What are the Sixers doing?

[Mik317]

Sixers are going no where. Poster before me says they are "SOOO early in the rebuild process" which is SADLY right EVEN THOUGH they have been rebuilding for multiple years already.

hasn't even been two years yet. People are counting the Bynum years for some reason. And year one was spent tearing down...

It took Washington 3-4 years before they stopped looking bad. Orlando is in year 3 or 4 and last time I checked have won about 5-6 more games than us (although as always a lot if not most of that is due to AAAAMMAAAAZZNNG coaching lol...geez).

Again I'll preface this with saying I'm not super pleased with the recent events but nothing has changed. This rebuild , like every **** rebuild, will take time. Lets say we kept MCW and all that...we would still be ass this year (maybe not as ass but probably around 18-22 wins right maxr but nothing special) and next year we would be bad again before finally adding some pieces via FA in year 4. The schedule is still adhered too , losing MCW and KJ, while I think sucks, doesn't mean we are now off schedule. MCW was hopefully going to be our 4th or 5th best player, KJ was either going to a damn solid starter or a 6th man type. We can HOPEFULLY get that later after all we have like a bazillion picks this year (I suspect at the very least 2 1st rounders with maybe a 3rd if OKC goes o a little run). We are only off schedule if Embiid isn't good or gets hurt again, if whoever we draft this year is a bum, if guys stop taking steps forward an stagnate...if that happens, then the "process" changes.

Again I am not a fan of the deals ATM, however I don't think it effects things as much as people think. The "process" always banked on us getting that guy...be it Embiid or whoever the **** we draft this year. If one or God Willing both of those guys are nice centerpieces (i am avoiding the word superstar because that leads to awful places), then everything is fine and all of this uproar is pointless. Not saying it is a lock to happen, Not saying that it is that easy, I understand the alternate version but despite what many people want to believe, I always knew the alternate reality of this path we are on. Most Sixers fans do, even the ones who love this deal.

This isn't the potential apocalypse point. Even if we kept MCW, drafting busts or having Embiid not be the guy will always be our Ragnarok .

[Tony Franciosa]

Sixers are going no where. Poster before me says they are "SOOO early in the rebuild process" which is SADLY right EVEN THOUGH they have been rebuilding for multiple years already.

It took 2 years just to undo the damage that Collins/Thorn/Stefanski did to our roster/cap. The re-assembly only really started last year, so it's disingenuous to say it's been going on for multiple years.

[Mik317]

and anyone who think this will go on for 10 seasons is crazy. Hinkie would be fired by then. come on guys stop using hyperbole to prove you points..it makes yall look silly.

[MiltownHawkeye]

Sixers are going no where. Poster before me says they are "SOOO early in the rebuild process" which is SADLY right EVEN THOUGH they have been rebuilding for multiple years already.

The "we're only 1.5 years into the rebuild" talking point is just silly. Obviously the rest of the season is a lost cause. 2 years. Now, what are Sixers fans expecting next year that makes them a passably competitive team? That's 3 years right there if we're being realistic.

Sure, other franchises like SAC and MIN have been in rebuild mode forever. But those fans aren't calling their GM a genius and saying that he's taking the rest of the league to the cleaners. They're not steadfast about how their strategy will work and that everyone who is skeptical "just doesn't understand." It's the Hinkie cult of personality that attracts more negative attention on this site than the concept of rebuilding itself. There are rational Sixers fans who recognize the risks in this strategy and don't get snarky and defensive when they gets pointed out. Then there are the others...

[Sixerscan]

Hinkie is playing golf. He's Roy McAvoy on the final hole in Tin Cup, trying to hit the pin 235 yards away over a water hazard. Let's hope for the Sixers' sake he doesn't take 12 attempts to do it.

That comment doesn't match what he is doing in any way shape or form. I'm sure you felt clever typing it, but the guy is continually shortening his distance, trying to trade a longer shot to a shorter shot, or 2 similar shots that he can keep the best of.

