'14-'15 Rookie/Sophomore/Junior Thread

[dckingsfan]

Rookies this year - meh so far:

http://www.nba.com/2014/news/11/12/2014 ... index.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... er_by=vorp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[dckingsfan]

Sophomores look a bit better, Porter much improved in the rankings. The four bigs from last year looking very good (Gobert, Dieng, Olynyk and Plumlee).

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... er_by=vorp

[verbal8]

Sophomores look a bit better, Porter much improved in the rankings. The four bigs from last year looking very good (Gobert, Dieng, Olynyk and Plumlee).

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... er_by=vorp

Porter really had only one direction he could go in the rankings. Especially since every indication previous to entering the NBA was that he would be at least a decent NBA player.

That said it is encouraging to see his improvement this season. Some of it is of course a small sample size, but I think there is enough to discount the disaster last season.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... =ws_per_48

Parker and Wiggins get the most coverage among rookies, but early season stats show several international players that might be playing higher levels.

Nikola Mirotic, Bojan Bogdanovic, Kostas Papanikolaou, Damjan Rudez, and Dante Exum are all off to good starts.

Some older (22-25) NCAA matriculated players are also doing very well early on. Tarik Black, James Ennis, Shabazz Napier, PJ Hairston, and Doug McDermott have all stepped into meaningful rotation minutes with pretty good stats overall.

I saw Papanikolaou play for Houston against Minnesota last night. The guy can't finish inside but he can do everything else. He's a tremendous passer and he handles the ball well. He hits threes. He also rebounds well.

I haven't seen Bogdanovic, but he's playing perhaps as well as any rookie.

Zach Levine is arguably the better rookie on the Timberwolves, ahead of Wiggins.

Elfrid Payton and Aaron Gordon look to be good ones.

The only semi-red flag would be Jabari Parker. His shooting is off and although he's averaging the most points a lot of other rookies have better stats.

EDITED TO ADD: Of course, NBA.COM has Parker #1 on its Rookie Ladder http://www.nba.com/2014/news/11/12/2014 ... index.html

[dckingsfan]

My Sophomore rankings... Yep, probably a bit of homerism

Code: Select all

1    Kelly Olynyk
2    Gorgui Dieng
3    Otto Porter
4    Dennis Schröder
5    Rudy Gobert
6    Alex Len
7    Solomon Hill
8    Mason Plumlee
9    Cody Zeller
10   Giannis Antetokounmpo


Pero Antic, Brandon Davies, Hollis Thompson, Shane Larkin and Kentavious Caldwell-Pope come off the list. They just aren't playing very well right now.

Trey Burke comes off the list due to his shooting. Shabazz Muhammad much improved but the D is still too sucky. Ben McLemore D has been really good but the O is still too sucky. Andre Roberson is TO machine at this point. Isaiah Canaan has been playing some solid backup minutes but the TO/A ratio is a problem. Did Tim Hardaway's D magically just disappear or was last year an aberration?

[TGW]

Schroeder looks like a nice young player. Maybe Atlanta considers moving Teague at the deadline?

[keynote]

If Otto can continue to provide solid bench minutes for a top-4 EC team, he'll probably get a little recognition in the form of an invite to the Rookie/Sophomore game during All-Star Weekend.

[Dat2U]

I feel a little better about my 2013 draft rankings that had Noel, Porter & Olynyk in my top 4. As the driver of Olynyk's bandwagon prior to the draft I feel pretty damn good considering I felt stronger about him than most other prospects that year.

As for 2014, Parker looks terrible. If there's any good news, it's that his defense actually looks better than his offense. So if he ever gets on track he actually may be pretty useful. I feel very confident about the comparisons to Glenn "Big Dog" Robinson made months back.

Wiggins still looks like a deluxe role player in time.

I still think Embiid & Exum (in that order) will turn out to be the best players from the draft long term.

[Dat2U]

I'm curious to folks opinions on Elfrid Payton... I'm not seeing it with the kid. Shot is completely broken (arguably worse than Wall's coming into the league) and he's a terrible finisher around the basket because he can't handle any contact.

Despite what looks to be a solid defender at the PG position as rookie (quite unusual for the position) and a desire to be a pure PG, he's a wretched offensive player that's turnover prone and simply incapable of making shots.

I think they screwed the pooch by not going for Exum and getting the best wing/forward they could find later in the 1st.

[dckingsfan]

I'm curious to folks opinions on Elfrid Payton... I'm not seeing it with the kid. Shot is completely broken (arguably worse than Wall's coming into the league) and he's a terrible finisher around the basket because he can't handle any contact.

Despite what looks to be a solid defender at the PG position as rookie (quite unusual for the position) and a desire to be a pure PG, he's a wretched offensive player that's turnover prone and simply incapable of making shots.

I think they screwed the pooch by not going for Exum and getting the best wing/forward they could find later in the 1st.

