JV at World Cup 2014

[Rapz]

Yesterday was the first Lithuania game I saw all summer

Wow.

JVs floor is borderline all-star

I wish I could see the alternate universe where we tank and JV becomes the focal point of our offense

a lot more efficient than DD's, that's for sure...

[Badatude]

They have the wrong stats for Jonas, because they're taken before the game against France. Jonas finished with 14.4 PPG (17th), 8.4 RPG (6th), 69.6 FG% (1st), 81 FT% (8th), 19.8 EFF (5th). So yeah, statistically he had a monstrous tournament.

I know it's hard to believe but Jonas consistently shoots 70% when he gets touches. He's done it for years in international tournaments and leagues and he's done it for 10-game stretches on the Raps.

He NEEDS to be taking 15 shots a game for us. If he does I guarantee he will be average 25+ points when you factor in the number of times he will go to the line (easily 8 times a game if he puts up 15 shots).

I know you will all say I'm crazy but I see him making 60% of his shots (9 of 15) and 80+ of his FTs for 25+ pts on the season and league-leading efficiency.

Yes he needs to work on positioning getting the ball etc. but there's nothing like reps to do that. I don't know why people keep ignoring that he consistently puts up GOAT type efficiency numbers when given the ball steadily. Efficiency-wise he was the the best offensive rookie centre in 30 years and yet his shots per game only in creased by like 1 in year 2. they better take a significantly bigger jump in year 3!

It is on the coaching staff to get him 15 shots. Yes Jonas needs to do more than show up but 15 shots for a starter in the NBA is reasonable if the coaches make an effort.
Casey should be let go if the raps dont make an effort to make Jonas a primary option on the offensive side of the ball. It is time to try. If it doesnt work the raps would still make the play offs and Jonas could have a chance to learn from the experience.

[Darkseid]

I see JV as more of a piece of a machine, not the most important part of it.

He reminds me of Noah more than any other player. Hard worker, very raw, but improving with every year. Still nowhere close to him but the Raptors should look to work with Jonas more.

Added defensive responsibilities, more involvement when he has a significant size advantage, and less force feeds.

[Clementine9]

I see JV as more of a piece of a machine, not the most important part of it.

He reminds me of Noah more than any other player. Hard worker, very raw, but improving with every year. Still nowhere close to him but the Raptors should look to work with Jonas more.

Added defensive responsibilities, more involvement when he has a significant size advantage, and less force feeds.

The issue is there are no force feeds.

[PoundTown]

Nowhere near the defensive impact as Noah. Doesn't have the lateral quicks or awareness to get there either. I see a much more effective scorer however. My revised expectations for JV this year are 15/10. Before world cup I was predicting 13/10. His footwork and poise down low have greatly improved.

[baulderdash77]

I know it's hard to believe but Jonas consistently shoots 70% when he gets touches. He's done it for years in international tournaments and leagues and he's done it for 10-game stretches on the Raps.

...Yes he needs to work on positioning getting the ball etc. but there's nothing like reps to do that. I don't know why people keep ignoring that he consistently puts up GOAT type efficiency numbers when given the ball steadily. Efficiency-wise he was the the best offensive rookie centre in 30 years and yet his shots per game only in creased by like 1 in year 2. they better take a significantly bigger jump in year 3!

Honestly you have to listen to what you're saying and consider the level of competition. The FIBA World Cup or any FIBA event is a significant step down from the NBA to be honest.

For context there has only ever been 1 player in the NBA to average 70% shooting in a single season. He's also the only guy to ever average 50 & 25 for a season; so it's pretty insane company you're comparing Val to.

The best All-Around bigman I've ever seen was Hakeem Olajuwon in 93/94 when he completed the trifecta of MVP, DPOY & Finals MVP. He shot .528 that season.

I'm as excited about Jonas as anyone but let's get some context.

[Dalek]

I finally got to watch the France Lith game and JV had some great moments. He is very assertive on the block and makes himself available for entry passes and has good hands to make difficult catches. The footwork was Pau-like. He is assertive, but he is not selfish. He made some good passes out of the post and I could see him getting more hockey assists on Toronto if we play inside-out more.

My concerns are with his defense. He really is poor at reading situations and is a bit flat-footed when challenging shots. I think he is better off just guarding the post and letting Amir do the help defense. He got caught in so many situations where he helped too early and left his man open for lay-ups. He couldn't guard Lavergne very well, since he was more of a PF, but Gobert could not handle JV.

