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Why Marcus Smart should start at SG

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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#261 » by BfB » Sun Oct 19, 2014 2:20 am

SichtingLives wrote:One can only hope he has a Billups career arc offensively. I would be happy with him going through the same progression on offense that Kelly has since his first games last year, he was tentative as hell (and still is at times) but he has come a long way since then. As of today Smart still looks like a smaller, stronger G. Wallace with PG skills. He'll certainly grow beyond that but he hasn't earned himself a huge role just yet which is good because he will develop more smoothly without a lot of pressure on him to do things that aren't in his professional repertoire yet. Let him keep playing the deferential PG role and he'll start working his own offense in more as it presents itself and he becomes more comfortable with the huge leaps in talent, size and athleticism that go along with the transition from NCAA to the NBA.


finally one post that isnt complete tripe.

This is preseason, there are different focuses during preseason. Alot of you would benefit greatly from following some other teams or a while in order to learn a few things about how the NBA works - knowing how the game is played is not the same as knowing how a team is run.

Here's how it works:

- Smart is learning what what his teammates tendencies are
- Stevens is learning the offensive hierarchy of the team
- Stevens and Smart both know Smart is down that list

The team is intending to play to win, or at least maximize its most developmentally ready talent in order to maximize their value through competitive play. Smart is under team control for the next 5 years and is a rookie, they are not concerned with maximizing everything he can do offensively right now.

As the season progresses and the team offensive identity takes form, Stevens and Smart will identify the situations that best suit Smarts drive game and he'll be allowed to explore his offensive within the context of the rest of the team's offensive flow.

This isn't NBA2K, nobody in the organization gives a **** about Marcus Smart right now. He is not the focus of this team offensively at the moment. He shouldnt be, he is not remotely close to being a primary option on this team of talented and more developed options that the team has more pressing decisions to make regarding.

If Smart were FAILING at his drive attempts that would be another situation to analyze. But Smart isn't even looking to drive. This has everything to do with the roles on the team. Save the arguing over Smart's offensive effectiveness once he actually has a role in the offense.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#262 » by UGA Hayes » Sun Oct 19, 2014 2:33 am

One other Thing people need to be prepared for. Point guards almost universally suck their first year.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#263 » by Taget » Sun Oct 19, 2014 9:50 am

It's only pre-season. Though I will admit to some concern since one reason we chose him over other point guards was NBA readiness. But point guards can take some time to blossom. Rajon Rondo was battling with scrubs for playing time his rookie year. And if memory serves me was often our third string.

Hopefully Smart's stat sheets are going to look more like 1st game of his rookie season Chauncy Billups.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/box ... 10BOS.html

Rather than 4th game of his rookie season Chauncy Billups.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/box ... 50BOS.html

And just because I found this interesting to look through. Chauncy Billups second to last game he played as a Celtic http://www.basketball-reference.com/box ... 30LAC.html versus the last game he played as a Celtic http://www.basketball-reference.com/box ... 50GSW.html .
[quote:545636310b="Darth Celtic"]man, these refs need to stop giving us the benefit of the doubt and start screwing us.[/quote]

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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#264 » by Slartibartfast » Sun Oct 19, 2014 3:55 pm

BfB wrote:
SichtingLives wrote:One can only hope he has a Billups career arc offensively. I would be happy with him going through the same progression on offense that Kelly has since his first games last year, he was tentative as hell (and still is at times) but he has come a long way since then. As of today Smart still looks like a smaller, stronger G. Wallace with PG skills. He'll certainly grow beyond that but he hasn't earned himself a huge role just yet which is good because he will develop more smoothly without a lot of pressure on him to do things that aren't in his professional repertoire yet. Let him keep playing the deferential PG role and he'll start working his own offense in more as it presents itself and he becomes more comfortable with the huge leaps in talent, size and athleticism that go along with the transition from NCAA to the NBA.


finally one post that isnt complete tripe.

This is preseason, there are different focuses during preseason. Alot of you would benefit greatly from following some other teams or a while in order to learn a few things about how the NBA works - knowing how the game is played is not the same as knowing how a team is run.

