Big 3 needed? Who is the target? Draft, FA or trade?

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

As far as Knight, the contract begins depreciating before the ink is even dry.

You know the moment he's signing that he's not a PG just as you announce in the press conference that we have in place our PG for the next 4-5 years. Makes absolutely no sense to me to waste that valuable cap space when you need to pay a true star to place next to Giannis and Jabari if we are to be a contender. Knight isn't it.

define star using our own rosters as examples. what level of players are we looking for here? have we had a true star by your definition since the big 3? was red a star? bogut? were they true stars or just real good players?

[SkilesTheLimit]

As far as Knight, the contract begins depreciating before the ink is even dry.

You know the moment he's signing that he's not a PG just as you announce in the press conference that we have in place our PG for the next 4-5 years. Makes absolutely no sense to me to waste that valuable cap space when you need to pay a true star to place next to Giannis and Jabari if we are to be a contender. Knight isn't it.

define star using our own rosters as examples. what level of players are we looking for here? have we had a true star by your definition since the big 3? was red a star? bogut? were they true stars or just real good players?

We have not had a star player since the Big 3 (all of whom I would consider stars). Redd was paid like one and Bogut was drafted to be one, but neither had the attributes, longevity, or health to be considered stars.

Knight couldn't carry the jock strap of any of the Big 3.

[AussieBuck]

If we get a third guy as good as current Bogut we are golden.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

As far as Knight, the contract begins depreciating before the ink is even dry.

You know the moment he's signing that he's not a PG just as you announce in the press conference that we have in place our PG for the next 4-5 years. Makes absolutely no sense to me to waste that valuable cap space when you need to pay a true star to place next to Giannis and Jabari if we are to be a contender. Knight isn't it.

define star using our own rosters as examples. what level of players are we looking for here? have we had a true star by your definition since the big 3? was red a star? bogut? were they true stars or just real good players?

We have not had a star player since the Big 3 (all of whom I would consider stars). Redd was paid like one and Bogut was drafted to be one, but neither had the attributes, longevity, or health to be considered stars.

Knight couldn't carry the jock strap of any of the Big 3.

so we haven't had a player in 15 years that was a true star. I just wanted to clarify.

and none of our players can carry the jock of the big 3. parker and giannis suck right now compared to them too.

I don't see what being a star has to do with anything. were a small market. you spend money to retain guys. of course don't overpay. and try to acquire the best new talent you can. and letting a young knight go because right now he cant carry the jock of the former journeyman who grew into a star pg named sam cassell doesn't make a lot of sense to me either. as youve pointed out, over the last 15 years....stars don't grow on trees.

[Licensed to Il]

I think we have two of the top ten (unestablished) assets in the NBA (in Giannis and Jabari) and its just too early to talk about how to get a third star. For one thing, we don't know the ultimate role either of those guys will settle in to. Giannis currently projects as a defensive swiss army knife who attacks the rim as a face up power forward on offense. But with a little more development he could emerge in other ways. Its not insane to say he could be a 20 point, 10 rebound, 6 assist guy defensive player of the year (and I don't think we have seen that since TWolves Garnett). Most here thought Jabari would become a finesse (ball stopping) post scorer but he has already shown surprising passing and vision. I mean, a crafty and willing passing Carmello is Larry Bird territory. All this to say, the front office needs to avoid the very type of thinking and projections referenced in this thread title, and instead just spend another two full seasons acquiring as much young talent as possible (draft, Dleague flyers, international signings, trades for unheralded guys, etc). I don't actually think these guys are going to be Garnett and Bird of course, I'm just saying that we can't have this discussion (best complimentary pieces) until we know what they are and we still don't.

Ginobli's don't exactly come around every few years, but I would love to find that type of guy as our third featured player.. super shifty slasher and passer who is a threat from three point range. I'm fine with 3 and D point guards since most of our offense will involve those forwards.

I am not a huge fan of Frank Kaminski, but as some have said, it would be sweet to have a seven footer that can shoot and pass like he does to rotate in and out with Larry PanHanders.

[hege53190]

No, I don't consider one of the Melo teams contenders. HIghest win total was 54, they were better once he left.

Have you looked at the rosters the Nugs trotted out there? During their only legit run they had Melo (24, again age) he was playing in the WCF next to Billups, JR Smith, Nene, K-Mart and Birdman. Every other Melo team got wiped out in the 1st.

A bunch of early playoff exits and one token conference final before shipping our "star" away in a trade seems like a terrible thing to sign up for. We've been down that path before.

A 10 year stretch where our lowest win total is 43 games and we win 50+ games 5 times, 49 another and a 50 win pace in a strike shortened season another? All the while we have a indisputable top 5 player in the league?