The complaints so far that might be able to bear some resemblance is
1) that the goal is such a tough one, that Philly could be in basketball purgatory for a long time, and not just in purgatory without a superstar, but without a decent team while they wait.
2) That the focus on marginally improving assets continually might result in a real asset loss, either through offending players and closing off future fa, a lack of development, or some other unclear mechanism.

Instead of trying to be clever, you should try to follow the conversation.

Yes, because I was responding to such a well thought out and perfectly relevant post. But you feel free to ignore my previous posts in this thread and focus on the facetious one.

Re: your first comment, I don't believe he is shortening the distance. With each draft pick he's doing is taking the drop and trying again. It's still a phenomenally difficult shot. Generational talent - the type he supposedly covets - doesn't come along in every draft, and having a high pick doesn't negate that there may be a lack of talent in a particular draft or that a team may overestimate talent. That doesn't mean he won't eventually hit said shot, but finding your superstar in the draft isn't getting any easier unless you somehow find a way to guarantee a no.1 overall pick when the next Tim Duncan, Shaq, or Lebron James declares.

Wait maybe I'm reading this wrong, but we've got to draft the next Shaq with that Laker pick to justify trading Michael Carter-Williams? That seems like a very high standard... how about just somebody better than MCW?

You're right, an NBA team can't control who is in the draft. They can however control how high and how often they pick in the draft. That's what this trade does, it gives the Sixers another crack in the area where super stars are disproportionally found. Whether they find another stud with that pick, with our own pick, with another pick we hold or a trade involving some combination of the 3, it doesn't matter. Sixers are just trying to increase their odds.

Also, people are talking about trading certainty for uncertainty. The only certainty with MCW is that he isn't one of the 20 best players at his position right now. Could he get better? Sure, that's also uncertainty though.

[DynastySS]

Not saying they will be in the playoffs next year, but why are so many people so sure the Lakers pick will be a top 10 pick next year. A returning Kobe + healthy Randle+ 2015 lotto pick+ cap space= Not so bad.

Kobe was off the charts this year. One more season of maturity and he should be unstoppable.

[Sixerscan]

That's assumed based on their reputations coming out of college (and in Noel's case, his 50 NBA games, still a small sample size). Noel has been hit and miss this year. His offense is borderline terrible. 8.2ppg on 7.8fga with a TS% of .467 is flat out bad for a 7 footer, rookie or not. His defense is at times outstanding and is obviously his calling card, and there's no doubt he should be a game changer at that end for his entire career, but what if his offense fails to progress? Then a lotto pick in the 6-10 range maybe becomes attractive to Hinkie. If Embiid continues to struggle with injury, what then?

Point being, they are worth more than a future lottery pick until the moment that they are no longer worth more than a future lottery pick.

Again, your post is too disingenuous to take seriously. The exact same arguments could be made for every rebuilding team including your own. What if Elfrid Payton continues to suck offensively? What if Aaron Gordon continues to deal with injuries through the remainder of is career? What if, what if, what if? We're talking about rookies here, they aren't going to light it up out of the gate. However, both Noel and Embiid were consensus number 1 picks before their injuries, so there is reason to have higher expectations for them than MCW.

All we heard last year was that Julius Randle and Jabari Parker were "safe picks" and Noel was never going to stay healthy because of his size and ACL injury. Turns out that RealGM posters don't know much about medical science in athletics, who knew?

Sure, if these hypothetical situations you bring up happen then we can start talking about trading away young talent for picks and firing Hinkie. But that's the flaw in your argument, it's nothing more than an unlikely hypothetical scenario, and I can make a similar Doomsday prediction for every NBA team. Doesn't mean that it has any validity or should be taken seriously.