Here's how it works:

- Smart is learning what what his teammates tendencies are
- Stevens is learning the offensive hierarchy of the team
- Stevens and Smart both know Smart is down that list

The team is intending to play to win, or at least maximize its most developmentally ready talent in order to maximize their value through competitive play. Smart is under team control for the next 5 years and is a rookie, they are not concerned with maximizing everything he can do offensively right now.

As the season progresses and the team offensive identity takes form, Stevens and Smart will identify the situations that best suit Smarts drive game and he'll be allowed to explore his offensive within the context of the rest of the team's offensive flow.

This isn't NBA2K, nobody in the organization gives a **** about Marcus Smart right now. He is not the focus of this team offensively at the moment. He shouldnt be, he is not remotely close to being a primary option on this team of talented and more developed options that the team has more pressing decisions to make regarding.

If Smart were FAILING at his drive attempts that would be another situation to analyze. But Smart isn't even looking to drive. This has everything to do with the roles on the team. Save the arguing over Smart's offensive effectiveness once he actually has a role in the offense.


It's a little weird that Stevens talks about having to play Evan Turner because "he gets in the paint" while apparently simultaneously coaching Smart not to take it into the paint.

You don't have to be a featured offensive guy to attack the rim. If Smart flipped his 3-point-heave to drive ratio at the same overall usage, I think we'd all be happy.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#265 » by Slartibartfast » Sun Oct 19, 2014 3:59 pm

Taget wrote:Rather than 4th game of his rookie season Chauncy Billups.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/box ... 50BOS.html



Talk about a classic Toine box score - wow factor with 20-13-5 with 4 steals and 4 blocks, until you see the 6 turnovers, 33% shooting, 44% foul shooting and the 16-point home loss.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#266 » by humblebum » Sun Oct 19, 2014 5:45 pm

BannersOnly wrote:
bbd24 wrote:
BannersOnly wrote:I see no similarities AT ALL between Rondo and Smart. None. Nada. Zippo. In fact, if Smart was playing for the Kings right now than NOBODY on this board would even think about the guy or even compare him to Rondo. How are they similar? Rondo is a true PG who is arguably the best passer in the entire league. Smart is good(not great) ballhandler that likes to move the ball instead of setting up an offense like Rondo. Where and how are they similar? Because neither one is a great shooter? That's about it. Rondo can lead ANY NBA offense and has proven himself to have the ability to mesh good with proven NBA all star talents. Smart hasn't even shown the ability to be a NBA starting PG or SG yet. Putting Smart in the same sentence with a proven NBA all star like Rondo is a joke right now. He's not even close to being in Kyle Lowry's neighborhood LOL.


Now analyze Rondo vs Smart in their 1st seasons. It's great you'll analyze a first year player against a guy with 8 years experience. Problem is, that's like comparing an apple to an orange.

Now take your thinking cap out and analyze both in their rookie seasons. You know, the rookie season where Rondo shot .20 % from 3, 60% from the Free Throw line, and had 3 assists to go with his 6 pts per game in 23 minutes of play. He also did not look like Smart whatsoever on the defensive end.

Go !


Completely different players. Anyone who watched Rondo play his rookie year knew one thing for 100% certainty........he was a TRUE POINT GUARD. Period. Is anyone 100% certain Smart is a true PG?????? No. He wasn't asked to be a true PG in college and the jury is still out if he can be one in the pros. Rondo was "raw" as a rookie but A) he was the #19 overall pick I believe and not a #6 pick and B) he was definitely a true PG who just needed time to develop. I'm not sure what the hell Smart is because I know he isn't a true shooting guard because he can't shoot and I still haven't seen the court vision and creativity as a point guard to believe he can be a top shelf NBA caliber point guard.


You're trying too hard to make your point.

Here is how they are similar:

They both play the point. Both are physical freaks. Both came into the league as defense first, pass first players.

Now Smart is obviously a more willing shooter from distance and a much, much better shooter from the free throw line.

