Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread - Part Deux

[moocow007]

If I had to guess, I'd say Charlotte would take him for Neal and a TPE. They were giving heavy minutes to Neal and CDR in the playoffs, and I think now that they're finally a playoff team, and have a difficult time attracting talent, they'd be willing to role the dice.

An equally pressing question is whether the Knicks are willing to dump him like that, given it probably makes them worst in the immediate future.

Neal would be a decent fit in the Triangle. He can mask as a PG in a system that doesn't really require a PG to be a real real PG and he has shown he can shoot real well from the perimeter. He's not a good defensive player though (even when he tries) and really can't do anything else besides shoot (doesn't rebound, doesn't pass, doesn't steal the ball, etc.).

[ORANGEandBLUE]

Well the key is that Neal expires in 2015. But yeah... he'd get minutes and would probably win a few games for us with his streaky shooting.

[melo mvp 15]

There's no reason to use any asset to dump Ray Felton (which the Knicks almost foolishly did at the deadline), because of two words: stretch provision.

The stretch works by waiving a player and "stretching" out what's left of his contract on the cap over twice the amount of years plus one. That means if we stretched Ray this summer, his remaining $7.69 mil over the next two years would only count for $1.54 mil a year for the next fives years. However, waiting until before 2015 free agency would be smarter because we get him as stop gap this year and in the off chance he bounces back, not only would we get a stop gap PG but he might be inclined to not pick up his player option. But lets say we wait until 2015 and he hasn't played much better and is going to pick up his option...then we stretch the remaining $3.95 mil over 3 years, which is only a $1.32 mil cap hold for the next 3 years.

My point is: is giving up any asset worth the extra $1.32 mil in cap space? HELL NO.

The same could be said about JR, although I don't think JR is as much of hindrance despite his larger contract. But if we wanted to, we could wait until 2015 and stretch the last year of his deal to $2.13 mil each year, for 3 years.

So big picture, we could be heading into 2015 with only $35.45-$39 mil committed (depending on Shumpert) if Melo re-signs for $24 mil next year (this includes Tim, Pablo, a stretched JR + Ray, Shump on a QO for the latter # /Shump leaving as the former # and a first), when the cap is projected to be $66.5 mil. With cap holds (estimate around $4-5 mil of $600k minimum contract players for 7-8 players), we could be looking at $27-$22 mil in cap space. Now obviously we could find takers for JR/Ray, re-sign Melo for a little less, and maybe trade the 2015 pick (which I wouldn't recommend) increasing that cap space number.... but looking at those numbers, that's enough for one of Rondo/Love/Aldridge/M Gasol on a MAX deal AND someone in the Milsap/ Ellis/ Jefferson/ Varajao/ Asik/ Deandre/ Tyson/ Afflalo/ Tony Parker range.

Melo/Love/Afflalo plus Hardaway/2015 pick is sooooo intriguing to me
Melo/Rondo/Milsap too. Melo/Gasol/Ellis, Melo/Aldridge/Parker. There are so many possibilities. I know this looking a little to far forward considering all the variables (Melo re-signing, the other FA's situations, any future trades/siginings, etc.)... but if you get Melo to take a a pay cut where he leaves like $3-4 mil a year), it wouldn't be insane to ask Rondo/Love/Aldridge/Gasol to take a $1-2 mil a year cut to go after someone like Afflalo or Milsap at $10 mil.

[R-DAWG]

Anyone think there is a chance Phill zens Jordan into taking Felton off our hands

Why would Charlotte want Felton? Why would ANY team willingly wake Felton, for that matter...?

They needed someoneeelse that could generate offense and he is from the area. We know they want to upgrade their wings so maybe we can expand with JR Smith. Wishful thinking but better than all these dumb Melo trades.

They have Kemba Walker who can generate offense. Felton is done physically. JR is a different story. They might have interest in him. I think there will be a market for JR on a 2 year deal. Worst case scenario a team can stretch the final year of his deal.

[siar617]

Why would Charlotte want Felton? Why would ANY team willingly wake Felton, for that matter...?

They needed someoneeelse that could generate offense and he is from the area. We know they want to upgrade their wings so maybe we can expand with JR Smith. Wishful thinking but better than all these dumb Melo trades.

They have Kemba Walker who can generate offense. Felton is done physically. JR is a different story. They might have interest in him. I think there will be a market for JR on a 2 year deal. Worst case scenario a team can stretch the final year of his deal.

