The $188 million gamble in Howard and Harden

[baki]

No rebuttal? Are you delusional? Try to find a single person who agrees with you on your ridiculous notions. So if you were GM you would trade Dwight for Chandler and sign a bunch of 360 dunkers? Oh yeah and trade Harden and re-sign Lin to the max. That is going to bring us a chip for sure.

And it's very hard to take you seriously when clearly you have your own agenda that could not be more obvious to anyone reading your posts.

A day later and you've got nothing because you've only got eyes for Harden, Howard and Hale no matter how obvious I can make it for you.

We can never win a championship with these 3 guys...ever.

[baki]

The actual peak for NBA players is around 25-26. The period during which most superstars tend to win big may be around 28-30, but I don't know the stats on that, and would bet that it's tied to a function of cap management and team building.
[/quote="moofs"]

Physical peaks varies so much with each individual at different position it is difficult to create an average. After players mature physically that is the height of where their natural ability reaches until they start to add weight. Ok for players that are looking to add strength in their game, but they become less mobile, more tired and heavier in movement.

So? Harden's range is pretty awesome. What he hasn't learned, and one place that Nowitzki has an advantage on him, is that in the playoffs floppy fouls don't get called unless the NBA wants you to win (see: Wade, Nowitzki, Malone).

What??? Are you saying that Wade, Nowitzki and Malone were given favorable calls so that they could and Harden wasn't?

Stop the press we've got a Harden fanboy here!

You do know that Harden is a flopper right? He is among the leader in faking incredibly hard looking fouls for free throws attempts. Now picture Hakeem flopping the way Harden does, or even Jordan? Now imagine...it looks stupid doesn't it?

The catch is that Dirk didn't win a championship until he was a 13 year vet. During Harden's 5 years, his teams have gone 54-28, 45-37, 47-19, 55-27, 50-32. I obviously am not really trying to pin any of those records on him, but it's not a bad set of records to be a part of. Dirk's first 5 years were 60-22, 57-25, 53-29, 40-42, 19-31.
I'd put Harden's two years with the Rockets as matching up with Dirk's second and third years with the Mavs (the 01-02/02-03 Mavs were fairly stacked teams). I'd imagine it's a lot easier to move from 54 wins to 60 wins than it is to move from 45 wins to 54 wins.

What??? OKC has Durant and Westbrook, 2 of the most talented players in the game. Harden was a bench player remember? Why would you compare Harden with Nowitzki?

I have no idea what you're trying to say here but let me pick another player's first 5 years in the league:
59-23, 63-19, 58- 24, 56-26, 54-28.

This dude helped the team win 2 championship in his first 5 years! That's amazing Matt Bonner!

It's not just McGrady, its Carter, Pippen, Barkley, Houston, Kemp, Arenas etc etc.
If they didn't have any other skills to add to the table (like shooting, rebounding, assists etc) then they're not going to last long in the league.

Did you just say Barkley, Carter, and Pippen all burnt out faster?
Arenas "burnt out" because he was never really that good (Monta V.1.0 or Iverson V.2.0, as you wish) then got into problems with the NBA and came back out of shape and miserable.
Kemp had a bit of a cocaine and alcohol problem.
Houston was overrated then got injured.
When Jordan came into the league, he wasn't much of a shooter, same with LeBron. They both added some really reliable jump shots and other wrinkles to their games, though, both during and after their athleticism started fading (has LeBron's done that yet? I haven't noticed it)

I don't necessarily disagree with the argument you were making there, but your examples to that end were pretty terrible.

Carter - Knee problems reduced his effectiveness, even he said he'd rather lay up the ball than dunk it, shoots 3s now.
Pippen - Was well conditioned until he left and came to Houston.
Barkley - Like most strongmen, he was pretty durable until that one big injury (in Houston) to end his career.
Houston - Knee problems forced him to retire early.
Kemp - Just got fat and couldn't carry the weight to be the same explosive player he once was.
Arenas - Suffered knee and other injuries and never saw the guy again.

My point is that the above guys were exceptional athletes compared to the rest of the league, but even everyone had to learn how to shoot a free throw or shoot better at one point or another if they weren't going to do some insane moves to the basket anymore....and Howard hasn't done that.

