Grunfeld a Great GM. Proves Doubters Wrong

[hands11]

You might want to do some reading up on the characteristics of an bulletin board troll. Milli is no troll. He is a fan. So what he started a thread saying EG proves doubter wrong. Not like we don't poke at each other hear on a regular basis.

As for trying to get under peoples skin, aren't you trying to do that to him and haven't you done that to others here ? I've seen tons of trollish style posting on this forum. Where are you calling troll when posters are posting in a classic troll manner ?

Funny quite a few people call him a troll, but you say he isn't. Alright, whatever.

I am not trying to get under his skin. I have tried my hardest to be respectful of him, and tried to make him understand why others call him a troll so often.

As to others, I don't think I have tried to get under anyones skin. If you are referring to our recent "spat", you created a strawman, accused me of not being a fan, and I think you called me a troll. If the result of that was my posts getting under your skin, good.

LOL Great post leswizards. That gave me a good laugh. I mean that honestly.

As for what you called a "spat", you didn't get under my skin. But for the record, the fact that you would think that doing so was good, is actually a trollish behaviors. I think we have all done it from time to time without realizing we are. Some would call it all in fun. Some take it more serious. But true troll behavior is someone that is always looking to escalate things. They are actually pretty easy to spot. They aren't looking to be social, they are looking for conflict.

Its easy to forget that all we have here is the text people post and people can read things every differently the poster intended. Its why you never have a serious conversation with your lady via txt and sometimes not even over the phone. To much gets lost in translation. Hell, people have miscommunication problems every day even when they are face to face with people they know.

Anyway, Milli isn't a troll. He is an exuberant optimistic fan. Its just we don't get much of that on this board so people think an alien with two heads landed.

Here is the funny thing. No one thinks they are posting in a trollish way. Seeing the word through around so much recently got me doing some Google searching to learn more about trollish behavior and bulletin board trolls. What I found was very interesting. Do some yourself if you have time. Interesting stuff.

[milellie111]

Wrong. I am clearly here because I am a fan of the Washington Wizards and this is a forum where i thought fellow positive supportive fans would hang out. Seems like I'm mistaken (except for some). The majority here seem bitter and scorned and enjoy living in the past.

So if fans don't share your view of EG they are "bitter and scorned and enjoy living in the past". Again, you need to consider the tone of your own post to understand why you are having such a hard time having a mature debate without resorting to name calling and negativity.

I am a fan of the Wizards as well, and I want them to do well. I think the best way for them to do well in the future is to replace EG. That doesn't make me "bitter and scorned and enjoy living in the past". It makes me a fan who wants to see the best for the Wizards.

I am not having a hard time having a mature debate. I am not resorting to name calling or negativity. I've called no one a "troll" or "idiot" any anything of that sort. I'm sure everyone has ideas on how to improve the Wizards. You don't think Ernie has ideas as well? You think Ernie does not want to see this team succeed as much as you do? Ernie has been in this business longer than some of you have probably been out of school, yet we should listen to you on what direction to take with a $485 million franchise? All I read is negative posts, we missed out on this draft pick, trade etc. Are any of you sitting in the meeting rooms with NBA executives or tapped in on the phone lines and know what exactly goes on behind closed doors? Do you really think Ted, a successful billionaire wants to lose money and risk his reputation with a losing team? This is the management and leadership we have now and I support this team. Stop worrying about change and worry about making some noise in the playoffs this year. Some of you can be likened to someone who is preoccupied with their camera doing a sporting event or concert that they miss the whole experience!

[dckingsfan]

millie may not be a troll but he buried EG with this thread

[TGW]

And what is your metric for judging?

That's easy...wins and losses. If you actually read my post, you'd already know this.

I posed the championship question because you are the one who makes it seem like these other coaches and GM's are SOOO great and Wittman and Grunfeld are SOOO bad. You're just a name tosser I see. I don't need the Wizards to validate or invalidate anyone. I've been watching this game and business for awhile and know success doesn't come overnight.

I've never said the alternative was SOOOOO great...stop putting words in my mouth. I've said in the past that these options are better than what we have in place now, based on their respective careers.

And LOL at "name tosser"—you're so lazy with your replies, I'm wondering why I even bother with your trolling tactics.

The names I suggested weren't pulled out of a hat, you buffoon. Those are actual NBA coaches who've actually coached NBA teams, and have actually won real NBA games.

