Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing (Part 2)

[daSwami]

While I'm disappointed by last night, I'm going to play the role of EG apologist for the moment. We were, after all, the sixth best team in the league last season (based on how far we went in the play-offs - only Miami, San Antonio, Indiana, OKC and LAC were still alive after we were eliminated) so he deserves some benefit of the doubt, I think. So, the question is: Is EG obliged to explain the rationale behind selling the pick? How much of his off-season strategies are the fans entitled to know? Maybe Ted wanted some cash in pocket just in case we end up in a luxury tax situation after signing Gortiza.

Plus, my two guys, Aaron Craft and Patrick Young, didn't even get drafted (shows you what I know). Maybe one (or both) will get invited to camp.

[verbal8]

Plus, my two guys, Aaron Craft and Patrick Young, didn't even get drafted (shows you what I know). Maybe one (or both) will get invited to camp.

Patric Young is a little bit surprising. DraftExpress had him as a mid-2nd rounder. I think teams are very wary of bigs with low standing reaches. I think that and his lack of skill made teams pass on him. Also I think his lack of rebounding may be a bit of a red flag.

I think Craft's big problem is the lack of 3 point shot. His defense is nice, but being a offensive liability would make it hard for him to play much.

[tontoz]

While I'm disappointed by last night, I'm going to play the role of EG apologist for the moment. We were, after all, the sixth best team in the league last season (based on how far we went in the play-offs - only Miami, San Antonio, Indiana, OKC and LAC were still alive after we were eliminated) so he deserves some benefit of the doubt, I think.

In the West we would have been sub .500 and wouldn't have even sniffed the playoffs.

And let's not forget that we were only a game away from having to face Miami in the first round.

EG gave a 2 year deal to a scrub (Maynor) and now doesn't want to spend the money on a second round pick? That is just flat dumb.

[TGW]

Sixth best team? Really?

That's funny...we were pretty much a win or two away from being first round dinner for the Miami Heat. That's a helluva stretch...

[MJG]

I have a hard time believing a GM capable of convincing an owner to sign Eric Maynor to a multi-year, non-minimum deal can't convince him to use his second round pick on a basketball player.

I know you didn't mean it this way, but in a round about way it sort of makes my point. Anytime a team trades a pick for cash, it strikes me as a predetermined ownership decision that money was more important than talent. Especially in this case where there aren't even any cap implications.

Obviously none of us were part of the teams internal discussions, but that's how I see see types of things playing out. No matter who the team is.

Maybe this is just me, but I see two options here: continue to believe that Grunfeld is incompetent and simply failed to do his job by convincing the owner that a second round is an asset worth using, in which case there is still some long-term hope for this team once he eventually gets replaced, or believe that we have an owner who just sold off a draft pick for personal gain and no on-court benefit without considering the opinion of his general manager whatsoever, in which case we are dealing with an absolute dreck owner who does not deserve any further support from me as a fan. Like I said, perhaps I'm alone here, but if anyone genuinely believes the second option, then I don't understand why they'd even bother rooting for the organization going forward.

[daSwami]

Sixth best team? Really?

That's funny...we were pretty much a win or two away from being first round dinner for the Miami Heat. That's a helluva stretch...

Fact remains 24 teams were sitting at home while we were still playing, exactly as EG planned it from the start. Just let EG into your heart and you will see the light, my friend. No lesser an authority than acclaimed sports journalist Mike Wise agrees.

[daSwami]

While I'm disappointed by last night, I'm going to play the role of EG apologist for the moment. We were, after all, the sixth best team in the league last season (based on how far we went in the play-offs - only Miami, San Antonio, Indiana, OKC and LAC were still alive after we were eliminated) so he deserves some benefit of the doubt, I think.

In the West we would have been sub .500 and wouldn't have even sniffed the playoffs.

And let's not forget that we were only a game away from having to face Miami in the first round.

EG gave a 2 year deal to a scrub (Maynor) and now doesn't want to spend the money on a second round pick? That is just flat dumb.

Well in my hypothetical world we won the championship. So there.

[LyricalRico]

Sixth best team? Really?

That's funny...we were pretty much a win or two away from being first round dinner for the Miami Heat. That's a helluva stretch...

Fact remains 24 teams were sitting at home while we were still playing, exactly as EG planned it from the start. Just let EG into your heart and you will see the light, my friend. No lesser an authority than acclaimed sports journalist Mike Wise agrees.

[tontoz]

Sixth best team? Really?

That's funny...we were pretty much a win or two away from being first round dinner for the Miami Heat. That's a helluva stretch...

