The One And Only Offseason Thread 4

[lilfishi22]

If you were Bledsoe and you didn't want to be in Phoenix, would you not have told the Suns so we could have worked with him to facilitate a S&T?

[batsmasher]

Info comes from Traxxe who seems entirely reputable.

Don't see how saying he wants to come back gives the FO leverage. If anything it puts pressure on FO to make a fair offer so they don't look like the bad guys to the public in case of a stalemate.

Forgive me for not following this but what makes Traxxe reputable? Has he/she ever claimed to have a source of information? Everything I have read sounds like it could just as easily be speculation.

As for Bled, saying he wants to play for the Suns would have reduced his market even further. RFA's have to at least appear interested in other teams if they want to get paid.

[PhxSunsFan1234]

Is it really a matter of living in a city? Yep, way too tough to live in PHX for the seven months of your season, which are pretty much the best months to live in AZ, and have a buttload of money to live in another city/state/country for the months you are not playing.

Isn't Bledsoe from Alabama, and there right now? Way better than PHX.

Yeah I don't get how players would be really like/dislike cities enough to matter unless they just absolutely hate cold weather or they have family in certain cities. For about five months they can be anywhere in the world, and even during the season they are on the road for a good three months. Even when at their team's city during the season, they are mostly practicing, working out or resting in some gated community mansion on the outskirts of town. Not really much time to get attached to a city's culture.

I take it you don't travel very often. I travel for my job...a lot actually. And I have been to some disgusting, terrible cities I would never live in. Oklahoma City, Cleveland, Minnesota, Detroit, Sacramento, Milwaukee, Orlando to name a few are terrible. It's your home. Yes, you can move in the off-season and train someplace else, but you sign a long term deal, you want to feel comfortable calling it your home.

Phoenix is top 5 area I have been though. Has to be the players or coaches or something. He's boys with LeBron and I don't think anyone on our team has the "cool" factor LeBron has. Maybe he's too cool for the other players?

[lilfishi22]

Info comes from Traxxe who seems entirely reputable.

Don't see how saying he wants to come back gives the FO leverage. If anything it puts pressure on FO to make a fair offer so they don't look like the bad guys to the public in case of a stalemate.

Forgive me for not following this but what makes Traxxe reputable? Has he/she ever claimed to have a source of information? Everything I have read sounds like it could just as easily be speculation.

As for Bled, saying he wants to play for the Suns would have reduced his market even further. RFA's have to at least appear interested in other teams if they want to get paid.

He/she has been verified by mods. There is a fairly robust verification process from what I've read. If they say he's legit, then I'll take their word for it.

[bwgood77]

I would love to see a straight up trade for Horford. He has the better resume but Bledsoe is young and more explosive/exciting and has tons of potential. Horford has had significant injuries too but not in the legs so hopefully less long term risk. He's still fairly young and he was having a very good season early last year before he went down. I imagine he could be successful at the 4 or the 5 for us.

Everyone would love to trade for Horford. But why do people always bring up such unrealistic scenarios? Atlanta has a good pg and doesn't have a quality center. Horford works fine at center if needed. Horford is a cornerstone and Bledsoe is a very talented yet unproven injury prone player who plays the position with the most quality talent and thinks he is worth over $80 million for five years. Nobody appears eager to pay him anywhere near that, much less give up quality or especially star assets for him.

[Sunsdeuce]

I don't agree some here, that say we were winners this off season.
1) didn't upgrade the sf position. As a matter of fact we resigned a player that probably shouldn't have been resigned. Colangelo would have shipped tucker out so fast.
2) Ennis still isn't signed and there was better talent still on the board when he was picked.
3) lost a key starter (frye) while replacing him with (no other word but scrub) tolliver.
4) unsuccessfully used any assets to improve the team. Something that babby and Mcd bragged about doing before the draft.
5) the power forward position still isn't addressed.
6) Bledsoe situation is a mess.

positives:
1) got Thomas.
2) warren looks good

Some may agree and some may disagree but that's how I see it. If I had to grade the offseason, I would say C-. Basically didn't hurt the team that much but definitely didn't improve the team. I don't see us as winners more like mediocre.


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[bwgood77]

Info comes from Traxxe who seems entirely reputable.

Don't see how saying he wants to come back gives the FO leverage. If anything it puts pressure on FO to make a fair offer so they don't look like the bad guys to the public in case of a stalemate.

Forgive me for not following this but what makes Traxxe reputable? Has he/she ever claimed to have a source of information? Everything I have read sounds like it could just as easily be speculation.

As for Bled, saying he wants to play for the Suns would have reduced his market even further. RFA's have to at least appear interested in other teams if they want to get paid.

He has broken some news in the past that came from people inside the Suns organization. More recently I think he has mentioned he no longer has direct front office connections and they are tight lipped but knows someone or some people close to the team so he gets some insight or news that has happened.

