Dario Saric

[dorkestra]

I know that he's got short arms, but how is a guy 6'10" too short to play PF? I can understand if you think he has a poor frame and will struggle to add the weight he needs to bang around with more physical bigs, but he's got the height to play PF.

Could someone just post some recent, quality highlights of the guy playing? So we know he isn't a good shooter, he is an good passer, and he is not a great athlete. Could we see how his face up game is? Is he a good rebounder? Is he a smart team defender?

Also, seriously people, could you stop attacking each other here? It's dumb everyone comes off as being immature. Just post some videos of him playing and be done with it.

Fair enough I'm done arguing with this joker.

[ManualRam]

People who keep talking about Saric as a SF are those who keep parroting what they read for years. It's as ridiculous as saying Randle is a SF. ManualRam was called out for it months ago (although to his credit he didnt' claim he was watching it) so now he just say stuff like "Saric is too slow to even play PF" out of rage; why you decided to agree with such nonsense it's hard to understand.

called out? by you? so what?

nope, its not out of rage. its out of observation. being able to attack with a head of steam or attacking in transition is different than a player attacking from a static position, supplying his own momentum and beating his man off the dribble in the halfcourt. the former is a function of speed, coordination and skill. the latter is a function of explosiveness or power/quickness. saric is coordinated enough to attack on 2ndary breaks, taking the ball off the rim and going or if his momentum is supplied for him off of cuts, curls or picks, but FROM WHAT I HAVE OBSERVED i do not think he has the quickness to consistently beat NBA PFs off the dribble in half court situations. the spots that you see him attacking from now: the elbows and mid post, i don't think he's nearly gonna be as effective putting his head down and blowing by defenders in the nba because he is neither quick nor powerful by nba PF standards. even at his current level of competition he gets cut off or gets ridden into the lane where he has to rely on off-balance, below the rim shots or trying to up-fake defender(s).

i say put him in space. use his ability to see over the defense and see the passing angles. attack shifting defenses off of catches, supply the momentum for him via cuts, tight curls, off ball and on-ball screens so he doesn't have to rely on his own explosion. use him in 1-3 PnR (which is NOT some sort of exotic set in the nba). have him handle some PnR too which i think he's capable of. with the occasional mid post or high post look where he would have the size advantage vs many SFs.

then there's the defensive side of the ball where SFs can survive these days shading the handler towards help and being a smart team defender. i'd much rather have saric in that role as opposed to being one of the paint protectors or post defenders. guarding in space is one thing (which i think he can do reasonably well), contesting shots on the interior either as a help defender or on his own man, is another.

[Rosque]

He's a PF and that's it. He'll operate from high post like Noah does. Why is that so hard to comprehend? He will get the ball at high post from which he can make a great pass, shoot that mid range(and hit about 33-36%) or he can drive because he is 6'10 going against a defender that is probably feeling uncomfortable at the perimeter. He is easily one of the most intelligent players in this years draft so he will adjust easily. He is a hard worker so with NBA coach he could develop shot that will be respected. Dude is only 19 years old and he can have 15 years NBA career, he will adjust and develop.

[Dr Positivity]

I can see the argument for why someone would want to make a posting up SF out of him, but I don't see how he's survive defensively at the position at all, not to mention as a perimeter ballhandler/shooter I don't think he'd cut it. Looks like a PF where he may be able to translate his post game anyways, in addition to his shooting being more rare.

[Novocaine]

People who keep talking about Saric as a SF are those who keep parroting what they read for years. It's as ridiculous as saying Randle is a SF. ManualRam was called out for it months ago (although to his credit he didnt' claim he was watching it) so now he just say stuff like "Saric is too slow to even play PF" out of rage; why you decided to agree with such nonsense it's hard to understand.

called out? by you? so what?

nope, its not out of rage. its out of observation. being able to attack with a head of steam or attacking in transition is different than a player attacking from a static position, supplying his own momentum and beating his man off the dribble in the halfcourt. the former is a function of speed, coordination and skill. the latter is a function of explosiveness or power/quickness. saric is coordinated enough to attack on 2ndary breaks, taking the ball off the rim and going or if his momentum is supplied for him off of cuts, curls or picks, but FROM WHAT I HAVE OBSERVED i do not think he has the quickness to consistently beat NBA PFs off the dribble in half court situations. the spots that you see him attacking from now: the elbows and mid post, i don't think he's nearly gonna be as effective putting his head down and blowing by defenders in the nba because he is neither quick nor powerful by nba PF standards. even at his current level of competition he gets cut off or gets ridden into the lane where he has to rely on off-balance, below the rim shots or trying to up-fake defender(s).