Rondo came into the league as a much better dribbler and a more creative passer.

They're not exactly similar but there are definitely some similarities.

In terms of Smart's lack of a dribble drive game, I just don't think he's gained that confidence to attack the paint. Part of it is what BfB is talking about, it's not really his role at this point in the process and the other part of it is that he has a high dribble and he's afraid it's going to get swiped.

Rondo is in a different league right now which is why I never understood this idea that Smart makes Rondo expendable. He is a rookie and he hasn't really proven anything at this level. He's in a perfect position to learn on the job and his defense and toughness will allow him to make an immediate impact off the bench though.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#267 » by sam_I_am » Sun Oct 19, 2014 9:58 pm

The only shot Smart can take is an uncontested 3. And they will remain uncontested because he is a dreadful shooter. The idea that he isn't driving because he is being coached that way is BS. He just can't do it at NBA level.

Stop making excuses based on theories that make no sense. If you call it like you see it, you must come to conclusion that Marcus Smart has no NBA caliber scoring ability yet. He has a lot of development to do. But like Avery Bradley, he will get playing time because he can play defense at a superior level.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#268 » by DarkAzcura » Sun Oct 19, 2014 10:16 pm

sam_I_am wrote:The only shot Smart can take is an uncontested 3. And they will remain uncontested because he is a dreadful shooter. The idea that he isn't driving because he is being coached that way is BS. He just can't do it at NBA level.

Stop making excuses based on theories that make no sense. If you call it like you see it, you must come to conclusion that Marcus Smart has no NBA caliber scoring ability yet. He has a lot of development to do. But like Avery Bradley, he will get playing time because he can play defense at a superior level.


You can't make proclamations like this until he actually tries and fails/succeeds. It's pre-season. Pre-season has always been a place to develop your game. Other thing is, it's important for the Celtics to make sure Smart isn't shy about taking his shot, or he may turn into another Rondo where teams won't play up on him. I'd be more worried if he was getting stripped, blocked, and cut off while attempting to drive to the rim, but none of this has happened. He's been in control with the ball. Has pretty much been able to dribble wherever he wanted when he wants. All of his drives have been kick-outs, and he has done it with ease. There's absolutely no reason to believe he couldn't have tried flipping up a couple floaters/shots while driving, but he is clearly developing his passing game along with his 3PT shot.

There's no way Stevens and the Celtics front office would be throwing him out there if they didn't want him to have a 80% 3Pr out there. That number is ridiculously high for a reason, yet he continues to get 25-30 MPG despite this. If the Celtics didn't want Smart shooting that 3 and wanted him to drive more, they wouldn't be letting him play all those minutes with his 80% 3Pr. Even with great defense. These aren't excuses. It is what it is. Until I see him actually fail at the rim for a couple seasons, I will not say one of his biggest strengths in college has turned into one of his weaknesses. There's no reason to.

You are right about one thing, though. Smart isn't really a NBA scorer yet. I just wouldn't say he can't drive to the rim at all.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#269 » by BannersOnly » Sun Oct 19, 2014 10:37 pm

sam_I_am wrote:The only shot Smart can take is an uncontested 3. And they will remain uncontested because he is a dreadful shooter. The idea that he isn't driving because he is being coached that way is BS. He just can't do it at NBA level.

Stop making excuses based on theories that make no sense. If you call it like you see it, you must come to conclusion that Marcus Smart has no NBA caliber scoring ability yet. He has a lot of development to do. But like Avery Bradley, he will get playing time because he can play defense at a superior level.


I agree with everything you said........except I'll believe his defense is "superior level" when I actually see him put the clamps on a Chris Paul or Russell Westbrook. He is very good defensively but let's not get carried away like far too many people did(and still are) with Avery Bradley's very good(but not GREAT a la Tony Allen) defense.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#270 » by Slartibartfast » Sun Oct 19, 2014 10:42 pm

DarkAzcura wrote:
sam_I_am wrote:The only shot Smart can take is an uncontested 3. And they will remain uncontested because he is a dreadful shooter. The idea that he isn't driving because he is being coached that way is BS. He just can't do it at NBA level.