To disingenuous to take seriously? Many Sixers fans wear this rebuild as a badge of honour, because their GM is so different and innovative and so on and so forth, and at the core of his thinking are assets and value. Yeah, you could create doomsday scenarios for every team, but I'm not talking about that, I'm talking about the Sixers specifically and their revolving door attitude to their roster. Three players survived from the final game of the 2012-13 season to the final game of 2013-14. 5 players (Richardson, Noel, Sims, Thompson and Wroten) who were on the team for the final game of last year are still with the team now. Richardson expires in the summer and Sims enters RFA, making them prime candidates to be gone by July.

My point wasn't simply "omg, what if their draft picks don't end up being as good as hoped", because of course that is going to happen at times (probably most of the time), it was "If their marquee draft picks don't end up being as good as projected, will Hinkie unceremoniously dump them for a future draft pick and another bite at the cherry"?

Everyone knows MCW was rookie of the year by virtue of it being a weak rookie year, but at the same time, he was a young pass-first point guard landed in a situation where he had no-one to pass to, so he couldn't play to his strengths, and was required to shoot way more than he was comfortable with. If the roster was rounded out with more offensive talent, would MCW have been a better player for you? Is that something Hinkie considers in his metrics, or is it simply "right now, MCW is way too inefficient, and someone has offered a first rounder for him, so let's cash in". My question with Noel and perhaps Embiid is will the same thing happen? If Noel remains a defensive specialist rather than becoming an elite two-way player, does Hinkie cash in on him or recognize that he can still be a very valuable player on a winning team and keep him around?

At some point you have to entertain the idea of continuity, and actually try and build a team. I understand that it must be crappy as a Sixers fan to have people constantly questioning and/or criticizing your team on here, but it doesn't mean all of those questions and criticisms are unfair or invalid. I get that Hinkie has pinned his colours to the draft - he sees that as the way to get his star. But given his wheelings and dealings in the trade market it's perfectly fair to question his methods. He has a roster with maybe 5 genuine NBA quality players (two of whom are injured, one of whom has just come back after 2 years out, one of whom is Luc Richard Mbah Moute, and the other is a rookie), and a filing cabinet filled with draft mulligans.

He wouldn't be a better player, his numbers would just be more efficient probably.

MCW is what, like 40th in PER among point guards? I really doubt Hinkie would have held out for an almost guaranteed lottery pick for the guy if Hinkie was just sitting in a dark room looking at spreadsheets all day. Of course they factor in his bad teammates. We can argue over how much of a factor it is or isn't, but there's definitely a variable in the equation here that numbers don't fully explain.

[MitchellUK]

Wait maybe I'm reading this wrong, but we've got to draft the next Shaq with that Laker pick to justify trading Michael Carter-Williams? That seems like a very high standard... how about just somebody better than MCW?

You're right, an NBA team can't control who is in the draft. They can however control how high and how often they pick in the draft. That's what this trade does, it gives the Sixers another crack in the area where super stars are disproportionally found. Whether they find another stud with that pick, with our own pick, with another pick we hold or a trade involving some combination of the 3, it doesn't matter. Sixers are just trying to increase their odds.

No, they don't have to draft the next Shaq with the Lakers pick. The discussion has evolved over the course of this thread, but the genesis for me was that I've seen people saying in this (and previous Sixers focused threads) that Hinkie making moves like this is all part of an end game to land his superstar, generational talent. MCW clearly wasn't that, so he was disposable and getting a potentially mid-lottery pick this season was worth trading him for because it increased the odds of Hinkie finding his dynasty-making talent. Until such time as Hinkie acquires his Shaq, TD, Lebron, Anthony Davis, whomever, all players are disposable assets.

