Off Topic VII

[catch20two]

Eh, it doesn't get any more reputable than Julio Cesar Chavez. Pernell dominated him, although he technically got screwed and was awarded a draw. He had a controversial decision loss to an undefeated 24 year old Oscar De La Hoya that was steamrolling through multiple divisions like Manny did back in the day . He put on a defensive display in that fight.

Floyd is a little bigger and stronger, but probably not as quick or as good defensively. Floyd seems like he might have a little more punching power. They are pretty comparable. Whitaker lost motivation and fell off a cliff after the De la Hoya fight and retired early. He was insanely good in his mid to late 20s though. I think he might have been a little better at his peak but he didn't have a super long run as a top fighter like Floyd.

I wouldn't say that Pernell dominated Chavez. It was a almost even fight in my eyes where Chavez had the bigger name and legend so he got a slight benefit. Sure Pernell shoulda won by split decision tho if all things were fair. The problem with Pernell and why he couldn't beat these high profiled Mexicans the way Floyd has despite great defense is that he wasn't as accurate of a puncher as Floyd.

[catch20two]

You have a point about GGG, but you can kind of tell he is a beast. He should have started fighting in America earlier. He's not amazing or anything. He'll never be anywhere near Floyd's level, but he would probably physically be too much for him at this point. He is big and strong and has dynamite power for a middleweight and is probably going to move up in weight. Floyd is really a welterweight and 154 is kind of pushing it for him. GGG is probably going to be fighting at 168+ before too long in order to find good fights. I don't think many middleweights want any part of that guy.

What do you think about Keith Thurman vs GGG? I would love to see that fight. I honestly don't know who would win.

[Braggins]

You have a point about GGG, but you can kind of tell he is a beast. He should have started fighting in America earlier. He's not amazing or anything. He'll never be anywhere near Floyd's level, but he would probably physically be too much for him at this point. He is big and strong and has dynamite power for a middleweight and is probably going to move up in weight. Floyd is really a welterweight and 154 is kind of pushing it for him. GGG is probably going to be fighting at 168+ before too long in order to find good fights. I don't think many middleweights want any part of that guy.

What do you think about Keith Thurman vs GGG? I would love to see that fight. I honestly don't know who would win.

I don't know a lot about Thurman. He seems talented, but its hard for me to imagine a welterweight not getting physically outmatched by GGG. Even if they out-landed him, all his shots to their arms, sides, or that were partially blocked, will take a huge toll on them over the course of some rounds and they'd eventually fold and not have any energy to fight back with. I seriously doubt there are even any jr middleweights that would consider fighting him.

[catsfan]

i don't think floyd wants any part of GGG.

I would respect this post the moment GGG fight at least somebody of Miguel Cotto's caliber. I can't project how good Triple G really is when he's basically fighting nobodies that even the allegedly pillow fisted old man Floyd could TKO in 6 rounds.

i agree, but it isn't like he is ducking anybody. cotto clearly doesn't want to fight him. plus, cotto looked great against a very aging, 1 legged fighter so using him as a benchmark isn't exactly the gold standard. i think the two people that would give floyd the most trouble right now are amir kahn and GGG. it isn't a detraction of floyd it is more an age thing.

[yosemiteben]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/rick_bonnell/status/580977009897115648[/tweet]

[catch20two]

i don't think floyd wants any part of GGG.

I would respect this post the moment GGG fight at least somebody of Miguel Cotto's caliber. I can't project how good Triple G really is when he's basically fighting nobodies that even the allegedly pillow fisted old man Floyd could TKO in 6 rounds.

i agree, but it isn't like he is ducking anybody. cotto clearly doesn't want to fight him. plus, cotto looked great against a very aging, 1 legged fighter so using him as a benchmark isn't exactly the gold standard. i think the two people that would give floyd the most trouble right now are amir kahn and GGG. it isn't a detraction of floyd it is more an age thing.

I don't think Cotto doesn't want to fight GGG because he's scared of him. I think Cotto is and was just looking for the bigger prized fight to earn more money at the tail end of his career and now that he didn't get the shot at Floyd on May 2nd that he wanted to rake in another few million he might consider it. GGG need to come down on the weight or something to fight some more notable fighters at a catch weight that they'd be comfortable with because nobody gonna give him and his newfound hype a shot when he's fighting nobodies and want them to move up in weight.