But I do think he throws in opinions at times too. The part about Bledsoe not wanting to play in Phx may have just been part of an opinion because for that to come from a Suns source Bledsoe or his agent would have had to communicate that to the Suns and I don't think they've even heard from him (but of course I don't know). Unless he has some connections to the Bledsoe camp.

[bwgood77]

Phoenix is top 5 area I have been though. Has to be the players or coaches or something. He's boys with LeBron and I don't think anyone on our team has the "cool" factor LeBron has. Maybe he's too cool for the other players?

I think with Bledsoe it may just be more that he wants to be around his homies. As we all know he is very reserved. He may have never really hit the nightlife in Phx and may simply feel lonely. I don't know how close he is with Green and the twins. He may really want to play in Sacramento because of Cousins or play near his agents or friends from his class. He may love LA. He may want to be closer to home.

A lot of this is speculation though,

[bwgood77]

I don't agree some here, that say we were winners this off season.
1) didn't upgrade the sf position. As a matter of fact we resigned a player that probably shouldn't have been resigned. Colangelo would have shipped tucker out so fast.
2) Ennis still isn't signed and there was better talent still on the board when he was picked.
3) lost a key starter (frye) while replacing him with (no other word but scrub) tolliver.
4) unsuccessfully used any assets to improve the team. Something that babby and Mcd bragged about doing before the draft.
5) the power forward position still isn't addressed.
6) Bledsoe situation is a mess.

positives:
1) got Thomas.
2) warren looks good

Some may agree and some may disagree but that's how I see it. If I had to grade the offseason, I would say C-. Basically didn't hurt the team that much but definitely didn't improve the team. I don't see us as winners more like mediocre.


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I think the positives far outweigh the negatives. The question mark is #6. If Nov 1st comes and goes and the Bledsoe situation hasn't changed, that will be a pretty big negative for me.

I would have rather taken Harris over Ennis, but I think Ennis can be very good. Especially as a backup.

I also don't think there were many SFs out there that were big upgrades relative to their costs, and Warren may get the chance to develop and start sooner anyway under this scenario.

[lilfishi22]

I don't agree some here, that say we were winners this off season.
1) didn't upgrade the sf position. As a matter of fact we resigned a player that probably shouldn't have been resigned. Colangelo would have shipped tucker out so fast.
2) Ennis still isn't signed and there was better talent still on the board when he was picked.
3) lost a key starter (frye) while replacing him with (no other word but scrub) tolliver.
4) unsuccessfully used any assets to improve the team. Something that babby and Mcd bragged about doing before the draft.
5) the power forward position still isn't addressed.
6) Bledsoe situation is a mess.

positives:
1) got Thomas.
2) warren looks good

Some may agree and some may disagree but that's how I see it. If I had to grade the offseason, I would say C-. Basically didn't hurt the team that much but definitely didn't improve the team. I don't see us as winners more like mediocre.


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1) We didn't improve but I felt we did well keeping a leader and hard worker on the team and we did it on a cap friendly deal.
2) I don't think it's a big deal whether Ennis is signed or unsigned at this point. We're definitely not letting him go for nothing so I expect him to be in Suns uniform (or our DLeague affiliate) before training camp starts.
3) I think we'll agree to disagree on this point. I think Tolliver will replace Frye's shooting and while he isn't as good a defender, for less than half the cost to retain Frye, I'm happy to make do for a season or two while we're not contending. It's not an upgrade but I don't think it's as big a downgrade as you may think.
4) Fair point but it wasn't due to us not trying.
5) We expect Kieff/Marcus to take over that 4 spot.
6) Did we do anything wrong ?

[Frank Lee]

Excuse me. How are some of you chastizing us for not wanting bledsoe? If the dude doesn't want to be a phoenix sun for his market value then trade his ass to China for the rights to yao ming for all I care. Watch how fast we get a deal done for Goran next year. Dude wants to be here. IT hasn't even put on a suns jersey yet, wants to be here. I'm not really into Bledsoe's low ass IQ and terrible decision making up to this point. I mean, I don't know what else to call it if he's still taking selfies with that joke of an agent. Its not just him holding out that's pissing us off, its the entire situation starting from the beginning of last season.

Bam Bam from the Bum

Agree 1000%

Getting more assets for moving him should and could be the eventual goal.

Henson, and may be Knight along with another pick should not be only gauged on how it improves us this yr, as all of those assets can be turned into something else. McDo can weave straw into gold in a Rumplestiltskinish manner.
And both of those guys are young. If Frye can evolve into a stretch four, Henson surely can with the proper coaching. We do have that, right?

My list would say West makes us the best this yr, Josh Smith would be fun to have, and Henson/Knight/Pick is a good haul for .... dudley er... Bledsoak.