I understand what the plan is. I understand that in a vacuum, trading MCW for a pick somewhere in the 6-10 range (if it pans out that way) is definitely good value. What I've been saying is that I don't understand the blind devotion to the plan, a plan that despite Hinkie's improving his odds still requires a large amount of luck. And the beginning of my involvement in this thread was to question at what point Hinkie would have to deviate from the plan and try and build a team instead of stockpiling and flipping assets. Noel and Embiid are both blue chip prospects, but if they fall off their curve and begin to project as just good players rather than outstanding ones, does Hinkie move them for future draft considerations, take another step back towards the drawing board, and try again? And then there are the other considerations I was discussing with Hartford - the effect all of this losing has on the young players Hinkie does plan on keeping around. The potential damage done to the Sixers' reputation when the time comes that they want to chase a free agent (such as the perception that many players would not be keen on signing in Houston because of Morey's propensity to treat them solely as assets to be moved at the right time).

It is what it is. The Sixers have committed to this path for their rebuild, and fair enough (I don't agree with how blatant Hinkie is about putting a losing team out, but he's not breaking any rules and he's playing the hand the system dealt him). I just find it strange that there seem to be so few Sixers fans who won't question his methods or acknowledge the potential pitfalls.

[RealRapsFan]

Because they need a great player (or 2) to build a future contender around - not a collection of good pieces.

If Embiid doesn't pan out, how many years do you think they'll be in rebuild mode?

To the first sentence, i agree. Yet thats the same with every team. But that doesn't mean their proverbial horse is tied to Embiid. They have other routes and option open to them. As it stands, Embiid may be their best option, but that doesn't mean he is their only option.

To the 2nd sentence, if Embiid doesn't pan out, who knows how long they'll be in rebuild mode? Another year? Five years? Ten years? A month? How many other things will happen around the league while they are figuring out if Embiid is/isn't panning out? Thats the very benefit of what Hinkie is doing... he has other options open because he's collect valuable assets. He has a slew of other draft picks, he has tons of cap space, he isn't (or doesn't seem to be) married to any player, and all of that = opportunity.

If I'm not mistaken Hinkie only took over and started tearing down the team a season and a half ago. The 76ers are SOOO early in the rebuild process, there is no reason to tie themselves to anyone or everyone, and in the mean time Hinkie has ensured he's maximizing his opportunity to get that great player (or 2)

Ok, so you've narrowed down the rebuild time from 1 month to 10 years...

We know it won't be 1 month, but we don't know it won't be 10 years or more. And we know they're on their second year of PUTRID play. Not every team has great players to build a championship contender, but very few are as putrid as the 6ers. In fact, hey've probably over-achieved getting 12 wins this season. If Embiid doesn't come around, that likely adds years to the rebuild process - unless they give that up and change the goal to reach mediocrity. It comes down to - what's acceptable to the fan-base? If they buy into historical ineptitude year after year after year, then Hinkie can win this thing... eventually... maybe.

Adding quality players through free agency really isn't an option - even with their cap space. Why would any in-demand free agent go there unless they get grossly over-paid? Embiid combined with a player like Russell developing gives them a chance to show free agents there's a reason for hope. Embiid failing means its likely epic fail for at least another couple years, imo.

Who knows how long it takes to rebuild? No one knows. Who knows how long any rebuild will take? No one knows. Who knows what will go wrong in any rebuild? No one knows. Who knows how long the fan base/media/ownership/joe schmoo down the road will find it acceptable? No one knows. What happens when fans don't find it acceptable? They whine and complain while the owners value keeps going up regardless. But why does this even matter? The unknown is unknown. No one can see the future. Its a moot point.

Why would a team not want to keep avenues open to tap into that alternative potential when they haven't committed to anything yet? Why believe that their entire future isn't tied to a single player who has yet to play a game?

If Embiid isn't as good as expect will a rebuild take longer? Probably. So..... what? Is the team stricken from doing other 'stuff' that may land them other high end players or other high end assets along the way or in the mean time (draft, trade, free agency)? Of course not. So why not, while still at the start, maximize your potential? That seems like sound planning.

If Embiid turns out to be a total bust, life goes on. The great thing about Philly is they have options and alternatives if this happens. Hinkie hasn't tied them to an anchor which means they aren't guaranteed they drown.