Where the hell do I sign up? Did they draw the unenviable task of playing in the loaded conference? Definitely. But that does not mean we should pu pu what those Nuggets teams did.

Would I rather have a championship contender? Yeah but I would easily take a half decade of 50+ win seasons.

If they play in the East they are probably a 2000 era Pistons type team and does Carmelo leave that? Well yeah he probably does because he is an idiot but hopefully Jabari and Giannis are smarter.

LOL.

Yeah I may have overstated Carmelo. He was a hell of a scorer and one of the better players in the league. Indisputable top 5 was probably off though.

But outside of that, I would still be happy with a decade of winning teams and a five year stretch where we roll off five 50 win seasons.

For Instance that 2001 team that everybody (including myself) is so fond of won 52 games. Give me a 5 year stretch of those type of teams and I would be happy. Don't get me wrong. I want a championship but if I get a decade of winning basketball including a 5 year stretch where we win 50 games a year I will consider it a successful run.

[eagle13]

AT DEADLINE
A. Get assets for Knight & Middleton before have to overpay or loose for nothing.
B. Clear salary.

TRADES
1 knight, middleton, zaza - to HOU for – 1st-NO, DMO, Terry-Ex
2 Ersan - to HOU for – TPE, 2nd
3 Mayo, 2nd – to SAC for – Stauskus, Casspi-Ex, Evans-Ex
4 Dudley & 1st–(the later of Mil or NO) – to DEN for - Hickson

IN OFF-SEASON
Trade Henson, Bayless, TPE, 2ND – to ATL for – Teague
Draft – BPA
Expire – Terry, Casspi, Evans
Resign - Marshall
Sign – Matthews – yes he is older at 28 but SG like him last a long time like Korver plus
have young Stauskus learning behind him – he gives vet leadership and with his Wisco ties
he is one of few FAs that might actually sign here

ROSTER
sanders / DMO
giannis / hickson / JOB
parker / inglis
matthews / stauskus
teague / marshall / wolters
+ BPA 1st

[coolhandluke121]

They do need more talent, and I believe it will be a long and winding process. There's going to be a lot of tinkering involved. It's not just gonna be "trade Knight and Ersan and Mayo for a top-7 pick" and it sure as hell isn't going to be tanking for one unless they trade those guys plus Sanders. And even then, Parker and Giannis will get you some wins. The East is so friggin' bad, and the worst teams in the West will have horrible records by virtue of the fact that they have such a tough schedule.

They should just be in asset management mode, trying to trade guys at peak value while preserving their financial flexibility and making sure they will be able to put a good team around Parker and Giannis when they are in their mid-20's. To me that means trading vets as well as trading any young players if they don't fit in or if their trade value will go down once they sign their next contract. However, unlike a tank year, I don't advocate desperately unloading anyone for whatever you can get. Let someone make it worth your while if they want Ersan or Mayo. The 27th pick in the draft, while it obviously could be a good player, is much less than what they are worth to a contender in need. Little by little, trading guys like Sanders and Ersan and Mayo and Knight for picks in the teens would allow the Bucks to eventually move up in the draft and maybe get a good lead guard. Or they could package two of those guys for a legit prospect. Or if they slowly but surely make good value trades, in several years they might be able to add some real talent the way Houston added Harden and Boston added KG.

[humanrefutation]

Mass Dispatch Thread of The Week

Our Milwaukee Bucks Forum's Big 3 needed? Who is the target? Draft, FA or trade?

viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1358919

This is a great sign.

For many years, our Milwaukee Bucks Forum has been down about the direction of their team especially with some controversial personal moves that were made.

As mentioned in a past edition, they still have a Tobias Harris tracking thread they rant about.

And now, they are talking about having a “Big 3” and who they can pair with young forwards Giannis Antetokounmpo and Jabari Parker.

It is so refreshing to see the forum in a more upbeat tone and I really enjoyed reading through the debate in their thread.

Congratulations to our Milwaukee Bucks Forum for not only winning thread of the week but for feeling good about the positive direction their favorite team is taking.

[BMatt07]

Jiannibari

Just stop..... for the love of god, stop.

[Ron Swanson]

Carmelo Anthony never had a running mate that had the potential of current Giannis. Those Nuggets teams were built almost entirely through free agency and trades, and I'd argue that they were similar to how we tried to build the post-Bogut draft Bucks teams that culminated with the FTD year.

Melo also seems to get a bad rap because he's never had the benefit of playing with another star player (old Iverson and broken-down Amare don't count). The guy has consistently been a top 10 player in the league for the majority of his career.

Start with 20 year old Melo next to another top 15 player and I bet he has more than one conference finals appearance in his career. Because if we're using that as a measuring stick, Chris Paul wasn't/isn't that great since he's never been to a conference finals.