Stop making excuses based on theories that make no sense. If you call it like you see it, you must come to conclusion that Marcus Smart has no NBA caliber scoring ability yet. He has a lot of development to do. But like Avery Bradley, he will get playing time because he can play defense at a superior level.


You can't make proclamations like this until he actually tries and fails/succeeds. It's pre-season. Pre-season has always been a place to develop your game. Other thing is, it's important for the Celtics to make sure Smart isn't shy about taking his shot, or he may turn into another Rondo where teams won't play up on him. I'd be more worried if he was getting stripped, blocked, and cut off while attempting to drive to the rim, but none of this has happened. He's been in control with the ball. Has pretty much been able to dribble wherever he wanted when he wants. All of his drives have been kick-outs, and he has done it with ease. There's absolutely no reason to believe he couldn't have just tried flipping up a couple floaters/shots while driving, but he is clearly developing his guard game along with his 3PT shot. There's no way Stevens and the Celtics front office would be throwing him out there if they didn't want him to have a 80% 3Pr out there. That number is ridiculously high for a reason, yet he continues to get 25-30 MPG despite this. These aren't excuses. It is what it is. Until I see him actually fail at the rim for a couple seasons, I will not say one of his biggest strengths in college has turned into one of his weaknesses. There's no reason to.


The 80% 3Pr likely doesn't mean much to the coaches because of how low his overall shot volume is.

He's playing like he's Derek Fisher - a defensive specialist who moves the ball and shoots 3's and only drives when the lane is wide open. Only he's not shooting anywhere near as well as Fish.

This is not the player we want him becoming and it's concerning that he's spending all of preseason playing like it.

And this is not normal. He's the first lottery rookie I've seen come into preseason who has completely abandoned the supposed strength of his offensive game.

Per 36 this preseason he's putting up 9/6/3 on 27% shooting - that's worse than what Phil Pressey put up last year in preseason. He's looked really good defensively, but he's been a turd as a scorer both in terms of efficiency and aggressiveness.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#271 » by DarkAzcura » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:00 pm

Slartibartfast wrote:The 80% 3Pr likely doesn't mean much to the coaches because of how low his overall shot volume is.

He's playing like he's Derek Fisher - a defensive specialist who moves the ball and shoots 3's and only drives when the lane is wide open. Only he's not shooting anywhere near as well as Fish.

This is not the player we want him becoming and it's concerning that he's spending all of preseason playing like it.

And this is not normal. He's the first lottery rookie I've seen come into preseason who has completely abandoned the supposed strength of his offensive game.

Per 36 this preseason he's putting up 9/6/3 on 27% shooting - that's worse than what Phil Pressey put up last year in preseason. He's looked really good defensively, but he's been a turd as a scorer both in terms of efficiency and aggressiveness.


The bolded is kind of my point. If the coaching staff cared or didn't already have this planned out for Smart, they would yank him out of the games even if he has low shot volume. He's going away from his strengths because he is probably being told not to care so much about his strengths right now. Typically a young player or rookie would be pulled if he didn't play to his strengths. That's not happening here.

BannersOnly wrote:
sam_I_am wrote:The only shot Smart can take is an uncontested 3. And they will remain uncontested because he is a dreadful shooter. The idea that he isn't driving because he is being coached that way is BS. He just can't do it at NBA level.

Stop making excuses based on theories that make no sense. If you call it like you see it, you must come to conclusion that Marcus Smart has no NBA caliber scoring ability yet. He has a lot of development to do. But like Avery Bradley, he will get playing time because he can play defense at a superior level.


I agree with everything you said........except I'll believe his defense is "superior level" when I actually see him put the clamps on a Chris Paul or Russell Westbrook. He is very good defensively but let's not get carried away like far too many people did(and still are) with Avery Bradley's very good(but not GREAT a la Tony Allen) defense.


