Official Trade Thread - Part XXVIII

[FAH1223]

Honestly the thought of Ernie drafting late against scares the hell out of me.

He simply CANNOT draft. It's basically a fact at this point.

Yeah

We can only hope the blind squirrel finds a nut out of no where

[JWizmentality]

Norris Cole...ugh. Jesus.

[WallToWall]

Reggie Jackson is available... if it doesnt take away from the Durant chance, I say do it! He drives the ball, and can dish. He could be a good backup PG....look at how he filled in for Westbrook. He gets to the FT line too. He can create, and we need that on our 2nd unit. If the price is right, Ernie, make it so...

[bealwithit]

Reggie Jackson is available... if it doesnt take away from the Durant chance, I say do it! He drives the ball, and can dish. He could be a good backup PG....look at how he filled in for Westbrook. He gets to the FT line too. He can create, and we need that on our 2nd unit. If the price is right, Ernie, make it so...

He wants to start for a team. Won't be happy here either.

And as others have said, Norris Cole doesn't excite me either.

[hands11]

Reggie Jackson is available... if it doesnt take away from the Durant chance, I say do it! He drives the ball, and can dish. He could be a good backup PG....look at how he filled in for Westbrook. He gets to the FT line too. He can create, and we need that on our 2nd unit. If the price is right, Ernie, make it so...

He wants to start for a team. Won't be happy here either.

And as others have said, Norris Cole doesn't excite me either.

Can we just get to busting EG for the wrong decision he is about to make.. whatever it is.

He clearly didn't talk to enough agents. Or he talked to to many and got confused. And getting whatever player he got, we gave up to much and if he didn't get anyone, he didn't give up enough. And we waited to long or didn't wait long enough.

What a terrible move or unmove. Franchise is doomed.

[bealwithit]

Reggie Jackson is available... if it doesnt take away from the Durant chance, I say do it! He drives the ball, and can dish. He could be a good backup PG....look at how he filled in for Westbrook. He gets to the FT line too. He can create, and we need that on our 2nd unit. If the price is right, Ernie, make it so...

He wants to start for a team. Won't be happy here either.

And as others have said, Norris Cole doesn't excite me either.

Can we just get to busting EG for the wrong decision he is about to make.. whatever it is.

He clearly didn't talk to enough agents. Or he talked to to many and got confused. And getting whatever player he got, we gave up to much and if he didn't get anyone, he didn't give up enough. And we waited to long or didn't wait long enough.

What a terrible move or unmove. Franchise is doomed.

Lol hands, I'm holding out hope for a surprise move tomorrow, just saying seeing Cole as the first name connected to us right before the deadline isn't what fans were really hoping for. The reality though is that the team just doesn't have enough valuable assets to make a truly impactful move. This is mostly due to the team being made up of veterans, two untouchables in Wall and Beal, and Porter being the only other young guy but with a ceiling that most teams probably don't think is very high. And, of course, the front office is just waiting for the Durant sweepstakes regardless of whether that's the smart move or not.

I just hope they have a good back-up plan if Durant stays in OKC or goes elsewhere for whatever reason.

[hands11]

Back up plan ?

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/RPM

GS has Curry 1st, Draymond Green 17th, Bogut 20th, Klay Thompson 35th

GS seems to be pretty good and in the West and they have Curry, Klay and pieces that can be acquired like.. Bogut and Green.
Draymond .. what did he cost them ?

We have

Wall 9th was up from last year
Beals numbers took a nice jump this year from -0.53 to 0.74. Just 21.. I expect another big jump next year
Nene is 34th.. call him our Bogut
Gortat was 24th last year but since they stopped running PnR for him his numbers really took a hit.

Point is, right now we are still waiting on Beal to mature and he projects to keep getting better and can easily get to Klay range. After that, who can't you get that GS has ? We have Nene and Gortat. They have Bogut and David Lee

The wild care is Draymond Green and the underrated Iguodala. Both the type of players that can be acquired. Not KD difficult to get.

And PP is our Iggy for now.

They have Barnes. We have Otto.

What they have is their young stars not as young as ours, a really good HC, and pieces you can pick up.

So the fall back plan is, we have Wall first and foremost. Then we have Beal. And we have Nene and Gortat and cap space to get those other support pieces.

