Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes

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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#81 » by noobcake » Wed May 28, 2014 5:12 am

richboy wrote:
Illmatic12 wrote:
Tave wrote:
Compared to whom?

I agree that MKG is a better ball handler, and I love him as a player, but that dude literally can't shoot. He's a useless point of comparison.

Compared to most shotcreating wings in the NBA, Wiggins has a subpar handle.

If you're drafting a player like Wiggins with a top 2 pick, yes the defense and athleticism in transition is great. But you're expecting him to eventually be able to create his own shot and carry a team offensively. I don't see how he'll be able to do that without seriously improving his ballhandling ability. You just don't see players with poor handle and a shaky jumper becoming bigtime scorers

He could potentially become a 20ppg scorer, but he's a LONG way off from that right now. He will have to put in a lot of work.


Thing is Wiggins does have a handle. He not an elite handle but it doesn't have to be elite. Similar to Durant his first step and length are so good he gets around opponents. He actually has NBA level step back and 2 dribble pull ups.


Durant's handle was never an issue. Wiggins' handles are highly deficient compared to most superstar wing players at the same age.
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#82 » by Mr. Dynomite! » Wed May 28, 2014 5:14 am

richboy wrote:On a scale of 1-10 Barnes has like a 3 level handle. Which means can't create his own shot vs anyone at the SF position consistently. Wiggins is more like 7. Which would put him as a comparable handle to Durant, and Paul George.

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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#83 » by TommyTBolt » Wed May 28, 2014 5:33 am

I NEVER remember Harrison Barnes scoring 40 in college let alone carrying a team that just lost a top 5 pick big man to injury to a conference championship. Barnes had some terrific college games and some clutch moments but NOTHING like what Wiggins did this year. Wiggins is a better athlete and has more accomplishments to his resume than Barnes did and I believe Wiggins is younger than Barnes was. Very hard to make this comparison.
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#84 » by noobcake » Wed May 28, 2014 5:46 am

TommyTBolt wrote:I NEVER remember Harrison Barnes scoring 40 in college let alone carrying a team that just lost a top 5 pick big man to injury to a conference championship. Barnes had some terrific college games and some clutch moments but NOTHING like what Wiggins did this year. Wiggins is a better athlete and has more accomplishments to his resume than Barnes did and I believe Wiggins is younger than Barnes was. Very hard to make this comparison.


Kansas was stacked. Barnes played for Roy, one of the greatest underachievers recently.

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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#85 » by WhatsaTDot » Wed May 28, 2014 6:02 am

Kobblehead wrote:50 wins, let's get it.


Is your sig in reference to the Phillies?
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#86 » by E-Balla » Wed May 28, 2014 8:10 am

This comparison is why the more I watch Wiggins tape the further he drops in my mind. If he goes in the top 5 it's too high and he might've fallen out of my top 10 if he went to the combine and wasn't at least 210.
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#87 » by richboy » Wed May 28, 2014 9:24 am

noobcake wrote:
richboy wrote:
Illmatic12 wrote:Compared to most shotcreating wings in the NBA, Wiggins has a subpar handle.

If you're drafting a player like Wiggins with a top 2 pick, yes the defense and athleticism in transition is great. But you're expecting him to eventually be able to create his own shot and carry a team offensively. I don't see how he'll be able to do that without seriously improving his ballhandling ability. You just don't see players with poor handle and a shaky jumper becoming bigtime scorers

He could potentially become a 20ppg scorer, but he's a LONG way off from that right now. He will have to put in a lot of work.


Thing is Wiggins does have a handle. He not an elite handle but it doesn't have to be elite. Similar to Durant his first step and length are so good he gets around opponents. He actually has NBA level step back and 2 dribble pull ups.


Durant's handle was never an issue. Wiggins' handles are highly deficient compared to most superstar wing players at the same age.


In 1996 they said Kobe Bryant didn't have a true position and had a questionable handle. When Michael Jordan entered the league people questioned the idea if he had the handle to play the second guard. One of the big issues when projecting players at the NBA level is realizing the difference in the NBA game compared to college and high school. At the lower level perimeter players are often guarded by smaller defenders with less space and lanes to drive. This isn't always a positive. Nobody ever questions Kevin Durant's ball handling? He get stripped constantly and his inability to handle against guys like Chris Paul and Tony Allen are a big reason why he has struggled against smaller defenders. Against players his size he is fine. This is not unique to Kevin Durant.

Now if we were talking about a SG prospect I would be a little more concerned about his ball handling. For the SF position people are way over blowing his perceived lack of a handle. This is not a guard position. Rudy Gay has little ball handling ability and he a 20 point per game scorer. For someone to say Wiggins can't score 20 is ridiculous. Luol Deng has been near 20 PPG and not even close to Wiggins in ball handling.