Lastly, if people are excited about his offense, they should be. But, FIBA is not to be trusted as a benchmark. Understand in the NBA he will have taller and more athletic teams who will double him and try to get him to turn it over. He will need to make quicker passes and reads to avoid traps. Plus, he has to watch his elbows, since the NBA ref is much less likely to allow physical play. For a 22 year-old we have quite a player. I could see him being the best C in the league by the time he is 27. That will contingent on him finding his place on defense. He has still a long way to go on that end.

[Thespianoid]

I finally got to watch the France Lith game and JV had some great moments. He is very assertive on the block and makes himself available for entry passes and has good hands to make difficult catches. The footwork was Pau-like. He is assertive, but he is not selfish. He made some good passes out of the post and I could see him getting more hockey assists on Toronto if we play inside-out more.

My concerns are with his defense. He really is poor at reading situations and is a bit flat-footed when challenging shots. I think he is better off just guarding the post and letting Amir do the help defense. He got caught in so many situations where he helped too early and left his man open for lay-ups. He couldn't guard Lavergne very well, since he was more of a PF, but Gobert could not handle JV.

Lastly, if people are excited about his offense, they should be. But, FIBA is not to be trusted as a benchmark. Understand in the NBA he will have taller and more athletic teams who will double him and try to get him to turn it over. He will need to make quicker passes and reads to avoid traps. Plus, he has to watch his elbows, since the NBA ref is much less likely to allow physical play. For a 22 year-old we have quite a player. I could see him being the best C in the league by the time he is 27. That will contingent on him finding his place on defense. He has still a long way to go on that end.

I agree with a lot of your assessment here.

He's a lot more offensively talented than defensively, which throws the Noah/Chandler comparisons out the window (in my opinion). I'd like him to model his game after Marc Gasol and Tim Duncan - smart, patient, skilled play in the post, and fundamentally sound defense that demonstrates a high-level understanding of the game. Their understanding of defensive spacing is elite, and can be developed over time.

I think it's clear that Jonas still needs a lot of work defensively, even if he shows flashes of proper positioning and correct timing now and then. But I'm still optimistic that he can be a competent rim protector down the road, (not elite, he doesn't have the natural instincts like Davis/Gobert) and shouldn't be limited just yet. Ideally he'll be paired with another strong defensive big who's a bit better as the last line of defense (weakside shot blocking).

That being said, he still has a tendency to help early on the guard during P&R coverage, leaving the pocket/roll man wide open. And he stays down too often when he's tasked with weakside help. This is different from rotations when a guard has entered a wide open paint, to which Jonas does a good job of reading and reacting. In these cases teammates need to help the helper to prevent easy drop offs. Too often the rest of the team stands and ball watches while some other offensive players sneak under the rim.

Mentally, he simply needs to calm down and stay composed. He's intense and always thinks he should have done better, which is a good trait to have, but there are times when things just won't go perfectly. This should be ok as he continues to mature. He's only 22.

[Anatomize]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LpMOEkkAl8[/youtube]

[MrBojangelz71]

Kid is looking good down low, noticeable improvement in his fluidity, footwork. Granted it is against lesser talent, but some of those moves are almost impossible to guard against, without bringing help from the perimeter. No reason he shouldn't be earning a couple of dimes per game this season.

I believe he is capable of 15ppg, 10brds, 2 dimes this season. The tools are all there

[DG88]

I finally got to watch the France Lith game and JV had some great moments. He is very assertive on the block and makes himself available for entry passes and has good hands to make difficult catches. The footwork was Pau-like. He is assertive, but he is not selfish. He made some good passes out of the post and I could see him getting more hockey assists on Toronto if we play inside-out more.

My concerns are with his defense. He really is poor at reading situations and is a bit flat-footed when challenging shots. I think he is better off just guarding the post and letting Amir do the help defense. He got caught in so many situations where he helped too early and left his man open for lay-ups. He couldn't guard Lavergne very well, since he was more of a PF, but Gobert could not handle JV.

