Rudy Gobert: Future DPOY

JMac1 · Post #161 » by **JMac1** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 6:57 pm

HawaiianJazzFan wrote: You couldn't find anyone in the Jazz organization that would consider trading Gobert for Len.

And you wouldn't find any one in the Suns organization who would even consider trading for Rudy Gobert?!

Len is working toward being a two-way center my friend.

Jazz turn down Len for Gobert....Darn, we tried. :lol:

HawaiianJazzFan · Post #162 » by **HawaiianJazzFan** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 7:39 pm

JMac1 wrote:
HawaiianJazzFan wrote: You couldn't find anyone in the Jazz organization that would consider trading Gobert for Len.

And you wouldn't find any one in the Suns organization who would even consider trading for Rudy Gobert?!

Len is working toward being a two-way center my friend.

Jazz turn down Len for Gobert....Darn, we tried.

Well Gobert is already elite defensively by every measure (I realize you don't like stats) but look at some film if you want... he has blocked 25 shots in his last 5 games, and players are shooting below 39% at the rim when he is defending it. I'm sorry to say that Len isn't having that impact offensively or defensively (he's actually a below average defender, by most measures), so he has a lot of work to go on both sides.

rockersdash · Post #163 » by **rockersdash** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 7:58 pm

JMac1 wrote:
HawaiianJazzFan wrote: You couldn't find anyone in the Jazz organization that would consider trading Gobert for Len.

And you wouldn't find any one in the Suns organization who would even consider trading for Rudy Gobert?!

Len is working toward being a two-way center my friend.

Jazz turn down Len for Gobert....Darn, we tried.

I'm sorry, but any sane person would take Gobert over Len anyday everyday.

Len too has a great future but Gobert is miles ahead.

Wonderllama · Post #164 » by **Wonderllama** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 8:12 pm

His ceiling is Dikembe Mutombo apparently

LBJKBD12 · Post #165 » by **LBJKBD12** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 8:28 pm

Give me Gobert over Len anyday. Len is better offensively but one can and probably will be elite at his end while one will be so so at both ends.

Amish Mafioso · Post #166 » by **Amish Mafioso** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 8:53 pm

JMac1 wrote:
HawaiianJazzFan wrote: You couldn't find anyone in the Jazz organization that would consider trading Gobert for Len.

And you wouldn't find any one in the Suns organization who would even consider trading for Rudy Gobert?!

Len is working toward being a two-way center my friend.

Jazz turn down Len for Gobert....Darn, we tried.

I don't blame you for pimpin' your boy, so I will just say wait and see for yourself. Gobert isn't working toward being anything, he is already a phenomenon. Until you experience him firsthand, you can't understand the force that is Rudy.

stitches · Post #167 » by **stitches** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 9:50 pm

GreatWhiteStiff wrote:
orlandomanic wrote:
Damon_3388 wrote:
He's shooting .692 from the line this year. Not mindblowing, but hardly "horrible".

What I like about him for a young big, especially one that contests shots often, is that his foul rate is pretty low, and his block-to-foul ratio is pretty high. Shows that he can play hard and smart. Can be a bit fumbly and turn the ball over a little too much on offense though, considering his role.

I see him turning out like Tyson Chandler, or at least being molded into that type of player. Pretty good value for an foreign big coming late in the first round. Seems to be a lot further along and much more of a sure thing than someone of similar age and size like Lucas Nogueira, who was taken eleven spots higher in the same draft.

When has Gobert ever shot .692 from the line??? he is shooting .650 from the line. like i said, he is a good prospect and i can see him at 12/9 role player, but he won't be able to play in the fourth and finish games unless its a blow out. he needs to do better than JaVale McGee and Mark Eaton and improve on his free throw shooting

Sorry but wut? How are guys shooting 65% from the line not allowed to play during 4th quarters. That's good efficient basketball.

Lol, absolutely! If I was a coach and had the choice - run my offense or send a 65% shooter to the line in every single possession in any quarter(not only the 4th), I'd pick the 65% FT shooter every single time... oh... and by doing that I will have the most efficient offense in the league. I will have 130 offensive efficiency. The best offense in the league right now, the Warriors, has 112 offensive efficiency.

JMac1 · Post #168 » by **JMac1** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:13 pm

These responses are too funny!!

thamadkant · Post #169 » by **thamadkant** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:21 pm

HawaiianJazzFan wrote:
JMac1 wrote:What are you talking about? Going on and on about Len? I just read a thread on Gobert and Len's name came into the conversation. From some of the comments, I see people don't know what they are talking about so I provided some insight on Len. You don't have to get butt hurt because film don't lie and it displays that Len has an offensive ceiling that dwarfs Rudy's so you say look at the stats.....lol

Look at the film. Don't hate because some other center is better than yours!!

I love all the objective support and proof you show to back your statements, although honestly, that is what I'd do if there was no objective evidence whatsoever out there, that Len was outplaying Rudy. You couldn't find anyone in the Jazz organization that would consider trading Gobert for Len.

Len was brought up by a Sun's fan

Film, stats, highlights, everything you could think of suggests that Gobert's Defensive ceiling dwarf's Lens.

BTW, check out how well Len is defending the rim...

http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/defense/?sort=FGP_DEFEND_RIM&dir=-1&CF=MIN*G*15%7CBLK*G*1

Suns as a team has been greatly impacted by Len, they are 11-3 with him starting and their defense in the paint is amongst the NBA's best.
So team impact wise Len is pretty good already.
As an individual, Len since starting is averaging 2.6 blocks per game, which is 3rd in the NBA. S

Now since this is a Gobert thread, I made the Len comparison because these 2 as I mentioned are 2 of the better shot blocking centers I've seen since the 2000s. Ibaka and Davis are PFs.

