Off Topic VII

[yosemiteben]

You cannot trade comp picks so we would have to move our picks to jump around.

Derp, right, knew that.

Can you provide me some examples of meaningful and helpful FAs coming to Carolina under Hurney? The only one I can think of is Olsen (technically he was traded and then extended), but he just extended under GMan so doesn't seem like a good example. Olindo Mare is a good example of an awful overpay to attract FAs.

It seems like a pretty fundamental principle that you don't build an NFL roster through free agency, and at this point I don't think there is evidence of us losing long term pieces because of bad PR skills. You would have seen massive departures of our core guys if GMan never came to town because we wouldn't have had the space to resign them.

[BeesWax]

You cannot trade comp picks so we would have to move our picks to jump around.

Derp, right, knew that.

Can you provide me some examples of meaningful and helpful FAs coming to Carolina under Hurney? The only one I can think of is Olsen (technically he was traded and then extended), but he just extended under GMan so doesn't seem like a good example. Olindo Mare is a good example of an awful overpay to attract FAs.

It seems like a pretty fundamental principle that you don't build an NFL roster through free agency, and at this point I don't think there is evidence of us losing long term pieces because of bad PR skills. You would have seen massive departures of our core guys if GMan never came to town because we wouldn't have had the space to resign them.

To list just a few:
Ken Lucas
Ricky Proehl
Kevin Dyson
Mike Tolbert

They were all solid pickups who were recruited here by Hurney. Again Hurney was not perfect but neither is Gettleman. You need FA to help improve your team while building through the draft and developing your own players. He is a bad choice at GM but has some good qualities just like Hurney was. His positives are a little better than Hurney's but not a ton. I wish we had gone with Marc Ross like we should have.

[yosemiteben]

I'd be curious to see an exhaustive list, because that's just four guys in his 10 year tenure. If we're saying half the GM's job is FAs and retaining players, I would expect to see guys staying for reasons other than massive overpays (or hell, maybe even taking a paycut because players liked it here so much) and a significant volume of FAs coming in, neither of which seems to be the case.

Hurney literally gave away the franchise's future in trading away draft picks and making terrible signings. GMan came in with his hands tied behind his back and still managed to pull off back to back division titles (admittedly with some luck in the form of a down year in the division), something Hurney never did. No player that projected to have a productive long term (meaning 2+ year) career with Carolina has left with GMan at the helm.

I guess we're about to put your theory to the test when we try to resign some of these draft picks. Until someone significant walks, I'm not willing to put GMan close to Hurney's level. I still do not at all agree that a player cares anywhere close as much about the personality of a GM as he does about the size of the paycheck he's receiving.

With that said, I don't totally criticize Hurney's drafting, he made some good picks, but he was way too willing to trade future picks to move up, which made his misses even worse (Armanti Edwards anyone?). His drafting just pales in comparison to Getts, who has done better without having to move up.

[BeesWax]

Getts has a limited track record. One good draft is fine but if he blows this one then he has a worse track record than Hurney. They are very close with Gettleman having a slight edge due to last seasons draft but one bad draft can drop him quick because he is so awful at the other aspects of the job.

La'el Collins is threatening to sit out the year if not drafted in the first 3 rounds. I am starting to really believe he is innocent and I would take him in the third if he is there. I do not think he would be this loud and vocal if he was not innocent.

[Liver_Pooty]

Desperately need a speed receiver. Funchess is big, but he's slow as hell.

[fatlever]

I guess the Panthers are thinking:
1) offensive line is way too bad to give Cam enough time to throw deep, so no need for speed receivers
2) Cam so inaccurate that they need giant receivers to catch all his overthrown passes

[Liver_Pooty]

I guess the Panthers are thinking:
1) offensive line is way too bad to give Cam enough time to throw deep, so no need for speed receivers
2) Cam so inaccurate that they need giant receivers to catch all his overthrown passes

Lol. I wouldn't doubt #2, at all.

[yosemiteben]

Panthers biggest weakness on O has red zone offense. This can't hurt.

We're collecting a bunch of giants here in Charlotte.

[BeesWax]

So is he a really slow WR or a really weak and slow TE? At least we know he has questionable hands which is something I always look for in a pass catching position.


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[Liver_Pooty]

WR wasn't picked for another 26 or so spots after we picked him. Could have very well traded up when we didn't need to.

[BeesWax]

The two picked later are both better players too. It is like the goal is to overdraft everyone this year. Move up to snag a guy who might have been available with the third round pick you attached to your second to move up.

[Liver_Pooty]

Funchess ran a 4.47 at his pro day, and a 4.7 electronic time at the combine. I desperately hope he's more toward the 4.47 area

[JDR720]

Devin better be a stud of this was a terrible trade, 3 picks for a slow WR that drops tons of balls when he more than likely would've been there at our original pick.

need a OT,RB and a CB. We cant keep passing on OT's, Cam is going to get murdered and I dont trust J-Srew to stay healthy.

[Liver_Pooty]

Devin better be a stud of this was a terrible trade, 3 picks for a slow WR that drops tons of balls when he more than likely would've been there at our original pick.

need a OT,RB and a CB. We cant keep passing on OT's, Cam is going to get murdered and I dont trust J-Srew to stay healthy.

I don't mind trading some of the picks since we had 9, and there is no way 9 would have made our roster, but Im not too sure about that pick at all. Had no problem with Shaq, but Beckham was drafted at 40, a shame he didn't last till 41. Now thats someone who I would have been thrilled to draft.

[BeesWax]

Another trade. Lots of movement for us this season.

[yosemiteben]

Glad to see it, we don't need nine guys. Cautiously optimistic. If you told me pre draft that we'd go BPA defense, WR, and OT with our first three picks I would've been ok with that.

[BeesWax]

The problem is I do not see it as BPA, WR and OT. I see it as overdrafted small OLB, weak TE and RT. I am not thrilled so far. We have not done well value wise this draft IMO.

[JDR720]

I feel like we overdrafted all 3 of our picks so far.

[mattcampbell]

Think I heard it on the radio yesterday that the Cowboys supposedly wanted Shaq at 27, it isn't that much of an overdraft if at all imo.

[BeesWax]

Think I heard it on the radio yesterday that the Cowboys supposedly wanted Shaq at 27, it isn't that much of an overdraft if at all imo.

Jim on the morning show said he thought since they drafted a CB that they would have been interested in Thompson. He had no knowledge and will do anything to justify Gettleman. It was an overdraft because he could have been had in the mid second just like Funchess could have been had without a move up and possibly in the third at our pick. We massively overdraft these guys.