GGG might be super awesome and unbeatable but nobody will know until he meet the odd demands and catch-weights of the more notable fighters.

[mrknowitall215]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/rick_bonnell/status/580977009897115648[/tweet]

I dislike the likes of both Bonnell & Goodman. Bonnell is a Twitter attention whore and Goodman is a contradicting assh0le

[mrknowitall215]

I see some of you are discussing boxing. Boxing is such a mercurial sport that it's difficult to decipher what could, could've, would, or would've happened in certain matches. All I know is that Floyd Mayweather is easily the best pound-for-pound fighter doing it and it's been that way for several years despite what any pundit has to say. Mayweather make great fighters look amateurish

[fatlever]

I'm wondering how much does the average American know about the situation in Ukraine and how much are you exposed to it? Seemingly the Charlie Hebdo and ISIS storylines are more prevalent in your media coverage.

Asking this since I would be lying if I said that I'm not afraid about the threat Russia could be against Latvia.

Is this something that is being discussed in Latvia - the possibility of a Russian takeover? What would be the motivation from Russia's side? With the Ukraine it gave them a valuable port as well as oil, right? Also, since Latvia is much closely aligned with the Euro powers (right?), I assume an invasion would get a bigger negative reaction from the surrounding Euro nations.

Also, do you think there is a possibility of nations boycotting the 2018 World Cup if things don't improve with Russia? Can you imagine if Germany, Spain, Netherlands, England, Portugal, Italy, Belgium and the USA all told Russia they were boycotting the World Cup, If....

Even if the people involved in the conversation look at it as if it was something otherworldly, the thought of it being a threat is definitely in the air. The governments of our two Baltic neighbours, Estonia and Lithuania, have taken notice. Per example, Lithuania just reintroduced compulsory military service. Estonia already had it as obligatory. Ours unfortunately is pretty clueless and tends to avoid any controversy.

Well, a huge variable in this scenario would be Putin and the madman he is. I just don't feel like we can predict anything he might do. Yes, obviously we're a part of the European Union (unlike Ukraine) and them attacking any of the Baltic countries would start something we'd probably end up calling World War Three. Ukraine was almost easy pickings for Russia since Western powers have no real reason to interfere, no matter how brutal and horrible Russia's annexation of parts of Ukraine might be.

So, yeah, they pretty much took everything they could to build an even bigger empire, while not sparking a reaction from the West. They seemingly could advance even further within Ukraine but seem satisfied not to do so.

The part that kills me, beside Putin being unpredictable, is that we've utterly failed to integrate the Russian community in Latvia. A huge part of them are victims of the same Russian propaganda that people within Russian believe in. The majority of them, people of Russian descent living in Latvia, have faith in Putin and truly believe that you, the USA, are somehow responsible for all of this. Man, I'm telling you... It's not a comfortable feeling to know that these people are my neighbours, that I share the same public transport with them, etc.

9th of May is what they call Victory Day when they celebrate the defeat of the Third Reich. It's not uncommon to receive threats or get beat up just for being Latvian in my part of Riga. I really don't like the idea of that date this year. They have enough numbers to start something really stupid in certain cities. Like I said, they are a lost cause and might get in their heads that a huge demonstration and rioting on their part would receive support from Russia.

it's obviously a 0.1% chance that anything will happen but it's not exactly comfortable to live in the society that Latvia has.

Thanks for this insight Lamar.

Regarding the Russian community in Latvia, do you think that it will take several generations before they become more integrated? I had no idea there was that much division in some of the former Russian states between pro-Russian and pro-country alliances.

Good luck on May 9th. Better just lock the doors and stay inside for a few days.

[LamarMatic7]

Thanks for this insight Lamar.

Regarding the Russian community in Latvia, do you think that it will take several generations before they become more integrated? I had no idea there was that much division in some of the former Russian states between pro-Russian and pro-country alliances.

Good luck on May 9th. Better just lock the doors and stay inside for a few days.

Hard for me to answer that question. I guess so since we missed our chance on integrating them right after the dissolution of the Soviet Union.

At this point it seems very difficult to integrate the people who have settled within the pro-Putin television information space. Our public broadcasting television channel is set to create a third channel solely dedicated to the Russian speaking audience, yet it almost feels like a long-shot that they would switch over from their own Russian satellite channels.