Its too bad Bledsoe does not realize this is a great place for him to thrive to levels he has yet to achieve.

This reminds me of Diamondback fans who cheered each move for a "clutch" guy and "team player" while watching all their talent go out for nothing. The result-->higher payroll and fewer wins. See, you need this thing called talent to win in basketball, and Bledsoe is arguably our most talented player, so yeah, I think you're incredibly wrong for wanting to ship him out for anyone even Yao Ming.

I dont rate Bledsoe as our most talented player. I give that nod to Dragic.Put Dragic out there with the same FA restrictions and I bet he would have many options. I don't rate Bledsoe as a top 10 PG either. Perhaps he has the potential, but he isn't there yet.

I do give Bledsoe high value in the success for this season,and would like to see him here.... but feel the FO has made an adequate adjustment in signing Thomas.

The fact we have had absolutely no enthusiasm from Bled to be here speaks volumes. Bledsoe's mind has been contaminated with Jamesian grandeur. IMO, many here over rate this guy as much as he over rates himself... and the fact that many GMs have turned away is an indicator. And Its not just the contractual equation of obtaining him that caused his barren offer sheet. When Lowry inked up, it was to death of his max deal. Lowry is a better PG and has proven it on the court.

[Christine-In-AZ]

Everyone would love to trade for Horford. But why do people always bring up such unrealistic scenarios? Atlanta has a good pg and doesn't have a quality center. Horford works fine at center if needed. Horford is a cornerstone and Bledsoe is a very talented yet unproven injury prone player who plays the position with the most quality talent and thinks he is worth over $80 million for five years. Nobody appears eager to pay him anywhere near that, much less give up quality or especially star assets for him.

Admittedly an unlikely scenario but...

-What if Bledsoe was peachy-keen with 12m per year as a Hawk?
-What if this were to be a bigger deal or a 2 trade process?
-What if players such as Teague, Plumlee, G.Green, Ennis or even the Morrii were possible elements in these trades?

The chances of something like this happening...or needing to happen are tiny, but if any sign and trade were to happen, I place Atlanta at/near the top of the list.

[RunDogGun]

Is it really a matter of living in a city? Yep, way too tough to live in PHX for the seven months of your season, which are pretty much the best months to live in AZ, and have a buttload of money to live in another city/state/country for the months you are not playing.

Isn't Bledsoe from Alabama, and there right now? Way better than PHX.

Yeah I don't get how players would be really like/dislike cities enough to matter unless they just absolutely hate cold weather or they have family in certain cities. For about five months they can be anywhere in the world, and even during the season they are on the road for a good three months. Even when at their team's city during the season, they are mostly practicing, working out or resting in some gated community mansion on the outskirts of town. Not really much time to get attached to a city's culture.

I take it you don't travel very often. I travel for my job...a lot actually. And I have been to some disgusting, terrible cities I would never live in. Oklahoma City, Cleveland, Minnesota, Detroit, Sacramento, Milwaukee, Orlando to name a few are terrible. It's your home. Yes, you can move in the off-season and train someplace else, but you sign a long term deal, you want to feel comfortable calling it your home.

Phoenix is top 5 area I have been though. Has to be the players or coaches or something. He's boys with LeBron and I don't think anyone on our team has the "cool" factor LeBron has. Maybe he's too cool for the other players?

First, Minnesota isn't a city. I live in Minny, and have only been in a few neighborhoods that would not want to live in. But for the most part, the people here are great, and only this last winter has been horrible.

[bwgood77]

Everyone would love to trade for Horford. But why do people always bring up such unrealistic scenarios? Atlanta has a good pg and doesn't have a quality center. Horford works fine at center if needed. Horford is a cornerstone and Bledsoe is a very talented yet unproven injury prone player who plays the position with the most quality talent and thinks he is worth over $80 million for five years. Nobody appears eager to pay him anywhere near that, much less give up quality or especially star assets for him.

Admittedly an unlikely scenario but...

-What if Bledsoe was peachy-keen with 12m per year as a Hawk?
-What if this were to be a bigger deal or a 2 trade process?
-What if players such as Teague, Plumlee, G.Green, Ennis or even the Morrii were possible elements in these trades?

The chances of something like this happening...or needing to happen are tiny, but if any sign and trade were to happen, I place Atlanta at/near the top of the list.

I don't think a Teague/Millsap deal for Bledsoe and perhaps Plumlee deal is extremely improbable, because they would be swapping/upgrading point guards, trading a guy that will be a FA next season anyway, so they maybe lose him, and it allows Horford to move to the 4.

I think they have zero plans on trading Horford though, unless they got some sort of frontcourt star back, but there are only a handful of players better than he is in the frontcourt.

