Suns and Bledsoe on the Verge of Irreparable Relationship

[mixerball]

The answer is....Sign and Trade Eric Bledsoe to the Lakers for Jordan Hill, Steve Nash and Wesley Johnson. This gives Phoenix a rebounder,scoring off the bench and retiring Steve Nash in a Suns uniform.For the Lakers it's biscuits and gravy. Eric drives the ball downpour. Make this move build a core of Bledsoe and Randle going forward.

why would PHX want that?

[NaturalBuns]

The answer is....Sign and Trade Eric Bledsoe to the Lakers for Jordan Hill, Steve Nash and Wesley Johnson. This gives Phoenix a rebounder,scoring off the bench and retiring Steve Nash in a Suns uniform.For the Lakers it's biscuits and gravy. Eric drives the ball downpour. Make this move build a core of Bledsoe and Randle going forward.

Idk last time Suns and Lakers traded suns owned them.
probably snagging randle in a deal mitch is kind of... lost his touch

[HotelVitale]

Ask the Raptors fans how much impact Lowry had in pulling their team into the playoffs. He has more impact than Bledsoe. If Lowry isn't worth the max in this market as an unrestricted free agent, then injury prone Bledsoe certainly isn't.

It's not exactly simple supply and demand, it's simly two different products that appeal to different buyers. Lowry is in his late 20s and Bledose his early 20s, so Lowry's likely to remain at a high level of play for 2-3 years but then you start worrying about decline; most teams with big money this offseason are in the process of fairly drastic rebuilds and don't really need a good high usage PG for the next 2-3 years, nor do they want to tie up a lot of money in someone who might be declining just as their rebuild comes together. (Also, you'll recall that Lowry has had a pretty serious injury history himself).

except when Curry's shot isnt falling, he is a ghost. Bledsoe can impact a game whether his shot is falling or not

Except his shot falls more frequently than most players in NBA history, and it's a completely devastating weapon overall. Curry is also a killer spot up shooter and a good cutter who still helps the offense immensely even w/o the ball in his hands, while Bledsoe is at best average without the ball. Curry also dropped 8.5 assists per game to Bledsoe's 5.5.

I'm not even a Curry or GSW fan but this comparison isn't going anywhere. Yeah, Bledsoe is better on D but Curry is a mega-star by any measure while Bledsoe is a nice piece that hopefully keeps improving.

To be realistic, if Bledsoe was a Unrestricted free agent he'd get a max offer, if not a couple.

That's possible but far from certain. If teams were willing to max him, there's no reason they wouldn't have taken a shot at it. Maybe not the first 2-3 days of FA when there were so many other possibilities, but no significant suitors gave up a big chunk of money during those days. After those couple of days, who cares if a team matches or not? You give your offer sheet and see what happens. He probably would've gotten a better offer than 4/48 but I don't think there were any teams looking to throw the whole hog at him.

[HotelVitale]

The answer is....Sign and Trade Eric Bledsoe to the Lakers for Jordan Hill, Steve Nash and Wesley Johnson. This gives Phoenix a rebounder,scoring off the bench and retiring Steve Nash in a Suns uniform.For the Lakers it's biscuits and gravy. Eric drives the ball downpour. Make this move build a core of Bledsoe and Randle going forward.

why would PHX want that?

Yeah that's ridiculous for PHX. That's nearly $20m for a completely broken Nash and a decent Hill (who I like...but not at $9m per year). And Johnson is a replacement-level player who does't do anything very well, definitely not a very good or prolific scorer. They'd be much better off just letting him walk for nothing and spending the money on someone better. Or just saving it for a rainy day.

[Kevin Johnson]

Sprewell says good for Bledsoe. You gotta stick to you guns if you want to feed your family

[spaceballer]

The answer is....Sign and Trade Eric Bledsoe to the Lakers for Jordan Hill, Steve Nash and Wesley Johnson. This gives Phoenix a rebounder,scoring off the bench and retiring Steve Nash in a Suns uniform.For the Lakers it's biscuits and gravy. Eric drives the ball downpour. Make this move build a core of Bledsoe and Randle going forward.

Not allowed by the CBA. Jordan Hill just re-signed with the Lakers. Newly (re-)signed free agents like Hill can't be traded till several months from now. The Lakers made the signing official already, to kill the sign-and-trade rumors of using Hill, since that's no longer allowed by the CBA now that Hill has signed.

If you want to use Jordan Hill's contract to match salaries for a Bledsoe sign-and-trade, that means Bledsoe is going to have to sit out the season and wait for Dec/Jan. I don't see Bledsoe waiting out part of the season's games (including training camp and pre-season) just so the Lakers can send Jordan Hill to the Suns around the end of the calendar year

Ditto for Wesley Johnson.

[Gus Fring]

The answer is....Sign and Trade Eric Bledsoe to the Lakers for Jordan Hill, Steve Nash and Wesley Johnson. This gives Phoenix a rebounder,scoring off the bench and retiring Steve Nash in a Suns uniform.For the Lakers it's biscuits and gravy. Eric drives the ball downpour. Make this move build a core of Bledsoe and Randle going forward.

