The Marvin Gaye Williams Thread

[BlackOutBuzz]

Should have just kept McRoberts. Don't be surprised if Zeller gives Williams a run for his money for the starting spot.

Marvin will be the starter opening night, though.

You act like we had a choice. I'm sure we offered McBob the contract Marvin got, he just preferred the long-term agreement.

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[Liver_Pooty]

Should have just kept McRoberts. Don't be surprised if Zeller gives Williams a run for his money for the starting spot.

Marvin will be the starter opening night, though.

You act like we had a choice. I'm sure we offered McBob the contract Marvin got, he just preferred the long-term agreement.

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I don't know what we offered him, nor does anyone else. For all we know we could have low balled him. Or we could have offered him the same deal Miami did but he likes South Beach better. Wish we knew.

[yosemiteben]

Should have just kept McRoberts. Don't be surprised if Zeller gives Williams a run for his money for the starting spot.

Marvin will be the starter opening night, though.

You act like we had a choice. I'm sure we offered McBob the contract Marvin got, he just preferred the long-term agreement.

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I don't know what we offered him, nor does anyone else. For all we know we could have low balled him. Or we could have offered him the same deal Miami did but he likes South Beach better. Wish we knew.

True, but given (1) the seemingly genuine respect and appreciation expressed for McBob by Clifford and our FO, (2) the contract we gave Marvin, and (3) our FO's apparent interest in leaving open tons of space for 2016, I tend to agree with BOB.

[Liver_Pooty]

You act like we had a choice. I'm sure we offered McBob the contract Marvin got, he just preferred the long-term agreement.

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I don't know what we offered him, nor does anyone else. For all we know we could have low balled him. Or we could have offered him the same deal Miami did but he likes South Beach better. Wish we knew.

True, but given (1) the seemingly genuine respect and appreciation expressed for McBob by Clifford and our FO, (2) the contract we gave Marvin, and (3) our FO's apparent interest in leaving open tons of space for 2016, I tend to agree with BOB.

You guys are probably right, still frustrating though. Oh well. We will see how this pans out.

[Bassman]

not sure if this was reported elsewhere today, but i heard cho on the radio tonight. most of the interview was about lance, but cho did say something of note. he said "we brought marvin in to be our starting power forward". he said it in passing and then moved on and the hosts never asked a follow-up. but based on that comment, it seems
1) he views marvin as a power forward
2) he was brought in to start, not back up MKG at small forward, not back up zeller or vonleh
3) zeller is not viewed as the starter

Thanks Fats. Just saw your post, and that jibes with my previous supposition relative to the Clifford comments in the Observer article. This means they know Cody is not ready, and Noah will be given time to learn and develop without the pressure of immediate production. Williams would not have been my choice, but we'll see how he plays out.

[yosemiteben]

not sure if this was reported elsewhere today, but i heard cho on the radio tonight. most of the interview was about lance, but cho did say something of note. he said "we brought marvin in to be our starting power forward". he said it in passing and then moved on and the hosts never asked a follow-up. but based on that comment, it seems
1) he views marvin as a power forward
2) he was brought in to start, not back up MKG at small forward, not back up zeller or vonleh
3) zeller is not viewed as the starter

How did the host not hone in on that?

Nice find fats.

[ARHornet]

I still find it odd that we picked Williams as (presumably) our starting PF after all the comments Clifford has made about not liking to play small.

[Liver_Pooty]

I still find it odd that we picked Williams as (presumably) our starting PF after all the comments Clifford has made about not liking to play small.

Well when you compare Williams combine stats to Vonlehs they are similar. Same standing reach. Williams had a 7'3.5 reach while Vonleh had a 7'4.25. Williams probably grew an extra half inch or so since as well.

[Diop]

Williams would not have been my choice, but we'll see how he plays out.

this is how I'm playing it as well. I never thought of Marv as a target for starting Pf, but I'm willing to give him a shot to see how he goes.

[BlackOutBuzz]

@mcristaldi
@jonrinehart nailed scouting report on Marvin Williams. Said he was one of the best he's ever worked with. After one day, I can see that.

@jonrinehart
Can’t say enough good things about Marvin Williams. Total class act who was a pleasure to work with. My loss is @mcristaldi ’s gain.

Mike Cristaldi is our VP of Communications. Jon Rinehart is the JAZZ PR director.

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[legendO_Kiko]

I still find it odd that we picked Williams as (presumably) our starting PF after all the comments Clifford has made about not liking to play small.

I would've preferred they kept Mcroberts, but I get the idea just not the player when it comes to marv.

They have al, and drafted vonleh and zeller very high so it's hard to give Mcroberts the kind of money he wanted there. Or at least that's what I assume the logic was because I'm not a big Marvin guy. I grew up and unc fan obviously bc of mj, and I was just getting big into hoops when unc dubbed Marvin Williams the next big thing. So naturally I hitched my wagon to him and needless to say I bailed from that bandwagon not to years after him being drafted. He just has never lived up to the potential. I'm hoping he could just be a guy to play d and stretch the floor when they go small and put him at the 4 but I still like Mcroberts more as a shooter and a distributor from the 3 point line.