Lastly, if people are excited about his offense, they should be. But, FIBA is not to be trusted as a benchmark. Understand in the NBA he will have taller and more athletic teams who will double him and try to get him to turn it over. He will need to make quicker passes and reads to avoid traps. Plus, he has to watch his elbows, since the NBA ref is much less likely to allow physical play. For a 22 year-old we have quite a player. I could see him being the best C in the league by the time he is 27. That will contingent on him finding his place on defense. He has still a long way to go on that end.

I agree with a lot of your assessment here.

He's a lot more offensively talented than defensively, which throws the Noah/Chandler comparisons out the window (in my opinion). I'd like him to model his game after Marc Gasol and Tim Duncan - smart, patient, skilled play in the post, and fundamentally sound defense that demonstrates a high-level understanding of the game. Their understanding of defensive spacing is elite, and can be developed over time.

I think it's clear that Jonas still needs a lot of work defensively, even if he shows flashes of proper positioning and correct timing now and then. But I'm still optimistic that he can be a competent rim protector down the road, (not elite, he doesn't have the natural instincts like Davis/Gobert) and shouldn't be limited just yet. Ideally he'll be paired with another strong defensive big who's a bit better as the last line of defense (weakside shot blocking).

That being said, he still has a tendency to help early on the guard during P&R coverage, leaving the pocket/roll man wide open. And he stays down too often when he's tasked with weakside help. This is different from rotations when a guard has entered a wide open paint, to which Jonas does a good job of reading and reacting. In these cases teammates need to help the helper to prevent easy drop offs. Too often the rest of the team stands and ball watches while some other offensive players sneak under the rim.

Mentally, he simply needs to calm down and stay composed. He's intense and always thinks he should have done better, which is a good trait to have, but there are times when things just won't go perfectly. This should be ok as he continues to mature. He's only 22.

I personally see him developing like Marc Gasol defensively. When Marc started playing in the NBA he wasn't a great defender, average, but not great. Though with more experience and understanding he got better every year and ended up becoming DPOY. Positioning and experience is key here for JV. Casey is probably the best coach for him to understand defensive fundamentals. Last year his defense was better compared to his rookie year. I expect to continue to see gradual improvement on that end.

[Kabookalu]

It is on the coaching staff to get him 15 shots. Yes Jonas needs to do more than show up but 15 shots for a starter in the NBA is reasonable if the coaches make an effort.
Casey should be let go if the raps dont make an effort to make Jonas a primary option on the offensive side of the ball. It is time to try. If it doesnt work the raps would still make the play offs and Jonas could have a chance to learn from the experience.

If we fired a coach for not forcing plays around a player that we're not sold on that's capable of being a focal point of the offense then that would just be very incompetent managing.

[Badatude]

It is on the coaching staff to get him 15 shots. Yes Jonas needs to do more than show up but 15 shots for a starter in the NBA is reasonable if the coaches make an effort.
Casey should be let go if the raps dont make an effort to make Jonas a primary option on the offensive side of the ball. It is time to try. If it doesnt work the raps would still make the play offs and Jonas could have a chance to learn from the experience.

If we fired a coach for not forcing plays around a player that we're not sold on that's capable of being a focal point of the offense then that would just be very incompetent managing.

Game planning to get Jonas 15 shots when it could be argued he is the raps best low post option is a reasonable expectation. If Casey chooses not to make the effort to try well I guess he can explain that to his boss. I would like to tell my boss why I cant even try when I am at work. Not sure how that would be received though?

[Kabookalu]

Game planning to get Jonas 15 shots when it could be argued he is the raps best low post option is a reasonable expectation. If Casey chooses not to make the effort to try well I guess he can explain that to his boss. I would like to tell my boss why I cant even try when I am at work. Not sure how that would be received though?

He's our best low post option but, as of right now, he's not someone ready to usurp main scoring responsibilities over Lowry and DeRozan, which is what Casey will have to do to get Jonas more involved. For the most part Jonas does get his fair share of touches, it's up to Jonas to capitalize on those opportunities. If Jonas was playing with confidence all the time and reacted faster in situations he could probably score 17ppg with how the offense is structured as it is now.

[Badatude]

Game planning to get Jonas 15 shots when it could be argued he is the raps best low post option is a reasonable expectation. If Casey chooses not to make the effort to try well I guess he can explain that to his boss. I would like to tell my boss why I cant even try when I am at work. Not sure how that would be received though?