Smh, two bench players and a 40 year old who is literally in the trade so he can retire, for Eric Bledsoe. C'mon man...

[spaceballer]

The answer is....Sign and Trade Eric Bledsoe to the Lakers for Jordan Hill, Steve Nash and Wesley Johnson. This gives Phoenix a rebounder,scoring off the bench and retiring Steve Nash in a Suns uniform.For the Lakers it's biscuits and gravy. Eric drives the ball downpour. Make this move build a core of Bledsoe and Randle going forward.

Smh, two bench players and a 40 year old who is literally in the trade so he can retire, for Eric Bledsoe. C'mon man...

Don't worry, that transaction is not allowed by the CBA rules right now. People are just throwing out bizarre scenarios

Bledsoe will mostly likely eventually reach a deal with the Suns before training camp starts. He has no leverage to force a sign-and-trade, and no takers out there willing or able to offer him more money in an offer sheet, and he's not going to take the QO because of his injury risks and little financial benefit. He'll posture if he wants, but he'll sign before training camp, probably. It's the off-season, it doesn't make any difference to the Suns or to Bledsoe if he signs now or waits till just before training camp. He's "stuck" as he's said.

[Bigmagicfan82]

Just curious, what teams left have enough to offer Bledsoe the max?

Pretty much just the Sixers. Any other team would have to trade someone or do a sign and trade with Phoenix.

The Magic have enough to offer a max contract. They are still below the cap floor.

Sent from my SM-N900V using RealGM Forums mobile app

[LBPTarHeel27]

Just curious, what teams left have enough to offer Bledsoe the max?

Pretty much just the Sixers. Any other team would have to trade someone or do a sign and trade with Phoenix.

The Magic have enough to offer a max contract. They are still below the cap floor.

Sent from my SM-N900V using RealGM Forums mobile app

We don't have enough to offer a max deal. Frye and Ridnour put us at roughly 57 million. We have just about 6 mill left in cap room. We are above the floor now.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/orlando.htm

[SF_Warriors]

curry, westbrook, cp3 are max level players.

Bledsoe is not. he wont average higher points or assists than those guys.

except when Curry's shot isnt falling, he is a ghost. Bledsoe can impact a game whether his shot is falling or not

Yes, bledsoe is a load on both ends of the floor even when he is cold, which is why he is worth 12 mill a year or so.
But he is no curry. Steph forces the opposition to put so much attention on him. Much, much more so than bledsoe commands. That is why bledsoe isnt worth the max.

but not sure what you mean when you say he doesnt affect the game when he is off.
curry averaged 8.5 assists and even if he is cold his defender still cannot leave him even slightly open.
and how often is he ice cold anywys? Curry shot 47% from the field and 42% from 3pt while pretty muchbeing the sole focus of the opposing defense

[WiggOuts]

This guy knows he doesn't have it in him to stay healthy which is why he wont budge. If Im PHO, I give him 2 options, take the initial offer or take the QO. I willing to bet Bledsoe doesn't get close to a max in his career...he just isn't MAX good

[Scalabrine]

Why not just offer Bledsoe 4 years $61M max deal with a team option on the last year that leaves it only partially guaranteed. If they structured it that way, they could essentially guarantee Bledsoe the same $48M they're offering now while giving him upside in his last year if he performs like he thinks he will. If he's injured / doesn't perform the Suns get out of the deal early.

I don't actually blame Bledsoe for trying to maximize his deal because you see what happened with Curry who took a similar discount but he needs to concede something. No one is giving him a five-year max fully guaranteed.

48 million over 3 years is more money then 48 over 4 years

[LBPTarHeel27]

Supply and demand good sir.

If there are 30 PG's in the league worth the max...I am NOT paying the max. I'll sit back, be team #30 that grabs a pg and pay less than the max and use that extra money elsewhere. No other team is going to pay a 2nd PG a 2nd max contract.

Your logic isn't very sound and the BMW metaphor doesn't fit your scenario.

Nothing you say makes sense and you have the nerve to question someone's else logic. If there are 30 BMW's on the lot worth $50,000 and 5 Grand Am's on the lot worth $20,000 just because I have fewer Grand Am's does that drive the price up for them? The answer is no. There are several ways to look at things and yours is illogical to me.

I'll break it down very easily...

-30 max caliber PG's available
-30 teams looking for a PG

You're telling me that if you are the 30th team to sign a PG, you would still give him a max contract even though the market would allow you to pay less? All other 29 teams have their Max PG. There is 1 left. No one else will offer the max...but you will?

Your car example only makes sense if you are saying there are 30 BMW's and only 30 customers looking to buy. The same can be said there. If I'm the dealer and have sold 29 cars and there is only 1 buyer out there...it would be naive of the seller to think they can still get the full price. The buyer has all the power, otherwise that car never gets sold.

...and as far as your $20.000 Grand Am inclusion...it still doesn't really relate but if you want to stretch it...your Grand Am example is basically big men in the NBA. They receive higher and more undeserving contracts because of the shortage and quality of big men. A decent big man is gonna make more than an above average wing player. That is a fact that history has proven time and time again.