[Sixerscan]

Wait maybe I'm reading this wrong, but we've got to draft the next Shaq with that Laker pick to justify trading Michael Carter-Williams? That seems like a very high standard... how about just somebody better than MCW?

You're right, an NBA team can't control who is in the draft. They can however control how high and how often they pick in the draft. That's what this trade does, it gives the Sixers another crack in the area where super stars are disproportionally found. Whether they find another stud with that pick, with our own pick, with another pick we hold or a trade involving some combination of the 3, it doesn't matter. Sixers are just trying to increase their odds.

No, they don't have to draft the next Shaq with the Lakers pick. The discussion has evolved over the course of this thread, but the genesis for me was that I've seen people saying in this (and previous Sixers focused threads) that Hinkie making moves like this is all part of an end game to land his superstar, generational talent. MCW clearly wasn't that, so he was disposable and getting a potentially mid-lottery pick this season was worth trading him for because it increased the odds of Hinkie finding his dynasty-making talent. Until such time as Hinkie acquires his Shaq, TD, Lebron, Anthony Davis, whomever, all players are disposable assets.

I understand what the plan is. I understand that in a vacuum, trading MCW for a pick somewhere in the 6-10 range (if it pans out that way) is definitely good value. What I've been saying is that I don't understand the blind devotion to the plan, a plan that despite Hinkie's improving his odds still requires a large amount of luck. And the beginning of my involvement in this thread was to question at what point Hinkie would have to deviate from the plan and try and build a team instead of stockpiling and flipping assets. Noel and Embiid are both blue chip prospects, but if they fall off their curve and begin to project as just good players rather than outstanding ones, does Hinkie move them for future draft considerations, take another step back towards the drawing board, and try again? And then there are the other considerations I was discussing with Hartford - the effect all of this losing has on the young players Hinkie does plan on keeping around. The potential damage done to the Sixers' reputation when the time comes that they want to chase a free agent (such as the perception that many players would not be keen on signing in Houston because of Morey's propensity to treat them solely as assets to be moved at the right time).

It is what it is. The Sixers have committed to this path for their rebuild, and fair enough (I don't agree with how blatant Hinkie is about putting a losing team out, but he's not breaking any rules and he's playing the hand the system dealt him). I just find it strange that there seem to be so few Sixers fans who won't question his methods or acknowledge the potential pitfalls.

Yeah I think those are reasonable concerns.

Realistically, Hinkie probably has some sort of deadline after which ownership is going to step in. I don't know when that is, and the owners would never in a million years divulge that information. But it's definitely out there somewhere.

I think that's true of any GM's "plan" though. How many more years do you think Hennigan can run out these 50 loss teams? What happens if they never get better than an also-ran in the East? Is he just gonna keep his job forever? Hinkie would probably be more notorious in his failure, but that's for him to worry about.

[RealRapsFan]

double post

[Mik317]

why do people keep acting like Sixers fans don't see the potential downfall....

we all generally do (to various levels of course).

Just because you are positive or hopeful for the outcome or believe in the plan doesn't mean you think it is bulletproof.

If Embiid is just ok and not the next coming of Hakeem...then yeah maybe he gets moved. I doubt it comes to that because Hinkie doesn't have infinite time like people are acting. He has a contract and if he wants to get extended he will eventually need to show some results. This is common sense. This goes for every GM. Hennigan probably gets canned if the Magic stagnate over the next 2 years....and yet before that happens I am sure he will try to do something.

The plan is to collect assets in hopes of getting a star. Hopefully that is Embiid, Noel, 2015 draft pick man or who knows Grant or some ****. If it isn't, then Hinkie will probably be forced to cash in for a guy and try to build a different way.