Fact remains 24 teams were sitting at home while we were still playing, exactly as EG planned it from the start. Just let EG into your heart and you will see the light, my friend. No lesser an authority than acclaimed sports journalist Mike Wise agrees.

Yeah let's just ignore the fact that the east was historically weak and that the Bulls' starting backcourt was Hinrich/Butler. Unfortunately luck is not something a team can count on.

[payitforward]

I have a hard time believing a GM capable of convincing an owner to sign Eric Maynor to a multi-year, non-minimum deal can't convince him to use his second round pick on a basketball player.

I know you didn't mean it this way, but in a round about way it sort of makes my point. Anytime a team trades a pick for cash, it strikes me as a predetermined ownership decision that money was more important than talent. Especially in this case where there aren't even any cap implications.

Obviously none of us were part of the teams internal discussions, but that's how I see see types of things playing out. No matter who the team is.

Maybe this is just me, but I see two options here: continue to believe that Grunfeld is incompetent and simply failed to do his job by convincing the owner that a second round is an asset worth using, in which case there is still some long-term hope for this team once he eventually gets replaced, or believe that we have an owner who just sold off a draft pick for personal gain and no on-court benefit without considering the opinion of his general manager whatsoever, in which case we are dealing with an absolute dreck owner who does not deserve any further support from me as a fan. Like I said, perhaps I'm alone here, but if anyone genuinely believes the second option, then I don't understand why they'd even bother rooting for the organization going forward.

When I first heard about and criticized this move, I thought we were getting @$500K. Which, obviously, made me think that they undervalued an asset by a lot -- reflecting, imo, Ernie's seeming disdain for R2 picks.

I was wrong. Now that I understand that they knew Martell would be lost for a few months and that we got $1.8m I have a different view.

Now, this looks like it follows the "mediocrity now" strategy. We aren't trying to build a title-contending team, we're just trying to be ok now -- and I do mean "now" in caps: NOW.

The $1.8m will buy (or help buy) Ted and Ernie a short-term, role-playing veteran 2-3. Don't know who it'll be, but it'll be someone who is unlikely to contribute to our future. If they are panicky about the season, it'll be someone like Tayshaun Prince; Ted & Ernie might have been trying to score Afflalo; they would be if he were still in Orlando.

So, nothing seamy here. Not "dreck." Just a very very flawed strategy, and two guys one of whom nods repeatedly when the other one talks. Welcome to the Ted/Ernie show.

Best cheap guy might be Keith Bogans. He's mostly washed up I think, but he was very solid and might have enough left to satisfy them. His deal is non-guaranteed this year, and I question whether Boston will (or should) pick it up.

There are others too. If it's a young guy they bring in, I'll be blown away.

[hands11]

This is the problem with that fun playoff run we want on -- it confounds the issues with how this roster was built, and it allows for Ted and EG to justify standing pat. Ted can easily say now that we were only a game or two away from the ECF, and making large changes wouldn't make sense. Wall, Beal and Porter are so young and can only improve. The sky is the limit, and it's a great day to be a Wizards fan.

The reality is that the East is going to get a lot tougher, and the odds of us making it past the second round of the playoffs with this roster, assuming we resign Ariza and Gortat, are really low. Our one single hope is that Beal becomes an elite franchise player.

The really frustrating part of this is that Wizards fans already went through this, as the Gilbert Arenas teams were boxed into the exact same corner -- few options in terms of upgrading the roster because we were up against the cap with zero young talent to speak of. I think almost anyone could see this coming basically the day we traded for Okafor and Ariza. Leonsis wants to safely and consistently make the playoffs, and he'll happily forfeit any championship equity in pursuit of that.

Sounds like the same stuff that was said before last season started. And the year before.

You knows what different today from before the last draft ? Not much if anything.

They had a late 46th pick where they could add a young talent and they walked out with 2M and a young talent signed to the summer league.

This board is so over reactive.

Let the annual melt down commence.

[dckingsfan]

We have no idea what is going to go on in free agency. What we do know is that we have $46.5M against:

Code: Select all

PG   Wall      Miller
SG   Beal      Rice
SF   Webster   Porter
PF   Nene   
C      


I think that may would be worried about Nene coming back in one piece after this summer. With Webster likely out the season and Nene out 1/2 a season. You have basically paid $40M for Wall, Beal and Porter and you are hoping that Miller doesn't lose another step and Rice steps up big time.

That draft wasn't make or break but several teams have probably jumped us from last year with their drafts. Namely Chicago, Charlotte and Atlanta and if not in the very short term - certainly in the long term. Possibly, Miami will lose Lebron & co, otherwise you most like have:

Miami, Indiana, Chicago, Charlotte, Atlanta ahead of us. If Toronto resigns Lowry, there is another team ahead of us...

