Nerlens Noel Thread

sixersblue · Post #101 » by **sixersblue** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:50 am

I need to read the date of the OP before I read further. Obviously Noel is one of the pieces and not The One.

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FreesFro · Post #102 » by **FreesFro** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:48 pm

Let's post some positive spin regarding Nerlens.

He leads all rookies in rebounds per game, blocks per game and steals per game. So there's that

Too early to draw any conclusions on Noel. Remember that Joakim Noah hasn't averaged more than 12.6 PPG, has been in the league 7 full seasons and was 22 when he entered the NBA. Noel is 20. Patience please before drawing conclusions.

Negrodamus · Post #103 » by **Negrodamus** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:53 pm

FreesFro wrote:Let's post some positive spin regarding Nerlens.

He leads all rookies in rebounds per game, blocks per game and steals per game. So there's that

Too early to draw any conclusions on Noel. Remember that Joakim Noah hasn't averaged more than 12.6 PPG, has been in the league 7 full seasons and was 22 when he entered the NBA. Noel is 20. Patience please before drawing conclusions.

Great points and all that needs to be said about Nerlens at this point in time. One of the youngest guys on this team.

FreesFro · Post #104 » by **FreesFro** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:05 pm

Negrodamus wrote:
FreesFro wrote:Let's post some positive spin regarding Nerlens.

He leads all rookies in rebounds per game, blocks per game and steals per game. So there's that

Too early to draw any conclusions on Noel. Remember that Joakim Noah hasn't averaged more than 12.6 PPG, has been in the league 7 full seasons and was 22 when he entered the NBA. Noel is 20. Patience please before drawing conclusions.

Great points and all that needs to be said about Nerlens at this point in time. One of the youngest guys on this team.

Yep. I've been saying the same thing in various threads, but I don't understand what people expected from him on the offensive end. Irrational and unrealistic. He was extremely raw at Kentucky, hasn't played a real game in 19 months, is 6'11" and 20 years old, tore his knee up and spent a lot of time rehabbing and not playing basketball, etc. Not many guys that tall, that athletic, that young have even adequate low post moves or can hit a 15 foot jumper with any regularity.

Let's just sit back and watch Nerlens develop over the years, the ups and downs, instead of running on here after every bad play and post about it.

SexDrugsPnR · Post #105 » by **SexDrugsPnR** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:13 pm

FreesFro wrote:Yep. I've been saying the same thing in various threads, but I don't understand what people expected from him on the offensive end. Irrational and unrealistic. He was extremely raw at Kentucky, hasn't played a real game in 19 months, is 6'11" and 20 years old, tore his knee up and spent a lot of time rehabbing and not playing basketball, etc. Not many guys that tall, that athletic, that young have even adequate low post moves or can hit a 15 foot jumper with any regularity.
.

Again, I don't think people were expecting post moves or a solid 15 footer. Most are just disappointed that he cannot catch a ball to save his life and regularly misses open layups and lobs.

Mogul · Post #106 » by **Mogul** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:27 pm

Nerlens is shaping up to be a pretty damn close comparison to Larry Sanders.

- <= 12% Total Rebounding Percentage
- <= 45% True Shooting
- >=5% Block Percentage
- >= 1.3% Steal Percentage

Sanders was 22 in his first season and Nerlens is 20. I'd say he's on track to be a pretty damn good player in this league. He's already much less of a knucklehead than Larry and hopefully he proves to be more durable.

MRxBLACK · Post #107 » by **MRxBLACK** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:35 pm

Noel has been protecting the rim well. His opponent's FG% at the rim is 44%.

The best in the NBA are Hibbert and Howard at 38%.

Some others-
Drummond: 47%
Davis: 57%
PGasol: 42%
MGasol: 46%
Duncan: 46%
Ibaka: 42%
Jordan: 47%
Bogut: 44%
Sanders: 43%

Eyeamok · Post #108 » by **Eyeamok** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:44 pm

He will be right there in the running for rookie of the year. A lot of knee Jerk reactions going on. This team is just going into the 10th game of the season. Give him some time. One think you can't deny is the guy has excellent defensive instincts. He is going to be a monster on the defensive end and erase a lot of mistakes made by other players that just can't or won't play defense.

