2013-2014 College Basketball / '14 NBA Draft Thread

[Negrodamus]

Humbly disagree. I think the NBA started doing early entry before it started really committing to player development. Which was an issue through the mid 90s and early 00s, but at this point I think the league as whole is doing a phenomenal job.

I agree with this. Teams are way more focused on developing players. Additionally, the NBDL, while unheralded at times, has provided additional structure and attention for developing players.

If a guy simply doesn't have the ability or right state of mind, then they aren't going to make it. It won't be due to lack of resources like it once might have been.

[Sixerscan]

Agreed, between the commitment to player development, the D League, and more guys coming from Europe every year, the competition to become an NBA player is harder than ever.

[snoopdogg88]

good players will probably figure out a way to become good players
bad players will probably bust


thats my in depth theory

[Foshan]

good players will probably figure out a way to become good players
bad players will probably bust


thats my in depth theory

Profound.

[agiaco]

Great video/story on Adreian Payne

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBmEQlToMFA#t=93

[51X3RF4N]

An interesting player to keep an eye on is TJ Warren. He's got ideal size, and is crafty. He can score in a variety of ways and he's not the worst defender in the world.

If the Sixers happen to miss on both Wiggins and Parker, I'd be seriously considering Warren with the Pels pick.

Take Randle with the top 4 pick, and follow it up with Warren. Then trade 2 of the 2nd round picks to get back into the mid-late 1st and select PJ Hairston.

MCW/Hairston/TJW/Randle/Noel

That lineup has post scoring with Randle, post defense with Noel, and tons of rebounding between the 2, plus MCW, Hairston and TJW are all good rebounders as well. It has a go-to scoring threat in TJW, along with a distributor to make it all go. Not to mention a great perimeter shooter in Hairston who would be a great 2nd scoring option IMO. And the lineup would be 6'6/6'5/6'8/6'9/6'11 with lots of athleticism.

Thoughts?

[Negrodamus]

An interesting player to keep an eye on is TJ Warren. He's got ideal size, and is crafty. He can score in a variety of ways and he's not the worst defender in the world.

If the Sixers happen to miss on both Wiggins and Parker, I'd be seriously considering Warren with the Pels pick.

Take Randle with the top 4 pick, and follow it up with Warren. Then trade 2 of the 2nd round picks to get back into the mid-late 1st and select PJ Hairston.

MCW/Hairston/TJW/Randle/Noel

That lineup has post scoring with Randle, post defense with Noel, and tons of rebounding between the 2, plus MCW, Hairston and TJW are all good rebounders as well. It has a go-to scoring threat in TJW, along with a distributor to make it all go. Not to mention a great perimeter shooter in Hairston who would be a great 2nd scoring option IMO. And the lineup would be 6'6/6'5/6'8/6'9/6'11 with lots of athleticism.

Thoughts?

You absolutely love hypothetical lineups. Nothing wrong with it at all, just an observation.

I'm not sure we will be able to trade up to get Hairston, but that's not a bad team. Warren was the only reason NC State functioned this year. Not much of a three point shooter, but a crafty scorer.

[51X3RF4N]

An interesting player to keep an eye on is TJ Warren. He's got ideal size, and is crafty. He can score in a variety of ways and he's not the worst defender in the world.

If the Sixers happen to miss on both Wiggins and Parker, I'd be seriously considering Warren with the Pels pick.

Take Randle with the top 4 pick, and follow it up with Warren. Then trade 2 of the 2nd round picks to get back into the mid-late 1st and select PJ Hairston.

MCW/Hairston/TJW/Randle/Noel

That lineup has post scoring with Randle, post defense with Noel, and tons of rebounding between the 2, plus MCW, Hairston and TJW are all good rebounders as well. It has a go-to scoring threat in TJW, along with a distributor to make it all go. Not to mention a great perimeter shooter in Hairston who would be a great 2nd scoring option IMO. And the lineup would be 6'6/6'5/6'8/6'9/6'11 with lots of athleticism.

Thoughts?

You absolutely love hypothetical lineups. Nothing wrong with it at all, just an observation.

I'm not sure we will be able to trade up to get Hairston, but that's not a bad team. Warren was the only reason NC State functioned this year. Not much of a three point shooter, but a crafty scorer.

I do love hypothetical lineups. It goes back to my days of playing NBA Live in the early 2000's. It's also the "GM" in me. I like to see what the future might hold if I build a team the way I think an NBA team should be constructed.

[Bling76]

Not quite sure what to make of Warren as a prospect. Big-time scorer at the college level, but there are definite question marks as to how this will translate into the pros and I'm not sure he's good enough at anything else to justify those concerns (like MCW, for instance). Not a bad option (much better than McDermott, at least IMO), but I think we could probably do better at #11 or wherever NO ends up.

[sixers23]

warren wont be a lottery pick hes more of the 18-25 range

[51X3RF4N]

warren wont be a lottery pick hes more of the 18-25 range

Ok so maybe trade the Pels pick down and pick up an extra 1st in the process, that way the Sixers could grab Hairston and Warren! LOL I just really like the potential of those 2 on the wings in terms of having consistent scoring/outside shooting every night. And the defensive potential of MCW/Hairston/Warren is pretty nice.