With that said, Gobert's wingspan and standing reach is amongst the highest of all time, whilst Len is a tier down in that regards, still elite in today's game. But Gobert is literally a freak of nature.

So YES, Gobert's defensive (shot blocking) potential is higher than Len's, but defense is not just about blocks per game, its about covering the paint and altering plays/shots as well as getting defensive rebounds.

Let's just say this, Jazz is extremely happy with Gobert, they wouldnt consider trading him unless for a superstar. The Suns feel EXACTLY the same way with Len.

These 2 as mentioned earlier should be amongst the blocks per game leaders in the next decade assuming they both stay healthy.

ninjamilk23 · Post #170 » by **ninjamilk23** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:29 pm

No offense to Gobert and Len but Jusuf Nurkic will be better than both. His trash talking skills is already in GOAT level.

Post #171 » by **NO-KG-AI** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:29 pm

veji1 wrote:
StocktonShorts wrote:
TKainZero wrote:Like who?
Give a few examples or players picked that have what he has

This history of the NBA draft is littered with scores of project big men with "upside" and "wingspan" who never pan out.

Hasheem Thabeet
Hassan Whiteside
Mouhamed Saer Sene
Lucas Nogueira (jury still out on him)

I would add fellow frenchmen Ajinca and Frederick Weiss (who never even made it to the NBA)

But Gobert is already better than those guys have ever been, and he's a legitimate player already, even aside from his upside.

But these threads are always annoying, where fans of young player way overshoot on future projections, or way underplay how well a guy is playing already.

thamadkant · Post #172 » by **thamadkant** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:35 pm

ninjamilk23 wrote:No offense to Gobert and Len but Jusuf Nurkic will be better than both. His trash talking skills is already in GOAT level.

I've seen a couple of Nuggets games where Nurkic has played well... the guy is a stud.
But he wont be the shot blocker/rim protector that Len and Gobert CAN be.

I see Nurkic as a brute Center that is a decent rim protector though.

He is getting good burn in Nuggets especially playing next to a pass first PG in Lawson.
I think offensively Len and Nurkic are higher potential than Gobert so thats that.

But these 3 are going to be very good starting centers for the next decade barring injuries.

rockersdash · Post #173 » by **rockersdash** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:37 pm

JMac1 wrote:These responses are too funny!!

Do you mean yours?

I get standing up for your guy but be realistic. Jumping the gun or not.

JMac1 · Post #174 » by **JMac1** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:40 pm

I think what you see with Rudy is what you get. So yes, he has reached his peaked already, a long shot blocker and good re-bounder. So his ceiling is a poor man's Mutombo.

JMac1 · Post #175 » by **JMac1** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:42 pm

rockersdash wrote:
JMac1 wrote:These responses are too funny!!

Do you mean yours?

I get standing up for your guy but be realistic. Jumping the gun or not.

Rudy is a phenom? You are insane if you took Len over him? Those comments aren't funny :roll:

Oops. Gobert is miles ahead of Len :-?

goober · Post #176 » by **goober** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:49 pm

I think I remember Gobert for Marquis Teague trade rumors last year..... Glad that didn't happen

goober · Post #177 » by **goober** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:51 pm

JMac1 wrote:I think what you see with Rudy is what you get. So yes, he has reached his peaked already, a long shot blocker and good re-bounder. So his ceiling is a poor man's Mutombo.

So far in the month of January he's averaged 10PPG/8.6RPG/5BPG so if that's what I'm getting for the rest of his career, I'll take it

Nikos Beard · Post #178 » by **Nikos Beard** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:56 pm

JMac1 wrote:I think what you see with Rudy is what you get. So yes, he has reached his peaked already, a long shot blocker and good re-bounder. So his ceiling is a poor man's Mutombo.

What makes you think this? He's only 22, I find it incredibly unlikely he makes zero progress on either end.

JMac1 · Post #179 » by **JMac1** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 11:03 pm

Bish wrote:
JMac1 wrote:I think what you see with Rudy is what you get. So yes, he has reached his peaked already, a long shot blocker and good re-bounder. So his ceiling is a poor man's Mutombo.

So far in the month of January he's averaged 10PPG/8.6RPG/5BPG so if that's what I'm getting for the rest of his career, I'll take it

And you should. I never said anything disparaging towards Rudy. You like your guy and I like my guy. I think they are two different type of players. Like one guy said here, Len has more offense and Rudy has better shot blocking, they appear to be about equal on rebounding. I don't have any idea how Rudy is on switches.

Len defense is really picking it up, especially his block shots. He had a 6 block game in like 15 mins of play a week ago. He just started playing (starting) and you cannot compare the two, Len's team is trying to make the playoffs, so Len development isn't a priority.

I had come in peace, I even ended my first post by complimenting the entire 2013 draft. Hopefully the NBA talking heads will be debating this in the future.

But the Len dunk was crazy and no one here admitted that yet?!

utjazzfan4life · Post #180 » by **utjazzfan4life** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 11:03 pm

PER 36 stats

Gobert: 11.0 PPG, 11.9 RPG, 3.8 BPG, 8.3 Block %, 1.1 SPG, 1.4 APG, 66.7 FT%, 63.8 FG%, 66.2 TS% 21.34 PER, Value Added 120.8, Estimated Wins Added 4.0.

Len: 10.8 PPG, 10.2 RPG, 2.8 BPG, 6.0 Block %, 0.9 SPG, 1.0 APG, 71.7 FT%, 55.2 FG%, 58.5 TS%, 14.98 PER, Value Added 50.2, Estimated Wins Added 1.7.

Gobert Wingspan: 7 foot 8.5
Len Wingspan: 7 foot 4