Andrew Wiggins vs. Giannis Antetokounmpo

[Nikos Beard]

Wiggings a bigger prospect, how can you even claim that when you talking about a guy that got instantly traded away ,havent shown anything yet on NBA to the guy that the team consider him nearly untradable and a franchise player ?

I agree the Giannis hype is getting out of hand sometimes but i see so many ignorant and clueless comments which makes wonder if they ever seen a game of Bucks last year.

C'mon... you're really going to attempt to knock wiggins for being traded for an all NBA player? It's simply illogical.

The combination of defensive fans and overall overrating of giannis does not bode well for him if he doesn't pan out.

We get it: he's nearly 7', has guard skills with court vision, he's an absurd athlete, and has a great attitude. That doesn't mean he's going to be a perennial all star. Wiggins has a great all around skill set for a wing, and he was the #1 pick for a reason. It isn't outlandish to call him the better prospect. That said, this thread would be more fair to him after he actually played a season in the NBA.

Have you actually watched Wiggins play? He doesnt have a great all around skill set at all. Giannis is probably the more skilled player of the two.

This x10.

Giannis has a very solid skill foundation already. He has actual point-forward vision, can handle the ball, decent but improvable jumper, great instincts on both ends of the floor...all in all, he's not raw. The skills are there, he just needs to build on them.

Wiggins on the other hand is a thoroughly mediocre ball handler, which is arguably the separator between good perimeter players and great perimeter players. And his jumper is also very streaky. If either of the two is raw and reliant on physical gifts, it's Wiggins.

[Clyde Frazier]

Wiggings a bigger prospect, how can you even claim that when you talking about a guy that got instantly traded away ,havent shown anything yet on NBA to the guy that the team consider him nearly untradable and a franchise player ?

I agree the Giannis hype is getting out of hand sometimes but i see so many ignorant and clueless comments which makes wonder if they ever seen a game of Bucks last year.

C'mon... you're really going to attempt to knock wiggins for being traded for an all NBA player? It's simply illogical.

The combination of defensive fans and overall overrating of giannis does not bode well for him if he doesn't pan out.

We get it: he's nearly 7', has guard skills with court vision, he's an absurd athlete, and has a great attitude. That doesn't mean he's going to be a perennial all star. Wiggins has a great all around skill set for a wing, and he was the #1 pick for a reason. It isn't outlandish to call him the better prospect. That said, this thread would be more fair to him after he actually played a season in the NBA.

Have you actually watched Wiggins play? He doesnt have a great all around skill set at all. Giannis is probably the more skilled player of the two.

Another defensive giannas post... big surprise. Did you completely miss everything positive i said about him above?

Yes, i've watched wiggins play in college and in summer league. For a rookie wing coming into the NBA, he has a great all around skill set, but needs time to develop.

[skones]

C'mon... you're really going to attempt to knock wiggins for being traded for an all NBA player? It's simply illogical.

The combination of defensive fans and overall overrating of giannis does not bode well for him if he doesn't pan out.

We get it: he's nearly 7', has guard skills with court vision, he's an absurd athlete, and has a great attitude. That doesn't mean he's going to be a perennial all star. Wiggins has a great all around skill set for a wing, and he was the #1 pick for a reason. It isn't outlandish to call him the better prospect. That said, this thread would be more fair to him after he actually played a season in the NBA.

Have you actually watched Wiggins play? He doesnt have a great all around skill set at all. Giannis is probably the more skilled player of the two.

Another defensive giannas post... big surprise. Did you completely miss everything positive i said about him above?

Yes, i've watched wiggins play in college and in summer league. For a rookie wing coming into the NBA, he has a great all around skill set, but needs time to develop.

How is it defensive to point out a false claim? What part of his skill set is great or all around? He hasn't demonstrated anything better than below average vision. He's very loose with his left hand and his right hand isn't anything to write home about either. He shows poor awareness in the dribble drive game tending to predetermine his moves rather than reacting to what the defense gives him. He's got an inconsistent release on his jumper as well. Just because you say he has a great all around skill set doesn't make it true.

