UFC Fight Night 49 (8/23) Bendo vs. RDA (FS1)

[lilfishi22]

You could always argue that he MAY have come round but those people making that argument seem to leave out the fact that had it not been stopped, RDA would have DEFINITELY kept dropping bombs on him. In the reverse angle after Big John had come in, Bendo was looking through Big John's legs into the distance, dude was so dazed.

It's a fine line between a good ref and a bad ref and I'd rather the ref make a questionable decision to keep his fighters safe than a questionable decision to let a fighter take unnecessary punishment. Some people just want this kind of definitive finish to be happy

[cowboyronnie]

That is stomach-churning ^ Jeez, I don't remember having seen it.

[Bernman]

If you know the posters here, we aren't arguing for one extreme or another. We are arguing what's best overall for the fighters, and that's some sort of middle ground. It doesn't need to be a stoppage immediately after a flash kd in the 1st rd when a beating hadn't proceeded, or following an extended period of blows. Both are extremist views which don't get condoned here. You are trying to paint us as just bleeds, or guys who ignore health, and that's just not true. If anything this group on the whole, me included, seems to lean over-protective of the fighters, and most still thought this one was early.

That early in the fight, there's no reason Big John couldn't have allowed a couple 2-3 blows after the knockdown to see how Bendo was reacting. And yes, he was rolling pretty quickly to defend himself.

It's a lot harder to explain how you knew Bendo was out in spite of him moving to defend himself quickly, than that McCarthy wasn't actually initially intending to stop the fight. His actions with his feet and hands suggest otherwise. He in point of fact got his foot tangled w/ RDA's first and at the time had his hands up like he wasn't going to pry them apart. So no, I don't think he intended to stop it, more so was forced to.

And if he accidentally did the right thing in retrospect, I don't think a couple more shots would have done discernibly much more damage. Bisping was clearly out, took a diving superman punch from one of the hardest hitters in the game, and still seemed fine. It's the prolonged beatings (Maldanado vs. Glover) or many clean shots subsequent to ko's (Munoz against Weidman) that are the primary problem. That's what I'm sensitive to as a result, and which types of fight I feel needs to stop earlier than it has.

[lilfishi22]

I don't think it matters when in the fight that knock down happened, it happened and the ref needs to do his job to stop the fight to prevent further punishment if the fighter is not in a position or mental state to protect himself.

If you look closely, Big John was watching quite intently at Bendo after he got the double knees from RDA a few moments after the knockdown and he must have thought at the very least Bendo was stunned as Bendo went straight for the takedown. So by the time Bendo ate that shot that dropped him, that was already #2. From then on, when Bendo got dropped, he ate two undefended shots to the head without looking like he was even in the action of protecting himself afterwards. The guy was looking totally the other way after and he had one hand on the floor, the other half-assed trying to block some bombs and his legs weren't doing anything to push off either. He wasn't even in a good defense mode that some fighters get into when they get zombied.

I do think Big John went in for the stoppage but being big as he is, didn't want to just tackle RDA into the fence so he stopped himself and readjusted his approach before grabbing RDA. We can agree to disagree on this point.

fwiw
http://forums.sherdog.com/forums/f2/benson-rda-stoppage-2810659/
About 60% thought the stoppage was fine.

[REDDzone]

That is stomach-churning ^ Jeez, I don't remember having seen it.

I don't understand how Mirgs is allowed to ref. Mazagatti is bumbling fool, to be certain, but Mirgs is basically a health risk to fighters, as was Rosenthal by the end.

[lilfishi22]

Winslow is right up there too

[CPT]

While I still think the stoppage was early based on the standards we are used to, it raises some interesting points.

Should a ref take the situation into account when making a decision to stop the fight? By that I mean the fighter (Bendo is known to recover), and the fight (main event, title fight, etc.) My gut is to say yes, they should, but I'm not sure why.

Maybe fighters in a main event position have earned the extra leeway, or a champ should be given more of a chance before taking his title away.

If a ref's job is to protect the fighters, wouldn't a uniform policy of "you lose consciousness, the fight is over" better achieve that goal? I suppose that could open up a bunch of other issues, but it might still be better overall.

