Bucks looking at Bledsoe, probably.

LUKE23 · Post #1101 » by **LUKE23** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:22 pm

If Bledsoe was added and Sanders regained form we'd be top 10 in D is my guess. I put essentially no stock in what happened last year when projecting what happens in 2014-15, for the several reasons already stated a dozen times.

And nobody is guaranteeing Sanders regains 2012-13 form. But any scenario where we contend means that is happening, and we are at some point going to need to take a few risks. I see Bledsoe as a risk worth taking over how we will realistically end up spending the money otherwise.

Newz · Post #1102 » by **Newz** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:22 pm

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:so if we had his rights we wouldn't have to worry about giving him the max to keep him? that's your argument? seriously? half the teams in this league would max him right now if they could!!!!!

Half the teams in the league can't max him though. This is why I'm not sure if you understand what you are talking about. You need that pesky "cap room" in order to do that.

Kerb Hohl · Post #1103 » by **Kerb Hohl** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:25 pm

wichmae wrote:Im not poo pooing your wants either. KH. I just want absolutely no FA's signed here. Its a waste. Develop what you have. Play the kids 35+ a night and try to see if you can score extra draft selections or turn the vets into assets. Philly is doing a masterful job at the build right now (even though I cant stnd Embiid).

That's what I'd do as well. That said, I wouldn't have a problem if our owners overpaid a player from the pool of 4 or 5 guys that are relatively young and could be very good/great and are attainable.

If not, I agree. No major moves and tank/acquire assets.

Newz · Post #1104 » by **Newz** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:26 pm

LUKE23 wrote:If Bledsoe was added and Sanders regained form we'd be top 10 in D is my guess. I put essentially no stock in what happened last year when projecting what happens in 2014-15, for the several reasons already stated a dozen times.

No reason to put any stock in a major decline once a player got his money, that's never happened before. Suspensions and off the court issues are nothing to be concerns about. Guys who get in trouble for that stuff never get in trouble for it again.

He's fine. No way he isn't the player he was two years ago or better. That's the only logical outcome... right?

I'm not saying Sanders can't still be a good player. But it amuses me how much people around here can get excited about new ownership, a new player or our team... and then all of the sudden they go from being logical fans to being overly optimistic about our guys. Sanders could return to form, but it is unrealistic to say we should put "no stock" in what happened with him last year.

There is a good chance Sanders continues to get into trouble and flames out... or that he got his money and just stopped giving a ****.

Post #1105 » by **MickeyDavis** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:27 pm

I wish the Almighty LeCramp would sign somewhere already so the rest of the dominos can fall where they may.

wichmae · Post #1106 » by **wichmae** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:28 pm

MickeyDavis wrote:I wish the Almighty LeCramp would sign somewhere already so the rest of the dominos can fall where they may.

Absolutely. He's holding it all up.

LUKE23 · Post #1107 » by **LUKE23** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:29 pm

I put no stock in last year. Different coach, different owners, different intentions, different key players, health factors will also be different. If you do that's fine, I'm not going to waste time debating it.

Bledsoe is a better use of money than we will realistically have moving forward. I'll wait for that prediction to bear itself out. It's not like signing Bledsoe prevents anything with Giannis/Parker. Like I said, I need to hear realistic alternatives to Bledsoe that we will add in the next few seasons, for players of comparable talent and age.

Newz · Post #1108 » by **Newz** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:32 pm

LUKE23 wrote:I put no stock in last year. Different coach, different owners, different intentions, different key players, health factors will also be different. If you do that's fine, I'm not going to waste time debating it.

We don't need to debate it. I just want to offer you a couple of examples to think about. Tim Thomas got his money and just didn't care with the Bucks before. The most recent example of a guy flaming out now is Josh Gordon, who is an unreal talent who is just throwing millions away.

I just don't think it's logical to put no stock in it. I get that you like Larry Sanders and you want him to return to being good... and he certainly could, but at least be logical about things.

Post #1109 » by **jr lucosa** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:34 pm

Newz wrote:
I'm not saying Sanders can't still be a good player. But it amuses me how much people around here can get excited about new ownership, a new player or our team... and then all of the sudden they go from being logical fans to being overly optimistic about our guys. Sanders could return to form, but it is unrealistic to say we should put "no stock" in what happened with him last year.

There is a good chance Sanders continues to get into trouble and flames out... or that he got his money and just stopped giving a ****.

We do need to hope he matures some and can stay out of trouble, but it's not like his production fell off a cliff when he was on the floor last season, the defensive impact is there, and he had already signed that extension. If we can keep him healthy and out of trouble (which I realize are real concerns) I have little doubt that he will continue to be an impact player.

LUKE23 · Post #1110 » by **LUKE23** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:35 pm

I am being logical. I believe players that played elite D for an entire season are capable of returning to form when they are in their mid 20's. I realize the general premise is to be negative about everything and then you can either be right or pleasantly surprised. I get why people do that and I've done it before as well. I'm just not in that mode of thinking right now. A new owner, coach, and player grouping means a completely different dynamic for every player on the roster, especially if we aren't blatantly tanking for half a season. That's just reality.