[Zubby]

I can understand people being a little frustrated with Harden, but Howard? For his entire career, come playoffs Howard steps his game up, this year was no different he is a superstar. He was the best player in that Portland series but its hard to win when next four best all play for the opposing team.

For what it's worth, Nowitzki choked out several times in the playoffs before that Mavs team finally won it all when Dirk was 32. At 24-25 I think Harden will be fine.

[cw3k]

Howard is terrible. What had he done to help out the team? Sure, he can score by posting up weaker big, but with his quickness, he should be doing PnR to help the ball handler to score. Whenever he did a screen, it was a weak screen. Look at how Duncan did it, committed and completely free up the ball handler.

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk

[seewhy]

Well let's be realistic. Howard and Harden are not on the same level as Lebron, KD. Let's say we give NBA stars a rating, S (Super), A, B, C, D...etc. I would say Howard is at A/A+ level and Harden at A-/B+ level, where player like LeBron is S. I would rate a star S if they have both the physical skills and the mental toughness and leadership to WILL a team to wins. I don't see Howard and Harden there yet mentally, even their physical skills and style have a bit of weakness. Harden's size for defense at 2 Guard is a concern.

I'd say if your expectation is for the Rockets to get into playoff consistently, there is no question with those two guys, the "gamble" has paid off. But if your expectation is a dynasty and for the team to contend for championship every year, Howard and Harden is not enough. Harden has a max deal, but his salary is at $15M level, which is still decent compare to other max players at $20M range. So salary wise, I think both players are okay and worth the investment.

There are 30 teams in NBA and you can't expect every team to land S level players. I'd say Howard and Harden are good investment, but they are not enough and Rockets need to build a team and long term solution around the two. Spurs is a perfect example where they surround good A level players with a strong supporting cast and a system to win and challenge every year. I don't think Howard is at Tim Duncan (peak) level, and Harden is not at Parker level in terms of impact to the team (assist, leadership, defense). And Spurs has more pieces and experience, strategy at coaching level. So there is a bit more to go for Rockets to be a strong contender. People need to stop looking at individuals and look at the whole team and the direction for the whole team.

[KJSharp1]

I feel like many people in this thread failed to watch the Rockets-Blazers playoff series. Howard was great. He was as good as he needs to be for us to win a championship. You could tell he was thirsty for one, too.

Harden, on the other hand, was extremely lazy on defense. I'm not going to trash him for being in a shooting slump during the series - it can happen to anybody -, but it is unacceptable to play no defense, and it is equally unacceptable that McHale has not yet developed an offensive system that doesn't revolve around Harden/Lin Iso plays. An offense is supposed to be greater than its players (like SA), and it is also supposed to maximize the opportunity for stars to get into a rhythm by getting them the ball with good looks where they like it best (like Portland's offense). Harden was forced to work to get into a rhythm, and he shouldn't have to.

Additionally, our ball-handling with the Harden/Lin combo on the floor was atrocious. That in and of itself lost us one game (game 2, I think). McHale should have only used the following guard combinations: Harden/Beverly, Harden/Daniels, Beverly/Lin, Lin/Daniels.

Non-drastic solution:

1) fire McHale
2) trade Lin because he can't play with Harden since both are offensive-flow destroyers (and keep Beverly, who is like the leader of the team. It isn't always the case that the best player on a team is its leader).
3) acquire a pass-first pointguard and upgrade SG depth so Harden's minutes can be reduced to 33-35 mpg so that he can have enough energy to play both defense and offense.
4) continue to develop Parsons, Daniels, and T Jones.

[baki]

I feel like many people in this thread failed to watch the Rockets-Blazers playoff series. Howard was great. He was as good as he needs to be for us to win a championship. You could tell he was thirsty for one, too.

Well have you been following his career?

All the evidence suggests that while Howard played ok it didn't translate into a TEAM WIN, which is what Howard's problem has been since bombing out from Orlando and LA. The guy is simply not a team player or a leader.

Plus he played against Lopez in the low post, not exactly a defender that strikes fear into many people's minds.

