and the Wizards would be better off with practically anyone else in charge? Why is this so hard for some people? I don't get it. I really don't.

[dckingsfan]

He's not a complete destroyer like Joe Dumars,

It amuses me whenever someone defends Ernie by saying something like that. (I don't mean that as an attack on you, Jayscott. But it does make me chortle, and then sigh, and then facepalm. Roughly in that order.)

In his tenure with Detroit, Joe Dumars has seven seasons with 50 or more wins. During that span of time his team never failed to reach the Eastern Conference Finals, and won an NBA Championship.

If you want to say Dumar was lucky and the last six years have proven how poor a GM he really is... that's fine. He's been really bad over that time. Horrendously bad, and deserved to be fired years ago. After all, Joe Dumar's winning percentage over his six worst years is an incredible 1% different than EG's win percentage over his entire time with the Wizards, including those one-and-done playoff glory years.

Can't we all just agree that EG is bad at his job and the Wizards would be better off with practically anyone else in charge? Why is this so hard for some people? I don't get it. I really don't.

Actually 95% on this board do agree with that sentiment - 95% want EG gone!

[ptptpt]

He's not a complete destroyer like Joe Dumars,

It amuses me whenever someone defends Ernie by saying something like that. (I don't mean that as an attack on you, Jayscott. But it does make me chortle, and then sigh, and then facepalm. Roughly in that order.)

In his tenure with Detroit, Joe Dumars has seven seasons with 50 or more wins. During that span of time his team never failed to reach the Eastern Conference Finals, and won an NBA Championship.

If you want to say Dumar was lucky and the last six years have proven how poor a GM he really is... that's fine. He's been really bad over that time. Horrendously bad, and deserved to be fired years ago. After all, Joe Dumar's winning percentage over his six worst years is an incredible 1% different than EG's win percentage over his entire time with the Wizards, including those one-and-done playoff glory years.

Can't we all just agree that EG is bad at his job and the Wizards would be better off with practically anyone else in charge? Why is this so hard for some people? I don't get it. I really don't.

Okay...Well...I tried. I'm done defending Ernie at this point. No more light to be shown here.

[dckingsfan]

It was a considered opinion jayscott - keep posting.

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

I was so frustrated, I couldn't sleep after the Meltdown in SacTown. I finally fell asleep at about 5am and had to be up by 6:30am.

Managed to make it through the day ok yesterday, but I'm slammed with the crud today. I hurts to contemplate even getting out of bed.

Thankfully, I'm not at the age where an intense illness could cause any real danger- like turning into pneumonia... which ultimately did in three of my four grandparents.

But, I'm laying here somewhat bemused, somewhat horrified with the thought that this franchise may literally kill me.

[verbal8]

What scares me most about EG as GM for the Wizards right is I feel that the Wizards need a great GM. They have an obvious high-level talent in Wall. Beal despite flaws mentioned on this board looks promising. Porter could turn out to be a key glue guy(disappointing for 3rd pick, but the draft is looking pretty awful). Booker and Webster could be pieces on a championship team, but they would have to be at the bottom of the 8 man key player rotation.

The problem is the age/contract status of the rest of the roster. The easy route is overpay Ariza for his career year and Gortat for a desperate need for a Center. With a couple decent moves that probably keeps the team in the bottom half of the play-off seeds, for a couple years and then gets weighed down by aging and expensive contracts.

What the Wizards GM needs to do is hard. He needs to get both younger and better. Maybe EG could pull off a Kwame/Bulter like deal with Porter(helps with the better, but gives up a little of the younger).

I don't see a path to building a contender that involves retaining Nene. I don't think you have to fleece another team to get rid of him, but at the very least you need to get some flexibility. This is definitely a move I don't see EG making.

[MikeTheKid]

There was nothing wrong with the Vesely pick and if you know basketball, you will see how Jan will be an asset to this team VERY soon.

I was rereading this thread looking for a particular quote, and I just saw this gem.