Marvin doesn't thrill me, not one bit

[InProblematique]

A lot of people are sleeping on this signing, I think. Marvin is a very good two-way player. He can hit jumpers, he can cut to the rim, he's very athletic, and he can play the 3 and 4. He's also become known around the NBA as one of the best locker room guys, and we need that.

We might have overpaid him a bit...I would've gone two years, $10 million. But it's not a huge reach, and he brings A LOT of versatility and depth to the team, not to mention a great locker room presence. I think he's going to work out very well here. It's going to be a nice way to bring Cody and Vonleh along at the proper pace...Marvin can get about 30 minutes between the 3 and 4, and Cody can hopefully begin to work his way into starting at the 4 as the season progresses.

Smart move by Cho. Obviously not the playmaker that McBob is, but he's a much better defender, a better overall scorer, arguably a better rebounder, and he can play two positions very well. Would I prefer McBob? Of course. But Marvin is more than an adequate replacement, especially as the young guys continue to mature.

[HornetShocker]

I love the Marvin signing. Good shooter, good defender, great teammate. Not every guy can score 20 and grab 10 bounds a game. Marvin will be awesome.

Oh and Rick Bonnell really needs to get out of McRoberts jock. OLD, let it go man!

[TheKingofSting]

Marvin is also a nice dresser.

[Snidely FC]

Clifford said the Hornets were impressed with Williams' transformation into a 3-point weapon in recent years.

13-14 3pt%: .359
Career 3pt%: .335

[yosemiteben]

Clifford said the Hornets were impressed with Williams' transformation into a 3-point weapon in recent years.

13-14 3pt%: .359
Career 3pt%: .335

Over 40% from the left wing last season, almost twice the percentage of McRoberts.

[EwingSweatsALot]

Clifford said the Hornets were impressed with Williams' transformation into a 3-point weapon in recent years.

13-14 3pt%: .359
Career 3pt%: .335

Over 40% from the left wing last season, almost twice the percentage of McRoberts.

Which will really pair well with Jefferson and Stephenson. Jefferson taking up his real estate on the left side allows for Marvin to have a little more room on that wing and corner. Stephenson shoots his best in the right corner so now you have some spacing cross court to allow Kemba and MKG to get in the lane or Kemba to operate up top where he shoots the best with volume.

It will be really interesting to see how our first team offense works this year with each of our guys doing something really well on different spots of the court.

[SWedd523]

I guess I'm thinking about it differently but I don't see how Marvin being a left corner shooter and Al being a left block postman are a good match. Ideally you'd want him to be on the weakside so he could get swing-around shots. There won't be enough space to get quality open looks on that same side of the court. His 3P% dropped from 38.9% in 2012 to 32.5% his one year with Al, then back up to 35.9% last year.

[EwingSweatsALot]

I guess I'm thinking about it differently but I don't see how Marvin being a left corner shooter and Al being a left block postman are a good match. Ideally you'd want him to be on the weakside so he could get swing-around shots. There won't be enough space to get quality open looks on that same side of the court. His 3P% dropped from 38.9% in 2012 to 32.5% his one year with Al, then back up to 35.9% last year.

I went and looked at his shot charts over those last three years.

LC
13-14- 36.84%
12-13- 35.00%
11-12- 47.62%

LW
13-14- 41.56%
12-13- 41.67%
11-12- 30.77%

TOP
13-14- 37.14%
12-13- 32.00%
11-12- 72.73%

RW
13-14- 31.75%
12-13- 31.11%
11-12- 28.13%

RC
13-14- 29.41%
12-13- 25.00%
11-12- 32.43%

IF you look at 11-12, there are some high anomalies. Look at the left corner and straight on. That shot up his 3P%, especially on less attempts than the other two years. If it was 5-7% higher then I would contribute that to having other outlying factors, but brings 12% higher on the LC and 50% higher from straight on I just attribute those to what is more than likely just a fluke.

So comparing last year and then 12-13 when he played with Al, they are somewhat similar in the areas of need for his shooting, the LW and LC. He was close to identical on percentage from the LW and just a tad better from the LC. From the left side of the court he shot 40% last year and 37.5% with Al. Part of that could be attributed to with or not with Al, but 2.5% isn't that much of a deviance especially when you consider the work he has put in to expand his game. It could just be an uptick because of the work he put in on his 3 ball.

Also, Williams shot worse on the right side with Al than he did without him as well.

Any way you look at it you want as much 3 point shooting as you can get in the NBA now. The fact we have a guy that excels on the left, another that excels on the right, and a guy that excels from straight on at volume in our starting lineup is a huge plus. Wherever you can get it you take it. If Williams continues to shoot in the high 30-low 40% from the left side of the court, then Al cannot be doubled on his favorite spot whatsoever. If you have Al posted up on the left in a semi clear out with Williams on the LW, Kemba slightly off center, MKG in the oppo post and Lance in the right corner, you cannot double Al whatsoever.

Al also shot better from the left block the year he played with Marvin compared to the other two years as well.

[yosemiteben]

Nice work Ewing.

I put a little effort into trying to find stats on how often McBob was assisted by Al on his right wing 3's, but couldn't find anything and gave up.