This is a crazy standard to hold a PG to. No one is really talking about how Smart has shut down his players. They are talking about the disruption he has had playing the passing lanes and getting above the screens while making it tough for the opposing PG. This won't change whether it is Chris Paul or Westbrook. Those guys are still going to get there's, but it's clear Smart will make them work for it, and he will have a huge impact playing help defense. Smart has already played against guys like Lowry and Williams. He received rave reviews for his defense while being matched up against Iriving and Wall in the Team USA camp. I'm not sure what you are waiting for before you can admit that Smart is a defensive stud. He doesn't need to hold Paul to like 5/15 shooting with 4 turnovers for him to be a great defender or even the best PG defender. That'd be awesome to see, but it'd also be something that basically never happens regardless of the defender.

The main thing I want to see from a PG defensively is whether they can knock their guy out of their game plan. If Paul went out and scored 25 points on 50% shooting but had no assists, you probably played a great game defensively honestly. Judging point guard defense isn't that easy, and it's why I believe Rondo is a great defender still even though he gets burned on picks like every second.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#272 » by Slartibartfast » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:10 pm

DarkAzcura wrote:
Slartibartfast wrote:The 80% 3Pr likely doesn't mean much to the coaches because of how low his overall shot volume is.

He's playing like he's Derek Fisher - a defensive specialist who moves the ball and shoots 3's and only drives when the lane is wide open. Only he's not shooting anywhere near as well as Fish.

This is not the player we want him becoming and it's concerning that he's spending all of preseason playing like it.

And this is not normal. He's the first lottery rookie I've seen come into preseason who has completely abandoned the supposed strength of his offensive game.

Per 36 this preseason he's putting up 9/6/3 on 27% shooting - that's worse than what Phil Pressey put up last year in preseason. He's looked really good defensively, but he's been a turd as a scorer both in terms of efficiency and aggressiveness.


The bolded is kind of my point. If the coaching staff cared or didn't already have this planned out for Smart, they would yank him out of the games even if he has low shot volume. He's going away from his strengths because he is probably being told not to care so much about his strengths right now. Typically a young player or rookie would be pulled if he didn't play to his strengths. That's not happening here.



I'm not sold. If Pierce came out his rookie year refusing to ISO , but playing like every coach's favorite roleplayer, you think he'd be benched?

Smart is busting his butt on D, moving the ball and hustling everywhere - no coach is going to yank someone for playing that way. But no one drafts that guy at #6 either.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#273 » by BfB » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:36 pm

DarkAzcura wrote:
sam_I_am wrote:The only shot Smart can take is an uncontested 3. And they will remain uncontested because he is a dreadful shooter. The idea that he isn't driving because he is being coached that way is BS. He just can't do it at NBA level.

Stop making excuses based on theories that make no sense. If you call it like you see it, you must come to conclusion that Marcus Smart has no NBA caliber scoring ability yet. He has a lot of development to do. But like Avery Bradley, he will get playing time because he can play defense at a superior level.


You can't make proclamations like this until he actually tries and fails/succeeds. It's pre-season. Pre-season has always been a place to develop your game. Other thing is, it's important for the Celtics to make sure Smart isn't shy about taking his shot, or he may turn into another Rondo where teams won't play up on him. I'd be more worried if he was getting stripped, blocked, and cut off while attempting to drive to the rim, but none of this has happened. He's been in control with the ball. Has pretty much been able to dribble wherever he wanted when he wants. All of his drives have been kick-outs, and he has done it with ease. There's absolutely no reason to believe he couldn't have tried flipping up a couple floaters/shots while driving, but he is clearly developing his passing game along with his 3PT shot.

There's no way Stevens and the Celtics front office would be throwing him out there if they didn't want him to have a 80% 3Pr out there. That number is ridiculously high for a reason, yet he continues to get 25-30 MPG despite this. If the Celtics didn't want Smart shooting that 3 and wanted him to drive more, they wouldn't be letting him play all those minutes with his 80% 3Pr. Even with great defense. These aren't excuses. It is what it is. Until I see him actually fail at the rim for a couple seasons, I will not say one of his biggest strengths in college has turned into one of his weaknesses. There's no reason to.