This is a forward position. Some of the best small forwards in league history didn't have great handle. Unless your comparing him to Lebron James he has plenty enough handle to be more than successful. Marvin Williams and Harrison Barnes had almost no shot creating ability at all. They were not doing this.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXt5JtlWnps#t=167[/youtube]

He has multiple moves in that one game alone that I'm still waiting to see from Barnes. Wiggins floor is a much better Rudy Gay. In that he has all his athleticism but a better handle and a better jump shot. I would not pass on Wiggins. His first step is insane. He may not be an amazing shot creator but he has as much as Paul George has. He has prime Gerald Wallace ability on defense. Another guy with no creating ability who at his peak was near 20ppg. Not nearly as skilled as Wiggins.
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#88 » by EscapoTHB » Wed May 28, 2014 3:09 pm

Does this mean that Harrison Barnes is also Andrew Wiggins?
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#89 » by Mikistan » Wed May 28, 2014 4:47 pm

Prokorov wrote:i think wiggins is more terrance ross then harrison barnes...

either way, he isnt a star. i think his celing is a great role player 3 and D guy



Ross will shoot Wiggins out of the gym
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#90 » by Winsome Gerbil » Wed May 28, 2014 6:31 pm

Kobblehead wrote:Can Kansas really afford to have another bust wing player?


yeah, I was thinking that too.

Wiggins might be Ben McLemore. Hyperatheltic but passive skinny wing player with ballhandling issues.
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#91 » by WiggOuts » Wed May 28, 2014 6:45 pm

imo Wiggins is a far superior athlete. He has a chance to be a top 5 athlete in the league whereas Barnes is a very good athlete but not even really a top 10. Barnes was more polished coming into the league and has better basketball skills but again, that athleticism of Wiggins is something that is beyond rare. Hes like a track superstar thats 6'8", at that size im willing to bet hell be one of if not the fastest guy in the league...plus he has those Vince Carter hops. There are a lot of similarities but I don't think these guys are going to end up being similar players, I don't think Barnes has half the defensive potential Wiggins does
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#92 » by WiggOuts » Wed May 28, 2014 6:48 pm

it really depends where the guy ends up to, some franchises just don't develop players well, and he NEEDS to be developed
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#93 » by Kabookalu » Wed May 28, 2014 6:49 pm

WiggOuts wrote:imo Wiggins is a far superior athlete. He has a chance to be a top 5 athlete in the league...


He'll already be a top 5 athlete the minute he steps on an NBA court.
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#94 » by WiggOuts » Wed May 28, 2014 6:53 pm

Illmatic12 wrote:
Compared to most shotcreating wings in the NBA, Wiggins has a subpar handle.

If you're drafting a player like Wiggins with a top 2 pick, yes the defense and athleticism in transition is great. But you're expecting him to eventually be able to create his own shot and carry a team offensively. I don't see how he'll be able to do that without seriously improving his ballhandling ability. You just don't see players with poor handle and a shaky jumper becoming bigtime scorers

He could potentially become a 20ppg scorer, but he's a LONG way off from that right now. He will have to put in a lot of work.


Guys like Vince Carter had very similar issues coming into the league but he made it work. When you have that kind of athleticism youll always have a fighting chance
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#95 » by WiggOuts » Wed May 28, 2014 7:01 pm

Choker wrote:
WiggOuts wrote:imo Wiggins is a far superior athlete. He has a chance to be a top 5 athlete in the league...


He'll already be a top 5 athlete the minute he steps on an NBA court.

true, people take these things for granted tho, Barnes is just like Wiggins with less athleticism? If Barnes had what Wiggins has, he would have went top 3 no question, that athleticism makes the difference between a young Charles Barkley vs Jason Maxiel lol
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#96 » by Kabookalu » Wed May 28, 2014 7:06 pm

WiggOuts wrote:true, people take these things for granted tho, Barnes is just like Wiggins with less athleticism? If Barnes had what Wiggins has, he would have went top 3 no question, that athleticism makes the difference between a young Charles Barkley vs Jason Maxiel lol


Exactly. They see him running fast and jumping high, and quickly dismiss him as just a Gerald Green because he doesn't have muscle while completely ignoring his astonishing body control, fluidity, lateral quickness, and his super quick first AND second jump. He's the protocol small forward athlete.




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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#97 » by MrLutareio » Wed May 28, 2014 7:07 pm

Wiggins blows Barnes outta the water athletically
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#98 » by Hans Embiid » Wed May 28, 2014 7:24 pm

I feel like people hating on Wiggins because he is from Canada.

Wiggins will be a steal if he falls to 3. This guy will be the best player from this draft.

I predict the Top 5 Players from this draft will be:

1 WIGGINS
2 EMBIID
----------
3 EXUM
4 LAVINE


Parker wont be as good as people think.
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#99 » by leolozon » Wed May 28, 2014 7:48 pm

So, the fact that Wiggins is better defensively, is a better athlete (4 inches vertical is a big difference, and 44" is incredible), is quicker in all facet of the game and shot better from the field while being more raw... that means that Wiggins is Barnes? Trolling much?
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Re: Andrew Wiggins is Harrison Barnes 

Post#100 » by thamadkant » Wed May 28, 2014 7:55 pm

Wiggins is somewhere between Barnes and Gay...

With potential to surpass them.


It's all about his competitive nature... If he is motivated to be a star... He has the tools and the body.... But to rise to the top, needs the right mentality and work ethic.

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