So, yes, I guess it would take several generations. But in the meanwhile you have to acknowledge the fact that we're a dying nation that was amongst the worst sufferers of the financial crisis a few years ago. Accompany that with a mediocre birth-rate and capable students and specialists in their field leaving to countries like the United Kingdom.. and you can almost call the Latvian an endangered species.

Worst comes to worst, I won't even be in the country on May 9th. Travelling to Doc End's Czech Republic to catch a couple of Latvia national hockey team's games.

[SWedd523]

I'm wondering how much does the average American know about the situation in Ukraine and how much are you exposed to it? Seemingly the Charlie Hebdo and ISIS storylines are more prevalent in your media coverage.

Asking this since I would be lying if I said that I'm not afraid about the threat Russia could be against Latvia.

It seems like the average American doesn't care about much more than selfies and tinder these days.

both situations are somewhat dicey as far as military presence goes. Current attitudes towards overseas intervention are very negative so a large show of force isn't really something you could count on (especially in Russia's case) as the politics are too treacherous to make such a move.

I wouldn't hold my breath for American help in Russia's case if I were you unless Putin does something big time.

[Braggins]

Eh, it doesn't get any more reputable than Julio Cesar Chavez. Pernell dominated him, although he technically got screwed and was awarded a draw. He had a controversial decision loss to an undefeated 24 year old Oscar De La Hoya that was steamrolling through multiple divisions like Manny did back in the day . He put on a defensive display in that fight.

Floyd is a little bigger and stronger, but probably not as quick or as good defensively. Floyd seems like he might have a little more punching power. They are pretty comparable. Whitaker lost motivation and fell off a cliff after the De la Hoya fight and retired early. He was insanely good in his mid to late 20s though. I think he might have been a little better at his peak but he didn't have a super long run as a top fighter like Floyd.

I wouldn't say that Pernell dominated Chavez. It was a almost even fight in my eyes where Chavez had the bigger name and legend so he got a slight benefit. Sure Pernell shoulda won by split decision tho if all things were fair. The problem with Pernell and why he couldn't beat these high profiled Mexicans the way Floyd has despite great defense is that he wasn't as accurate of a puncher as Floyd.

I only had Chavez winning a few rounds in that fight. Maybe four, I don't remember exactly how I scored it. It was a pretty thorough domination by Sweat Pea though. No way anyone could objectively score it anything but a UD for Pernell. They gave Chavez a draw because it was in El Paso Texas and a loss would have broken his crazy streak he had going (87 fights with no losses). His only other loss before he fell off a cliff in his 30s was against Jose Luis Ramirez, in another decision that was considered pretty disgraceful, although not as bad as the Chavez fight. He basically got screwed in his biggest fights. It is a shame because I think he is the best defensive boxer of the modern era and should be considered one of the all time pfp greats.

[Braggins]

I see some of you are discussing boxing. Boxing is such a mercurial sport that it's difficult to decipher what could, could've, would, or would've happened in certain matches. All I know is that Floyd Mayweather is easily the best pound-for-pound fighter doing it and it's been that way for several years despite what any pundit has to say. Mayweather make great fighters look amateurish

When he and Pacquiao were both in their late 20s/early 30s I think they were even. Manny has started to noticeably decline more over the past five or so years whereas Floyd has aged really well. No one has been able to step up dethrone him. I would say Floyd is clearly the pfp king now (don't sleep on Guillermo Rigondeaux though), but it wasn't clear that he was better than Manny when they were both at their peak. It is a shame that the Pacquaio fight didn't happen 8-10 years ago when it actually mattered, even 5 years ago would have been acceptable.

It is kind of sad that Floyd and Manny are still easily the two best fighters between 140-154 and are still 1st and 3rd in the pfp rankings. Part of that is due to how great they are, but this next generation of boxers seems relatively week imo.

[Braggins]

I honestly think all the middleweights are scared of GGG. Golovkin is the kind of fighter that ends an old dude like Cotto's career. I think Cotto supposedly looking for the most profitable fight is just an excuse for him to not fight the best fight he could, which would be against GGG. This is modern boxing in a nutshell.

