NBA Games Discussion Thread - Part 2

dobrojim · Post #1461 » by **dobrojim** » Fri Jun 6, 2014 4:45 pm

nate33 wrote:Wow. I didn't realize the Spurs drafted Goran Dragic too.

me neither

but I wonder what resulted in GD ending up in PHO. He's been there a while.
Can't we count this as an actual personnel error by the Spurs?

dobrojim · Post #1462 » by **dobrojim** » Fri Jun 6, 2014 4:49 pm

going 14-16 in the 4th quarter will win you a lot of games.

I'm just glad the Spurs won. It'd be awful for the rotting corpse
of Rashard Lewis to be a difference maker on the winning side.

Post #1463 » by **Ruzious** » Fri Jun 6, 2014 5:30 pm

Kanyewest wrote:
pancakes3 wrote:I just want to point out this odd little substitution at the end of the game there. When Lebron went out the first time with the cramp at around 7 minutes, Pops subbed in Danny Green for Leonard and Danny basically wins the game for them with 3 three's and a fast break dunk in the span of 5-6 minutes. Then with about 1-2 minutes left, Pops takes Green out and puts Leonard back in. Leonard does get some "garbage time" points but was that move a defensive move so they could preserve their 5-10 point lead and close it out? It just seemed like an odd move.

Also, Lebron traveled like hell on his cramp layup.

Good point on the travel... I didn't notice it

As for the Green/Leonard substitution, Leonard was put in when the Spurs were on offense and up by 4. Leonard's 3 essentially put the Spurs away with 1:43 left in the game. As for why Pop did it, maybe he thought Green needed a break given the conditions. Or Pop just wanted Leonard out there to close the game which he certainly did. Leonard didn't play well up to that point in comparison to Green but he has proven to be the superior player over the course of the season.

And some of the substitutions were probably affected by the heat (as opposed to the Heat). Watching Danny Green, I'm picturing what Otto Porter's role will be in the future.

Post #1464 » by **LyricalRico** » Fri Jun 6, 2014 5:30 pm

dobrojim wrote:
nate33 wrote:Wow. I didn't realize the Spurs drafted Goran Dragic too.

me neither

but I wonder what resulted in GD ending up in PHO. He's been there a while.
Can't we count this as an actual personnel error by the Spurs?

According to basketball-reference Dragic was dealt (presumably on draft night) for cash and a future pick that turned into DaJuan Blair. Considering that they had also taken George Hill earlier in the same draft, I'd say it was an understandable move.

Interestingly, they also drafted Leandro Barbosa - who also ended up in Phoenix. According to the same site, they traded his rights on draft night for a future pick. That future pick ultimately became David Lee, but was sent to the Knicks as payment for taking Malik Rose's contract of their books.

I'd probably say they'd wish for David Lee more than they'd wish for Dragic. Having Lee would give them the best of both Diaw and Bonner, plus more rebounding. It would cost them almost twice as much, though.

verbal8 · Post #1465 » by **verbal8** » Fri Jun 6, 2014 5:33 pm

dobrojim wrote:
nate33 wrote:Wow. I didn't realize the Spurs drafted Goran Dragic too.

me neither

but I wonder what resulted in GD ending up in PHO. He's been there a while.
Can't we count this as an actual personnel error by the Spurs?

The Spurs dealt the 45th pick(Dragic) for the 2008 48th pick and a 2009 2nd. The 2008 48th pick was Malik Hairston. He looked promising in D-League but didn't do much in the NBA.

The 2009 pick ended up being the 37th pick - Dejaun Blair. So "pick-wise" they won the trade even if they didn't player-wise. Past Dragic there really wasn't much in the 2008 2nd round, so I don't think Hairston was really a blown pick.

From Basketball-reference.com

June 26, 2008: Drafted by the San Antonio Spurs in the 2nd round (45th pick) of the 2008 NBA Draft.

June 28, 2008: Traded by the San Antonio Spurs to the Phoenix Suns for Malik Hairston, cash and a 2009 2nd round draft pick (DeJuan Blair was later selected).

Post #1466 » by **LyricalRico** » Fri Jun 6, 2014 5:45 pm

^ Ha! Beat you to it, verbal.

verbal8 · Post #1467 » by **verbal8** » Fri Jun 6, 2014 5:46 pm

LyricalRico wrote:^ Ha! Beat you to it, verbal.

But you left out the legendary Malik Hairston :lol:

FAH1223 · Post #1468 » by **FAH1223** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 1:50 pm

LeBron scores 35 and is unstoppable and the Spurs only lose because of missed free throws by Parker and Duncan in succession in the 4th quarter

Leonard has no rhythm because of foul trouble and Green was in foul trouble too.