He is a valuable asset to have. He is the kind of player I want to develop and grow on my team.

76ciology · Post #109 » by **76ciology** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:45 pm

Positive for Nerlens for me is that he's ultra quick and athletic while his basketball IQ is really high. He can defend the perimeter. I think he can defend most 3s. He's got crazy quick hands. His ability to be selective on defense, staying out of foul trouble and reading plays by being a facilitator shows how smart he is. Rarely do high upside guys who have great work ethic and basketball IQ fails.

I also thought that he's got a lot of good looks most of the time when he slips off pick and roll. The problem lies with him catching the ball.

He just needs to learn the art of being physical and effective at the same time. Some guys do it by being emotional like Noah and KG, that gives them strength.

I think right now, his confidence level is really down and that's why he is even struggling with his shot. But once he gets his rhythm back, I expect his shooting percentages to go up.

shawn_hemp · Post #110 » by **shawn_hemp** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:05 pm

I think Jabari will win it by default solely due to him playing more minutes and being relied on for offense by his team.

Unless Noel finishes the season leading rookies in Reb and Blks, with a respectable PPG number (id say anything above 10 would be good enough, double double shibe), I cant see him winning ROY

Giannis Antetokounmpo was all over the stat sheet last year in similiar ways to Noel this year and MCW won it anyway

voters look at scoring rookies more, just a fact of the NBA.

people want offense, Defensive POY is only something actual fans of the game get worked up over

FreesFro · Post #111 » by **FreesFro** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:08 pm

SexDrugsPnR wrote:
FreesFro wrote:Yep. I've been saying the same thing in various threads, but I don't understand what people expected from him on the offensive end. Irrational and unrealistic. He was extremely raw at Kentucky, hasn't played a real game in 19 months, is 6'11" and 20 years old, tore his knee up and spent a lot of time rehabbing and not playing basketball, etc. Not many guys that tall, that athletic, that young have even adequate low post moves or can hit a 15 foot jumper with any regularity.
.

Again, I don't think people were expecting post moves or a solid 15 footer. Most are just disappointed that he cannot catch a ball to save his life and regularly misses open layups and lobs.

Have you been reading the board? I've seen quite a few posts in a round about way saying "what was he working on all last season?", "he still can't shoot", "he has no low post moves", "where's the hook shot", "he has no offensive game", "I don't think he'll ever average double digits in points", "he won't even get to the Noah level of offense", etc.

His hands have not looked good. The first couple games were no issue in my mind. Lately he's missed a few lobs and other passes near the rim. Some of these passes were right there and others would've been tough catches. He's overly scrutinized in this regard. This past week I've seen the best players in the league fumble passes. It happens.

Eyeamok · Post #112 » by **Eyeamok** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:33 pm

FreesFro wrote:
SexDrugsPnR wrote:
FreesFro wrote:Yep. I've been saying the same thing in various threads, but I don't understand what people expected from him on the offensive end. Irrational and unrealistic. He was extremely raw at Kentucky, hasn't played a real game in 19 months, is 6'11" and 20 years old, tore his knee up and spent a lot of time rehabbing and not playing basketball, etc. Not many guys that tall, that athletic, that young have even adequate low post moves or can hit a 15 foot jumper with any regularity.
.

Again, I don't think people were expecting post moves or a solid 15 footer. Most are just disappointed that he cannot catch a ball to save his life and regularly misses open layups and lobs.

Have you been reading the board? I've seen quite a few posts in a round about way saying "what was he working on all last season?", "he still can't shoot", "he has no low post moves", "where's the hook shot", "he has no offensive game", "I don't think he'll ever average double digits in points", "he won't even get to the Noah level of offense", etc.

His hands have not looked good. The first couple games were no issue in my mind. Lately he's missed a few lobs and other passes near the rim. Some of these passes were right there and others would've been tough catches. He's overly scrutinized in this regard. This past week I've seen the best players in the league fumble passes. It happens.

People will ask what has he been working on all last season and he still can't shoot, because they have no idea how hard it is to change. It's easier to teach someone who has never shot a ball how to shoot it correctly than to teach someone that has already learned to shoot the ball and fix their bad shot. Not only are you trying to correct the physical shot but the mental part of the shot too. The mental part that goes back to the familiar and routine when the automatic mind/ basketball instincts takes over during the heat of a game.