Harden, on the other hand, was extremely lazy on defense. I'm not going to trash him for being in a shooting slump during the series - it can happen to anybody -, but it is unacceptable to play no defense, and it is equally unacceptable that McHale has not yet developed an offensive system that doesn't revolve around Harden/Lin Iso plays. An offense is supposed to be greater than its players (like SA), and it is also supposed to maximize the opportunity for stars to get into a rhythm by getting them the ball with good looks where they like it best (like Portland's offense). Harden was forced to work to get into a rhythm, and he shouldn't have to.

Harden's social life takes priority over his job, which is why I don't think his defense is going to get any better. I knew that he would be like this from his first game, while impressive against Detroit (37 points and 12 assists), it was against a 29-53 team! He's good at blowing up the weak teams but hides in a corner against a great one.

Additionally, our ball-handling with the Harden/Lin combo on the floor was atrocious. That in and of itself lost us one game (game 2, I think). McHale should have only used the following guard combinations: Harden/Beverly, Harden/Daniels, Beverly/Lin, Lin/Daniels.

I don't think you've been watching the Rockets for a long time, Daniels is a role player who's job is to pop up 3 pointers as he's not quite there yet for everything else (passing, defence, rebounding, steals, etc). I mean come on Harden/Daniels????

The Lin/Harden combo should have been lethal but couldn't work because Lin was so overworked covering Harden for defense and making way for Harden to create his ISO moves by becoming a spot up shooter just like the other 3 guys on the team.

Non-drastic solution:
1) fire McHale

Absolutely agree, even the rest of the league thinks he qualifies as one of the worst coaches out there.

2) trade Lin because he can't play with Harden since both are offensive-flow destroyers (and keep Beverly, who is like the leader of the team. It isn't always the case that the best player on a team is its leader).

Um, it's Harden that destroys the flow of offensive, he's literally the black hole on this team who doesn't listen to the coach while Lin does what everyone wants him to do including play from the bench.

And Beverley for a leader? We have more experienced players on the team, like Howard for example...except he doesn't want that responsibility as a max player.

3) acquire a pass-first pointguard and upgrade SG depth so Harden's minutes can be reduced to 33-35 mpg so that he can have enough energy to play both defense and offense.

??? A pass first point guard (as Lin has been doing) only gives Harden more minutes because he's the one who wants the ball in the end, our gameplan will remain the same and Harden isn't going to play better defense.

You mean a score first point guard who can take away shooting opportunities from Harden so that he'll be forced to do something else (like defence) and make way for another ball hog? We can bring in Monta Ellis or Stephen Curry.

Or are you thinking of Chris Paul? The elite point guard who can't get past the first round even with a team as talented as the Clippers and with a good coach? Dude can pass and score but we still have an overrated center who can't shoot and a shooting guard who can't play team ball or defense.

Face it, the problem is Harden and Howard, they know we're not going to win a championship so they're just milking the NBA for what it's worth.

4) continue to develop Parsons, Daniels, and T Jones.

These guys can develop and mature on their own, McHale would just slow it down a bit.

[inquisitive]

funny how everyone is comparing them to lebron...just 3-4 yrs ago, everyone was criticizing lebron about how he would never win a ring.

[ChokeFasncists]

I feel like many people in this thread failed to watch the Rockets-Blazers playoff series. Howard was great. He was as good as he needs to be for us to win a championship. You could tell he was thirsty for one, too.

Harden, on the other hand, was extremely lazy on defense. I'm not going to trash him for being in a shooting slump during the series - it can happen to anybody -, but it is unacceptable to play no defense, and it is equally unacceptable that McHale has not yet developed an offensive system that doesn't revolve around Harden/Lin Iso plays. An offense is supposed to be greater than its players (like SA), and it is also supposed to maximize the opportunity for stars to get into a rhythm by getting them the ball with good looks where they like it best (like Portland's offense). Harden was forced to work to get into a rhythm, and he shouldn't have to.

Additionally, our ball-handling with the Harden/Lin combo on the floor was atrocious. That in and of itself lost us one game (game 2, I think). McHale should have only used the following guard combinations: Harden/Beverly, Harden/Daniels, Beverly/Lin, Lin/Daniels.