This team needed a backup point guard due to Maynor not being fully recovered from the ACL tear in his right knee.

Your officially a Monumental pawn if you truly believe this, Maynor tore his ACL 2 seasons ago and back to full strength the beginning of last season. He was out of the rotation with OKC and was traded to Portland where he sucked even more and EG signed him last offseason. Your reaching Troll Gawd status

[nate33]

I don't see a path to building a contender that involves retaining Nene. I don't think you have to fleece another team to get rid of him, but at the very least you need to get some flexibility. This is definitely a move I don't see EG making.

I don't really see any reason to trade Nene. Trading him this summer for raw cap space would cost major assets. Trading him for a 2015 expiring contract might be doable, but we wouldn't get any extra talent in return. So then we'd have his salary off the books a year early, which wouldn't be any use to us. After resigning Ariza and Gortat, we wouldn't have cap space anyhow.

I really see just 2 good options.

1. Resign Gortat to a 4-year deal, Ariza to a 2-year deal, eventually move Webster's deal, and plan to make a big move in free agency in 2016.

2. Blow it all up now. Let Gortat and Ariza walk or S&T them for 1-year contracts. Trade Nene for a 1-year contract. Suck next year and then have a high pick and a ton of cap room in 2015.

There is very little chance that Ted opts for option 2. The problem is the "suck next year" part. It would also make the Gortat trade seem even more foolish. So basically, Option 1 is our only good option, and it doesn't require that we move Nene.

[LyricalRico]

I don't see a path to building a contender that involves retaining Nene. I don't think you have to fleece another team to get rid of him, but at the very least you need to get some flexibility. This is definitely a move I don't see EG making.

I don't really see any reason to trade Nene. Trading him this summer for raw cap space would cost major assets. Trading him for a 2015 expiring contract might be doable, but we wouldn't get any extra talent in return. So then we'd have his salary off the books a year early, which wouldn't be any use to us. After resigning Ariza and Gortat, we wouldn't have cap space anyhow.

I really see just 2 good options.

1. Resign Gortat to a 4-year deal, Ariza to a 2-year deal, eventually move Webster's deal, and plan to make a big move in free agency in 2016.

2. Blow it all up now. Let Gortat and Ariza walk or S&T them for 1-year contracts. Trade Nene for a 1-year contract. Suck next year and then have a high pick and a ton of cap room in 2015.

There is very little chance that Ted opts for option 2. The problem is the "suck next year" part. It would also make the Gortat trade seem even more foolish. So basically, Option 1 is our only good option, and it doesn't require that we move Nene.

The one wrinkle I would add is that Nene could be an interesting 2015 trade piece "IF" he can finish next season healthy. Depending on what happens with guys like Love, Melo, and possibly others, Nene as a veteran big on an expiring deal could be an option for team either trying to attract a guy or build around a guy that agreed to sign with them.

Wouldn't be an earth-shattering move, but might net us a low first or a few seconds. Maybe we even take back less 2015-16 salary in the deal and open up the chance to use the MLE/LLE while staying under the tax.

[nate33]

The one wrinkle I would add is that Nene could be an interesting 2015 trade piece "IF" he can finish next season healthy. Depending on what happens with guys like Love, Melo, and possibly others, Nene as a veteran big on an expiring deal could be an option for team either trying to attract a guy or build around a guy that agreed to sign with them.

Wouldn't be an earth-shattering move, but might net us a low first or a few seconds. Maybe we even take back less 2015-16 salary in the deal and open up the chance to use the MLE/LLE while staying under the tax.

That's an option, but I think it's really unlikely. If we keep Gortat and Ariza, presumably the intent would be to continue trying to win games and advance further in the playoffs. If we win, say, 48 games next year with Nene playing well; I don't see us then trading him in Summer 2015 for a bad expiring contract plus late picks. The thinking at that point would be that the benefit of a deep playoff run in 2015/16 outweighs the value of a few late picks gained by trading Nene.