[raferfenix]

You have to think that Kidd's opinion on our team's overall talent level matters at least as much as Hammond and Morway's:

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/bucks/da ... 38311.html

"We didn't play hard tonight," Kidd said. "The one thing we've laid our hat on is coming out and playing hard the first 21 games.

"When you look around the league and you hear people talk about the Bucks, the first thing they say is we play hard. We didn't do that."

"If we don't play hard, it doesn't matter if it's Dallas or Miami or whoever it may be, we don't have a chance to win," Kidd said. "We're not that talented."

[Ron Swanson]

You have to think that Kidd's opinion on our team's overall talent level matters at least as much as Hammond and Morway's:

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/bucks/da ... 38311.html

"We didn't play hard tonight," Kidd said. "The one thing we've laid our hat on is coming out and playing hard the first 21 games.

"When you look around the league and you hear people talk about the Bucks, the first thing they say is we play hard. We didn't do that."

"If we don't play hard, it doesn't matter if it's Dallas or Miami or whoever it may be, we don't have a chance to win," Kidd said. "We're not that talented."

I think the way coaches interpret "talent" is vastly different though. Kidd isn't blind to Giannis and Jabari's potential. But until they gain more experience and start to really play at a high level, he sees it as just that, "potential".

I think there's a difference between talent and raw talent, in that from a coaching perspective, you're not an NBA talent until your skill level meets up with your raw potential. I would think that all coaches use it in varying degrees to motivate and develop players.

Scouts and GMs can look at prospects based on what they could be in the future without worrying about the circumstances and growing pains that factor into that projection. That's their luxury. Whereas Kidd has to focus on weaknesses and correct them as their careers progress, because that's his job.

[ZeppelinPage]

With how our team is playing I don't see much chance of a top 5. But I would like to stockpile a bit of picks, the more players we draft that we think are good the more of a chance we have of picking up someone that could play an important role to this team.

[SpursNBucks]

To get a third piece they will need to be cap smart, load up on picks to round of the roster, and make one big move in free agency - kind of like what GB did when they brought in Reggie White. The owner's need to wine and dine them and Kidd needs to be part of the sales job - then just over-pay a little for being in a small market. With GA, Parker, and Sanders as your long term answer. They need a big time shooter or classic PG. They don't need to over-pay Knight and feel he is the future PG. They need to shave salaries of some of the short term vets that were signed in Kohl's last year.

I would say they are on about a two to three year plan.

[DutchManDanFan]

To get a third piece they will need to be cap smart, load up on picks to round of the roster, and make one big move in free agency - kind of like what GB did when they brought in Reggie White. The owner's need to wine and dine them and Kidd needs to be part of the sales job - then just over-pay a little for being in a small market. With GA, Parker, and Sanders as your long term answer. They need a big time shooter or classic PG. They don't need to over-pay Knight and feel he is the future PG. They need to shave salaries of some of the short term vets that were signed in Kohl's last year.

I would say they are on about a two to three year plan.

I agree with this. I think it would be fun if Rondo is the PG for a year or two. Over-paying is needed but I think G&J will benefit from it a lot, so worth the money. In any case I think the Bucks should get a PG who dished 2 or 3 ally oops to Giannis every game. That shouldn´t be too difficult. Too bad Knight is not able to do that, it seems...

[LeonJordanJr24]

Mudiay

[RRyder823]

To get a third piece they will need to be cap smart, load up on picks to round of the roster, and make one big move in free agency - kind of like what GB did when they brought in Reggie White. The owner's need to wine and dine them and Kidd needs to be part of the sales job - then just over-pay a little for being in a small market. With GA, Parker, and Sanders as your long term answer. They need a big time shooter or classic PG. They don't need to over-pay Knight and feel he is the future PG. They need to shave salaries of some of the short term vets that were signed in Kohl's last year.

I would say they are on about a two to three year plan.

I agree. That said a Reggie White type signing equivalent for the Bucks would be us signing either Durant, Lebron or Westbrook. Im even being generous by Including Westbrook. It more like us getting either Durant or Lebron. Whites arguably the best defensive lineman ever. The Bucks getting the equivalent to that via FA prolly isnt happening. But a signing or trade being the equivalent to when we traded for Cassel is a real possibility. Target a second or third teir guy with upside and we're gtg

[randy84]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2289 ... ing/page/4

[Rockmaninoff]

If Giannis and Jabari meet expectations, all that's really needed at smallest player is Derek Fisher.

I'd rather be unstoppable with everyone a passer/playmaker, rather then just one guy.

I think the Bucks need a biggest player with great hands, some ball skills, and rebounding ability. Maybe target Drummond since Detroit is such a mess.

They also need a lights-out shooter. I don't know who that is.