I don't think this whole thing will continue past next year if there is no tangible progress.

and another thing...no fan willingly wants to think their team will continue to suck or that players will bust...we all know it is possible but no one wllingly thinks of that unless they outright hate the player. If was to make a "what are the Magic doing" thread in which I state that since none of their guys are stars right now that they will be mediocre forever and never good...even if I somehow have facts and stats and logic to back it up (I do not btw), I am damn sure I'd get shanked by a bunch of Magic fans on the spot. Look at the rookie thread whenever someone even slightly disses Payton.. Yes some Sixers fans are a bit obnoxious and brash with banging their chests over a currently awful team but that doesn't speak for the whole fanbase.

Personally, I am torn. I don't like the recent events but because I can't factually say this was the wrong move until things play out, I am still hopeful. We have a shitton of picks and only really need ONE to pan out (including Embiid) for all of this to be worth it. Its year 2 (not even but whatever), if this time next year we are still searching for answers expect the sentiment of the fanbase to change a bit.

[MitchellUK]

Wait maybe I'm reading this wrong, but we've got to draft the next Shaq with that Laker pick to justify trading Michael Carter-Williams? That seems like a very high standard... how about just somebody better than MCW?

You're right, an NBA team can't control who is in the draft. They can however control how high and how often they pick in the draft. That's what this trade does, it gives the Sixers another crack in the area where super stars are disproportionally found. Whether they find another stud with that pick, with our own pick, with another pick we hold or a trade involving some combination of the 3, it doesn't matter. Sixers are just trying to increase their odds.

No, they don't have to draft the next Shaq with the Lakers pick. The discussion has evolved over the course of this thread, but the genesis for me was that I've seen people saying in this (and previous Sixers focused threads) that Hinkie making moves like this is all part of an end game to land his superstar, generational talent. MCW clearly wasn't that, so he was disposable and getting a potentially mid-lottery pick this season was worth trading him for because it increased the odds of Hinkie finding his dynasty-making talent. Until such time as Hinkie acquires his Shaq, TD, Lebron, Anthony Davis, whomever, all players are disposable assets.

I understand what the plan is. I understand that in a vacuum, trading MCW for a pick somewhere in the 6-10 range (if it pans out that way) is definitely good value. What I've been saying is that I don't understand the blind devotion to the plan, a plan that despite Hinkie's improving his odds still requires a large amount of luck. And the beginning of my involvement in this thread was to question at what point Hinkie would have to deviate from the plan and try and build a team instead of stockpiling and flipping assets. Noel and Embiid are both blue chip prospects, but if they fall off their curve and begin to project as just good players rather than outstanding ones, does Hinkie move them for future draft considerations, take another step back towards the drawing board, and try again? And then there are the other considerations I was discussing with Hartford - the effect all of this losing has on the young players Hinkie does plan on keeping around. The potential damage done to the Sixers' reputation when the time comes that they want to chase a free agent (such as the perception that many players would not be keen on signing in Houston because of Morey's propensity to treat them solely as assets to be moved at the right time).

It is what it is. The Sixers have committed to this path for their rebuild, and fair enough (I don't agree with how blatant Hinkie is about putting a losing team out, but he's not breaking any rules and he's playing the hand the system dealt him). I just find it strange that there seem to be so few Sixers fans who won't question his methods or acknowledge the potential pitfalls.

Yeah I think those are reasonable concerns.

Realistically, Hinkie probably has some sort of deadline after which ownership is going to step in. I don't know when that is, and the owners would never in a million years divulge that information. But it's definitely out there somewhere.

I think that's true of any GM's "plan" though. How many more years do you think Hennigan can run out these 50 loss teams? What happens if they never get better than an also-ran in the East? Is he just gonna keep his job forever? Hinkie would probably be more notorious in his failure, but that's for him to worry about.

In all honesty, I think next season is make-or-break for Hennigan. As with Hinkie, ownership would never publicly put a countdown on him, but this summer he will utilize another fairly high lotto pick and hire the guy who should be our long-term coach. If we aren't in the playoffs next season, I think it would have to be acknowledged that his rebuild was a failure.

[GallagherArt]

Sixers are going no where. Poster before me says they are "SOOO early in the rebuild process" which is SADLY right EVEN THOUGH they have been rebuilding for multiple years already.