Non-drastic solution:

1) fire McHale

So far so good, was gonna push And1, but then:

2) trade Lin because he can't play with Harden since both are offensive-flow destroyers (and keep Beverly, who is like the leader of the team. It isn't always the case that the best player on a team is its leader).
3) acquire a pass-first pointguard and upgrade SG depth so Harden's minutes can be reduced to 33-35 mpg so that he can have enough energy to play both defense and offense.

What???

No way Lin takes the blame on this one (offensive flow problems) I'm sorry. Harden is the ball stopper, Lin moves the ball; in both games we won, ball movement was much better in stretches when Lin was on the court. Keep in mind that he's being put in a tough situation that doesn't encourage his flourishing. He's supposed to the pass first point guard in there keeping the ball moving, doing PnR and facilitating for other scorers instead of looking for his shots as instant offense off the bench. IMO offensive flow would be much improved if the good and normal, tried and true point guard, shooting guard setting is restored rather than having this extremely hierarchical and egotistical setup.

[baki]

funny how everyone is comparing them to lebron...just 3-4 yrs ago, everyone was criticizing lebron about how he would never win a ring.

What??

He helped Miami reach the NBA finals, he still won it anyway the next year.

Lebron's criticisms and Howard/Harden's criticisms aren't quite the same here.

[BaYBaller]

No way Lin takes the blame on this one (offensive flow problems) I'm sorry. Harden is the ball stopper, Lin moves the ball; in both games we won, ball movement was much better in stretches when Lin was on the court. Keep in mind that he's being put in a tough situation that doesn't encourage his flourishing. He's supposed to the pass first point guard in there keeping the ball moving, doing PnR and facilitating for other scorers instead of looking for his shots as instant offense off the bench. IMO offensive flow would be much improved if the good and normal, tried and true point guard, shooting guard setting is restored rather than having this extremely hierarchical and egotistical setup.

Lin's role was supposed to be instant offense on the bench. I think Lin said something about trying get into that Ginobli mindset in I think (correct me if I'm wrong going by memory) his post-exit interview. Not model his game exactly since they are quite different but be effective in that role. I think you already know my opinion on this that Lin should be shooting more to cut down on his TOs. POR guarded him very soft relative to his offensive capabilities due to defenders just being draped all over Harden whenever he twitched. I think it's pretty clear what the coaching staff is telling him to do.

And regarding the LeBron comparisons, who in their right mind would compare LeBron to Harden? LeBron is on another level to virtually everybody else in the league sans Durant. LeBron didn't need to win a chip to prove that. No one is arguing Harden is at or will ever be at LeBron's level.

[ChokeFasncists]

No way Lin takes the blame on this one (offensive flow problems) I'm sorry. Harden is the ball stopper, Lin moves the ball; in both games we won, ball movement was much better in stretches when Lin was on the court. Keep in mind that he's being put in a tough situation that doesn't encourage his flourishing. He's supposed to the pass first point guard in there keeping the ball moving, doing PnR and facilitating for other scorers instead of looking for his shots as instant offense off the bench. IMO offensive flow would be much improved if the good and normal, tried and true point guard, shooting guard setting is restored rather than having this extremely hierarchical and egotistical setup.

Lin's role was supposed to be instant offense on the bench. I think Lin said something about trying get into that Ginobli mindset in I think (correct me if I'm wrong going by memory) his post-exit interview. Not model his game exactly since they are quite different but be effective in that role. I think you already know my opinion on this that Lin should be shooting more to cut down on his TOs. POR guarded him very soft relative to his offensive capabilities due to defenders just being draped all over Harden whenever he twitched. I think it's pretty clear what the coaching staff is telling him to do.

When I said "supposed to", I meant he's naturally inclined to, signed for, best at doing that; on the other hand, he's arbitrarily and ineffectively asked to doing something that's neither good for himself nor the team. It's just not his game. His game is pass-first --> score when the opportunity arises --> draw defenders --> pass. He is very different from Manu while Harden plays like him. Gotta give credit to Brooks, Harden is perfect as a sixth man, no wonder they made the finals.

[BaYBaller]

I disagree Lin has been pretty good actually, in terms of offensive-efficiency. A marked improvement over last season. Most of his passing efficiency stats were still terrible however (relative to his position). You realize even Harden has better passing efficiency than Lin did?

