Los Angeles Clippers (25-13) @ Portland Trail Blazers (30-8)

[TucsonClip]

I'm just glad I'm not the only Clipper fan in the 520.

I actually live in San Diego now... So you might still be

[Neddy]

F*ck Bill Simmons

AMEN!

[Sulingman]

F*ck Bill Simmons

[QRich3]

I +1'ed your post because I agree with pretty much everything else in it, but I definitely disagree with the portion I quoted above and wonder where you're getting the impression bolded and highlighted in red that we're a top rebounding team in any form or fashion.

According to NBA.com, the Clippers are currently ranked 15th in team defensive rebounds (middle of the road), tied for second-to-last in team offensive team rebounds (bottom of the barrel), and tied for 26th in overall team rebounds (also bottom level).

Adjust for pace. Just like we're not at the top in points scored per game but we still have the 3rd best offensive rating, we just score less on raw numbers because we play slower than a lot of teams. We too get less defensive rebounds because we play less possessions, but our defensive rebounding rate of 77% of rebounding chances is the 5th best mark in the league, right behind the Hornets, Pacers, Wizards and Spurs.

When it comes to overall rebounds, we are down because we are punting offensive rebounding like no other team has ever done. We have the worst offensive rebounding % in NBA history by a fair margin. That's by design, and that's something that only affects our offense. And since we can still be a top 3 team on offense (and closing in with the best two) without crashing the glass, I'm completely cool with us punting ORB. I'd rather they get back on defense all the time and abandon the possibility of getting the rebound even if it's there for us, since we need to add defense anywhere we can, but our offense is so good we can tilt things the other way and still be competitive.

EDIT- Wait, we used to have the worst ORB% in NBA history, I hadn't checked it in a while and it seems we went up from 17% to 21%? I've no idea how this happened but I guess I'l take it

I actually wrote an article about this a few weeks ago, explaining why, despite our high defensive rebound %, we still arent a good rebounding team (which we arent). Essentially, our rebounding problems stem from our defensive problems and foul rate.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2304739-5-statistics-that-are-defining-los-angeles-clippers-season-so-far/page/5

Excerpts:

Matt Barnes, for example, is only pulling down 3.0 rebounds per game, which would be his worst mark in nine years. Additionally, J.J. Redick is on pace to record his lowest rebound total in eight seasons. Basically, the entire team is to blame, not just Griffin.

The problem is partially due to slow defensive rotations and a lack of rebounds to grab. The Clippers are 29th in rebound chances available, via NBA.com. This is alarming, because according to Basketball-Reference.com, the team is fourth in defensive rebound percentage.

Part of the reason there are so few rebounds available is because teams break down the Clippers defense and score easily at the rim. Based upon NBA.com, opponents shoot 53.5 percent around the rim against the Clippers, the 19th-worst mark in the league.

Committing bad fouls has been a common theme for the Clippers this season. Late defensive rotations are to blame, but so are wild shot-block attempts and an overall lack of defensive awareness.

As a result, the Clippers allow 25.6 free-throw attempts per game, which ranks 25th in the league, according to ESPN.com. The team is giving away free points because it is not in a position to defend adequately.

Opponents are shooting so many free throws against the Clippers that the team’s rebounding totals are being affected. Good defense leads to a rebound, which ends a possession and allows the offense to leak into transition.

If the Clippers can limit their fouls while improving their rebounding and defense, they have a shot to win the conference this season. However, if these blemishes remain all season, it will likely result in another early exit this spring.

I liked the article in general, but isn't what you're saying that we're bad at defense and that makes us have less rebounding chances? yet, in the few rebounding chances that we have, we do well in them? That doesn't make us a bad rebounding team, it makes us have less rebounds in raw numbers, but what causes that is not being able to defend properly.

[TucsonClip]

I liked the article in general, but isn't what you're saying that we're bad at defense and that makes us have less rebounding chances? yet, in the few rebounding chances that we have, we do well in them? That doesn't make us a bad rebounding team, it makes us have less rebounds in raw numbers, but what causes that is not being able to defend properly.

Basically what I am saying is cause and effect. Fix the defense/fouls and more rebounding chances, so yes. However, it doesnt change the fact that overall, we arent a good rebounding team.

We can point to Dreb% as a reason why we are a better rebounding team than we have shown, but thats all it is. We need to create more opportunities and capitalize on them in order to be considered a good rebounding team.

We have had problems on the glass the last three years in the playoffs, mainly due to my points in the article. Therefore, I dont see this as a fluke (not putting words in your mouth) or something that is going to change anytime soon.

