Big Al's Paint: The Al Jefferson Thread

[MasterIchiro]

Biz' play and the teams play without Al must be at least forcing discussion amongst Cho, MJ and Clifford regarding the best plan moving forward. Part of that plan should be an openness to listen to offers on Big Al, namely from the 7 or so West teams scrambling for the final 2 playoff spots.

Maybe I'm wrong, but if I can recall you were one of the posters calling Biyombo a bust (or should be traded) about a few weeks ago before Jefferson got injured

Compared to Jefferson he's amazing. He's a starter nowhere. So yeah, bust. I want him starting this year but I want to sign Greg Monroe.

[TheKingofSting]

Isn't Monroe kind of like Al on defense?

[mrknowitall215]

Isn't Monroe kind of like Al on defense?

Worst

[BeesWax]

Isn't Monroe kind of like Al on defense?

Worst

Worse. And no. To easy to debunk to waste the time.

[mrknowitall215]

Biz' play and the teams play without Al must be at least forcing discussion amongst Cho, MJ and Clifford regarding the best plan moving forward. Part of that plan should be an openness to listen to offers on Big Al, namely from the 7 or so West teams scrambling for the final 2 playoff spots.

Maybe I'm wrong, but if I can recall you were one of the posters calling Biyombo a bust (or should be traded) about a few weeks ago before Jefferson got injured

Compared to Jefferson he's amazing. He's a starter nowhere. So yeah, bust. I want him starting this year but I want to sign Greg Monroe.

Oh, this guy...

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/542000734028713984[/tweet]

[Braggins]

Maybe I'm wrong, but if I can recall you were one of the posters calling Biyombo a bust (or should be traded) about a few weeks ago before Jefferson got injured

Compared to Jefferson he's amazing. He's a starter nowhere. So yeah, bust. I want him starting this year but I want to sign Greg Monroe.

Oh, this guy...

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/542000734028713984[/tweet]

How does that show Monroe is worse? That is literally the exact kind of stuff Al does and Monroe's casual jog in this clip is about the same as Al's top speed. Al would never even step out that far away from the basket on a defensive play. He would have been standing under the basket not paying attention. Monroe moved more in that 12 seconds than Al does on an entire possession.

[mrknowitall215]

Compared to Jefferson he's amazing. He's a starter nowhere. So yeah, bust. I want him starting this year but I want to sign Greg Monroe.

Oh, this guy...

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/542000734028713984[/tweet]

How does that show Monroe is worse? That is literally the exact kind of stuff Al does and Monroe's casual jog in this clip is about the same as Al's top speed. Al would never even step out that far away from the basket on a defensive play. He would have been standing under the basket not paying attention. Monroe moved more in that 12 seconds than Al does on an entire possession.

Am I going to have to debate on who's a lesser defender/rim protector between Jefferson & Monroe?

[Braggins]

Al sucks. It is going to take some fans a while to come around on it due to us being such a dominant team last year (lol) but it is plain as day. He is selfish, doesn't pass, doesn't try on defense, doesn't work enough to stay in condition, and basically only cares about padding his stats. What we are seeing this year is just what Al really is. Last year was an outlier. He has sabotaged every defense he has ever been a part with the exception of ours last season. He isn't even a good offensive player. He clearly makes our offense worse. He has no court vision, passing ability, or willingness to pass. He can't read doubles teams or team defenses despite being double teamed constantly his entire career as a focal point. He still can't set a proper screen. When he doesn't have the ball he just camps out in the post trying to get position so he can call for the ball which kills any attempts to penetrate the lane. All he knows how to do is score in post isolations and to get use out of that skill we have to use a terrible offensive strategy that limits basically everyone on our team. He is clearly declining as well. Biyombo is a more effective basketball player and should be our starting center.