[Clyde Frazier]

Another defensive giannas post... big surprise. Did you completely miss everything positive i said about him above?

Yes, i've watched wiggins play in college and in summer league. For a rookie wing coming into the NBA, he has a great all around skill set, but needs time to develop.

How is it defensive to point out a false claim? What part of his skill set is great or all around? He hasn't demonstrated anything better than below average vision. He's very loose with his left hand and his right hand isn't anything to write home about either. He shows poor awareness in the dribble drive game tending to predetermine his moves rather than reacting to what the defense gives him. He's got an inconsistent release on his jumper as well. Just because you say he has a great all around skill set doesn't make it true.

Because I never claimed he had a better skill set than giannis, and you automatically jumped to that without any hesitation. Would you prefer I say he showed the tools to develop a great skill set in the NBA? You can't teach court vision, so his ability as a play maker will predicate more on his great first step and good instincts when he gets in the hole. Combine that with above avg body control and second jump, and he can be a solid offensive rebounder for his position at the next level. Does he have the most fluid jumper in the world? Nope, but he's by no means inept in that area. He's also shown better defensive awareness than most players who have his physical tools at his age.

[skones]

Another defensive giannas post... big surprise. Did you completely miss everything positive i said about him above?

Yes, i've watched wiggins play in college and in summer league. For a rookie wing coming into the NBA, he has a great all around skill set, but needs time to develop.

How is it defensive to point out a false claim? What part of his skill set is great or all around? He hasn't demonstrated anything better than below average vision. He's very loose with his left hand and his right hand isn't anything to write home about either. He shows poor awareness in the dribble drive game tending to predetermine his moves rather than reacting to what the defense gives him. He's got an inconsistent release on his jumper as well. Just because you say he has a great all around skill set doesn't make it true.

Because I never claimed he had a better skill set than giannis, and you automatically jumped to that without any hesitation. Would you prefer I say he showed the tools to develop a great skill set in the NBA? You can't teach court vision, so his ability as a play maker will predicate more on his great first step and good instincts when he gets in the hole. Combine that with above avg body control and second jump, and he can be a solid offensive rebounder for his position at the next level. Does he have the most fluid jumper in the world? Nope, but he's by no means inept in that area. He's also shown better defensive awareness than most players who have his physical tools at his age.

It's a player comparison thread. It's absolutely reasonable for me to bring up his skill set when you're sitting there saying he has something that he simply doesn't. Theres a huge difference between a semblance of a skill set foundation and stating he has one. HUGE.

[JDR720]

I still don't understand the Giannis hype

[90sAllDecade]

I like Giannis as a prospect, but summer league hasn't been a good way to project players in the season from what I've seen. There's been some guys who were summer league stars and weren't nearly as good when the games counted.

Giannis should likely be slightly better this season with a year of experience (perhaps much better under Kidd), and his size, passing, combined with his great athleticism gives him the potential to be a scary good two way prospect.

But imo, Wiggins will likely be the better scorer, can develop as a passer and a shut down defender as well. I also think as great as Giannis is, Wiggins is still a better athlete.

Here's Wiggins high school highlights and look how he flies with his head above the rim at the 1:10 mark

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ip6H2libYqU[/youtube]

I just don't know if Giannis can develop into a consistent go to scorer who can create his own offense. If he can, as well as develop his passing he could beat out Wiggins. But more likely Andrew will be better imo.

[KD35Brah]

How exactly does Wiggins have a better "all around" game than Giannis?

[NO-KG-AI]

Andrew Wiggins is the better prospect, despite initially being very overrated as a prospect, and having some holes in his game at the moment.

[H2tObes]

Whoever is saying Wiggins is the more skilled of the two at this point is absolutely clueless.