i say put him in space. use his ability to see over the defense and see the passing angles. attack shifting defenses off of catches, supply the momentum for him via cuts, tight curls, off ball and on-ball screens so he doesn't have to rely on his own explosion. use him in 1-3 PnR (which is NOT some sort of exotic set in the nba). have him handle some PnR too which i think he's capable of. with the occasional mid post or high post look where he would have the size advantage vs many SFs.

then there's the defensive side of the ball where SFs can survive these days shading the handler towards help and being a smart team defender. i'd much rather have saric in that role as opposed to being one of the paint protectors or post defenders. guarding in space is one thing (which i think he can do reasonably well), contesting shots on the interior either as a help defender or on his own man, is another.

I can't really understand that sort of skill-set/plays used/position compartmentalization you're so keen on. I mean, who the heck are the NBA PFs who consistently attack their defenders off-the-dribble on perimeter isolations? Is that what a face-up PF is to you?

Saric can play in the NBA EXACTLY as he's playing now for Cibona. And that's as a PF. And it's a game extremely similar to many current NBA PFs. What's exactly the big deal here? He isn't attacking people isolated on the wings, that's a guard play. He can play in space as a PF as well - the point is that he can do those things versus a slower defender, making him more effective! Even posting up, he'll be far more effective versus NBA PFs then versus NBA wings - his post game is mostly about speed, not about backing down to gain position or shooting over people fading away.

And defensively your point reaches the pinnacle of ridiculousness. Since when every PF, or every big, needs to be a rim protector? Sure, ideally they are, but it doesn't mean one is condemned to defensive opprobrium if lacking rim protection skills.

Saric at PF can be a pretty good defender at anything else (not now, in a couple of years) except at altering/blocking shots near the rim (due to his length limitations). But he's a very good rebounder, with excellent foot speed to give multiple efforts showing on the ballscreen, a very good help defender, disruptive on the passing lines, excellent on transition and a good at containing quicker, perimeter oriented, PFs.

As a wing, he'll be a defensive sieve. A negative on every freaking defensive aspect. There's a reason why most 6'10'' players in the NBA aren't wings. Because few have the foot speed necessary to play and defend that position. Saric clearly isn't one of those. This is a complete non-brainer.

I actually think you understand this; you just don't want to concede you were wrong about him being a SF so you keep coming up with these weird arguments.

[Novocaine]

I think players with his mind and intuition are rare, especially at his position. If he can develop a better jumper, he can be a really tough matchup for opposing defenders.

I will agree with your point above in the sense that Saric being a defensive sieve is certainly not consensus. Like I said before, I acknowledge and respect other opinions, because it's all speculation and educated guessing at this stage. It is just that you are so convinced that if anyone has an opinion that correlates with one from draft express is 100% parroting someone's opinion. Let me flip this on you to show you what I mean. You quoted other posts in this thread that generally aligned with your opinion. So is it fair for me to then say you have never seen him play and are just parroting them?

Still can't see how can you justify anywhere but in the late 2nd rounder. What's the point of having mind and intuition if you lack any type of skill-set to use them? How many players could be though matchups if their jumpers would go from "terrible" (quoting you) to "good"?

I'm not convinced such a thing - actually I don't really know what is draftexpress opinion. One year ago I didn't have much disagreement with their opinion as I recall it; the point is that all that stuff is outdated or needs to be put in a different context because one year ago Saric was a player between two positions and a somewhat undefined skillset and now he's one of the most positionally pure players in the entire draft.

Anyone who reads your reactions in this thread to the highlights of Saric people posted will quickly understand you were lying with the all "I live in Europe, I watch him!" nonsense - because apparently living in Europe gives you a great advantage to watch him... on weekends! You went from "it matters because I can see him after coming back from work" to "I work on weekends" - which implies living in Europe doesn't really matter. Of course, it never did, as the games are available on delay. And the fact you felt the need of adding where you live as if that would add you any additional authority speaks volumes.

You built your opinion like this: one year ago, Saric was considered "slow" - vis a vis NBA wings. You read that and you kept repeating he's slow without understanding you were getting out of context - to the point of claiming he's slow vis a vis NBA PFs, something that is just flat out bizarre to anyone who had actually seen him playing. I bet you'll never read such an absurdity on Draftexpress (or anywhere else besides these boards) so it's not about your opinion being correlated with them. It's about you reading some stuff about a player and just keep repeating the same thing over and over, just to pretend you have an educated opinion. You don't, you have talking points.