Thinking he could make a good backup to Walker and JR could be the scoring wing they need to compliment Jefferson. In exchange for cap flexibility and a pick.

[siar617]

Why would Charlotte want Felton? Why would ANY team willingly wake Felton, for that matter...?

They needed someoneeelse that could generate offense and he is from the area. We know they want to upgrade their wings so maybe we can expand with JR Smith. Wishful thinking but better than all these dumb Melo trades.

They have Kemba Walker who can generate offense. Felton is done physically. JR is a different story. They might have interest in him. I think there will be a market for JR on a 2 year deal. Worst case scenario a team can stretch the final year of his deal.

Thinking he could make a good backup to Walker and JR could be the scoring wing they need to compliment Jefferson. In exchange for cap flexibility and a pick.

[Meat]

There is absolutely no way we stretch JR. That would be stupid. We could easily trade JR to a team for an expiring deal during the season if we had to. He is a guy that won the 6th man of the year a year ago and shot almost 40% from 3.

A team that is already capped out for the next couple of years would easily take him as scoring punch off the bench. A lot of teams have useless expirings they may want to swap. And JR doesn't have that terrible of a contract. If JR has a good year next year he way even consider opting out of his current deal anyways.

Felton is another story. A say a prayer every night that he goes to jail and his contract gets voided.

I'm not advocating what should be done, just explaining what can be done. Just putting all the different ways to considering the 2015 numbers on the table.

Which would u prefer? I don't think JR for an expiring is feasible. He was considered the most unwanted player league wide for a while. They said DEN had zero interest in JR for Miller swap, and Miller was an expiring and JR is by far more talented than their other options at the 2.

I don't doubt JR's abilities when he's on. I just think every GM sees a cancer to a culture and the high probalitu that he's off at least 60% of the time

a team like memphis that struggle to score would take jr

[R-DAWG]

They needed someoneeelse that could generate offense and he is from the area. We know they want to upgrade their wings so maybe we can expand with JR Smith. Wishful thinking but better than all these dumb Melo trades.

They have Kemba Walker who can generate offense. Felton is done physically. JR is a different story. They might have interest in him. I think there will be a market for JR on a 2 year deal. Worst case scenario a team can stretch the final year of his deal.

Thinking he could make a good backup to Walker and JR could be the scoring wing they need to compliment Jefferson. In exchange for cap flexibility and a pick.

not with that contract. Felton has negative value because of the injuries, legal issues and overall poor play.

[R-DAWG]

I think we should strongly consider moving shumpert for a first round pick in this years draft. Reason being that Shumpert's QO will be just shy of $3.9m in 2015 whereas a rookie scale player would make around $1.4m in the 2nd year of his rookie deal. That's an extra $2.5 million in space to spend on free agents while still having a cost controlled asset on the roster.

I can see OKC (21, 29), Houston (25), Clippers (28), Charlotte (24) and Pheonix (18, 27) all being interested. Not sure I would take a pick below 25 unless another asset came with it.

[Capn'O]

If I had to guess, I'd say Charlotte would take him for Neal and a TPE. They were giving heavy minutes to Neal and CDR in the playoffs, and I think now that they're finally a playoff team, and have a difficult time attracting talent, they'd be willing to role the dice.

An equally pressing question is whether the Knicks are willing to dump him like that, given it probably makes them worst in the immediate future.

I love the idea of a deal based around Neal for JR. That benefits both parties, imo.

[R-DAWG]

If I had to guess, I'd say Charlotte would take him for Neal and a TPE. They were giving heavy minutes to Neal and CDR in the playoffs, and I think now that they're finally a playoff team, and have a difficult time attracting talent, they'd be willing to role the dice.

An equally pressing question is whether the Knicks are willing to dump him like that, given it probably makes them worst in the immediate future.

I love the idea of a deal based around Neal for JR. That benefits both parties, imo.[/quote

I'm not sure Charlotte is the place for JR Smith. They have a young team and might not want him in the locker room.
Charlotte is a very interesting team to watch this offseason. They have 2 very good players in Walker and Jefferson at PG and C. Assets - Kidd-Gilchrest, Zeller, Pick $24 in this years draft, all future picks, a future DET pick, $17 million in cap space. Charlotte's a decent market and they have Michael Jordan recruiting players to offset Charlotte not being the ideal market. I expect them to be very active in trying to improve their team this offseason.