I still don't understand the Giannis hype

You will. You have to understand it on some degree, he's a 7 footer with guard skills. I hate seeing the 7 foot Magic Johnson posts as much as you do, it makes Bucks fans look terrible. I think he's going to be damn good though

[packforfreedom]

I still don't understand the Giannis hype

this. leave this Giannis has guardskills thing alone. He is a very mobile bigman, with good handles for his size. That doesn't equal guardskills. He can dribble the ball coast to coast without turning it over. He's an okay passer for his size, and he can handle the ball in the pick an roll a bit. Calling this guardskills is just ridicoulus. The only 7fter who could really play some PG as the primary ball handler was KG in his prime. Then from time to time, you have that 6'11, 7'' propect that is mobile for his size and everybody hypes this guy to be a 7ft guard. Nikoloz Tskitishvili was such a prospect, Jonothan Bender was another. 7ft guards simply doesn't happen in the nba because there are tons of real guards with far, far better skills and the pace in the nba is higher than these 7ft "guards" are used to. Somebody here mentioned Giannis reminds him of Magic Johnson, he should be banned for that comment.

Let's face it: Giannes is talented, he has very rare physical gifts, is still super young, and has an okay skillset. But that's it. He is no Durant, no KG and no Magic Johnson. He's best suited to be a combo forward, who can beat slower forwards off the dribble and overpower smaller forwards. He might be an allstar somedays, but in my opinion that's his absolute ceiling.

[Sign5]

The modern-day Beasley vs Anthony Randolph debate.

[dautjazz]

I still don't understand the Giannis hype

Because he looks good when he actually does something, therefore it means he will be the next Magic Johnson. Come on man, it's not clear to you?

[Optms]

Is it me or does anyone else see the similarities between this thread and the Michael Beasley VS Anthony Randolph of a few seasons ago?

viewtopic.php?f=64&t=939759&hilit=beasley

[Hornet Mania]

Two raw prospects, no way to really tell who will get the last laugh until two or three years down the road. I'd be happy with either on my team though, that's for sure.

Giannis looks really good in spurts, but he's still super raw and learning the game. It seems to come naturally to him, which is a huge bonus considering his relative inexperience, but it also makes you pump the brakes a bit on the hype. Let's not forget, he only averaged 6.8ppg/4.4.reb/1.8assists per game and 10/6/3 per36. He's a step up from Magic Randolph for sure, but also a step down from Magic Johnson. It'll be interesting to see how much the scoring, rebounding and passing components of his game can improve. Can he be an efficient 20ppg scorer? Can he average 8-10 rebounds? Or 6+ assists? If he can tick off two or three of those boxes he's a stud. If he ends up at 15ppg/6rebound/4assists on decent percentages he's just a borderline all-star even with those crazy measurables. Still much to be determined. At the same time I completely understand why Bucks fans are jazzed about his prospects, if he were in Charlotte I'd be super high on that kid. He seems to have a great attitude and is the kind of player you enjoy rooting for.

Andrew Wiggins has the insane hype working against him at this point. "Best prospect since Lebron" quotes did not help him, even though he was runner-up for Big 12 Player of the Year his performance still seemed underwhelming due to expectations. But let's not forget that Kansas was not the best place to showcase his talents, he was one part of an ensemble system and that was by design. It is entirely possible that he is a different caliber of player in the NBA game, some guys just aren't made for the college game and I believe Wiggins is one of them. Curious to see how he looks in Minnesota. I like the fact that he has a reputation as a hard worker, and he seems driven to succeed. I hope Cleveland shipping him off before even seeing how he fit with Lebron lights a fire under him, it wouldn't surprise me if he feels undervalued and that can be a powerful motivator.

No reason to trash either one of these prospects. I think they'll both be solid players, with sky-high upside right now. Anyone who acts like they wouldn't take them on their team is nuts. Right now I'll go with Wiggins. I feel certain he'll be an elite defender at minimum, with top-tier athleticism. If I preferred swinging for the fences I would choose Giannis, but it's just much more difficult to project his worst-case scenario. It wouldn't shock me if neither of these guys is a superstar, but I'd be very surprised if either of them washed out in a few years ala Beasley or Randolph.