He's our best low post option but, as of right now, he's not someone ready to usurp main scoring responsibilities over Lowry and DeRozan, which is what Casey will have to do to get Jonas more involved. For the most part Jonas does get his fair share of touches, it's up to Jonas to capitalize on those opportunities. If Jonas was playing with confidence all the time and reacted faster in situations he could probably score 17ppg with how the offense is structured as it is now.

I can see where you are coming from and your argument is logical. I am just looking at The Raps from a different perspective is all.
My thinking is more along the lines of development through experience. Jonas getting the chance (game planned 15 shots per game) and hopefully learning through the season would bode well for the raps long term.

The opinion I am putting forth is that I believe it is time to try regardless of the seasons final stats. Maybe not as eloquently as I would like though.

[lobosloboslobos]

I know it's hard to believe but Jonas consistently shoots 70% when he gets touches. He's done it for years in international tournaments and leagues and he's done it for 10-game stretches on the Raps.

...Yes he needs to work on positioning getting the ball etc. but there's nothing like reps to do that. I don't know why people keep ignoring that he consistently puts up GOAT type efficiency numbers when given the ball steadily. Efficiency-wise he was the the best offensive rookie centre in 30 years and yet his shots per game only in creased by like 1 in year 2. they better take a significantly bigger jump in year 3!

Honestly you have to listen to what you're saying and consider the level of competition. The FIBA World Cup or any FIBA event is a significant step down from the NBA to be honest.

For context there has only ever been 1 player in the NBA to average 70% shooting in a single season. He's also the only guy to ever average 50 & 25 for a season; so it's pretty insane company you're comparing Val to.

The best All-Around bigman I've ever seen was Hakeem Olajuwon in 93/94 when he completed the trifecta of MVP, DPOY & Finals MVP. He shot .528 that season.

I'm as excited about Jonas as anyone but let's get some context.

I didn't say he could shoot 70% for the season in the NBA I said he could shoot 60% and he can. After the all-star break last year he shot 60% on 10 shots a game and in his 1st season he shot 59% on 7 shots after the all-star break. And then there's this...

Lithuania’s Jonas Valanciunas has the highest true shooting percentage in NBA history among rookie centers that have started at least 50 games and averaged at least 20 minutes per game.

http://o.canada.com/sports/basketball/lots-of-potential-for-jonas-valanciunas

[joediamond]

Game planning to get Jonas 15 shots when it could be argued he is the raps best low post option is a reasonable expectation. If Casey chooses not to make the effort to try well I guess he can explain that to his boss. I would like to tell my boss why I cant even try when I am at work. Not sure how that would be received though?

He's our best low post option but, as of right now, he's not someone ready to usurp main scoring responsibilities over Lowry and DeRozan, which is what Casey will have to do to get Jonas more involved. For the most part Jonas does get his fair share of touches, it's up to Jonas to capitalize on those opportunities. If Jonas was playing with confidence all the time and reacted faster in situations he could probably score 17ppg with how the offense is structured as it is now.

One thing to take into consideration, he could be a college senior right now.

[Ari_Emanuel]

Kid is looking good down low, noticeable improvement in his fluidity, footwork. Granted it is against lesser talent, but some of those moves are almost impossible to guard against, without bringing help from the perimeter. No reason he shouldn't be earning a couple of dimes per game this season.

I believe he is capable of 15ppg, 10brds, 2 dimes this season. The tools are all there

Kind of tired of people qualifying JV's performance by saying he's been doing it against lesser talent. In the past two weeks he's gone toe to toe with Nene/Sideshow Bob, Gobert, Asik and Mexico's Ayon, who is one of the most coveted bigs in the world not currently playing in the NBA and could make a lot of rosters right now. Those are all talented and physically formidable centers.

[cammac]

One thing most posters forget is that both Marc Gasol & Noah were both much older both were 23 in there 1st NBA years and both were not good out of the gate. In this regard this will be in comparison to there rookie year and last year he was much better than eithers rookie years and is already a better rebounder than Marc.

He will be better offensively than both, better rebounder but obviously his defense needs improvement as both Noah/Marc did. I think this will be his break out year. He needs 12 shot attempts a game to get 16 PPG. and he is capable of 11 RPG. and 1.5 BPG.

[Kenyon009]

Val needs more touches but first he should stop turning into) the ball over. He would probably be more efficient than DeRozan if we did that... We have no clear cut first options on our team we should be trying everything.