FreesFro · Post #113 » by **FreesFro** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 2:36 pm

Here's another thing regarding Nerlens, he's nowhere near in NBA shape. Not even close. He's bent over with his hands on his knees quite a bit and this is after playing a few minutes. I think as he gets more run and gets his stamina up and he's used to the rigors of the NBA he'll improve. This along with the developing of his skills the next few years. Hopefully, BB goes back to starting him soon along with MCW.

Ericb5 · Post #114 » by **Ericb5** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 2:50 pm

FreesFro wrote:Here's another thing regarding Nerlens, he's nowhere near in NBA shape. Not even close. He's bent over with his hands on his knees quite a bit and this is after playing a few minutes. I think as he gets more run and gets his stamina up and he's used to the rigors of the NBA he'll improve. This along with the developing of his skills the next few years. Hopefully, BB goes back to starting him soon along with MCW.

Agreed. I am fine with Noel so far. He just is not ready for the NBA at this moment, and he is going to need to fight through it.

As long as his intangibles stay good this year about effort and competitiveness, I will be happy. I want him to establish himself as a defensive player who can stay on the floor for 30 minutes, and stay healthy.

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Mogul · Post #115 » by **Mogul** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:09 pm

Basketball Reference has a new statline added to their Advanced category called Box Plus/Minus. Of players that have at least 200 minutes played, Noel ranks 16th in the NBA (10th among frountcourt players) in Defensive Plus/Minus or DBPM.

People might be down on him right now, but he's fast-tracked towards developing into an ELITE defensive force. Still just 20 years old.

FreesFro · Post #116 » by **FreesFro** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:22 pm

Mogul wrote:Basketball Reference has a new statline added to their Advanced category called Box Plus/Minus. Of players that have at least 200 minutes played, Noel ranks 16th in the NBA (10th among frountcourt players) in Defensive Plus/Minus or DBPM.

People might be down on him right now, but he's fast-tracked towards developing into an ELITE defensive force. Still just 20 years old.

There were quite a few times last night that he contested shots at the rim that were not converted.

42uptop · Post #117 » by **42uptop** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:22 pm

Noel has been fine so far. His recent struggles are more to do with the quality of Howard, Duncan, and Chandler than anything Noel has done.

Our next 5 games are against some of the weakest defensive big men in the NBA. If Noel doesn't show up against them it will be time to start questioning his game.

MRxBLACK · Post #118 » by **MRxBLACK** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:26 pm

FreesFro wrote:
Mogul wrote:Basketball Reference has a new statline added to their Advanced category called Box Plus/Minus. Of players that have at least 200 minutes played, Noel ranks 16th in the NBA (10th among frountcourt players) in Defensive Plus/Minus or DBPM.

People might be down on him right now, but he's fast-tracked towards developing into an ELITE defensive force. Still just 20 years old.

There were quite a few times last night that he contested shots at the rim that were not converted.

Opponents were 2 for 7 at the rim against him last night. There were other times shots at close range weren't even attempted because of his presence.

Mogul · Post #119 » by **Mogul** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:34 pm

FreesFro wrote:There were quite a few times last night that he contested shots at the rim that were not converted.

Frontcourt players have definitely struggled to finish with Noel on or around them. Also, I haven't seen a backcourt player challenge Noel at the rim since the Harden block. I think that opened up some eyes around the league. In fact, I've seen a few guys resort to using a floater in the paint, instead.

FreesFro · Post #120 » by **FreesFro** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:46 pm

42uptop wrote:Noel has been fine so far. His recent struggles are more to do with the quality of Howard, Duncan, and Chandler than anything Noel has done.

Our next 5 games are against some of the weakest defensive big men in the NBA. If Noel doesn't show up against them it will be time to start questioning his game.

No. It's still way, way too early to start questioning his game even if he struggles the next 5 games. Big men take time to develop, especially guys that missed 19 months with a severe knee injury.

There's a guy some compare Noel to who came into the NBA right out of high school, Tyson Chandler. Go back and look at his 2nd season, 3rd, 4th season. It takes time. Hopefully, not as long as it took Chandler, but don't rush to judgment on Nerlens after 15 games.