Draft Thread: Who do you want with the 13th pick? Stanley Johnson and WCS added..change votes if you want

[edurham88]

I'm surprised that I haven't seen any mention of the Suns taking Looney at 13. He seems like the kind of upside pick that McDonough would like, especially with their need at backup PF and need for rebounding. Do you think he is too raw for where their team is at right now?

Chad Ford

Probably. Looney has enormous upside, but the learning curve scares teams right now. He hasn't quite figured out what he is. And it could take time. Not sure the Suns will have that sort of patience. Especially with players like Kaminsky, Devin Booker, Bobby Portis that could help right now.

http://m.espn.go.com/general/chat/chat? ... nd=ref~%7B"ref"%3A"http%3A%2F%2Ft.co%2Fz5xa8prWg2"%7D

I don't post much and I'm mostly a lurker, but I wanted to jump in this conversation since I sent this question to Chad Ford. I'm a little biased since I'm a UCLA fan, but I think Looney would be a great pick at 13. If the Suns don't do it, I understand why, though. I have come around a little on Kaminsky lately. I didn't think he was a great shooter, but he lit it up in workouts recently. It's interesting to note, though, that even though Kaminsky is 3.5" taller than Looney, Looney still has a higher standing reach by .5" because of his long arms (7' 3.5" wingspan) and the fact that Kaminsky is a t-rex.

At this point, I'd vote for Looney, Kaminsky, and Turner, probably in that order. But there's not a big gap between those 3 and I would be happy with any of them.

[jcsunsfan]

I am warming to Looney for a few reasons although I still like Kaminsky.

1. Length--His standing reach (real height) is 9'2" which is 1/2" taller than Kaminsky.
2. He is a quality rebounder. Better rate than Kaminski
3. He is a committed defender.
4. His three point shot is decent at 42%, same as Kaminsky.
5. Younger, more upside, (although I do not buy in to this as much)
6. He gets more steals, Kaminski more blocks. For some reason, the stats guys say the steals say more about a player's NBA future than blocks, so I will take them at their word.

Kaminsky has better mid-range moves and a better handle and just seems more of a leader. I have a feeling that Looney is going to move up the draft list as draft day approaches. I would be happy with either of them.

[ATTL]

I think steals are rated highly due to the timing, lateral quickness, and awareness that is usually tied into getting steals, especially for a big.

[Saberestar]

I I have a feeling that Looney is going to move up the draft list as draft day approaches. I would be happy with either of them.

Probably Looney can be a late first round pick .....

Report: Some concern Kevon Looney's preseason hip injury didn't fully heal

Ford reported Tuesday that Looney's range extends as high as the top 10 and as low as the second round. Part of the reason his stock is volatile is because his conditioning and motor are questioned, issues that appear to be bigger red flags for some teams than others. Another part is that the underlying root cause may be a concern.

There is a belief that a preseason hip injury Looney suffered may not have fully healed.

That injury kept him from practicing with the Bruins until the season began and put him behind the curve for conditioning all season long. And while Looney is putting in extra conditioning work and doing yoga to improve his strength and flexibility, team doctors will surely be looking at his medicals closely.

If it's a limiting factor in his athleticism moving forward, it's conceivable that teams who prefer Looney as a small forward could be turned off

.
http://www.thescore.com/news/770602

[Cutter]

If available at #13, you take Frank Kaminsky and don't look back. People concerned about arm length shouldn't worry. A good comparison for Frank is Kevin Love. They both have the exact same arm length, and Frank is about 3" taller. Love is not a "long" player at all, but is beast on the boards. Love only played one year in college versus 4 years for Kaminsky. However Franks had roughly equivalent stats his last 2 years to Love during his one year in college. I think Love is the perfect comparison for Frank, minus the diva attitude!

[Saberestar]

Phoenix Suns' Jeff Hornacek: Trading 13th overall pick could make sense
"Everyone wants to get in the playoffs and in the West, it's extremely difficult. I think that's where Ryan is saying 'hey, if somehow we get a veteran guy that can help us in the near future, we've got enough young guys to build from,' then yeah, he'd consider that," Hornacek told Burns and Gambo Thursday on Arizona Sports 98.7 FM.

"From the coaching standpoint, it's tough to win with young players in this league and we have several of them already. They're growing and they're getting better and better. We probably, at this point, need more veteran guys, so yeah, if the opportunity like that comes up, I think Ryan would do it."

http://arizonasports.com/41/1838054/Pho ... make-sense

[thamadkant]

If they are adamant in bringing in a veteran.