The "we're only 1.5 years into the rebuild" talking point is just silly. Obviously the rest of the season is a lost cause. 2 years. Now, what are Sixers fans expecting next year that makes them a passably competitive team? That's 3 years right there if we're being realistic.

Sure, other franchises like SAC and MIN have been in rebuild mode forever. But those fans aren't calling their GM a genius and saying that he's taking the rest of the league to the cleaners. They're not steadfast about how their strategy will work and that everyone who is skeptical "just doesn't understand." It's the Hinkie cult of personality that attracts more negative attention on this site than the concept of rebuilding itself. There are rational Sixers fans who recognize the risks in this strategy and don't get snarky and defensive when they gets pointed out. Then there are the others...

Specifying 2 full years would encompass the 2015 off season in most minds. It's assumed Embiid, their own first round pick, whatever picks they keep this season of the LA, MIA, OKC first round picks, and the improvement of their young players. You can see that their defense is also stabilizing and improving as the months have gone on which is why they've had a better winning percentage than 6 other teams since November. November (0-16) 24th ranked defense (106.6), December (3-13) 8th ranked defense (99.9), January (7-12) 12th ranked defense (102.0), February thus far (2-4) 1st ranked defense (97.0).

[Doctor MJ]

I think it's helpful to look at the issues the Pelicans have right now to understand the 76ers - not really coincidences they had the pivotal trade together.

NO wanted a quick rebuild so they brought in a bunch of guys they thought would fit with Davis, which also meant ditching Robin Lopez who they thought wouldn't.

Turns out Davis is a different beast than predicted and so none of those moves helped and together they make it tougher for NO to react

The moral of the story would seem to be to not get ahead of yourself. Until you see what the foundation you want to build around really looks like, avoid establishing things that may prove a poor fit.

While it's true you can't delay forever, MCW was never seriously seen as the team's foundation. Noel and Joel were. Hence moving the premature primacy of MCW is totally in line with what they've been doing and not a reason to think they are punting indefinitely


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[BruceO]

Personally I like what he's doing. he's doing the necessary even if people find it unpopular. Before the trade I commented on some sixers thread saying thus team needed three legit young guys who will eventually be championship cornerstones. I counted embiid, who'd id also take despite being injured in a year that wouldn't matter anyway. MCW I didn't think is a cornerstone guy and I think pgs are replaceable. They are many good solid guys you can get as a free agent if you have a good team. I also don't really know about saric. I would want guys who have few weaknesses you can take advantage of.

My other thing I'd said was that they need to figure out who to play alongside embiid. I think noel is physically and skill set wise on offense limited to play alongside him but it can work. Also I'm excited to see a guy with mcgees Length and speed cause I want too see how he'd work alongside embiid and Noel. In order tooo evaluate the prospects before you have a chance at okafor who you will know then how he can work with your prospect bigs.

Second legit prospect will come from this tanking year. Then you have a surplus of noel, Saric, lakers pick, potentially your own pick to get a legit third prospect. They can both be gotten next draft together. Russell, Mudiay (likely choice), okafor, and a few others are there. Philly will get its legit prospects. MCW wasn't one of them, personally I don't know about saric and Noel either. But if they're not, Hinkie will have the balls to trade them.

After that they make trades with the accumulated assets and cap space. Free agents wouldn't have signed on but you can now focus on culture and wins.

For right now though the name of the game is getting the legit and only the legit young players. through tanking or whatever. Whoever else whether young or old is leverage to make sure things snowball to that point.

[sixerswillrule]

Doctor MJ nailed it. We didn't tank for MCW and our rebuild wasn't based on him. Because

1) he wasn't a potential star player
2) he wasn't seen as someone who would fit with our player who is a potential star (Embiid)
and
3) we were able to get really good value for him

The trade made sense. If we dumped him for crap, the argument against it would be stronger. But that Lakers pick is probably going to be top 10 in 2016 (if it doesn't somehow drop to #6 this year, which is not likely but possible). Hopefully we'll be able to get another cornerstone player with our own pick in this year's draft.