[sixers23]

not necessarily for warren but im not opposed to a trading down at all if someone like Vonleh doesnt fall to 10 bc outside of that it is pretty much a crapshoot

[LloydFree]

Your right they stopped staying in school for over 20 years and Jonathon Bender and Darius Miles should have stayed in school. But these kids can learn more then just basketball in college. But that's a different story. The NBA was a lot better 20 years ago then today.

Nonsense. There are more good players, and more good teams than at any time in the last 40 years. The only difference is the top players do their apprenticeship on NBA benches for 2 years, rather than give away their labor to colleges for 3 years. The five (5) or so guys that come out too early every year, isn't ruining basketball.

The top players have been declaring early for the draft since I was a kid. Magic Johnson and Isaiah Thomas only went to school for two(2) years... 35 years ago. Didn't hurt them. The only reason this issue even comes up now, is there is a lack of patience for young players to develop now. The players don't need to go to college to learn how to play, if it was understood by fans that a HS player is going to take at least two (2) years to be useful in the NBA, this wouldn't even be an issue.

[Skates]

TJ Warren definitely has an NBA career in front of him, but with his best skill being in the two point area and lacking athleticism to really scare people at the rim, he is kind of the polar opposite of a Hinkie player. No three point shooting, not really a guy who will draw a bunch of fouls at the next level, in some ways he would be an ideal player in an earlier era, but might well be a dinosaur now.

Of all the 11-25 range players who have impressed me in the tournament, I have to say that Cleanthony Early and Adrien Payne would be the ones whose stock has risen the most in my mind. Maybe not with the Pels pick, but if we trade back for more picks or move up from the second round, I like both of those guys as very solid NBA rotation players.

[SJSF]

More players get hurt by coming out early then staying in. Try not to think about the top 3 players or the elites. What about Orton who was with the Sixers this year. He came out early and he never developed or became a player.

[ankle420breaker]

I like Gary Harris and Kyle Anderson with the Pels pick. Cleanthony Early would be a nice addition as well if we can buy ourselves a late first rounder, although I'm not sure how late he gets picked - he earned himself some over the weekend.

What's going on with Mitch McGary? Is he declaring? Draft Express currently has us taking him with our 32nd pick.

[Sixerscan]

More players get hurt by coming out early then staying in. Try not to think about the top 3 players or the elites. What about Orton who was with the Sixers this year. He came out early and he never developed or became a player.

You have no way of knowing Orton got hurt by coming out early. He could very well be a better basketball player now getting 3 years of pro coaching than he would have been if he stayed at Kentucky. Some guys suck no matter who tries to help them.

It's just wrong to assume college basketball is always the best option to develop NBA basketball players. Some guys develop best in college. Some guys develop best in the NBA, and that number will only become higher as the D League improves. What is Michael Carter-Williams learning about playing NBA defense by playing a 2-3 zone for another year?

Rather than just making a rule that hurts all the guys that could stand to benefit by learning in the NBA, giving them the option to choose allows more players to make the right choice for them. EVERY player won't make the right choice, that's a bad reason to take the choice away entirely.

[Mik317]

Orton left because he had bad knees and probably had to cash in right away. There is also the stigma of staying too long in Cals system must mean that you are ass...and well as much I enjoyed Orton's chaos, dude is in fact not good at basketball. I am not sure 3 more years of college would have changed that.

There is also the flipside of dudes who stay longer simply starting to dominate from basically being grown ass men physically. Turner's lack of speed and ups allowed him to effectively play PG in college because no one else was able to handle that. Not to mention a bunch of other college HOF type dudes that never ammount to **** in the league, Remember dudes like Wayne Simien? There isn't many examples of dudes legit getting better from what they learned in college as most of the next steps these guys take in college come from simply maturing into their bodies and having an advantage there. Like even a dude like Blake Griffin, who stayed 2 years...he is JUST learning post moves outside of dunking through dudes. Not saying nothing is learned in college but most if not all NBA level skills are groomed...in the NBA. The two games are super different and what works in college may not work in the NBA due to spacing, and the level of athletes so even if a guy learns that skill , it may not translate.

I cannot think of any player in recent-ish years that has stayed longer in college and benefitted from it skillswise. There will be busts no matter what.

[Negrodamus]

Orton had knee issues while at UK. If he were 100% healthy, he was a big body that was pretty athletic. Had no real offensive game to speak of. Mainly a shot blocker, but that was about it.

[PhilasFinest]

Orton had knee issues while at UK. If he were 100% healthy, he was a big body that was pretty athletic. Had no real offensive game to speak of. Mainly a shot blocker, but that was about it.

Agree. He left because he had a history with injuries, and heard his size and "upside" intrigued people enough to take him somewhere in the late 1st/early 2nd.

He never developed, and struggles with injury issues still to this day in the NBA/ NBDL....but if he stayed at UK, he likely would have gotten by with his sheer size and athletic ability, and also sustained a few injuries as well sidelining him and potentially clouding his chances at the nba. Most likely, he wouldn't have made it to the nba if he played 4 yrs at UK.