You are right about one thing, though. Smart isn't really a NBA scorer yet. I just wouldn't say he can't drive to the rim at all.


No ****, it's just plain logic. If Steven's wanted him mixing up his offensive game you wouldn't see the same three play types being run over and over. This is by design. Notice that we only just started feeding the post, barely, ober the past two games as well.

Stage 1 of this team's offensive strategy has been to keep the pace up and move the ball to find open shooters - they've done that exceptionally well all things considered. The last thing you want to do is throw the kitchen sink at an inexperienced team with little time spent together. The defensive schemes have been much more compex, indicating the focus is on figuring out effective ways to mask their limitations on the interior with overloads and quality help rotations.

To Slart's point - OF COURSE you can make reads based off the situation at hand. But this team is not focused on more dynamic reads, you can see it in their motion sets. Everything right now is designed to promote decision making speed. That means working the ball quickly and moving to find open looks, which means jacking up shots right now.

Once the team establishes that they can consistently create open looks with their motion sets they will move deeper into the playbook and begin to explore screens and cuts created off weakside motion as the ball is moving around the perimeter. This will subsequently create more strong side penetration from the spot up shooters who will be passing up decent spot up shots with specific intent when driving i to the lane.

Again, in all of this, Marcus Smart is a babe in the woods. They want him making simple plays and staying out of the way for now as the more prominant players work their way into their offensive roles. This offensive is predicated on motion and ball movement. Smart has enough on his plate learning how to read an NbA defense and creating effective looks for teammates with pace and precision. He has done well at this so far.

I have no doubt Marcus Smart will increase his basket forays as time progresses. His size, strength, and body control after contact are going to be very effective when he gains the lane on a recovering defense whose interior defenders are coming off the perimeter. This will happen with some frequency by the second half of the year, if not sooner, depending on how quickly the team progresses offensively as a whole.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#274 » by BfB » Mon Oct 20, 2014 12:20 am

Slartibartfast wrote:
DarkAzcura wrote:
Slartibartfast wrote:The 80% 3Pr likely doesn't mean much to the coaches because of how low his overall shot volume is.

He's playing like he's Derek Fisher - a defensive specialist who moves the ball and shoots 3's and only drives when the lane is wide open. Only he's not shooting anywhere near as well as Fish.

This is not the player we want him becoming and it's concerning that he's spending all of preseason playing like it.

And this is not normal. He's the first lottery rookie I've seen come into preseason who has completely abandoned the supposed strength of his offensive game.

Per 36 this preseason he's putting up 9/6/3 on 27% shooting - that's worse than what Phil Pressey put up last year in preseason. He's looked really good defensively, but he's been a turd as a scorer both in terms of efficiency and aggressiveness.


The bolded is kind of my point. If the coaching staff cared or didn't already have this planned out for Smart, they would yank him out of the games even if he has low shot volume. He's going away from his strengths because he is probably being told not to care so much about his strengths right now. Typically a young player or rookie would be pulled if he didn't play to his strengths. That's not happening here.



I'm not sold. If Pierce came out his rookie year refusing to ISO , but playing like every coach's favorite roleplayer, you think he'd be benched?

Smart is busting his butt on D, moving the ball and hustling everywhere - no coach is going to yank someone for playing that way. But no one drafts that guy at #6 either.


You could be 100% right...but, your concerns don't account for any type of situation variable except his "6th pick" status.

Not all 6th picks are created equal. Boston has Rajon Rondo and Evan Turner, who are going to be handling the bulk of the ballhandling/dribble penetration for this team. Both are most effective on-ball, which means their court time will likely be staggered to limit overlap and maximize the time they each spend being the primary ball-handler.

The concept of the "two point guard" offense is great for doubling the playmaking capacity of the 5 man unit. But on any given posession you are going to have the prime scoring portion of the shot clock being utilized by just one of those two. The secondary ballhandler will still most often be left to shoot the ball. Maybe each gets a PnR look on 50% of posessions.