[Capn'O]

If I had to guess, I'd say Charlotte would take him for Neal and a TPE. They were giving heavy minutes to Neal and CDR in the playoffs, and I think now that they're finally a playoff team, and have a difficult time attracting talent, they'd be willing to role the dice.

An equally pressing question is whether the Knicks are willing to dump him like that, given it probably makes them worst in the immediate future.

I love the idea of a deal based around Neal for JR. That benefits both parties, imo.

I'm not sure Charlotte is the place for JR Smith. They have a young team and might not want him in the locker room.
Charlotte is a very interesting team to watch this offseason. They have 2 very good players in Walker and Jefferson at PG and C. Assets - Kidd-Gilchrest, Zeller, Pick $24 in this years draft, all future picks, a future DET pick, $17 million in cap space. Charlotte's a decent market and they have Michael Jordan recruiting players to offset Charlotte not being the ideal market. I expect them to be very active in trying to improve their team this offseason.

Well, jr being an honest to God idiot is going to be a problem anywhere you try to move him. I doubt any contending team will want to take him on as a bit player at that contract. In Charlotte, at least his skill set fits a need. Plus, you have the Mr. Jackson/Mike connection.

[siar617]

They have Kemba Walker who can generate offense. Felton is done physically. JR is a different story. They might have interest in him. I think there will be a market for JR on a 2 year deal. Worst case scenario a team can stretch the final year of his deal.

Thinking he could make a good backup to Walker and JR could be the scoring wing they need to compliment Jefferson. In exchange for cap flexibility and a pick.

not with that contract. Felton has negative value because of the injuries, legal issues and overall poor play.

That being the reason I'd add Smith. I know these are two players peolpe don't like but I feel they can work for the Hornets

[dakomish23]

I know this is the Knicks trade idea forum, but I just wanted to throw one out there. Wouldn't it make sense for both sides to do a Waiters for Barnes deal? CLE should of drafted him especially since ur star is begging u to. He needs to start and build something with other young players. Waiters seems like a great combo guard to come off the bench a la Jack did for them. Have a nice young core in ur backcourt moving fwd. def an upgrade over Jordan Crawford. Kid they're already set at the 3 with Iggy and Green.

[dakomish23]

CHA just distinguished itself as a franchise with upside. Why would they take our garbage and take a step back? They can go after so many other available players.

As NYK fans, we want to keep who's playing well and dump who's garbage. Same rules apply to other teams. The only way I see us moving Felton and JR is in a swap for someone else's bad contract

[dakomish23]

I think we should strongly consider moving shumpert for a first round pick in this years draft. Reason being that Shumpert's QO will be just shy of $3.9m in 2015 whereas a rookie scale player would make around $1.4m in the 2nd year of his rookie deal. That's an extra $2.5 million in space to spend on free agents while still having a cost controlled asset on the roster.

I can see OKC (21, 29), Houston (25), Clippers (28), Charlotte (24) and Pheonix (18, 27) all being interested. Not sure I would take a pick below 25 unless another asset came with it.

Will he be a restricted FA that year?

[dakomish23]

I think we should strongly consider moving shumpert for a first round pick in this years draft. Reason being that Shumpert's QO will be just shy of $3.9m in 2015 whereas a rookie scale player would make around $1.4m in the 2nd year of his rookie deal. That's an extra $2.5 million in space to spend on free agents while still having a cost controlled asset on the roster.

I can see OKC (21, 29), Houston (25), Clippers (28), Charlotte (24) and Pheonix (18, 27) all being interested. Not sure I would take a pick below 25 unless another asset came with it.

Will he be a restricted FA that year?

Never mind - http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blog ... rc=desktop

Shump is a rfa that yr. a team will try to offer him a big deal to mess with our cap space because doesn't that yr then become half of what the contract in it's first yr is as a cap hit?!?

[siar617]

Shump is not a problem in 2015 just sign who you want then go over cap for him

[ORANGEandBLUE]

Shump is not a problem in 2015 just sign who you want then go over cap for him

His cap hold is like $6.5m.

[siar617]

Shump is not a problem in 2015 just sign who you want then go over cap for him

His cap hold is like $6.5m.

Yeah but it might be better for the knicks to have two max guys and several good players then to have three max and nothing else.