Thanks for all the and-1's on this post but I really would like to hear from SBM.

I normally don't chime in on the general board but when I hear a guy call me out, I like to see it through.

Where you at SBM?

[cochiseuofm]

48 million over 3 years is more money then 48 over 4 years

Dude I got through Calc 4 in high school...I know math. I structured my proposed deal as a compromise for both Bledsoe and the Suns...not as a deal to give the Suns the best possible position/ Bledsoe is a talented player and if guys like Hayward and Parsons are getting what they're getting he is worth the upside he is seeking if he can stay healthy IMO. I personally think the Suns would be dumb to let a potentially very good player go for nothing over a few million a year - I don't particularly think they're going to get anyone better in free agency next year.

[Kibago]

agents need to start offering their RFA players 'risk insurance' so they can take the QOs from teams refusing to max them. if the only two Suns options were QO and max I'm sure they'd max him (and just trade him later if they don't want him long term at the max)

[baubo]

I'll break it down very easily...

-30 max caliber PG's available
-30 teams looking for a PG

The rest cut for readability.

Technically in the situation you've outlined, the 30th PG would still get max or near max. This is because the 30th team also only have one option left, the 30th max PG. In such a case of one-and-one, one team with money and one player worth that money, the player will still sign for basically market value. But really, the example of cars in of itself is way too simple. If we want to make a car analogy, it would be more like you want a pick-up, your wife wants a SUV, your son wants sports car, your daughter wants a hybrid, etc. The point is that there are multiple type of players on the market each with their own value system.

I think a simplified version would be comparing PERs. No, PER isn't the greatest stat int he world, but it's a decent indicator of a player's value on the market adjusted for minutes.

So looking at last year's PERs for SFs and PGs.

The 'average' SF last year based on PER and playing >25mpg(ignoring the energy guys off the bench) was DeMarre Carroll. The 'average' PG last year was Jeff Teague. With Teague's PER being ~2 points better. And that's the thing. If you don't get Chandler Parsons or Gordon Heyward, you are replacing them with lesser players than if you would have to replace Bledsoe. If you don't want to spend the max on Bledsoe, you can get Kyle Lowry for $12mil and Isiah Thomas for $7mil. If you don't want to spend max on Parsons or Heyward, you can get Trevor Ariza for $8mil or Deng for $10mil. And I think it's safe to say no one believes Deng and Ariza are difference makers on par with Lowry and Thomas combined.

[ARISE_CHICKEN]

Miami would have been a nice fit. Lose Lebron but get mini-Lebron to pair with Bosh and whoever for the next few years.

[goldrodd]

The answer is....Sign and Trade Eric Bledsoe to the Lakers for Jordan Hill, Steve Nash and Wesley Johnson. This gives Phoenix a rebounder,scoring off the bench and retiring Steve Nash in a Suns uniform.For the Lakers it's biscuits and gravy. Eric drives the ball downpour. Make this move build a core of Bledsoe and Randle going forward.

Smh, two bench players and a 40 year old who is literally in the trade so he can retire, for Eric Bledsoe. C'mon man...

Don't worry, that transaction is not allowed by the CBA rules right now. People are just throwing out bizarre scenarios

Bledsoe will mostly likely eventually reach a deal with the Suns before training camp starts. He has no leverage to force a sign-and-trade, and no takers out there willing or able to offer him more money in an offer sheet, and he's not going to take the QO because of his injury risks and little financial benefit. He'll posture if he wants, but he'll sign before training camp, probably. It's the off-season, it doesn't make any difference to the Suns or to Bledsoe if he signs now or waits till just before training camp. He's "stuck" as he's said.

Giving the Suns Hill, Nash and Johnson for Bledsoe is fair. First of all, Nash is going into the Hall of Game as a Sun. Their greatest player ever should be honored by their organization. Hill is a rebounder and inside scorer they need with Frye leaving. Wes is a throw in for salary purposes.

[Hans Embiid]

Smh, two bench players and a 40 year old who is literally in the trade so he can retire, for Eric Bledsoe. C'mon man...

Don't worry, that transaction is not allowed by the CBA rules right now. People are just throwing out bizarre scenarios

Bledsoe will mostly likely eventually reach a deal with the Suns before training camp starts. He has no leverage to force a sign-and-trade, and no takers out there willing or able to offer him more money in an offer sheet, and he's not going to take the QO because of his injury risks and little financial benefit. He'll posture if he wants, but he'll sign before training camp, probably. It's the off-season, it doesn't make any difference to the Suns or to Bledsoe if he signs now or waits till just before training camp. He's "stuck" as he's said.

Giving the Suns Hill, Nash and Johnson for Bledsoe is fair. First of all, Nash is going into the Hall of Game as a Sun. Their greatest player ever should be honored by their organization. Hill is a rebounder and inside scorer they need with Frye leaving. Wes is a throw in for salary purposes.

never heard of a Barkley guy?