If these two are going to play 30 mpg a piece, Smart is 3rd on the totem pole and will likely rarely be the first option for dribble penetration. It is also unlikely that he'll be one of the two primary options offensively when he is on the court. The team is not designed to make Smart the focal point of the offense yet.

So, what is he likely to be doing a majority of the time? Probably shoot late in the clock or when open and set up the primary scorers. Driving the lane with the intent to score is going to be a "picking your spots" scenario for Smart. If and when he begins to establish that he is moving up the food chain, he will mobe up the usage food chain.

You're looking at his lottery status and confusing it with a need for the team to start maximizing his offensive contribution from day one. On Philly or Orlando or LA that may be the case. But Boston has numerous offensive weapons who are more established, more polished, and more central to THIS year's development plan.

Just because Smart is the highest draft pick - 3rd in actuality - it doesn't mean that this season is all about Smart. What you want is to make sure he is getting on the court over 20 mpg and has a role that he grows into and masters.

This really goes into the "tanking" mindset again - if the team isn't a playoff shoe in than that means there is no strategy other than maximg out shot opportunities for the percieved top prospects. But thats not whats going on here.

Smart's time wil come...that time isnt now.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#275 » by Slartibartfast » Mon Oct 20, 2014 12:50 am

This team needs dribble penetration and someone who can get to the line, esp. with Rondo out. I get bringing Smart along slowly, but there's a vacuum now that needs his slashing skillset however unpolished.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#276 » by humblebum » Mon Oct 20, 2014 1:05 am

BfB wrote:
Slartibartfast wrote:
DarkAzcura wrote:
The bolded is kind of my point. If the coaching staff cared or didn't already have this planned out for Smart, they would yank him out of the games even if he has low shot volume. He's going away from his strengths because he is probably being told not to care so much about his strengths right now. Typically a young player or rookie would be pulled if he didn't play to his strengths. That's not happening here.



I'm not sold. If Pierce came out his rookie year refusing to ISO , but playing like every coach's favorite roleplayer, you think he'd be benched?

Smart is busting his butt on D, moving the ball and hustling everywhere - no coach is going to yank someone for playing that way. But no one drafts that guy at #6 either.


You could be 100% right...but, your concerns don't account for any type of situation variable except his "6th pick" status.

Not all 6th picks are created equal. Boston has Rajon Rondo and Evan Turner, who are going to be handling the bulk of the ballhandling/dribble penetration for this team. Both are most effective on-ball, which means their court time will likely be staggered to limit overlap and maximize the time they each spend being the primary ball-handler.

The concept of the "two point guard" offense is great for doubling the playmaking capacity of the 5 man unit. But on any given posession you are going to have the prime scoring portion of the shot clock being utilized by just one of those two. The secondary ballhandler will still most often be left to shoot the ball. Maybe each gets a PnR look on 50% of posessions.

If these two are going to play 30 mpg a piece, Smart is 3rd on the totem pole and will likely rarely be the first option for dribble penetration. It is also unlikely that he'll be one of the two primary options offensively when he is on the court. The team is not designed to make Smart the focal point of the offense yet.

So, what is he likely to be doing a majority of the time? Probably shoot late in the clock or when open and set up the primary scorers. Driving the lane with the intent to score is going to be a "picking your spots" scenario for Smart. If and when he begins to establish that he is moving up the food chain, he will mobe up the usage food chain.

You're looking at his lottery status and confusing it with a need for the team to start maximizing his offensive contribution from day one. On Philly or Orlando or LA that may be the case. But Boston has numerous offensive weapons who are more established, more polished, and more central to THIS year's development plan.

Just because Smart is the highest draft pick - 3rd in actuality - it doesn't mean that this season is all about Smart. What you want is to make sure he is getting on the court over 20 mpg and has a role that he grows into and masters.

This really goes into the "tanking" mindset again - if the team isn't a playoff shoe in than that means there is no strategy other than maximg out shot opportunities for the percieved top prospects. But thats not whats going on here.

Smart's time wil come...that time isnt now.