Personally, I think the deal I outlined first would be a decent deal for both teams (I am really high on Millsap though..more than most I think). It would give us that nice 3 pt guard rotation, give us a huge upgrade stretch 4 from Frye, and allow Kieff to lead our second unit with his bro. I guess we'd have to take a center back too in that scenario though. Pero Antic?

[sunsbum]

Excuse me. How are some of you chastizing us for not wanting bledsoe? If the dude doesn't want to be a phoenix sun for his market value then trade his ass to China for the rights to yao ming for all I care. Watch how fast we get a deal done for Goran next year. Dude wants to be here. IT hasn't even put on a suns jersey yet, wants to be here. I'm not really into Bledsoe's low ass IQ and terrible decision making up to this point. I mean, I don't know what else to call it if he's still taking selfies with that joke of an agent. Its not just him holding out that's pissing us off, its the entire situation starting from the beginning of last season.

Bam Bam from the Bum

Agree 1000%

Getting more assets for moving him should and could be the eventual goal.

Henson, and may be Knight along with another pick should not be only gauged on how it improves us this yr, as all of those assets can be turned into something else. McDo can weave straw into gold in a Rumplestiltskinish manner.
And both of those guys are young. If Frye can evolve into a stretch four, Henson surely can with the proper coaching. We do have that, right?

My list would say West makes us the best this yr, Josh Smith would be fun to have, and Henson/Knight/Pick is a good haul for .... dudley er... Bledsoak.

Its too bad Bledsoe does not realize this is a great place for him to thrive to levels he has yet to achieve.

This reminds me of Diamondback fans who cheered each move for a "clutch" guy and "team player" while watching all their talent go out for nothing. The result-->higher payroll and fewer wins. See, you need this thing called talent to win in basketball, and Bledsoe is arguably our most talented player, so yeah, I think you're incredibly wrong for wanting to ship him out for anyone even Yao Ming.

missed that sarcasm eh. I don't know how much more fececious I could be although with a many terrible trades that vet tossed around I see why you might have thought that.

[JTrain]

Is it really a matter of living in a city? Yep, way too tough to live in PHX for the seven months of your season, which are pretty much the best months to live in AZ, and have a buttload of money to live in another city/state/country for the months you are not playing.

Isn't Bledsoe from Alabama, and there right now? Way better than PHX.

Yeah I don't get how players would be really like/dislike cities enough to matter unless they just absolutely hate cold weather or they have family in certain cities. For about five months they can be anywhere in the world, and even during the season they are on the road for a good three months. Even when at their team's city during the season, they are mostly practicing, working out or resting in some gated community mansion on the outskirts of town. Not really much time to get attached to a city's culture.

I take it you don't travel very often. I travel for my job...a lot actually. And I have been to some disgusting, terrible cities I would never live in. Oklahoma City, Cleveland, Minnesota, Detroit, Sacramento, Milwaukee, Orlando to name a few are terrible. It's your home. Yes, you can move in the off-season and train someplace else, but you sign a long term deal, you want to feel comfortable calling it your home.

Phoenix is top 5 area I have been though. Has to be the players or coaches or something. He's boys with LeBron and I don't think anyone on our team has the "cool" factor LeBron has. Maybe he's too cool for the other players?

I have been to most of those cities. I'm not saying there aren't large differences or that some cities aren't much better than others. My point was basically that the average NBA player only has about 2% of his life to really experience the city. So I think other considerations are much higher on the list.

[jcsunsfan]

Looks to me like Eric is trying to force his way to the Lakers.

[JTrain]

Info comes from Traxxe who seems entirely reputable.

Don't see how saying he wants to come back gives the FO leverage. If anything it puts pressure on FO to make a fair offer so they don't look like the bad guys to the public in case of a stalemate.

Forgive me for not following this but what makes Traxxe reputable? Has he/she ever claimed to have a source of information? Everything I have read sounds like it could just as easily be speculation.

As for Bled, saying he wants to play for the Suns would have reduced his market even further. RFA's have to at least appear interested in other teams if they want to get paid.

I don't agree. Pek got a 5th year and incentives added late in the process after saying emphatically that he wanted to be in Minnesota.

[lilfishi22]

Looks to me like Eric is trying to force his way to the Lakers.

I expected this to happen if we couldn't come to terms with him. I wouldn't mind dealing with LA again now that McD is in charge. I'd expect Randall to be in the conversation though.

[Sunsdeuce]

Looks to me like Eric is trying to force his way to the Lakers.

I expected this to happen if we couldn't come to terms with him. I wouldn't mind dealing with LA again now that McD is in charge. I'd expect Randall to be in the conversation though.

Hopefully Kobe still has power within the lakers organization. Reason I say that is he really like bledsoe's game and I am willing to bet he would support trading randle (plus other stuff) for Bledsoe.


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