[gustofwind]

Hinkie's a free thinker. Rock on, man.

[lakersin4]

It makes sense in a way. They weren't sold on MCW as the starting PG they should keep around for the future, so they got assets for him. They're just going to keep throwing **** against the wall until some things sticks. Eventually 1 or 2 of these draft picks is going to be an allstar talent that you attempt to build a winning team around.

It'll be a lot harder to see if that **** sticks if the **** in question has little to no talent or stability around him. If you draft the next LBJ/KD/AD then none of it matters. What happens if you don't? As Mik317 has said, something will have to give eventually if the next top 1-3 player doesn't walk in the door.

Yeah I don't agree with that. How much talent does Wiggins have around him? Yeah there's a lot of young players that look promising, but they're tied for the 2nd worst record in the league. With who you ask? The 76ers. I wouldn't say Wiggins has had stability either. Rumors of him being traded during the entire LBJ saga, then it happened. Starts off the season with Rubio running the team then he goes down & Lavine is getting most of his minutes at PG. You'll probably say that's because Wiggins is the next LBJ/KD/AD but there are plenty of other examples of rookies showing star potential on bad teams.

& I don't believe it would be an unstable environment if Philly finally finds their Franchise player. I think that's when they'll start building the team around that player. If they feel like a player isn't going to be that guy, why not cash in his trade value for more chances at finding that Franchise player?

You can point to Philly getting rid of all of their best players over the last few years & say there would be more talent to take pressure off of a rookie & give him a better chance to succeed, but is that really the case?

- Jrue, easily the best player they got rid of. But nowhere near a franchise player. Got them Noel's draft rights. Made room for them to see if MCW could be their Franchise player.
- ET, inefficient volume scorer that didn't help them win games when he was given the keys to the car. Has been a role player since he was traded.
- Hawes, wanted 10M a year for putting up a career best 13/8 for less than half a season in his contract year. Hasn't put those numbers up since. Another guy that has been a role player since leaving.
- Elfrid Payton, Obviously a mistake in hindsight, unless Saric comes over & is a monster. But they were still giving MCW the greenlight to see if he could be their guy.
- Thad Young, didn't want to be there, was probably going to opt out & leave for nothing. Not a bad player by any means but at no point made them a winning team. They got a MIA 1st which looks like it's going to be in the 14-16 range, & Mbah a Moute who was/is an idol to Embiid. An example of why I think they'll do what it takes to make their Franchise player happy when he comes along.

They didn't let go of a single player who would help them win enough games to do anything but mess up their draft position. The 2 best players they got rid of played the same position as MCW who they thought might be the guy that turns things around. What were they supposed to do, keep those guys & lose valuable draft position & then lose them for nothing in FA? I really dont understand how anyone can talk down on what the 76ers are doing considering what they had to work with.

[Roddy B for 3]

I've trashed the sixers before, but I like the MCW trade. If he's not your guy and your losing anyway why not take the pick.

I think that Lackers pick is one of the most valuable assets floating around, a top ten pick without suffering through a whole year of terrible ball is extremley valuable.

MCW isn't that exciting of a prospect in my eyes. As a Dallas fan I can tell you first hand how a ball dominate non-shooter PG is a recipe for an average offense.

If Embid lives up to the hype your core is Joel, Noel, Saric, 2015 top ten pick, and the Lacker pick. Thats 5 chances at getting a franchise corner stone. Most people would take 2-3 losing seasons to get 1, 2, or 3 cornerstones.

However, Hinke hasn't blown me away with his drafting yet. And asset collection is not as important as hitting on your draft picks.

Philly fans, what do you think of Hinkies drafting and how many years without having real postseason asperations are you willing to endure to let Hinkie keep doing his thing?