They are also guarding Lin very soft when he's on the floor with Harden, considering his scoring efficiency. How many times do we see Lin literally drive right through the lane uncontested when Harden sets a pick for him? That's because they are stuck on Harden's hip. Lin should be scoring at will vs. defenses like that, and that's why I don't buy the logic of Harden and Lin not being able to co-exist. Whether Bev or Lin is better next to Harden is more of a match-up issue (or more specifically, how that match-up chooses to defend Harden), similar to the TJones/Asik situation.

But you should try get your head out of defining players in neat little boxes, things like "naturally inclined" and originally "signed for" etc. etc. The vast majority of the players have to change their games when they get into the NBA. A lot of NBA players were lead scorers, post players, etc. in college but had to radically adjust their game. There's no question Lin has become a more well-rounded player, but uneducated fans might just look at his absolute game production and think he hasn't improved.

And there's absolutely no reason why Lin can't drive and kick in our system. Absolutely none whatsoever. It's up to Lin to be more aggressive. You don't have to run a top of the key PnR to drive and kick, if that's what the defense gives you. You can do it off the catch or an off-the-ball screen (where it is more efficient). And yes, Harden should be doing the same thing rather than iso'ing so much.

And there's the reality that you have to accept of Lin's tenure with the Rockets is not long. Who in their right mind would bench Harden, and start Lin and totally change the ENTIRE TEAM'S OFFENSE (which was 5th in the league) to suit Lin? Do you know how ridiculous that sounds? Even if Lin was as good as Harden (and he's not even close), Lin is gone after next season, if not sooner.

[baki]

I disagree Lin has been pretty good actually, in terms of offensive-efficiency. A marked improvement over last season. Most of his passing efficiency stats were still terrible however (relative to his position). You realize even Harden has better passing efficiency than Lin did?

You could say the same for any rookie player with upsides about their improved offensive-efficiency, but what's this about Harden having performed better passing efficiency than Lin? Lin's points creating by assist per 48 min is higher than Harden despite only averaging 29 minutes.

They are also guarding Lin very soft when he's on the floor with Harden, considering his scoring efficiency. How many times do we see Lin literally drive right through the lane uncontested when Harden sets a pick for him? That's because they are stuck on Harden's hip. Lin should be scoring at will vs. defenses like that, and that's why I don't buy the logic of Harden and Lin not being able to co-exist. Whether Bev or Lin is better next to Harden is more of a match-up issue (or more specifically, how that match-up chooses to defend Harden), similar to the TJones/Asik situation.

What??????

You just saw a couple of games and decided that Harden made some effort to set screens and run the floor? Nobody guards Lin softly, the guy gets banged up, held, kneed etc etc. Have you even seen the injuries this guy gets? You're not really a Rockets follower are you if you haven't seen any of this.

But you should try get your head out of defining players in neat little boxes, things like "naturally inclined" and originally "signed for" etc. etc. The vast majority of the players have to change their games when they get into the NBA. A lot of NBA players were lead scorers, post players, etc. in college but had to radically adjust their game. There's no question Lin has become a more well-rounded player, but uneducated fans might just look at his absolute game production and think he hasn't improved.

Lin was a great shooter in college but somehow his shooting hasn't been as good in the NBA, ever wondered why? It's not just his physique that has changed, it's his shot selection. He's not holding the ball as much as he used to where he had created habits for shooting and laying up the ball. He's being passed the ball and spot up shoot. He had to break those habits and create new ones as a non-ball handling player.

Now you know why Harden needs to have the ball in his hands all the time.

And there's absolutely no reason why Lin can't drive and kick in our system. Absolutely none whatsoever. It's up to Lin to be more aggressive. You don't have to run a top of the key PnR to drive and kick, if that's what the defense gives you. You can do it off the catch or an off-the-ball screen (where it is more efficient). And yes, Harden should be doing the same thing rather than iso'ing so much.

I think in this system Lin has done all that he has been asked to do. Put any other good player there and it'll be the same. Put someone like Beverley and it'll be worst. The problem is we have a center would won't do PnR, we have another center who can't catch the ball for lobs and nifty bounce passes, we have a shooting guard that needs to have the ball in his hands so that he can get his groove on and make something out of 35 shots.