I tend to agree with this view in general with the added caveat that I think Smart hasn't quite gained complete confidence in his ability to drive the lane at the NBA level with his relatively high dribble. Not sure if he's getting picked in practice or what, but there does seem to be a bit of hesitancy to go along with a clear emphasis from the coaching staff on ball and player movement.

My question for you and everyone is when in this whole process will Marcus start to get some touches in the post as a PG?

It's my contention that even more than his dribble drive game, the element most lacking from his game has been his ability to post. Can you imagine many of the PG's in the NBA being able to deal with him down there? And from that area of the floor I really think he could be a dynamic, Mark Jackson-esque distributor long term.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#277 » by London2Boston » Mon Oct 20, 2014 1:22 am

This kid is going to be so easy to cheer for. His defensive awareness and general defensive ability is off the charts for a rookie and he hustles like hell out there. I'm going to enjoy seeing hi improve on the other end hopefully. He has the tools to excel on both ends....patience guys. Not everyone is Lebron James or Tim Duncan coming into the NBA.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#278 » by bbd24 » Mon Oct 20, 2014 5:13 am

sam_I_am wrote:The only shot Smart can take is an uncontested 3. And they will remain uncontested because he is a dreadful shooter. The idea that he isn't driving because he is being coached that way is BS. He just can't do it at NBA level.

Stop making excuses based on theories that make no sense. If you call it like you see it, you must come to conclusion that Marcus Smart has no NBA caliber scoring ability yet. He has a lot of development to do. But like Avery Bradley, he will get playing time because he can play defense at a superior level.


Why are you judging his skills 5 games into the preseason like there a finished product ?

He's 20. Not 30.

Let him develop & then hand out your critique. Get it prepared in 2020 & come back to us.

My guess is your critique changes by then. It won't be the same today as it will be in 2020.
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#279 » by sam_I_am » Mon Oct 20, 2014 7:13 am

I'm sorry but I have to still call BS on these lame excuses. If you can get to the rim and dunk with authority - no coach can stop you. If you are shooting 19% from the field you don't pass on a chance to explode to the basket. Pressey is a terrible shooter and jacks up a lot of 3s too - but he gets to the rim a lot. Smart has played a dozen games in a Celtics uniform and he is strictly a jump shooter at NBA level right now. Unfortunately, the Derrick Rose and Westbrook comparisons before the draft simply have no merit. He just doesn't have that game.

Im not saying he never will - I mean the guy is 20, has a lot of heart and drive and is a heck of a talent. Looking at Avery Bradley as a rookie and seeing what he can do now is proof that guys with great character and talent can develop. Billups is a guy who showed more ability as a rookie but many teams gave up on him before he became a stud. Sometimes players don't develop - ie. Marcus Banks. So I suggest we hold off on plans of trading Rondo so we can hand the franchise over to a 19% jump shooter.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Why Marcus Smart should start at SG 

Post#280 » by KJandHondo35 » Mon Oct 20, 2014 2:00 pm

sam_I_am wrote:I'm sorry but I have to still call BS on these lame excuses. If you can get to the rim and dunk with authority - no coach can stop you. If you are shooting 19% from the field you don't pass on a chance to explode to the basket. Pressey is a terrible shooter and jacks up a lot of 3s too - but he gets to the rim a lot. Smart has played a dozen games in a Celtics uniform and he is strictly a jump shooter at NBA level right now. Unfortunately, the Derrick Rose and Westbrook comparisons before the draft simply have no merit. He just doesn't have that game.

Im not saying he never will - I mean the guy is 20, has a lot of heart and drive and is a heck of a talent. Looking at Avery Bradley as a rookie and seeing what he can do now is proof that guys with great character and talent can develop. Billups is a guy who showed more ability as a rookie but many teams gave up on him before he became a stud. Sometimes players don't develop - ie. Marcus Banks. So I suggest we hold off on plans of trading Rondo so we can hand the franchise over to a 19% jump shooter.


At least give him the credit for upping his efficiency to 23.3% from 3.
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