The only way Nene gets traded is if we see the emergence of some young player to replace him, rendering Nene redundant. (It would have to be a young player getting good, not Nene regressing to the level of the young player. Because in that scenario, Nene wouldn't have trade value.)

[AFM]

From the latest Grantland article:

PHOENIX/WASHINGTON
The Trade: Phoenix traded Marcin Gortat for Washington’s pick (top-12 protected), Emeka Okafor and 10 complimentary “I JUST WON A TRADE WITH ERNIE GRUNFELD” T-shirts. Not a collector’s item.

Retroactive Verdict: What’s sadder — that Washington fans would definitely make this trade again, or that you can’t even really blame them? Had they waited three months, Gortat would have cost only two second-rounders. But can you really nitpick when the same team that took Otto Porter and Jan Vesely with high lottery picks doesn’t totally botch a front-office move? Even getting mildly beat in a trade — that’s a huge, huge, HUGE win for Wizards fans.

2014 Draft Ramifications: Phoenix is definitely getting this pick (right now, it’s no. 17). And Washington is definitely paying Gortat twice what he’s worth next summer. Who cares? CHOCOLATE CITY IS HEADED TO THE PLAYOFFS!!!!!!!!!!

[Dat2U]

From the latest Grantland article:

Retroactive Verdict: What’s sadder — that Washington fans would definitely make this trade again, or that you can’t even really blame them? Had they waited three months, Gortat would have cost only two second-rounders. But can you really nitpick when the same team that took Otto Porter and Jan Vesely with high lottery picks doesn’t totally botch a front-office move? Even getting mildly beat in a trade — that’s a huge, huge, HUGE win for Wizards fans.

This is so true. A perfect example of the battered wife syndrome. If there's a 1% chance that we weren't totally embarrassed in a deal, I guarantee you 75% of the fan base will support it (see Miller/Foye trade, see Okafor/Ariza trade, see Nene trade, see any stinking trade Ernie has made. It's frustrating because you'd really think Wizfans would know better but obviously not.

[verbal8]

From the latest Grantland article:

Retroactive Verdict: What’s sadder — that Washington fans would definitely make this trade again, or that you can’t even really blame them? Had they waited three months, Gortat would have cost only two second-rounders. But can you really nitpick when the same team that took Otto Porter and Jan Vesely with high lottery picks doesn’t totally botch a front-office move? Even getting mildly beat in a trade — that’s a huge, huge, HUGE win for Wizards fans.

This is so true. A perfect example of the battered wife syndrome. If there's a 1% chance that we weren't totally embarrassed in a deal, I guarantee you 75% of the fan base will support it (see Miller/Foye trade, see Okafor/Ariza trade, see Nene trade, see any stinking trade Ernie has made. It's frustrating because you'd really think Wizfans would know better but obviously not.

I think it is not a reach to say that Okafor on an insured contract and the Wizards 1st probably could have gotten Asik mid-season, would need a 3rd team like the Sixers to balance salaries.

Okafor straight up might have gotten Gasol at least at the trade deadline, if the deal could give the Lakers luxury tax relief.

At the very least it could have gotten Humphries and a 2nd from the Celtics.

[closg00]

From the latest Grantland article:

Retroactive Verdict: What’s sadder — that Washington fans would definitely make this trade again, or that you can’t even really blame them? Had they waited three months, Gortat would have cost only two second-rounders. But can you really nitpick when the same team that took Otto Porter and Jan Vesely with high lottery picks doesn’t totally botch a front-office move? Even getting mildly beat in a trade — that’s a huge, huge, HUGE win for Wizards fans.

This is so true. A perfect example of the battered wife syndrome. If there's a 1% chance that we weren't totally embarrassed in a deal, I guarantee you 75% of the fan base will support it (see Miller/Foye trade, see Okafor/Ariza trade, see Nene trade, see any stinking trade Ernie has made. It's frustrating because you'd really think Wizfans would know better but obviously not.

Grantland has the Wizards org pegged perfectly. I have referred to this in the past as Stockholm Syndrome.