[JayMKE]

Having actually watched both players extensively, I can comfortably say it's Giannis and anybody else that has done the same would agree. There isn't a single part of Wiggins game that I would take over Giannis, all Wiggins has on Giannis is maybe better form on his jumper and leaping ability. Giannis' shot isn't broken or anything but it wasn't great last year, it looked improved in SL and he's been working on it a ton. I think Giannis is and will be a better defender, Giannis was already a real solid defensive player in his rookie year. You can't teach a 7'4" and growing wingspan, Giannis is so quick and mobile for his size. He's an absolute terror on the perimeter.

The biggest knock I have on Giannis is that he seems to defer too much and has been willing to sit in the corner and not demand the ball, this is also a problem with Wiggins tho. Giannis looked very aggressive in SL tho and Kidd seems to be into the idea of giving him free reign so I'm hopeful that will be a thing of the past. It is pretty hard to knock a 18/19 year old for deferring to older veteran players and coaches, it's just really frustrating to watch. Giannis is a real affable kid, very charismatic with a bit of nasty competitive streak you want to see. There is a difference, the lack of a killer instinct or willingness to take over. Harrison Barnes is a guy that comes to mind when you think of a kid that lacks that "it" factor. Watching Wiggins, I see some Harrison Barnes but hopefully it is just a passing phase. Wiggins seems like a shy dude, not a very fiery personality.

Giannis has a rare feel and understanding for the game for a kid as young as he is with as little experience, he's very smart on the court and it just seems to come naturally to him. He has great vision. He's still growing too, his body is still maturing, watching him play for the Greek team right now it is apparent how much stronger he looks this year as opposed to last. I can see Giannis growing into a PF or C down the line, I think he compares a lot to KG physically. Wiggins body wise I don't see changing much, maybe he'll get stronger. I think Wiggins is pretty solidly a wing player whereas I see Giannis being a much much more versatile player.


FWIW, I had Jabari over Wiggins in this draft. I see Jabari as a much more skilled versatile player with the personality I'd like build around. I think my reasoning for liking Giannis over Wiggins is pretty consistent with why I liked Parker over Wiggins when we were in the running for both so it isn't homerism.

[Kings2013]

I still don't understand the Giannis hype

I don't really to the tune the hype is either.. There is going to be a lot of backlash against the hype the kid received if in 3-4 years he doesn't turn out to be good

[LakerLegend]

Giannis has quickly become the most overrated prospect in the NBA. He is extremely Raw, but has all of the measurables. A player as Raw as him will never round off a complete skill set and will be lucky to have one or two basketball skills that end up in the elite department outside of measurables/athleticism.

I don't think he's as raw as that, and there are always exceptions to the rule. He's what, 19? Not like he's diop.

[Colbinii]

I don't think he's as raw as that, and there are always exceptions to the rule. He's what, 19? Not like he's diop.

You are right, there are always exceptions, but I'm going with the 99% of players that have entered the league as raw as Giannis and haven't amounted to anything more than role players. Actually, who are the exceptions to this rule? I can't recall a player as raw as Giannis ever amounting to All-Star caliber.

[Joseph17]

I don't think he's as raw as that, and there are always exceptions to the rule. He's what, 19? Not like he's diop.

You are right, there are always exceptions, but I'm going with the 99% of players that have entered the league as raw as Giannis and haven't amounted to anything more than role players. Actually, who are the exceptions to this rule? I can't recall a player as raw as Giannis ever amounting to All-Star caliber.

Most players his age are pretty raw. You'll rarely find exceptions like Melo, Lebron, and Durant who come into the league pretty polished. Look at T-Mac, Dwight Howard, KG, Kobe, etc. I would say that being raw at age 19 is more of the norm not the exception even for superstars. Even Jordan's numbers during his first year in college weren't that impressive. These guys are just too young to show us what kind of player they are going to be. Give him 2 full years in the NBA before you call him too raw to become an all-star.