Since you are so high strung on any flashy named coach, how about Spoelstra or Scott Brooks if they were available? They are successful right? Yet, read around and many of their fans want them gone. That's why you can't listen to fans and forum "GM's" whine about change.

I see you've taken time to read other fans boards, but you won't take 5 minutes to look at other threads on the Wizards board? TRRRROOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

[milellie111]

From the tone of many, you would think that this franchise is in such as a state as the Detroit Pistons. We are still over .500 and in the playoffs. Yet, I don't see any fans jumping on board. Trust me, there are many more excited fans of this team than the handful of grumps that post here and want to fire everyone. I see them making noise at the Verizon Center. They are REAL fans.

[ptptpt]

That doesn't sound like the words of a fan to me. Enjoy this next loss? You must not be a supporter of the Washington Wizards if you are waiting to see them lose.

Whatever dude. You blew off my reply and the reply of quite a few other posters. If you really wanted to participate in this conversation you would at least do some research into answering some of your own questions that you pose on here. I don't see a point in talking to someone who doesn't even try to understand. You are just as closed minded as you claim we are.

Really? Again, why do i need to look up coaching candidates when my team is in the middle of a playoff run? If the situation were different then yeah, but it's not. Wittman didn't make the playoffs last year because of Walls injury. Healthy Wall, then they would have been in the playoffs. 2 years back to back including this year. Why do i need to research a new car if the one i have currently serves my needs? If all you are saying is "Fire Ernie, Fire Wittman", then you and others are the ones who are close minded.

If your car is leaking oil or needs a new engine, it might just be time to get a new one even if it does get you from point a to point b. This car looks shiny but its a lot of things wrong under the hood. And tuning it up isn't gonna fix it.

Don't ask the question then if you ain't gonna like the answer. Don't disrespect folks opinions if its not in line with yours. I gave you answers to your questions and you brushed them off. Very disrespectful if you are in a message board. You barely even acknowledged hands opinion on why he wants the coach fired. Being positive is nice and all but it would be nice to actually have a conversation where you do acknowledge a person's answer and give out a very thought out reply.

This supposed playoff run is nice and all but I would be way more excited about it if our young bench players showed some significant improvement and the team wasn't relying so much on older players. We're all fans in it for the long term and its looking like the long term is shaky at best. I honestly wouldn't mind Ernie and Randy keeping their jobs if they showed dedication and competence to developing and scouting younger players and not just vying for playoff seeding (Wall and Beal are not enough to count for development. They are two out at least 6-7 players under 25 that get consistent minutes. You have a #3 pick in the draft that is just sitting on the bench. Even bad players get time to get the kinks out. Otto has barely gotten a chance)

[TGW]

And as for the innocent "I'm just looking for other supportive Wizards fans" post, spare us the BS.

The title of this thread is clearly combative, not supportive. Doclinkin made a much better, more entertaining, support thread than you that can found here: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1147678

Notice the difference between a good thread and a trolling thread? You came here to challenge people, clearly.

Again, I don't know why I'm bothering. You're probably not going to even click on the link. You'd rather continue to troll.

[ptptpt]

From the tone of many, you would think that this franchise is in such as a state as the Detroit Pistons. We are still over .500 and in the playoffs. Yet, I don't see any fans jumping on board. Trust me, there are many more excited fans of this team than the handful of grumps that post here and want to fire everyone. I see them making noise at the Verizon Center. They are REAL fans.

We're real fans too here. How about you stop judging this board just because the folks here aren't as optimistic as you?

[tontoz]

This team is temporarily one game over .500 in a historically weak conference riding the backs of guys who will be ufas this summer. BFD

Long term all this team has is Wall and a bunch of role players/question marks/duds.

[hands11]

That doesn't sound like the words of a fan to me. Enjoy this next loss? You must not be a supporter of the Washington Wizards if you are waiting to see them lose.

Whatever dude. You blew off my reply and the reply of quite a few other posters. If you really wanted to participate in this conversation you would at least do some research into answering some of your own questions that you pose on here. I don't see a point in talking to someone who doesn't even try to understand. You are just as closed minded as you claim we are.

Really? Again, why do i need to look up coaching candidates when my team is in the middle of a playoff run? If the situation were different then yeah, but it's not. Wittman didn't make the playoffs last year because of Walls injury. Healthy Wall, then they would have been in the playoffs. 2 years back to back including this year. Why do i need to research a new car if the one i have currently serves my needs? If all you are saying is "Fire Ernie, Fire Wittman", then you and others are the ones who are close minded.