I know that he's got short arms, but how is a guy 6'10" too short to play PF? I can understand if you think he has a poor frame and will struggle to add the weight he needs to bang around with more physical bigs, but he's got the height to play PF.

He isn't. He won't really have any significant physical disadvantage against most NBA PFs. He'll struggle to defend a few of them in the next few years (if he joins right away), but he's large enough to keep adding weight without sacrificing quickness.

This all comes from an initial discussion about his NBA position and since then a few people try to convince themselves Saric is a terrible fit at the 4: his defense is a better fit as a wing, his offense too, at the same time he's too short to play the 4, too slow to play the 4, but just fine to play the 3, etc. It's nuts.

Could someone just post some recent, quality highlights of the guy playing? So we know he isn't a good shooter, he is an good passer, and he is not a great athlete. Could we see how his face up game is? Is he a good rebounder? Is he a smart team defender?

They were posted in page #3, but you can go to http://www.abaliga.com/ and watch whatever you want.

Yes, very good rebounder. He leads the league in rebounding (and lead most competitions he participated, even when playing at the 3). Yes, smart team defender.

[ManualRam]

People who keep talking about Saric as a SF are those who keep parroting what they read for years. It's as ridiculous as saying Randle is a SF. ManualRam was called out for it months ago (although to his credit he didnt' claim he was watching it) so now he just say stuff like "Saric is too slow to even play PF" out of rage; why you decided to agree with such nonsense it's hard to understand.

called out? by you? so what?

nope, its not out of rage. its out of observation. being able to attack with a head of steam or attacking in transition is different than a player attacking from a static position, supplying his own momentum and beating his man off the dribble in the halfcourt. the former is a function of speed, coordination and skill. the latter is a function of explosiveness or power/quickness. saric is coordinated enough to attack on 2ndary breaks, taking the ball off the rim and going or if his momentum is supplied for him off of cuts, curls or picks, but FROM WHAT I HAVE OBSERVED i do not think he has the quickness to consistently beat NBA PFs off the dribble in half court situations. the spots that you see him attacking from now: the elbows and mid post, i don't think he's nearly gonna be as effective putting his head down and blowing by defenders in the nba because he is neither quick nor powerful by nba PF standards. even at his current level of competition he gets cut off or gets ridden into the lane where he has to rely on off-balance, below the rim shots or trying to up-fake defender(s).

i say put him in space. use his ability to see over the defense and see the passing angles. attack shifting defenses off of catches, supply the momentum for him via cuts, tight curls, off ball and on-ball screens so he doesn't have to rely on his own explosion. use him in 1-3 PnR (which is NOT some sort of exotic set in the nba). have him handle some PnR too which i think he's capable of. with the occasional mid post or high post look where he would have the size advantage vs many SFs.

then there's the defensive side of the ball where SFs can survive these days shading the handler towards help and being a smart team defender. i'd much rather have saric in that role as opposed to being one of the paint protectors or post defenders. guarding in space is one thing (which i think he can do reasonably well), contesting shots on the interior either as a help defender or on his own man, is another.

I can't really understand that sort of skill-set/plays used/position compartmentalization you're so keen on. I mean, who the heck are the NBA PFs who consistently attack their defenders off-the-dribble on perimeter isolations? Is that what a face-up PF is to you?

Saric can play in the NBA EXACTLY as he's playing now for Cibona. And that's as a PF. And it's a game extremely similar to many current NBA PFs. What's exactly the big deal here? He isn't attacking people isolated on the wings, that's a guard play. He can play in space as a PF as well - the point is that he can do those things versus a slower defender, making him more effective! Even posting up, he'll be far more effective versus NBA PFs then versus NBA wings - his post game is mostly about speed, not about backing down to gain position or shooting over people fading away.

And defensively your point reaches the pinnacle of ridiculousness. Since when every PF, or every big, needs to be a rim protector? Sure, ideally they are, but it doesn't mean one is condemned to defensive opprobrium if lacking rim protection skills.

Saric at PF can be a pretty good defender at anything else (not now, in a couple of years) except at altering/blocking shots near the rim (due to his length limitations). But he's a very good rebounder, with excellent foot speed to give multiple efforts showing on the ballscreen, a very good help defender, disruptive on the passing lines, excellent on transition and a good at containing quicker, perimeter oriented, PFs.