And there's the reality that you have to accept of Lin's tenure with the Rockets is not long. Who in their right mind would bench Harden, and start Lin and totally change the ENTIRE TEAM'S OFFENSE (which was 5th in the league) to suit Lin? Do you know how ridiculous that sounds? Even if Lin was as good as Harden (and he's not even close), Lin is gone after next season, if not sooner.

2 years ago I would have said that Lin should not leave because this was a young team of players his age, they would gell well together and because of his great attitude and effort in the game, he would no doubt grow into an amazing leader. In comes Harden, a head case who is difficult to coach, and Howard who is another one. Two players widely seen as underachievers in the NBA. Add in McHale, who is widely seen on realgm as one of the worst coaches in the league. Meanwhile, I see the Pacers rising with the same young squad playing together, I see the Blazers with the same young squad playing together.
They made it further into the playoffs, we didn't. If Lin and Asik went to New York for Anthony I know exactly who is going to come out on top. If Lin resumes his point guard role at NY and doing all those passes with Chandler, Stats and Shumpert it will be exciting to watch.

Meanwhile, I'm going to have to watch a game of ISOs, ISOs and ISOs between Anthony, Harden and Howard. I will probably resort to NBA highlights than spend an hour watching these stooges.

[BaYBaller]

You could say the same for any rookie player with upsides about their improved offensive-efficiency, but what's this about Harden having performed better passing efficiency than Lin? Lin's points creating by assist per 48 min is higher than Harden despite only averaging 29 minutes.

But Lin's not a rookie. And I was talking about his AST/Bad pass ratio.

What??????

You just saw a couple of games and decided that Harden made some effort to set screens and run the floor? Nobody guards Lin softly, the guy gets banged up, held, kneed etc etc. Have you even seen the injuries this guy gets? You're not really a Rockets follower are you if you haven't seen any of this.

When Harden sets screens he sets pretty good screens generally. Are you trying to say he doesn't set a lot of screens?

And read what I said before you pop a vein. I said when Harden picks Lin's man most defenses are so focused on Harden they guard Lin softly. Perhaps it's more correct to say they don't guard Lin at all, or forget about him. His man is recovering off the pick and Harden's man doesn't leave him (since if they do, then now you have a PG on Harden which is also good, which we've seen some defenses do, but I was talking about the POR matchup). Often times there are no other rotations and Lin can drive it right into the defense. If Lin developed a faster pull-up this action would be virtually unguardable without 3 defenders on the wing.

Lin was a great shooter in college but somehow his shooting hasn't been as good in the NBA, ever wondered why? It's not just his physique that has changed, it's his shot selection. He's not holding the ball as much as he used to where he had created habits for shooting and laying up the ball. He's being passed the ball and spot up shoot. He had to break those habits and create new ones as a non-ball handling player.

Now you know why Harden needs to have the ball in his hands all the time.

In the Ivy League ? I take Ivy League stats with a grain of salt. It is to my understanding Lin played SG in college yes?

And Harden already proved he can play off the ball in OKC. The fact of the matter is for how our offense is structured everybody needs to be able to play off the ball. Harden has a bad habit of resorting to isos yes, but less Harden isos doesn't mean endless PnRs for Lin. Our offense is not supposed to be structured to have a primary ballhandler who all the action runs through.

I think in this system Lin has done all that he has been asked to do. Put any other good player there and it'll be the same. Put someone like Beverley and it'll be worst. The problem is we have a center would won't do PnR, we have another center who can't catch the ball for lobs and nifty bounce passes, we have a shooting guard that needs to have the ball in his hands so that he can get his groove on and make something out of 35 shots.

Read what I said. I agree Lin has done pretty good under the circumstances. His overall box score is always going to be up and down based on what defenses give him, some teams focus too much on Harden and Lin can go off, other times they will guard straight up and let Harden go off. Lin just needs to be consistently aggressive and clean up bad habits (particularly picking up his dribble and jumping in the air with no shot or pass in mind beforehand) to really become a dependable rotation player.