I think it pretty simple.

Neither side has to be close minded to hold apposing views.

They can simply have different time frames for evaluating things. And different tolerances for what they view as exceptionable. Hell, we disagree about that stuff every day here. TA sucks .. year one. Trade him now. Worst player ever. Oh, TA is actually average but he is over paid... Wow, this dude is good, but he is going to leave and he is overpaid.. Crap, how much will it cost us to keep TA. Two year at 14M should do it. Its just what we do. And the same people that later want to keep him now are often the ones calling someone clueless the year before when they were saying lets see what we have before trading him. In the right situation he can play well.

Milli is wants to enjoy the playoff run. That's his focus. Something he hasn't gotten to see Wall do yet so he wants to enjoy it. If not about Wall, maybe its because they haven't been there in years. Maybe he has never scene them there before. Who knows. Sounds like even if he wasn't sold on Randy he wouldnt be thinking about replacing him right now. He wants to enjoy the playoffs. I can get that. So why go looking at other coaches.

And from the other people side. They have already made their decision. They have seen enough. Randy having success in the playoffs just means more delay in getting a better coach. Gotta except these peoples views as fans as well Milli. Hell, I'm one of them and I'm one of the more positive glass half full people on the board. And Randy success could be connected to EG. So anyone that wants EG gone also doesn't want to see them winning more then maybe one game in the playoffs.

This is what makes being a fan so tough right now. As a fan, I want them to win and kick butt in the playoffs and I want to be looking forward to it right now. But at the same time, as a fan, I want them to lose because I have lost faith in Randy coaching them. As for EG. MEH. A great GM would be awesome. EG could move up a level and they can get a GM. Or I could live with him for a short contract if they got a really good coach.

Yeah. Its sucks. I think that is what you are seeing from some other poster here Milli. Frustration.

My best hope would be that they drop below .500 now. Randy get let go. Lets Newman take over. Go on a good playoff run. Thats something I could get more excited about.

Then find a new coach over the summer.

[hands11]

And what is your metric for judging?

That's easy...wins and losses. If you actually read my post, you'd already know this.

I posed the championship question because you are the one who makes it seem like these other coaches and GM's are SOOO great and Wittman and Grunfeld are SOOO bad. You're just a name tosser I see. I don't need the Wizards to validate or invalidate anyone. I've been watching this game and business for awhile and know success doesn't come overnight.

I've never said the alternative was SOOOOO great...stop putting words in my mouth. I've said in the past that these options are better than what we have in place now, based on their respective careers.

And LOL at "name tosser"—you're so lazy with your replies, I'm wondering why I even bother with your trolling tactics.

The names I suggested weren't pulled out of a hat, you buffoon. Those are actual NBA coaches who've actually coached NBA teams, and have actually won real NBA games.

Since you are so high strung on any flashy named coach, how about Spoelstra or Scott Brooks if they were available? They are successful right? Yet, read around and many of their fans want them gone. That's why you can't listen to fans and forum "GM's" whine about change.

I see you've taken time to read other fans boards, but you won't take 5 minutes to look at other threads on the Wizards board? TRRRROOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

You might to read on what on a troll is. You might find it eye opening.

[hands11]

And what is your metric for judging?

That's easy...wins and losses. If you actually read my post, you'd already know this.

I posed the championship question because you are the one who makes it seem like these other coaches and GM's are SOOO great and Wittman and Grunfeld are SOOO bad. You're just a name tosser I see. I don't need the Wizards to validate or invalidate anyone. I've been watching this game and business for awhile and know success doesn't come overnight.

I've never said the alternative was SOOOOO great...stop putting words in my mouth. I've said in the past that these options are better than what we have in place now, based on their respective careers.

And LOL at "name tosser"—you're so lazy with your replies, I'm wondering why I even bother with your trolling tactics.

The names I suggested weren't pulled out of a hat, you buffoon. Those are actual NBA coaches who've actually coached NBA teams, and have actually won real NBA games.

Since you are so high strung on any flashy named coach, how about Spoelstra or Scott Brooks if they were available? They are successful right? Yet, read around and many of their fans want them gone. That's why you can't listen to fans and forum "GM's" whine about change.