GS isn't levels above WAS in talent. They just have their young stars more mature and have been together longer.
And they have a great Head Coach.

[Ruzious]

Well, who's going and coming by 3:00 this afternoon? Should we break out a Kevin Seraphin appreciation thread?

[Ruzious]

Back up plan ?

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/RPM

GS has Curry 1st, Draymond Green 17th, Bogut 20th, Klay Thompson 35th

GS seems to be pretty good and in the West and they have Curry, Klay and pieces that can be acquired like.. Bogut and Green.
Draymond .. what did he cost them ?

We have

Wall 9th was up from last year
Beals numbers took a nice jump this year from -0.53 to 0.74. Just 21.. I expect another big jump next year
Nene is 34th.. call him our Bogut
Gortat was 24th last year but since they stopped running PnR for him his numbers really took a hit.

Point is, right now we are still waiting on Beal to mature and he projects to keep getting better and can easily get to Klay range. After that, who can't you get that GS has ? We have Nene and Gortat. They have Bogut and David Lee

The wild care is Draymond Green and the underrated Iguodala. Both the type of players that can be acquired. Not KD difficult to get.

And PP is our Iggy for now.

They have Barnes. We have Otto.

What they have is their young stars not as young as ours, a really good HC, and pieces you can pick up.

So the fall back plan is, we have Wall first and foremost. Then we have Beal. And we have Nene and Gortat and cap space to get those other support pieces.

GS isn't levels above WAS in talent. They just have their young stars more mature and have been together longer.
And they have a great Head Coach.

Not to pick on just one point (who me? I could pick on some more if you want.), but can we stop with the assuming that Beal will be Klay Thompson or better just because it took Thompson several years to become what he is? What's the percent of NBA players that improve to the extent that Thompson has? Spoiler alert - it's very low. Thompson is the single best shooting guard in the NBA. Some consider him an MVP candidate. Assuming Beal is going to get in that range is silly.

[Dark Faze]

I agree on the above, but Klay isn't better than Harden. Even being better defensively, Harden is that much better offensively.

[Ruzious]

I agree on the above, but Klay isn't better than Harden. Even being better defensively, Harden is that much better offensively.

Fair enough - 2nd best 2 in the NBA.

[hands11]

Back up plan ?

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/RPM

GS has Curry 1st, Draymond Green 17th, Bogut 20th, Klay Thompson 35th

GS seems to be pretty good and in the West and they have Curry, Klay and pieces that can be acquired like.. Bogut and Green.
Draymond .. what did he cost them ?

We have

Wall 9th was up from last year
Beals numbers took a nice jump this year from -0.53 to 0.74. Just 21.. I expect another big jump next year
Nene is 34th.. call him our Bogut
Gortat was 24th last year but since they stopped running PnR for him his numbers really took a hit.

Point is, right now we are still waiting on Beal to mature and he projects to keep getting better and can easily get to Klay range. After that, who can't you get that GS has ? We have Nene and Gortat. They have Bogut and David Lee

The wild care is Draymond Green and the underrated Iguodala. Both the type of players that can be acquired. Not KD difficult to get.

And PP is our Iggy for now.

They have Barnes. We have Otto.

What they have is their young stars not as young as ours, a really good HC, and pieces you can pick up.

So the fall back plan is, we have Wall first and foremost. Then we have Beal. And we have Nene and Gortat and cap space to get those other support pieces.

GS isn't levels above WAS in talent. They just have their young stars more mature and have been together longer.
And they have a great Head Coach.

Not to pick on just one point (who me? I could pick on some more if you want.), but can we stop with the assuming that Beal will be Klay Thompson or better just because it took Thompson several years to become what he is? What's the percent of NBA players that improve to the extent that Thompson has? Spoiler alert - it's very low. Thompson is the single best shooting guard in the NBA. Some consider him an MVP candidate. Assuming Beal is going to get in that range is silly.

I will counter your.. what percent become that good with ... what percent of SG are as good a Beal at this age ? Spoiler alert.. its very low.

So the question was ... what is the back up plan.. What I did was point out.. its not clear its a dire as some think it is and they will have options. Same thing I have said though the entire rebuild while people cried the sky is falling, trade Nene, TA sucks, Okafor is a bust, don't give up a lottery pick for Gortat.