Does anyone dispute that Bendo went out, even if just for a second or two? If so, then that's a different issue, and the stoppage may really not be justified. Should it matter that he may be able to recover? Would it be fair to require people to knock Bendo out twice if they only have to KO another fighter once?

Just throwing some stuff out there. I'm sure someone can present a convincing case for the opposite.

[WashWiz54]

I'd actually consider Big John as one of the best refs in MMA, and I also considered the stoppage appropriate.

That's just me, though.

[REDDzone]

Personally I'm not a fan of the thought that who the fighter is should determine when its stopped.

I think using context in the fight itself is more appropriate. I don't think anyone would have had an issue with the stoppage if it were in round 4 and Benson had been dropped 3-4 times already and taken a beating, for example.

[Shaazzam]

Only BJJ geeks would be excited by the first ever ompalata in the UFC. j/k Saunders is crazy flexible, and was close to pulling that off before. I think he almost had Sapo. Once he had that locked I was worried he was just going to use it to sweep or bail on it. He had control and the arm was right there. He just had to bend it. If nothing else the UFC reacquired another fun fighter, although he's clearly made massive ground improvements since his first stint. Can't hold those brutal ko's by Lima against him, but he still did get controlled disappointingly by Brian the Beast Baker in a fight, so his bottom game doesn't appear to work against everybody, and his tdd is pretty shaky.

i impressed myself by calling the omoplata before he went for it and when he locked it up i was going crazy
i think ive only ever seen like 3 or 4 finish a fight

[Shaazzam]

Killa B!

The dude put himself in the omoplata, that was weird. His arm was on the correct side of the hip for the omoplata and he just spun into it. I'm not sure if Ben was threatening another submission (I'm not at all familiar with rubber guard) so the guy decided to sacrifice the omoplata and gamble that he could escape that instead of the armbar/triangle (super common I feel like), or if he just didn't know what the hell was going on.

see this stuff i dont know at all
i just saw "ohh he's gonna go for an omoplata"

[REDDzone]

i impressed myself by calling the omoplata before he went for it and when he locked it up i was going crazy
i think ive only ever seen like 3 or 4 finish a fight

Apparently it was the first ever in the ufc, not sure if its been seen in other major orgs. As bern alluded to earlier, that position is mostly just used to sweep. It seems pretty rare to finish that (maybe not at whitebelt or beginner grappling) because the guy usually just rolls and can get out, but you saw Killa B controlling across his back to the far side of his waist, preventing his opponent from rolling over his shoulder and conceding mount or side control.

[Shaazzam]

heh 3 or 4 might be a stretch, but i have seen a couple
shane del rosario had one
and for some reason i think i saw one in king of the cage

[REDDzone]

BTW, the LW division is so bananas.

RDA's hands looked gooooood. Cerrone/Alvarez should be great. Khabib obviously.

Mother of God.

[NZB2323]

I'll defend the refs to some degree. I hated being a little league umpire and that was easy compared to professional refs. They have to watch guys moving at lightning speed and if they call it a split second too early or a split second too late they're a bad ref. And different people have different standards for when the ref should call the fight. Is there any ref in the history of the UFC that we'd call good, or are all they all bad because they've had some calls that are a little too early or a little too late?

The thought of being in the cage with UFC fighters and having to call the fight at the exact right moment sounds like an impossible task to me.

[CPT]

I view the omoplata finish as a sign that the UFC has gone to ****. When you have finishes by omoplata and neck crank on the same event, you have too many events.

[REDDzone]

I view the omoplata finish as a sign that the UFC has gone to ****. When you have finishes by omoplata and neck crank on the same event, you have too many events.

Or could be a good thing, guys remember that its not taboo to grapple and exploit the blue belt level grappling (Brendan Schaub's words, not mine ) of a lot of mma fighters.

[SDM]

No probs with the stoppage. Benson ate like 6-7 shots in a row and when his legs went out, he was making the Bisping face.

[Nemesis21]

I also think it was an early stoppage by Big Jon. BTW, when did RDA get so muscular? I don't remember him being that ripped.