Spurs perimeter defense goes to hell with Belinelli out there.

I think SA wins one in MIA

dandridge 10 · Post #1469 » by **dandridge 10** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 2:18 pm

FAH1223 wrote:LeBron scores 35 and is unstoppable and the Spurs only lose because of missed free throws by Parker and Duncan in succession in the 4th quarter

Leonard has no rhythm because of foul trouble and Green was in foul trouble too.

Spurs perimeter defense goes to hell with Belinelli out there.

I think SA wins one in MIA

Agreed. The Parker and Duncan missed free throws were huge and probably cost the Spurs the game.

I wish the refs would call LeBron at least one time for using his forearm to gain an advantage. Dude constantly pushes people off driving to the basket or fighting for a rebound using his off arm. Yet, if Leonard touches him, its a foul.

DCZards · Post #1470 » by **DCZards** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 2:18 pm

FAH1223 wrote:LeBron scores 35 and is unstoppable and the Spurs only lose because of missed free throws by Parker and Duncan in succession in the 4th quarter

Leonard has no rhythm because of foul trouble and Green was in foul trouble too.

Spurs perimeter defense goes to hell with Belinelli out there.

I think SA wins one in MIA

Spurs might win one in Miami but they ain't winning the series. Last night, Lebron showed once again that when the Heat are in a must win situation, he puts on his cape and does what it takes to put his team over the top.

DCZards · Post #1471 » by **DCZards** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 2:23 pm

dandridge 10 wrote:Agreed. The Parker and Duncan missed free throws were huge and probably cost the Spurs the game.

I wish the refs would call LeBron at least one time for using his forearm to gain an advantage. Dude constantly pushes people off driving to the basket or fighting for a rebound using his off arm. Yet, if Leonard touches him, its a foul.

No one gets fouled more than Lebron without getting the call. Similar to Shaq, Lebron is so big and strong that the refs often ignore the contact because it rarely slows Lebron down.

Post #1472 » by **Ruzious** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 3:08 pm

DCZards wrote:
FAH1223 wrote:LeBron scores 35 and is unstoppable and the Spurs only lose because of missed free throws by Parker and Duncan in succession in the 4th quarter

Leonard has no rhythm because of foul trouble and Green was in foul trouble too.

Spurs perimeter defense goes to hell with Belinelli out there.

I think SA wins one in MIA

Spurs might win one in Miami but they ain't winning the series. Last night, Lebron showed once again that when the Heat are in a must win situation, he puts on his cape and does what it takes to put his team over the top.

Still, Miami needed an awful flop call on Wade's great/terrible acting job. Even with the 2 days off, you could see SA's veterans were tired down the stretch - just like last year as the series wore on. I get the feeling, the longer the series wears on, the better off Miami will be. If I'm SA, I use Mills more than the 11 and 15 minutes he's gotten so far - just for some extra energy and speed - and take some of the pressure/onus off of Parker.

FAH1223 · Post #1473 » by **FAH1223** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 3:33 pm

DCZards wrote:
Spurs might win one in Miami but they ain't winning the series. Last night, Lebron showed once again that when the Heat are in a must win situation, he puts on his cape and does what it takes to put his team over the top.

Bosh and Wade are -22 and -23 on the court in this series. I hat plus/minus but watching both games, it is evident those two are not at the level defensively they need to be to win the series. Duncan if given the opportunity is still scoring on the block esp early and often and Wade lets guys get open on threes a lot.

LeBron is the difference but the Spurs had a shot to win with him dominating and their offense going to hero ball Parker chucking up shots and going completely away from Duncan. You have to think the Spurs will stop beating themselves for once at the free low line and win a game they are supposed to win. They won a game they were supposed to lose in Game 1 with all those turnovers... they cleaned it up last night but went into one on one mode late in the game.

Spurs still have a great chance to win this series. This isn't Indiana. This is the team with the best road record in the NBA who have only played 3 good quarters in this series.

If Leonard and Green stay out of foul trouble, the Spurs will win the next game and maybe even the game after that.

Miami just executed better in the last two minutes.

If they're expecting RASHARD to keep hitting shots, then they are in some trouble.

Ruzious wrote:Still, Miami needed an awful flop call on Wade's great/terrible acting job. Even with the 2 days off, you could see SA's veterans were tired down the stretch - just like last year as the series wore on. I get the feeling, the longer the series wears on, the better off Miami will be. If I'm SA, I use Mills more than the 11 and 15 minutes he's gotten so far - just for some extra energy and speed - and take some of the pressure/onus off of Parker.

Both teams looked tired.

The Spurs are actually the younger team and play the faster pace throughout the season and postseason.

LeBron and D-Wade have gotten gassed because they are chasing guys up and down the court and through screens.