I see you've taken time to read other fans boards, but you won't take 5 minutes to look at other threads on the Wizards board? TRRRROOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

You really might want to read up on what on a troll is. You might find the research eye opening.

[hands11]

Whatever dude. You blew off my reply and the reply of quite a few other posters. If you really wanted to participate in this conversation you would at least do some research into answering some of your own questions that you pose on here. I don't see a point in talking to someone who doesn't even try to understand. You are just as closed minded as you claim we are.

Really? Again, why do i need to look up coaching candidates when my team is in the middle of a playoff run? If the situation were different then yeah, but it's not. Wittman didn't make the playoffs last year because of Walls injury. Healthy Wall, then they would have been in the playoffs. 2 years back to back including this year. Why do i need to research a new car if the one i have currently serves my needs? If all you are saying is "Fire Ernie, Fire Wittman", then you and others are the ones who are close minded.

If your car is leaking oil or needs a new engine, it might just be time to get a new one even if it does get you from point a to point b. This car looks shiny but its a lot of things wrong under the hood. And tuning it up isn't gonna fix it.

Don't ask the question then if you ain't gonna like the answer. Don't disrespect folks opinions if its not in line with yours. I gave you answers to your questions and you brushed them off. Very disrespectful if you are in a message board. You barely even acknowledged hands opinion on why he wants the coach fired. Being positive is nice and all but it would be nice to actually have a conversation where you do acknowledge a person's answer and give out a very thought out reply.

This supposed playoff run is nice and all but I would be way more excited about it if our young bench players showed some significant improvement and the team wasn't relying so much on older players. We're all fans in it for the long term and its looking like the long term is shaky at best. I honestly wouldn't mind Ernie and Randy keeping their jobs if they showed dedication and competence to developing and scouting younger players and not just vying for playoff seeding (Wall and Beal are not enough to count for development. They are two out at least 6-7 players under 25 that get consistent minutes. You have a #3 pick in the draft that is just sitting on the bench. Even bad players get time to get the kinks out. Otto has barely gotten a chance)

The voice of a frustrated fan that would be willing to give EG and Randy a chance if they showed signs of improvement that he hasn't seen enough of.

While Milli is not as frustrated.

Posting here is like a group theory season. Wizards theory. Just trying to deal with this conflicting situation as a fan.

On one hand... Playoffs .. Over .500

On the other hand. Uncertainty. Randy. And EG.

Its tough stuff.

[hands11]

From the tone of many, you would think that this franchise is in such as a state as the Detroit Pistons. We are still over .500 and in the playoffs. Yet, I don't see any fans jumping on board. Trust me, there are many more excited fans of this team than the handful of grumps that post here and want to fire everyone. I see them making noise at the Verizon Center. They are REAL fans.

We're real fans too here. How about you stop judging this board just because the folks here aren't as optimistic as you?

Come on. You have been posting here to long if you don't see this place can be a pit of despair at times.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeMux1GjA7Y[/youtube]

[ptptpt]

I've been lurking this message board for quite some years now. I should know better. Great clip btw. very fitting.

[dckingsfan]

Troll: a troll is someone who posts a message in the hope of attracting hostile responses, or "flames."

ummm... I think one could argue with all of the "From the tone of many, you..." that he is certainly trolling.

As long as you wanted the definition

[TGW]

You really might want to read up on what on a troll is. You might find the research eye opening.

And you may want to read up on the difference between the words "shoot" and "shot." Then maybe you might actually use them in a sentence correctly.

[hands11]

Troll: a troll is someone who posts a message in the hope of attracting hostile responses, or "flames."

ummm... I think one could argue with all of the "From the tone of many, you..." that he is certainly trolling.

As long as you wanted the definition

One could also argue that sounds like a lot of posters here.

But if you keep reading. There is a lot more then that to it.

[hands11]

You really might want to read up on what on a troll is. You might find the research eye opening.

And you may want to read up on the difference between the words "shoot" and "shot." Then maybe you might actually use them in a sentence correctly.

ooowwwwwww. That stings. Haven't been insulted like that since I was 7 I think.

Yeah, I thought you might not take me up on that invitation to learn something.

Alright. I'll play. How about this..

Yo mamma so fat I took a picture of her last Christmas and its still printing.

I loved your momma's so fat jokes when I was 7.

[TGW]

Not insulting you. Just trying to let inform you that they are two different words.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3rhQc666Sg[/youtube]