[Eoghan]

I don't understand the all-out hatred for Jefferson's game by some when he's notably one of the best scoring bigs in the entire NBA just because he has a glaring flaw. Virtually every player in the NBA has a flaw that coaches have to devise a strategy to cover

You have it backwards, he does one thing well and sucks at everything else. All things considered he is a terrible center. Unathletic, poor effort, tunnel vision, sucks at setting screens, can't scrap for contested boards, doesn't draw fouls, slows ball movement, poor passer out of double teams, limited range, can't protect the rim or guard the pick & roll at all and the one thing he is good at (post scoring) he's painfully mediocre at and kinda poor for a center.

He **** blows donkey dick, I'm sorry. I don't care how good a volume shooter he is. And he is getting older and is curiously injury prone for somebody whose feet rarely leave the floor.

[Braggins]

Oh, this guy...

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/542000734028713984[/tweet]

How does that show Monroe is worse? That is literally the exact kind of stuff Al does and Monroe's casual jog in this clip is about the same as Al's top speed. Al would never even step out that far away from the basket on a defensive play. He would have been standing under the basket not paying attention. Monroe moved more in that 12 seconds than Al does on an entire possession.

Am I going to have to debate on who's a lesser defender/rim protector between Jefferson & Monroe?

I don't really care about Monroe. Al is downright pathetic regardless of how bad Monroe is. Just out of curiosity, is your pro-Al argument in any way predicated on our team defense last year?

[Joest2003]

Al sucks. It is going to take some fans a while to come around on it due to us being such a dominant team last year (lol) but it is plain as day. He is selfish, doesn't pass, doesn't try on defense, doesn't work enough to stay in condition, and basically only cares about padding his stats. What we are seeing this year is just what Al really is. Last year was an outlier. He has sabotaged every defense he has ever been a part with the exception of ours last season. He isn't even a good offensive player. He clearly makes our offense worse. He has no court vision, passing ability, or willingness to pass. He can't read doubles teams or team defenses despite being double teamed constantly his entire career as a focal point. He still can't set a proper screen. When he doesn't have the ball he just camps out in the post trying to get position so he can call for the ball which kills any attempts to penetrate the lane. All he knows how to do is score in post isolations and to get use out of that skill we have to use a terrible offensive strategy that limits basically everyone on our team. He is clearly declining as well. Biyombo is a more effective basketball player and should be our starting center.

There is definitely a lot truth in there im just glad I wasn't the one that said it because I love AL but its really hard to disagree with anything you wrote there.

[Braggins]

I don't understand the all-out hatred for Jefferson's game by some when he's notably one of the best scoring bigs in the entire NBA just because he has a glaring flaw. Virtually every player in the NBA has a flaw that coaches have to devise a strategy to cover

You have it backwards, he does one thing well and sucks at everything else. All things considered he is a terrible center. Unathletic, poor effort, tunnel vision, sucks at setting screens, can't scrap for contested boards, doesn't draw fouls, slows ball movement, poor passer out of double teams, limited range, can't protect the rim or guard the pick & roll at all and the one thing he is good at (post scoring) he's painfully mediocre at and kinda poor for a center.

He **** blows donkey dick, I'm sorry. I don't care how good a volume shooter he is. And he is getting older and is curiously injury prone for somebody whose feet rarely leave the floor.

People who saw him play prior to coming here know this. Utah couldn't trade him and was forced to let him walk for nothing. We were the only team pursuing signing him. His entire reputation as a supposedly good player is based on us making the playoffs last year lol.

[mrknowitall215]

With Jefferson being as horrible as I'm being told, instead of being a 43-39 last season, had we not had Jefferson we would've won more, possibly over 50 games, and would've taken the Heat to 7 games instead of getting swept as we did with Jefferson on a gimpy foot. Am I correct? Don't answer that as it's blatant sarcasm since he allegedly demoralize the play of our entire team so bad that he shouldn't even be in the NBA

[MasterIchiro]

The Mavericks of all teams, were interested in both Al and Lance as free agents. We signed Al before they could and they swiped Parsons before Lance could sign. For such a smart organization, they dodged 2 bullets. If they ended up with those players, both would be on the market turned into something better.