They already have pieces. Young pieces. And GS built a good team largely in a very similar model. I broke that down. They draft Curry and Klay. They got their not so athletic bigs. They added Iggy. And they gave it time. Then lucked into Green. And if people remember, Curry had lots of injury ankle problem. He got past that. Hell, I feared his career would be over quick it was so bad. But his body, training program, whatever.. he got over it.

Not saying its a sure thing. No one can. But it would be silly to not see the potential. Not like they don't have Wall and Beal. Not like Wall's chances of becoming what he is today was a sure thing 2-3 years ago when lots here questioned if he could get here like the are questions Beal now. What's so different about Beal ? Another level headed young talented kid that needs to mature and grow his skills and his mental approach. Sounds like Wall was when lots here complained about maxing him early.

So your first shot at picking at what what wrote didn't go so well. What else you got ? Or, you can also acknowledge they are fair points and comment from there. Up to you.

Curry will be 27 this march. Wall is 24
Klay just turned 25. Beal is 21

No way I am capping Beals game at 21 That would be foolish. Specially in light of Klays game taking the time it did to develop.

[payitforward]

Back up plan ?

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/RPM

GS has Curry 1st, Draymond Green 17th, Bogut 20th, Klay Thompson 35th

GS seems to be pretty good and in the West and they have Curry, Klay and pieces that can be acquired like.. Bogut and Green.
Draymond .. what did he cost them ?

We have

Wall 9th was up from last year
Beals numbers took a nice jump this year from -0.53 to 0.74. Just 21.. I expect another big jump next year
Nene is 34th.. call him our Bogut
Gortat was 24th last year but since they stopped running PnR for him his numbers really took a hit.

Point is, right now we are still waiting on Beal to mature and he projects to keep getting better and can easily get to Klay range. After that, who can't you get that GS has ? We have Nene and Gortat. They have Bogut and David Lee

The wild care is Draymond Green and the underrated Iguodala. Both the type of players that can be acquired. Not KD difficult to get.

And PP is our Iggy for now.

They have Barnes. We have Otto.

What they have is their young stars not as young as ours, a really good HC, and pieces you can pick up.

So the fall back plan is, we have Wall first and foremost. Then we have Beal. And we have Nene and Gortat and cap space to get those other support pieces.

GS isn't levels above WAS in talent. They just have their young stars more mature and have been together longer.
And they have a great Head Coach.

Not sure what you're getting at here....?

Right now, as good as Wall is, Curry is even better -- significantly more productive. Will Wall become as good as Curry? Well, maybe. But we can't know that.

Beal's only 21 and has a big upside -- will he turn out to be as good a player as Klay Thompson. Well, maybe. But we can't know that either.

Barnes has turned out to be a much better NBA player than I expected (or that his college performance would make you think he'd be). Good for him. Will Porter turn out that good. Well, maybe. But we can't know that one either!

And, as you know I like Gortat a lot -- but Bogut has played the last two years at a level well above Gortat. He's the better player between the two of them.

Guys like Draymond Green are *not* easy to acquire, Hands. GS acquired him by drafting him a few spots after we picked Tomas Satoransky. Now... guys like Satoransky *are* easy to acquire. I.e. guys who don't play in the NBA.

The sum of those differences between them and us is enormous -- huge. They eclipse by orders of magnitude the difference between any two coaches in the league today (maybe leaving out Pop...?). And to equate our guys with theirs requires that we project all of them to reach their highest possible potential.

[nate33]

OKC fans on the Trade Board are now looking to dump Dion Waiters for just an expiring contract. Obviously, fan sentiment isn't the same as the sentiment of the team's management, but it's an issue that bears watching. Would you trade Andre Miller straight up for Dion Waiters?

Waiters is definitely a selfish team-cancer with a near-delusional sense of self worth, but he's also a talented guard with the ball in his hands and he could be the instant offense guy our second unit really needs.

[Ruzious]

Back up plan ?

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/RPM

GS has Curry 1st, Draymond Green 17th, Bogut 20th, Klay Thompson 35th

GS seems to be pretty good and in the West and they have Curry, Klay and pieces that can be acquired like.. Bogut and Green.
Draymond .. what did he cost them ?