As a wing, he'll be a defensive sieve. A negative on every freaking defensive aspect. There's a reason why most 6'10'' players in the NBA aren't wings. Because few have the foot speed necessary to play and defend that position. Saric clearly isn't one of those. This is a complete non-brainer.

I actually think you understand this; you just don't want to concede you were wrong about him being a SF so you keep coming up with these weird arguments.

the big deal is that he lacks the size, length and explosiveness to take advantage of NBA PFs. yes, he could play in space as a PF, but i think his game would benefit even more by USING the other bigs as screeners, either on or off the ball to help him get to where he needs to go on the floor. i think he will need to have his momentum supplied for him. i also think that saric has good potential as a PnR handler because of his natural pace, passing and vision. PnR would be much quicker and easier to get into if he started possessions on the perimeter. imo, in 1 on 1 situations he does not have the quickness/explosion to take advantage of matchups whether as a SF or PF, but he would have a size advantage vs most SFs.

no, not every PF has to be a rim protector. i never said that, but they do have to adequately contest shots, both on their man and in help situations. vs PFs, saric can be shot over by face up PFs, out-muscled in the post by the back to the basket PFs and attacked, shot over by all in help situations.

if you think that he can defend in space well, which i agree that he can and if he's a smart enough help defender, as seen by his ability to help and recover in PnR situations, then he can survive as a SF defender. in today's schemes if they can shade towards help, fight over screens and make the proper rotations, they can be considered passable.

yes, there is a reason why most 6'10 players aren't wings and that's because they don't have the skill, instincts or awareness to play in space. i actually think dario does.

[Mr.Raptorsingh]

Saric is probably one of the more talented guys in this draft, if you're just talking pure talent. I suspect he will be a good player in the NBA, just based on his feel for the game and IQ.

[BadWolf]

What's his contract status?

[dorkestra]

He's finishing off the year at KK Cibona and signed up for three years in Turkey for Andalou Efes for 6 million euro. I haven't heard about his buyout. Looked it up and couldn't find anything.

[pohani komarac]

He's finishing off the year at KK Cibona and signed up for three years in Turkey for Andalou Efes for 6 million euro. I haven't heard about his buyout. Looked it up and couldn't find anything.

he didn't signed anything, he didn't even had agent at that point (fired his old menager) when that rumour came up

1,2 M euros

interview with his new agent Misko Raznatovic

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Mis ... aft--4464/

[Rosque]

Looks like Dario will stay in Europe as Cibona's executive said if Cibonamakes the Euroleague Dario will stay. Also, Dario manhandled Crvena Zvezda in Final Four of ABA League.

http://www.abaliga.com/a7527/News/LIVE_ ... ibona.html
http://www.abaliga.com/game/183/Crvena_ ... lStatistic

He had 21 point, 15 rebounds and 6 assists with 5 TOs. He shot 4 for 7 inside the arc and 3 out of 7 behind the arc.

[pohani komarac]

Dario pushing coach and saveing him from geting tehnical 25 secends to go with result 70-71....reaction of 40 year old veteran

http://gfycat.com/InconsequentialLongJunco

[stc]

dario reach finals with team that collapse during season. most of people argue will they lose all 14 games and relegate or win once and stay in league.

now they are one step to the title with ( 90% ) secured euroleague. and saric become legitimate 20+10 player at age od 19


kid is amazing. at the end of game he said "I dedicate wictory to players who abandon us during season" he don't have biggest wingspan on draft but biggest heart for sure

[Apollo64]

He had a couple of turnovers and missed two FTs at the end of the game, which could have been crucial. Luckily for Cibona, Red Star couldn't capitalize on those.

[BadWolf]

Cibona doesn't have the money to pay him.

[pohani komarac]

Cibona doesn't have the money to pay him.

he does not have big contract with Cibona. it's about 150k euros

[Rosque]

Cibona doesn't have the money to pay him.

Luckily Šarić knos that if he can be no1 player on a "bad" team in Euroleague he will have inflated numbers and thus being better draft pick => more guaranteed money.

[BadWolf]

he has a small contract with cibona, but will want and can get paid by another euroleague or even nba team.
isn't his contract up anyway?

[Rosque]

he has a small contract with cibona, but will want and can get paid by another euroleague or even nba team.
isn't his contract up anyway?

150 k € is a LOT of money in Croatia. That's like 500 k € in USA. Šarić will probably stay in Cibona, if not he will go to NBA.