If GGG can't find any more suitable fights at 160, I hope he moves up to 168 to fight Carl Forch. I've been waiting years for someone to shut that idiot up ever since he got embarrassed by Andre Direll but was awarded a terrible hometown decision by British judges. Floyd isn't going to fight Golovkin. I can't see anyone at 154 moving up to fight him except maybe Alvarez, even though there are plenty of bigger fighters at 154 that wouldn't have that much of a size disadvantage. I don't think GGG should have to move down or fight at a catch weight. He is a big middleweight and if anything needs to move up. I don't blame anyone at 154 or lower for not wanting to fight him.

I can't see Floyd losing to Khan unless he starts to lose some more of his speed and timing, and I haven't seen much evidence of that happening. Hes a tad slower than his prime, but he has held up extremely well in his old age since he gets hit so little. I haven't seen Khans last couple fights so maybe he is better than when I saw him last.

[catch20two]

If GGG wanna become a big name he's gonna have to come down in weight to fight the bigger names. Ain't nobody tryna go up to his comfort zone when they have more to lose.

[catch20two]

I think Thurman and GGG are a boxing match made in heaven or hell, whichever you prefer. They need to find a catch-weight for each other. I recall De La Hoya discussing that Thurman is better than GGG but I'd take his word with a heavy grain of salt.

Also for my own hood and ghetto purposes I would love to see Broner and Garcia fight. I would even love to see Broner fight Maidana again. It would be interesting to see if Broner could come into a fight with Maidana better prepared since he like to clown like a coon until Maidana knocked some sense into him while he was tryna play. All in all Broner gained respect from me in that loss the way he recovered from gettin dropped and going toe to toe with Maidana the rest of the way even tho he was dazed.

[Braggins]

I don't think agreeing to a catchweight would get anyone who fights at 154 to step in the ring with him. I think he would demolish anyone who fights at 154 anyways. Hes probably too big to move all the way down to 154. There are good fights for him at 160 but they also want no part of him. His only option is to move up if he can't get any of the top middleweights to fight him. If no one will fight him at middleweight there is no way anyone smaller than that is going to take the challenge unless Alvarez gets froggy and decides he really wants to make a name for himself. The obvious fight that should happen is GGG/Cotto. If we were still in the pre 2000s era that fight would already be in the works.

[catch20two]

I don't think agreeing to a catchweight would get anyone who fights at 154 to step in the ring with him. I think he would demolish anyone who fights at 154 anyways. Hes probably too big to move all the way down to 154. There are good fights for him at 160 but they also want no part of him. His only option is to move up if he can't get any of the top middleweights to fight him. If no one will fight him at middleweight there is no way anyone smaller than that is going to take the challenge unless Alvarez gets froggy and decides he really wants to make a name for himself. The obvious fight that should happen is GGG/Cotto. If we were still in the pre 2000s era that fight would already be in the works.

GGG says he'll fight anybody but I think that's just his promoter's way of hyping him and then they'll bend or ignore negotiations. Like he said that he'll fight bums like Frouch and Chavez Jr at 168 but he want a catchweight to fight Andre Ward, I don't get it. What's with all the tricky stuff.

[catch20two]

Cotto not tryna fight GGG because he want that one last Mayweather payday. Lol. He'll prolly fight some bum for practice to play it safe hoping Floyd will consider him again in September.

[Braggins]

I can understand if Cotto wants to get one more for sure big payday before he takes a super risky fight like GGG. If GGG isn't his next opponent then he should be the next after whoever he fights next, assuming he wins and GGG doesn't lose his upcoming fight.

It can be hard to figure out the true motivations with fighters a lot of the time because of how their promoters deal and make the fights. If he is asking for a catchweight against Ward but not the others then I would take that to mean that either GGG or his promoters don't want him to fight Ward yet, which is understandable. There are other fights that make more sense for him than Ward right now and Ward would be a big risk for GGG to take before going up against the best at his weight first. The real elephant in the room is that no one seems to want to fight him at his natural weight of 160. The other 160 fighters don't seem interested in fighting him and the smaller guys would honestly be foolish to get in the ring with him. I think Ward would beat him at 168 and if I was Ward I would have no interest in going down to a catcheweight to make that fight happen for the same reason I wouldn't want to go below 160 if I was GGG (Ward is probably looking to move up to 175 if anything). Cotto needs to step up and fight him soon and if GGG makes it through him then he'll probably just need to move up to 168 to fight Froch and Chavez Jr, with Ward being the ultimate goal.