Agreed, Exum was the better choice - at least that's the way it looks right now. Although I fully expect him to fix his shot, I think the contact will always bother him (famous last words).

[stevemcqueen1]

I'm curious to folks opinions on Elfrid Payton... I'm not seeing it with the kid. Shot is completely broken (arguably worse than Wall's coming into the league) and he's a terrible finisher around the basket because he can't handle any contact.

Despite what looks to be a solid defender at the PG position as rookie (quite unusual for the position) and a desire to be a pure PG, he's a wretched offensive player that's turnover prone and simply incapable of making shots.

I think they screwed the pooch by not going for Exum and getting the best wing/forward they could find later in the 1st.

Agreed that Payton doesn't look like anything special. I think his ceiling is competent caretaker PG. Smart and Exum both are going to be a lot better than him IMO.

But they might have something in Gordon. If he pans out, that's a pretty ideal PF to pair with Vucevic. Orlando is going to be able to play some D.

[dckingsfan]

But they might have something in Gordon. If he pans out, that's a pretty ideal PF to pair with Vucevic. Orlando is going to be able to play some D.

Agreed, he has surprised me at how quickly he adapted to the speed of the NBA game.

[dckingsfan]

http://www.nba.com/2014/news/features/s ... index.html

vs.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-bas ... ely-injury

Jabari Parker
Andrew Wiggins
Bojan Bogdanovic
K.J. McDaniels
Nerlens Noel
Dante Exum
Doug McDermott
Elfrid Payton
Aaron Gordon
Tarik Black

Vs.

Jabari Parker
Aaron Gordon
Bojan Bogdanovic
Dante Exum
Andrew Wiggins
Elfrid Payton
K.J. McDaniels
Nerlens Noel
Doug McDermott
Kostas Papanikolaou

[stevemcqueen1]

It's been a sorry start for this rookie class. Even last season had MCW seizing a starting spot from the outset.

[Nivek]

To the point about this being a sorry start for this rookie class, here's how the guys in the lists dckingsfan posted rated in PPA through Monday's games (where 100 is average, higher is better, and replacement level is 45):

1. Aaron Gordon -- 87
2. Bogdanovich -- 86
3. Parker -- 74
4. McDaniels -- 45
5. Exum -- 44
6. Papanikolaou -- 42
7. Wiggins -- 37
8. Black -- 34
9. Tied: Noel & Payton -- 25
10. McDermott -- 21

Not too good.

[dckingsfan]

Nivek, PPAs for the sophomores?

Kelly Olynyk
Gorgui Dieng
Otto Porter
Dennis Schröder
Rudy Gobert
Alex Len
Solomon Hill
Mason Plumlee
Cody Zeller
Giannis Antetokounmpo

[Nivek]

Nivek, PPAs for the sophomores?

Through Monday games...

Kelly Olynyk -- 162
Gorgui Dieng -- 136
Otto Porter -- 106
Dennis Schröder -- 147
Rudy Gobert -- 114
Alex Len -- 94
Solomon Hill -- 88
Mason Plumlee -- 106
Cody Zeller -- 66
Giannis Antetokounmpo -- 97

[fishercob]

Nivek, PPAs for the sophomores?

Through Monday games...

Kelly Olynyk -- 162
Gorgui Dieng -- 136
Otto Porter -- 106
Dennis Schröder -- 147
Rudy Gobert -- 114
Alex Len -- 94
Solomon Hill -- 88
Mason Plumlee -- 106
Cody Zeller -- 66
Giannis Antetokounmpo -- 97

It's almost like experience is helpful to young players.

[Dat2U]

Nivek, PPAs for the sophomores?

Through Monday games...

Kelly Olynyk -- 162
Gorgui Dieng -- 136
Otto Porter -- 106
Dennis Schröder -- 147
Rudy Gobert -- 114
Alex Len -- 94
Solomon Hill -- 88
Mason Plumlee -- 106
Cody Zeller -- 66
Giannis Antetokounmpo -- 97

I would have say Zeller has to be the most disappointing of the 2nd year guys so far. Specifically offensively. I see he's taking the mid-range more this season but he's only shooting 34% from 16ft & out. Unless he starts making that shot with regularity he's going to be a career backup.

[dckingsfan]

Nivek, PPAs for the sophomores?

Through Monday games...

Kelly Olynyk -- 162
Gorgui Dieng -- 136
Otto Porter -- 106
Dennis Schröder -- 147
Rudy Gobert -- 114
Alex Len -- 94
Solomon Hill -- 88
Mason Plumlee -- 106
Cody Zeller -- 66
Giannis Antetokounmpo -- 97

Hmmm, and I wanted us to trade down for two of Olynyk, Dieng, Gobert or Plumlee... probably wouldn't have been possible - but that would have been pretty nice.