We have

Wall 9th was up from last year
Beals numbers took a nice jump this year from -0.53 to 0.74. Just 21.. I expect another big jump next year
Nene is 34th.. call him our Bogut
Gortat was 24th last year but since they stopped running PnR for him his numbers really took a hit.

Point is, right now we are still waiting on Beal to mature and he projects to keep getting better and can easily get to Klay range. After that, who can't you get that GS has ? We have Nene and Gortat. They have Bogut and David Lee

The wild care is Draymond Green and the underrated Iguodala. Both the type of players that can be acquired. Not KD difficult to get.

And PP is our Iggy for now.

They have Barnes. We have Otto.

What they have is their young stars not as young as ours, a really good HC, and pieces you can pick up.

So the fall back plan is, we have Wall first and foremost. Then we have Beal. And we have Nene and Gortat and cap space to get those other support pieces.

GS isn't levels above WAS in talent. They just have their young stars more mature and have been together longer.
And they have a great Head Coach.

Not to pick on just one point (who me? I could pick on some more if you want.), but can we stop with the assuming that Beal will be Klay Thompson or better just because it took Thompson several years to become what he is? What's the percent of NBA players that improve to the extent that Thompson has? Spoiler alert - it's very low. Thompson is the single best shooting guard in the NBA. Some consider him an MVP candidate. Assuming Beal is going to get in that range is silly.

I will counter your.. what percent become that good with ... what percent of SG are as good a Beal at this age ? Spoiler alert.. its very low.

So the question was ... what is the back up plan.. What I did was point out.. its not clear its a dire as some think it is and they will have options. Same thing I have said though the entire rebuild while people cried the sky is falling, trade Nene, TA sucks, Okafor is a bust, don't give up a lottery pick for Gortat.

They already have pieces. Young pieces. And GS built a good team largely in a very similar model. I broke that down. The draft Curry and Klay. They got their not so athletic bigs. They added Iggy. And they gave it time. Then lucked into Green.

Not saying its a sure thing. No one can. But it would be silly to not see the potential. Not like they don't have Wall and Beal. Not like Wall's chances of becoming what he is today was a sure thing 2-3 years ago when lots here questioned if he could get here like the are questions Beal now. What's so different about Beal ? Another level headed young talented kid that needs to mature and grow his skills and his mental approach. Sounds like Wall was when lots here complained about maxing him early.

So your first shot at picking at what what wrote didn't go so well. What else you got ? Or, you can also acknowledge they are fair points and comment from there. Up to you.

Your counter sucked. Beal is not good. He's average. There have been a ton of average shooing guards in the NBA - probably several hundred his age. Saying a lot of irrelevant junk to clutter things up doesn't change that.

[dckingsfan]

Less than 6 hours left...

[hands11]

OKC fans on the Trade Board are now looking to dump Dion Waiters for just an expiring contract. Obviously, fan sentiment isn't the same as the sentiment of the team's management, but it's an issue that bears watching. Would you trade Andre Miller straight up for Dion Waiters?

Waiters is definitely a selfish team-cancer with a near-delusional sense of self worth, but he's also a talented guard with the ball in his hands and he could be the instant offense guy our second unit really needs.

NO

[hands11]

Back up plan ?

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/RPM

GS has Curry 1st, Draymond Green 17th, Bogut 20th, Klay Thompson 35th

GS seems to be pretty good and in the West and they have Curry, Klay and pieces that can be acquired like.. Bogut and Green.
Draymond .. what did he cost them ?

We have

Wall 9th was up from last year
Beals numbers took a nice jump this year from -0.53 to 0.74. Just 21.. I expect another big jump next year
Nene is 34th.. call him our Bogut
Gortat was 24th last year but since they stopped running PnR for him his numbers really took a hit.

Point is, right now we are still waiting on Beal to mature and he projects to keep getting better and can easily get to Klay range. After that, who can't you get that GS has ? We have Nene and Gortat. They have Bogut and David Lee

The wild care is Draymond Green and the underrated Iguodala. Both the type of players that can be acquired. Not KD difficult to get.

And PP is our Iggy for now.

They have Barnes. We have Otto.

What they have is their young stars not as young as ours, a really good HC, and pieces you can pick up.

So the fall back plan is, we have Wall first and foremost. Then we have Beal. And we have Nene and Gortat and cap space to get those other support pieces.

GS isn't levels above WAS in talent. They just have their young stars more mature and have been together longer.
And they have a great Head Coach.