Post #1111 » by **ReasonablySober** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:39 pm

Sanders doesn't even have to return to form. When he was on the court last season he was still an elite defensive presence

For all his faults and failings, Larry Sanders still appears to be every bit the impact defender that the Bucks signed to a long-term extension this summer. The Bucks have performed like a top-10 defense with Sanders on the floor and a bottom-five unit without him.

On the season, only Lopez and Hibbert were better with regards opponent FG percentage at the rim.

If Sanders is healthy and playing this year, the Bucks will have a top ten defense.

Newz · Post #1112 » by **Newz** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:39 pm

LUKE23 wrote:I am being logical. I believe players that played elite D for an entire season are capable of returning to form when they are in their mid 20's. I realize the general premise is to be negative about everything and then you can either be right or pleasantly surprised. I get why people do that and I've done it before as well. I'm just not in that mode of thinking right now. A new owner, coach, and player grouping means a completely different dynamic for every player on the roster, especially if we aren't blatantly tanking for half a season. That's just reality.

I'm not being negative at all.

He could return to being an elite defensive center. He could also continue to be an idiot off the court, struggle with drugs or get hurt again.

That's reality. Ignoring the entire equation is not reality... it's just ignoring the things you don't want to hear.

LUKE23 · Post #1113 » by **LUKE23** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:42 pm

Except I have acknowledged everything that has been stated. People are blatantly ignoring how much has changed. Anyone who legitimately argues that, "we were 15 win talent last year, that means we are X wins this next season and surely still a top 5 pick roster" is not thinking through things. That's all I'm saying.

LUKE23 · Post #1114 » by **LUKE23** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:43 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:Sanders doesn't even have to return to form. When he was on the court last season he was still an elite defensive presence

For all his faults and failings, Larry Sanders still appears to be every bit the impact defender that the Bucks signed to a long-term extension this summer. The Bucks have performed like a top-10 defense with Sanders on the floor and a bottom-five unit without him.

On the season, only Lopez and Hibbert were better with regards opponent FG percentage at the rim.

If Sanders is healthy and playing this year, the Bucks will have a top ten defense.

Yep.

JimmyTheKid · Post #1115 » by **JimmyTheKid** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:44 pm

MickeyDavis wrote:I wish the Almighty LeCramp would sign somewhere already so the rest of the dominos can fall where they may.

People are getting antsy. And mad at Lebron. Again.

Thats what Jay Mohr was ranting about today. It was great. He was even more pissed off that Bosh insists on waiting until Lebron figures it out. Calling Bosh "Merton Hanks Neck." Which was brilliant. He then went off on Carmelo.

Save yourself a headache and tune it out until there is some concrete news. (aka a "Decision")

CaptainAwesome · Post #1116 » by **CaptainAwesome** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:45 pm

MickeyDavis wrote:I wish the Almighty LeCramp would sign somewhere already so the rest of the dominos can fall where they may.

He's doubled over from the weight of so many options.

Newz · Post #1117 » by **Newz** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:45 pm

LUKE23 wrote:Except I have acknowledged everything that has been stated. People are blatantly ignoring how much has changed. Anyone who legitimately argues that, "we were 15 win talent last year, that means we are X wins this next season and surely still a top 5 pick roster" is not thinking through things. That's all I'm saying.

I think it's possible we could still be picking top 5 this year. Our best player had injury and off the court problems last year and our second/third guys are both under 20. Odds are we aren't going to be all that great. That being said, I think we could also sneak into the 7th-8th seed if Parker and Giannis both play incredibly well for their age. I think making the playoffs in the East (with how awful the conference is) can be achieved just by playing hard.

Badgerlander · Post #1118 » by **Badgerlander** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:46 pm

If Jabari is going to drag our defense into the gutter, how does Golden State rank 3rd with David Lee playing 33 minutes per night?

midranger · Post #1119 » by **midranger** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:48 pm

The way I see it...

1. Chances of landing in the top 5 next year are very slim if Giannis and Parker are any good. If they aren't any good, the team is screwed regardless, and probably heading to Seattle.

2. If Sanders doesn't play (or play well), we'll be fairly bad regardless of who we sign. Not top 5 bad, but top 10 bad.

3. No Sanders, No Bledsoe = ~6-7th pick, IMO
No Sanders, + Bledsoe = ~10-11 pick

4. Bledsoe will be better than the 6 or 7th pick 90% of the time.

5. Bledsoe + 10th pick > 6th pick + crappy short term salary filler, IMO (this is worst case scenario in my mind outside of Bledsoe suffering catastrophic career ending injury which can happen to any player)

6. Best case scenario for next year, Bledsoe, Giannis, and Sanders play elite level defense. Bledsoe and Parker are dynamic scorers. Bledsoe and Giannis are dynamic playmakers. Middleton and Ersan are elite floor spacing shooters. Brandon Knight is a 6th man of the year candidate 3rd G. We win 45 games. Think this is not possible? The rabble of crappy players that Toronto sent out last year won 48 games. Big things to come the next few years.

Chapter29 · Post #1120 » by **Chapter29** » Tue Jul 8, 2014 6:53 pm

LUKE23 wrote:Still all in on using our cap space on a Bledsoe offer, and still think the people that feel we are a lock for the top 5 again in 2015 are nuts.

I am with you on both accounts.

And I am LMAO on the Bledsoe vs Knight comparisons. I wish those people worked for the Suns.