[Braggins]

With Jefferson being as horrible as I'm being told, instead of being a 43-39 last season, had we not had Jefferson we would've won more, possibly over 50 games, and would've taken the Heat to 7 games instead of getting swept as we did with Jefferson on a gimpy foot. Am I correct? Don't answer that as it's blatant sarcasm since he allegedly demoralize the play of our entire team so bad that he shouldn't even be in the NBA

Last year was by far Al's best season as a pro and the only season his team's defense wasn't completely ruined by his presence. All that got us to obvious mediocrity in a historically bad year for the Eastern Conference. MKG, Biz, and Cody weren't ready to step up last year. They seem to be there or at least close now. All Al does is slow us down at this point.

[mrknowitall215]

I don't really care about Monroe. Al is downright pathetic regardless of how bad Monroe is. Just out of curiosity, is your pro-Al argument in any way predicated on our team defense last year?

My sentiment for Jefferson is that he's a important cog on a team like ours that's void of talent, and that we could win with him if he's held accountable and strategically used the right way, and trading him for nothing won't make us any better. His contract expire in 2016, and he has the option to opt out after this season. I wouldn't be interested in re-signing him if he opt out, but for now I'm willing to let him live --- as in be a part of our team without it effecting me much outside of the way he's used

[MasterIchiro]

1st choice - trade Al
2nd choice - cut Al's minutes and put him on the 2nd unit

The last thing I want is Al starting the rest of the year but that's what I'm going to get.

[Braggins]

I don't really care about Monroe. Al is downright pathetic regardless of how bad Monroe is. Just out of curiosity, is your pro-Al argument in any way predicated on our team defense last year?

My sentiment for Jefferson is that he's a important cog on a team like ours that's void of talent, and that we could win with him if he's held accountable and strategically used the right way, and trading him for nothing won't make us any better. His contract expire in 2016, and he has the option to opt out after this season. I wouldn't be interested in re-signing him if he opt out, but for now I'm willing to let him live --- as in be a part of our team without it effecting me much outside of the way he's used

His on-court/off-court statistics before his injury as well as our offensive and defensive rating since Al's injury show that we are clearly substantially better without him. The eye test says the same thing in my opinion. I think he could be a deadly weapon as a backup center but I don't think there is any chance Al would accept that role and I really don't see Clifford asking him to take on that role since Clifford is probably his biggest fan in the entire world. As long as he is here he is going to be our starter playing 30-35 minutes per game doing nothing but camping out in the post calling for the ball. It is just who he is. I wish that weren't that case and hope that somehow it changes but I just don't see it.

[MasterIchiro]

It's like being a terminally ill smoker with lung cancer, still chain smoking every day. It's not what you want. You wish things were different. But you can't help it and you continue to accelerate your demise.

[mrknowitall215]

I don't really care about Monroe. Al is downright pathetic regardless of how bad Monroe is. Just out of curiosity, is your pro-Al argument in any way predicated on our team defense last year?

My sentiment for Jefferson is that he's a important cog on a team like ours that's void of talent, and that we could win with him if he's held accountable and strategically used the right way, and trading him for nothing won't make us any better. His contract expire in 2016, and he has the option to opt out after this season. I wouldn't be interested in re-signing him if he opt out, but for now I'm willing to let him live --- as in be a part of our team without it effecting me much outside of the way he's used

His on-court/off-court statistics before his injury as well as our offensive and defensive rating since Al's injury show that we are clearly substantially better without him. The eye test says the same thing in my opinion. I think he could be a deadly weapon as a backup center but I don't think there is any chance Al would accept that role and I really don't see Clifford asking him to take on that role since Clifford is probably his biggest fan in the entire world. As long as he is here he is going to be our starter playing 30-35 minutes per game doing nothing but camping out in the post calling for the ball. It is just who he is. I wish that weren't that case and hope that somehow it changes but I just don't see it.

In my eyes, there is no before the injury, because I believe he's been hampered all season whether it's been bad conditioning or a groin pull. I've mentioned it on several occasions that I'm surprised that Clifford has been riding him so much instead of playing Biyombo longer stints when it was clear that he wasn't physically able early in the season

If we're going to use last year outliers & on-court/off-court statistics this year, do the same apply for Lance Stephenson?