Suns / Nets
Morris twins + pick 13
for
Brook Lopez

[jcsunsfan]

Phoenix Suns' Jeff Hornacek: Trading 13th overall pick could make sense
"Everyone wants to get in the playoffs and in the West, it's extremely difficult. I think that's where Ryan is saying 'hey, if somehow we get a veteran guy that can help us in the near future, we've got enough young guys to build from,' then yeah, he'd consider that," Hornacek told Burns and Gambo Thursday on Arizona Sports 98.7 FM.

"From the coaching standpoint, it's tough to win with young players in this league and we have several of them already. They're growing and they're getting better and better. We probably, at this point, need more veteran guys, so yeah, if the opportunity like that comes up, I think Ryan would do it."

http://arizonasports.com/41/1838054/Pho ... make-sense

ok. who is it they want? No harm in beating the bushes some to see if anything pops out.

[Mr-Al]

I might be on an island but I like Portis. Id take him over Kaminsky or Looney easily.

as someone else said, his ceiling is Kieff with better defense

that's pretty good, but I would still take Looney or Kaminsky or Lyles over him imo

[Mr-Al]

If available at #13, you take Frank Kaminsky and don't look back. People concerned about arm length shouldn't worry. A good comparison for Frank is Kevin Love. They both have the exact same arm length, and Frank is about 3" taller. Love is not a "long" player at all, but is beast on the boards. Love only played one year in college versus 4 years for Kaminsky. However Franks had roughly equivalent stats his last 2 years to Love during his one year in college. I think Love is the perfect comparison for Frank, minus the diva attitude!

They're not similar very much in terms of their games but Frank is similar to Love in that I think he will succeed regardless of his lack of elite length or athleticism. He will rely on his IQ and skill and like Love, that will be enough

[Mr-Al]

If they are adamant in bringing in a veteran.

Suns / Nets
Morris twins + pick 13
for
Brook Lopez

Why the **** would we make that trade? Easiest pass in the world

Lopez doesn't fit our style of play in the slightest
Terrible rebounder
Terrible motor
Paid way too much
Way to injury prone. Like how could you even consider this, even with our training staff
We're already more than fine at the center position with Len

[jredsaz]

How so? Read what I wrote again:

-Bledsoe starts year #2 of his deal--FACT
-$13.5M, or 20%, or 1/5th of our Salary Cap ($67.1M) for 2015/2016--FACT
-Right now, Bledsoe is the 7th highest paid PG in the league--FACT
-He is not the 7th best PG in the league--OPINION

And, you pretty much just wrote what I said, just in a different way. Next year, his deal will be a bargain--most likely. Once the Morri's case has been resolved and they suffer no time lost, yes, they have good value.

I think I'm not communicating very well my point, which is, at this point, both Bledsoe and the Morri do not have positive value. Next year, IF the assault charges are dropped, then absolutely, the Morri will be a bargain. Maybe even much sooner, but UNTIL the charges are dropped or they are found innocent, they do not have positive value.

Go ahead--I challenge anyone to put forth that deal, of right now--not next year, or once the Morri's case is resolved--right at his moment in time, of Bledsoe, Tucker and the Morri for the 4th overall pick in either the Knicks forum or the trade forum, and do a poll to see who 'wins' that deal. If the result after 3-4 days is that the Knicks win that deal, point it out to me, and I'll admit I was wrong. And since you and Damkac are so positive I'm wrong, you should have no issue with this.

How so? None of the things you mentioned are attributes that will limit his value.

1. Bledsoe does start year two of his deal and according to Basketball Reference, Hoopshype and Sheridan Hoops has four years remaining on his contract, three of which will be under the new salary cap paradigm.

2. The fact that his salary represents 20% of the cap is a) commensurate with the second tear, borderline-all-star talent that is early in his contract and b) ABSOLUTELY IRRELEVANT. If we trade Bledsoe it will be to a team that will send back expiring(s), young talent, and picks. If the Suns dealt Bledsoe to NY, Suns would take back Calderon. If Suns dealt Bledsoe to the Kings, they would take back either Landry or Thompson. The salary exchange diminishes the cap impact of Bledsoe's acquisition. Further, the opportunity for a team to unload unwanted salary in a Bledsoe trade further increases his potential trade value.

3. He is paid as the 7th best point guard because the advanced stats point to the fact that he can be reasonably considered the 7th best PG in the NBA. More importantly, due to the length of his deal and the impending increase in the cap, by August 2016 he will be paid like the 15th best PG in the NBA. AGAIN, this adds value.

[drewsprocket]

Ok so why isn't Kevin Looney rated higher in the draft? I've heard people talk on this thread about him and after some videos on him, he looks really legit. A lengthy wing who can shoot and rebound and take it coast to coast. He reminds me of Uncle Cliff. How is he not a mid 1st round pick on everyone's board here. He isn't an athletic freak but he has motor, hustle, good IQ, and a shot from outside.