Basically we are chasing 7 or 8 unless a miracle happens.

So, giving up a late second - meh, saying there is no reason for concern - hehehe - hope you are joking.

[Kanyewest]

We have no idea what is going to go on in free agency. What we do know is that we have $46.5M against:

Code: Select all

PG   Wall      Miller
SG   Beal      Rice
SF   Webster   Porter
PF   Nene   
C      


I think that may would be worried about Nene coming back in one piece after this summer. With Webster likely out the season and Nene out 1/2 a season. You have basically paid $40M for Wall, Beal and Porter and you are hoping that Miller doesn't lose another step and Rice steps up big time.

That draft wasn't make or break but several teams have probably jumped us from last year with their drafts. Namely Chicago, Charlotte and Atlanta and if not in the very short term - certainly in the long term. Possibly, Miami will lose Lebron & co, otherwise you most like have:

Miami, Indiana, Chicago, Charlotte, Atlanta ahead of us. If Toronto resigns Lowry, there is another team ahead of us...

Basically we are chasing 7 or 8 unless a miracle happens.

So, giving up a late second - meh, saying there is no reason for concern - hehehe - hope you are joking.

Atlanta is also getting Horford back and Chicago will be getting Rose back and could acquire Melo.

The Wizards will only go as far as Wall and Beal take them even if Ariza/Gortat resign. They need to solve the mid-range conundrum, either improve their mid range jump shot or stop taking it altogether. Perhaps a dip would be necessary for the Wizards to take the next step either so Wall and Beal stop taking bad shots, or a change in offensive systems that value the 3 and discourage the mid-range jumper.

[dckingsfan]

Also a good point... I guess I assumed that we would see Wall/Beal improve regardless of if we made the playoffs.

But yes, Rose/Chicago and Horford/Atlanta definitely help bump them. That and Chicago picked up McDermott and Atlanta picked up Adreian Payne.

[dckingsfan]

I will add that it seems a certainty that Gooden will resign for the vet minimum - that is certainly a positive.

[dckingsfan]

"The Wizards have told Andre Miller that he'll be retained via the $4.6 million option on his contract for the 2014-15 season, his agent Andy Miller confirmed to CSNwashington.com on Friday."

[Mickstix]

On the flip side, Grundfeld can't get a top 5 pick right, what the hell was he going to do with the 48th anyway.. lol So wish we had an owner with testes.. Bum should of been gone years ago, same with McPhee and the Caps.. It's as if they like losing or somthing..

[noworriesinmd]

"The Wizards have told Andre Miller that he'll be retained via the $4.6 million option on his contract for the 2014-15 season, his agent Andy Miller confirmed to CSNwashington.com on Friday."

Wow, if they are overpaying and all in for a 38 yr old. Imagine the contract Ariza and Gortat will get.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

We have no idea what is going to go on in free agency. What we do know is that we have $46.5M against:

Code: Select all

PG   Wall      Miller
SG   Beal      Rice
SF   Webster   Porter
PF   Nene   
C      


I think that may would be worried about Nene coming back in one piece after this summer. With Webster likely out the season and Nene out 1/2 a season. You have basically paid $40M for Wall, Beal and Porter and you are hoping that Miller doesn't lose another step and Rice steps up big time.

That draft wasn't make or break but several teams have probably jumped us from last year with their drafts. Namely Chicago, Charlotte and Atlanta and if not in the very short term - certainly in the long term. Possibly, Miami will lose Lebron & co, otherwise you most like have:

Miami, Indiana, Chicago, Charlotte, Atlanta ahead of us. If Toronto resigns Lowry, there is another team ahead of us...

Basically we are chasing 7 or 8 unless a miracle happens.

So, giving up a late second - meh, saying there is no reason for concern - hehehe - hope you are joking.

Boston is going to be way tougher with Rondo healthy.

Cleveland is much improved defensively.

Don't underestimate the picks and Calderon to NYK. That team will probably improve even though tanking is what most expect.

The Wizards same guys could slump and miss the playoff.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using RealGM Forums mobile app

[noworriesinmd]

It pains me to say this.... It would be extremely foolish for Ariza or Gortat to sign with the Wizards day one.
Each will get pitched from multiple teams, some with better prospects this us.
A lot of people keep on saying that Miami can't afford Gortat, but the only thing that matters to JBJ is winning.
Endorsements pays the bills not his NBA salary.

I wonder what EG's pitch is?

They are over a barrel and both Ariza and Gortat know it. There will be no home team discount. A lot of teams appear to be flush with cap space and ready to spend it.