Duncan missed easy shots but he got long rest, Parker might be injured due to Chalmers flagrant, and Ginobili was in foul trouble.

The Spurs main problem is Pop playing Belinelli over Joseph. Belinelli is a HORRIBLE defender. If they play CoJo, their defense on the perimeter will improve with the 2nd unit and Mills hounding Cole on the full court.

DCZards · Post #1474 » by **DCZards** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 4:11 pm

Ruzious wrote:
Still, Miami needed an awful flop call on Wade's great/terrible acting job. Even with the 2 days off, you could see SA's veterans were tired down the stretch - just like last year as the series wore on. I get the feeling, the longer the series wears on, the better off Miami will be. If I'm SA, I use Mills more than the 11 and 15 minutes he's gotten so far - just for some extra energy and speed - and take some of the pressure/onus off of Parker.

Everybody is pointing out that the Spurs might have won last night's game if Parker and Duncan hadn't missed 4 straight free throws and/or if Wade hadn't gotten that "awful flop call." But no one is mentioning that the Heat may have been up 2-0 if Lebron could have finished game one on the court rather than on the bench.

FAH1223 · Post #1475 » by **FAH1223** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 4:15 pm

DCZards wrote:
Everybody is pointing out that the Spurs might have won last night's game if Parker and Duncan hadn't missed 4 straight free throws and/or if Wade hadn't gotten that "awful flop call." But no one is mentioning that the Heat may have been up 2-0 if Lebron could have finished game one on the court rather than on the bench.

LeBron by himself isn't stopping them from going 6/6 from 3 point range or 14/16

It would have been closer but when the Spurs do that, who's beating them? Not even the undisputed greatest player in the game.

DCZards · Post #1476 » by **DCZards** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 4:36 pm

FAH1223 wrote:
LeBron by himself isn't stopping them from going 6/6 from 3 point range or 14/16

It would have been closer but when the Spurs do that, who's beating them? Not even the undisputed greatest player in the game.

The Heat were trailing by 2 pts. with 4 minutes left when Lebron exited game 1 with the cramps. So please don't tell me that his absence--including his great D--wouldn't have had an impact on the outcome of the game or the Spurs ability to score. You can't possibly believe that.

DCZards · Post #1477 » by **DCZards** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 4:39 pm

Oh...this just in: Heat +11 In Finals With LeBron On Floor, -24 On Bench

Kanyewest · Post #1478 » by **Kanyewest** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 4:45 pm

DCZards wrote:
FAH1223 wrote:LeBron scores 35 and is unstoppable and the Spurs only lose because of missed free throws by Parker and Duncan in succession in the 4th quarter

Leonard has no rhythm because of foul trouble and Green was in foul trouble too.

Spurs perimeter defense goes to hell with Belinelli out there.

I think SA wins one in MIA

Spurs might win one in Miami but they ain't winning the series. Last night, Lebron showed once again that when the Heat are in a must win situation, he puts on his cape and does what it takes to put his team over the top.

We'll see. LeBron was due for a performance like this. Still, he has to play like this 3 more times . Should be a fun series to watch.

Post #1479 » by **Ruzious** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 4:48 pm

FAH1223 wrote:
DCZards wrote:
Everybody is pointing out that the Spurs might have won last night's game if Parker and Duncan hadn't missed 4 straight free throws and/or if Wade hadn't gotten that "awful flop call." But no one is mentioning that the Heat may have been up 2-0 if Lebron could have finished game one on the court rather than on the bench.

LeBron by himself isn't stopping them from going 6/6 from 3 point range or 14/16

It would have been closer but when the Spurs do that, who's beating them? Not even the undisputed greatest player in the game.

Yup. And to reiterate, this is what someone posted on the last page:

Yeah, it's really hard to make the case that Miami would have won if Lebron hadn't cramped up. SA was amazing after Lebron went to the bench, but it's absurd to say that was only because Lebron wasn't in. SA deserves all the credit. That's why they're SA. And it was a treat to watch them finish the way they did.

As for Lebron, the only thing I'd question is why he wasn't drinking more. Before he cramped up, it was obvious that he was heavily fatigued on the bench. I don't know if he was taking fluids then, but when the camera panned to him - several times - there was no sign of fluid intake.

FAH1223 · Post #1480 » by **FAH1223** » Mon Jun 9, 2014 6:39 pm

DCZards wrote:The Heat were trailing by 2 pts. with 4 minutes left when Lebron exited game 1 with the cramps. So please don't tell me that his absence--including his great D--wouldn't have had an impact on the outcome of the game or the Spurs ability to score. You can't possibly believe that.

The Spurs have beaten the Heat with LeBron on the floor before, why is that hard to believe?

They were already on a 15-6 run with him in the game.