[bwgood77]

Ok so why isn't Kevin Looney rated higher in the draft? I've heard people talk on this thread about him and after some videos on him, he looks really legit. A lengthy wing who can shoot and rebound and take it coast to coast. He reminds me of Uncle Cliff. How is he not a mid 1st round pick on everyone's board here. He isn't an athletic freak but he has motor, hustle, good IQ, and a shot from outside.

I think many have wondered that, though the injury concern was mentioned a few posts above, so that is obviously part of it. It just depends on what teams need. I think the biggest concern is that he could be more of a tweener, but I think his length and great rebounding #s bode well for playing him at PF. I like him.

As for potentially trading the pick, I think the league has (much like people here) has grown more infatuated with potential over proven production, and picks may be overvalued, and if that is the case, saying you are open to trading it is a good thing to say...to see what offers people make. That being said, I also like the thought of potential, and unless we are getting a guy that is really proven and could really help be a big role model for our young guys, I wouldn't trade it. A guy like David West would be perfect as a role model and team leader, but he is probably too old to be a part of a successful future contending team, so giving up a lottery pick for a guy like that may be short sighted.

Ultimately I don't think McD trades it unless he just gets a killer offer......best case scenario IF he trades down is we get a good vet to help lead and bring along the young guys and we still only move down like 7 or so spots at the most and still get a guy like Looney. Maybe a team desperately wanting a shooter who has depth and can give up a good asset and then we get a guy a little later like Looney or Portis or Lyles with the later pick.

[thamadkant]

If they are adamant in bringing in a veteran.

Suns / Nets
Morris twins + pick 13
for
Brook Lopez

Why the **** would we make that trade? Easiest pass in the world

Lopez doesn't fit our style of play in the slightest
Terrible rebounder
Terrible motor
Paid way too much
Way to injury prone. Like how could you even consider this, even with our training staff
We're already more than fine at the center position with Len

Why the **** wouldn't they?

You don't know what McD and the FO is thinking.

Check Lopez stats when healthy which is the 2nd half of the season and his playoff stats.

If they want to desperate make the playoffs and get a veteran in doing so... Then they'll consider bringing in size since they lack size at the moment. 20/7/2 is not bad from Lopez.... Len will grab the rebounds and protect the paint with him.

[StarMaker]

I really like Frank Kaminsky. If he is still available at 13th pick, we should select him. IMO, he will be a Superstar in the league someday. His attitude, work ethic, self-discipline, personality, all of things are excellent.

Look at that http://moosebball.blogspot.kr/2015/05/t ... f.html?m=1
He penned a farewell to Wisconsin. I love it.

I am certain that he wil become a Superstar like Steve Nash did.
I of course know his subpar level of athleticism, short wingspan, age, but he can overcome all of drawbacks people say. I make no doubt of his success in NBA.

Pick The Moose!!!

[Mulhollanddrive]

Sounds like Hornacek wants to trade pick 13 for the next Marcus Thornton.

That'll be well recieved here!

I don't understand the Kaminsky hype, he projects to be Cody Zeller but not as good.

[RaisingArizona]

Sounds like Hornacek wants to trade pick 13 for the next Marcus Thornton.

That'll be well recieved here!

I don't understand the Kaminsky hype, he projects to be Cody Zeller but not as good.

Cody Zeller was never this good offensively.

[Mulhollanddrive]

I'd be hugely surprised if we take him, doesn't fit McDonough's profile.

I was reading the same things about Doug McDermott last year about his offensive being compared to Kevin Love.

These guys are going outside the top 10 for a reason. The ones I'd target are high risk, as that's the reason, not lack of upside.

[Mr-Al]

If they are adamant in bringing in a veteran.

Suns / Nets
Morris twins + pick 13
for
Brook Lopez

Why the **** would we make that trade? Easiest pass in the world

Lopez doesn't fit our style of play in the slightest
Terrible rebounder
Terrible motor
Paid way too much
Way to injury prone. Like how could you even consider this, even with our training staff
We're already more than fine at the center position with Len

Why the **** wouldn't they?

You don't know what McD and the FO is thinking.

Check Lopez stats when healthy which is the 2nd half of the season and his playoff stats.

If they want to desperate make the playoffs and get a veteran in doing so... Then they'll consider bringing in size since they lack size at the moment. 20/7/2 is not bad from Lopez.... Len will grab the rebounds and protect the paint with him.

wow. "when healthy"

that's convincing

and Len and Brook can't in any shape or form play together

We lack size at the PF position, not the damn center position

Getting one of the most injury prone, high paid players in the league to play a position we're already set in doesn't help us make the playoffs in the slightest and would probably be the first move a GM would make if they had the sole intention of hurting this team