Not sure what you're getting at here....?

Right now, as good as Wall is, Curry is even better -- significantly more productive. Will Wall become as good as Curry? Well, maybe. But we can't know that.

Beal's only 21 and has a big upside -- will he turn out to be as good a player as Klay Thompson. Well, maybe. But we can't know that either.

Barnes has turned out to be a much better NBA player than I expected (or that his college performance would make you think he'd be). Good for him. Will Porter turn out that good. Well, maybe. But we can't know that one either!

And, as you know I like Gortat a lot -- but Bogut has played the last two years at a level well above Gortat. He's the better player between the two of them.

Guys like Draymond Green are *not* easy to acquire, Hands. GS acquired him by drafting him a few spots after we picked Tomas Satoransky. Now... guys like Satoransky *are* easy to acquire. I.e. guys who don't play in the NBA.

The sum of those differences between them and us is enormous -- huge. They eclipse by orders of magnitude the difference between any two coaches in the league today (maybe leaving out Pop...?). And to equate our guys with theirs requires that we project all of them to reach their highest possible potential.

Sounds like you mostly got it to me. Question was, what is the fall back plan. My point was, as we are shooting for 2016, Wall, Beal and Otto and going to get better and we will have better answers. And they well may be, we have our answers.

Gortat.. The Hammer. The Machine.
http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_ ... position/9
We could have this Gortat again the moment Randy gets his head out of his ass or we get an elite coach replacement. Something that is very doable. Lots of coaches would want to come here now. And from the sounds of it, Ted is turning up the head on Randy. And...Dray's 8M comes off the books this year. If they want, they can buy out next yeas Randy contract at like 3M and not blink.

As for D Green. Yeah. They won the lottery on that one. But hard to get. Maybe hard to luck into them working out but he wasn't hard to get. You pointed that out yourself. He was picked in the 2nd round after our pick. He was actually easy to get.

So besides Green, the some of those different are TIME and a great coach.

[Ruzious]

Not to pick on just one point (who me? I could pick on some more if you want.), but can we stop with the assuming that Beal will be Klay Thompson or better just because it took Thompson several years to become what he is? What's the percent of NBA players that improve to the extent that Thompson has? Spoiler alert - it's very low. Thompson is the single best shooting guard in the NBA. Some consider him an MVP candidate. Assuming Beal is going to get in that range is silly.

I will counter your.. what percent become that good with ... what percent of SG are as good a Beal at this age ? Spoiler alert.. its very low.

So the question was ... what is the back up plan.. What I did was point out.. its not clear its a dire as some think it is and they will have options. Same thing I have said though the entire rebuild while people cried the sky is falling, trade Nene, TA sucks, Okafor is a bust, don't give up a lottery pick for Gortat.

They already have pieces. Young pieces. And GS built a good team largely in a very similar model. I broke that down. The draft Curry and Klay. They got their not so athletic bigs. They added Iggy. And they gave it time. Then lucked into Green.

Not saying its a sure thing. No one can. But it would be silly to not see the potential. Not like they don't have Wall and Beal. Not like Wall's chances of becoming what he is today was a sure thing 2-3 years ago when lots here questioned if he could get here like the are questions Beal now. What's so different about Beal ? Another level headed young talented kid that needs to mature and grow his skills and his mental approach. Sounds like Wall was when lots here complained about maxing him early.

So your first shot at picking at what what wrote didn't go so well. What else you got ? Or, you can also acknowledge they are fair points and comment from there. Up to you.

Your counter sucked. Beal is not good. He's average. There have been a ton of average shooing guards in the NBA - probably several hundred his age. Saying a lot of irrelevant junk to clutter things up doesn't change that.

Edit - Sorry, that was harsh. Not a good time right now.

[JWizmentality]

OKC fans on the Trade Board are now looking to dump Dion Waiters for just an expiring contract. Obviously, fan sentiment isn't the same as the sentiment of the team's management, but it's an issue that bears watching. Would you trade Andre Miller straight up for Dion Waiters?

Waiters is definitely a selfish team-cancer with a near-delusional sense of self worth, but he's also a talented guard with the ball in his hands and he could be the instant offense guy our second unit really needs.

Are you looking at Waiters being a stopgap with Beal being out?