2 years ago I would have said that Lin should not leave because this was a young team of players his age, they would gell well together and because of his great attitude and effort in the game, he would no doubt grow into an amazing leader. In comes Harden, a head case who is difficult to coach, and Howard who is another one. Two players widely seen as underachievers in the NBA. Add in McHale, who is widely seen on realgm as one of the worst coaches in the league. Meanwhile, I see the Pacers rising with the same young squad playing together, I see the Blazers with the same young squad playing together.
They made it further into the playoffs, we didn't. If Lin and Asik went to New York for Anthony I know exactly who is going to come out on top. If Lin resumes his point guard role at NY and doing all those passes with Chandler, Stats and Shumpert it will be exciting to watch.

Meanwhile, I'm going to have to watch a game of ISOs, ISOs and ISOs between Anthony, Harden and Howard. I will probably resort to NBA highlights than spend an hour watching these stooges.

I find it amusing you think NY will come out on top in a Lin/Asik for Melo trade. I don't even think Dolan would be that stupid, and that's saying something. I think what most fans care about is this thing called winning.

[Sasaki]

Lin fans are just adorable.

[ChokeFasncists]

I disagree Lin has been pretty good actually, in terms of offensive-efficiency. A marked improvement over last season. Most of his passing efficiency stats were still terrible however (relative to his position). You realize even Harden has better passing efficiency than Lin did?

I'm not sure what you're disagreeing about. I was saying, this team had a better chance at winning a PO series with better team O and Lin would have helped in that regard. Lin is certainly not put in position that would help his passing efficiency, no wonder it suffers.

They are also guarding Lin very soft when he's on the floor with Harden, considering his scoring efficiency. How many times do we see Lin literally drive right through the lane uncontested when Harden sets a pick for him? That's because they are stuck on Harden's hip. Lin should be scoring at will vs. defenses like that, and that's why I don't buy the logic of Harden and Lin not being able to co-exist. Whether Bev or Lin is better next to Harden is more of a match-up issue (or more specifically, how that match-up chooses to defend Harden), similar to the TJones/Asik situation.

I think they could co-exist too on paper. However, it seems like the problem is that Harden likes to not play D and have the ball in his hands all the times and the coach is placating him regardless of playing winning playoffs ball.

But you should try get your head out of defining players in neat little boxes, things like "naturally inclined" and originally "signed for" etc. etc. The vast majority of the players have to change their games when they get into the NBA. A lot of NBA players were lead scorers, post players, etc. in college but had to radically adjust their game. There's no question Lin has become a more well-rounded player, but uneducated fans might just look at his absolute game production and think he hasn't improved.

Sure, first I agree that he has become a more well-rounded player and he has improved. However, his team suffers in the playoffs because the team doesn't utilize its players to the maximum, like not playing a certain way in the RS and then do a sudden turn in the playoffs resulting in the capsizing of the ship. (like Korea) It's not about the player, it's about the team.

And there's absolutely no reason why Lin can't drive and kick in our system. Absolutely none whatsoever. It's up to Lin to be more aggressive. You don't have to run a top of the key PnR to drive and kick, if that's what the defense gives you. You can do it off the catch or an off-the-ball screen (where it is more efficient). And yes, Harden should be doing the same thing rather than iso'ing so much.

Well, he has been doing drive and kick. I dunno where I said he hasn't been doing that? One problem I see is that when Lin drives other players just watch because they're so used to Harden driving and trying to draw fouls, we need better team O than that.

And there's the reality that you have to accept of Lin's tenure with the Rockets is not long. Who in their right mind would bench Harden, and start Lin and totally change the ENTIRE TEAM'S OFFENSE (which was 5th in the league) to suit Lin? Do you know how ridiculous that sounds? Even if Lin was as good as Harden (and he's not even close), Lin is gone after next season, if not sooner.

Well, it's certainly possible that he's gone, maybe in a few weeks! (if the strategic direction of the team doesn't change, Lin for Hill makes a lot of sense, Hill is a great combo guard) The thing is, the offense that was installed in the first place, it's not good for PO and maybe it should/could change? It's not about suiting Lin, it's about winning a playoff series. Or maybe some people like to make the playoffs and not winning a series? (how many have McHale won? Perhaps it's Morey that is the problem) I'm sure Dwight isn't one of those people. I'm sorry, RS stats don't mean jack if it can't win a PO series. BTW, it's not that big of a change. Lin was the starting PG of a playoffs team just a year ago and a wrong a decision was made. That's that, nothing ridiculous.