[TucsonClip]

I calculated our Dreb% for the last three years in the playoffs. We are at 77% this season:

2013-14

• vs. Oklahoma City (72%, -12 differential)
• vs. Golden State (69.2%, -43 differential)

2012-13

• vs. Memphis (78.2%, -4 differential)

2012-13

• vs. San Antonio (78.2%, -17 differential)
• vs. Golden State (67.4%, -40 differential)

[QRich3]

I liked the article in general, but isn't what you're saying that we're bad at defense and that makes us have less rebounding chances? yet, in the few rebounding chances that we have, we do well in them? That doesn't make us a bad rebounding team, it makes us have less rebounds in raw numbers, but what causes that is not being able to defend properly.

Basically what I am saying is cause and effect. Fix the defense/fouls and more rebounding chances, so yes. However, it doesnt change the fact that overall, we arent a good rebounding team.

We can point to Dreb% as a reason why we are a better rebounding team than we have shown, but thats all it is. We need to create more opportunities and capitalize on them in order to be considered a good rebounding team.

We have had problems on the glass the last three years in the playoffs, mainly due to my points in the article. Therefore, I dont see this as a fluke (not putting words in your mouth) or something that is going to change anytime soon.

Yeah I agree with most of the points in the article, I guess what I have an issue with is calling that "not being a good rebounding team", since it's a problem related to volume, not rebounding itself. People say we are bad at it, and the suggestion to fix it is Blake hustling more or the perimeter players crashing the boards harder, but that's not the problem really, they are doing fine at that right now. Obviously if they defend better and create more misses, the rebounding volume numbers will look better, but what they fixed was not the specific skill of rebounding, but the ones related to stopping the other team.

I calculated our Dreb% for the last three years in the playoffs. We are at 77% this season:

2013-14

• vs. Oklahoma City (72%, -12 differential)
• vs. Golden State (69.2%, -43 differential)

2012-13

• vs. Memphis (78.2%, -4 differential)

2012-13

• vs. San Antonio (78.2%, -17 differential)
• vs. Golden State (67.4%, -40 differential)

You included offensive rebounds in the differential and that skews it a little, since again that doesn't hurt anything but the offense and we were generally fine in that department. For instance, we had the exact same number of defensive rebounds as the Warriors in last year's first round, and we had 5 more DRB than Memphis in 2013.

In any case, I'm not a fan of using 2012 and 2013 numbers against this team, since we did have a rebounding problem then much bigger than we have now. Deandre played about 20 minutes a game back then and Odom/Kenyon Martin were our crunch time 5s. Plus, it's a small sample size where we played against some of the better rebounding teams in the league, where things like Blake missing a few games can put a lot of noise in the numbers.

Not saying we can't/shouldn't improve, but it's not an area where I'd fixate.

[TucsonClip]

My point in the playoff statistics was just to show that despite our solid defensive rebounding rates, when you factor in offensive rebounding we just arent that good of a rebounding team (total wise). When it matters (playoffs), defensive rebound percentage doesnt mean a whole lot. If you are getting beat by double digits in total rebound differential, that likely results in a close series and/or a loss.

While we did grab the same amount of defensive rebounds against the Warriors, we also were in a dog fight that entire series because we couldnt get a stop and secure the defensive glass.

Basically (in the article), I applied cause and effect and conjoined that with our overall rebounding history since making the playoffs. I dont think anyone would consider us better than a slightly above average rebounding team, in general, despite our dreb%. As I said, and probably should have mentioned in the article (which you pointed out originally), this is a trend that hasnt changed with the core of the team intact. I dont think it changes anytime this year, because we would have to defend better and foul less to see what the results would be with more rebounds available.

[QRich3]

My point in the playoff statistics was just to show that despite our solid defensive rebounding rates, when you factor in offensive rebounding we just arent that good of a rebounding team (total wise). When it matters (playoffs), defensive rebound percentage doesnt mean a whole lot. If you are getting beat by double digits in total rebound differential, that likely results in a close series and/or a loss.

While we did grab the same amount of defensive rebounds against the Warriors, we also were in a dog fight that entire series because we couldnt get a stop and secure the defensive glass.

I do not agree with that, if we do well on the defensive glass, the number of offensive rebounds we get is not that important, as long as we can score at a great rate anyway. Just as you said before that we don't generate DRB chances because we can't buy a stop, we also don't generate many ORB chances because we make shots at a better rate than mostly anyone else. Add to it that we barely even try to crash the offensive glass because we need to find defense anywhere and get back quick, and it's no wonder we don't do well on ORB numbers, and total rebounds by extension. You seem to keep equating getting a lot of rebounds with being a good rebounding team and I think it's more nuanced than that.

But we agree on one thing, we lose mainly because we can't stop teams from outscoring us, even if we disregard ORB to be better at it, and fixing that would be the end of any rebounding problems.

[TucsonClip]

I mean I agree overall, I guess I am just worried that this isnt going to translate, as our Dreb% hasnt been good the last two seasons. Hawes has helped, but im still skeptical this hold up, especially in the playoffs.

In reality the best way, like we both agree, is to shore up the defense so we dont have to worry about the rebounding as much. Im not sure that happens though, so ill continue to worry about our rebounding