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WT: Bulls Fire Thibodeau

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Re: WT: Thibs May be available 

Post#101 » by kblo247 » Fri May 29, 2015 1:35 am

LApwnd wrote:
Sofa King wrote:I wish the Lakers hired Steve Kerr seeing how the Dubs are playing. Steve Kerr will be the Zen Master 2.0

helps that the roster was already made for him....I highly doubt Kerr would have any more success than Scott with the roster we had. I'd take thibs as an asst. for D but Scott O kinda blows to, I'd prefer we find an asst. that can create better flowing offense. I never liked any of Scotts teams even the winning one with Nets or NOLA

He has common sense. He understands what Scott doesn't, and it's not solely a both talent.

He isn't a micromanaging dictator. That is what he learned from Phil letting Cleamons, Hamblen, and Tex a manage the team during practices and in huddles. It's what Scott did in his only coaching success with Frank and Jordan before he became touchy and got in his feelings that Jordan and Frank were more liked and respected, so he stuck to yes men. Gentry, Adams, Walton, and Collins. Gentry was a former head coach so he knows what it is to fail, succeed, and everything between similar to Cleamons. He went got his tell it to him straight up whether he wants to hear it or not guy in Adams, much like how Phil had tex, and tex would call Phil out when he crossed the line or even insult Kobe or Shaq to their face if needed. He got a guy who is smart and can mix it up with guys in practice, knows the game, and has helped a team win before in Luke which is like how Phil kept hodges, Shaw, and the like around. And lastly he got his over the top obsessive scout who will document everything about an upcoming opponent from hours over film in Collins, which is what Hamblen did. Kerr even lets them run a practice; Scott hasn't relented power or his voice since jersey and that's a vast reason he wears so fn thin on everyone everywhere he goes. It also is why his D and his O have historically sucked multiple times.


He knows roles and rotations. You don't just decide to shake things up in 20 game increments. No you see what works, who subs best for who, and what the team needs. Scott benched Lin and Booz after his magical 20 game number and let the media explain it to them. He shuffled price, Tarik, Sacre, Kelly, Wes and the like in and out based on numbers of games played over actual chemistry or feel. Kerr on the other hand made GSW get reserve charts who are the opposite of his starters in Livingston and Barbosa. Kerr set Iggy down and explained how he needed him to come off the bench and lead defensively and needed Barnes to start, while telling Barnes to settle for a smaller offensive role with the starters. He talked Bogut into a management plan, cut Lee in favor of a stretch 4 in the mold of odom/Horry/Kukoc in draymond green, and he cycles Speights and EZili over the way Jackson overused JO to he dropped dead. Steph and crew played a great year with little injuries because he managed them well, and he didn't run them ragged like Scott admitted to over using Kobe to offset his own shortcomings. He set a bar and said show me, and his team responded.

And the the biggest difference is just personality. Kerr is a PC guy, but he is also a guy who can explain himself without being insulted. Scott is abrasive, dismissive, and rubs people wrong every stop from players to management because he's well a douche. If Scott learned to communicate at all with Kidd, Martin, Jefferson, Kittles, Tyson, Peja, Bonzi, west, Kyrie, waiters, Thompson, Nick, Lin, Booz, and a number of guys everywhere he's been, he would actually have had a job stuck, get defensive effort, and not be number 2 all time for losses by a coach who coached 1000 games.


They are just worlds apart because they are wired different. Kerr knows when to not get in his own way because he's not threatened. His time as a gm may have helped him, as well as pop and Phil, but make no mistake, Kerr is better because Kerr gets it
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Re: Re: WT: Bulls Fire Thibodeau 

Post#102 » by Laker_Kid » Fri May 29, 2015 5:54 am

kblo247 wrote:I'd still pay Thibs to manage the D of this team. Scott isn't fit to be a head coach. Thibs isn't either. They would probably make good co-coaches to hide each other's deficiencies. Scott knows more about O, but he's god awful at D. Thibs knows about D but his O can be a grinding mess. They both have grating personalities that wear thin which is a problem. But he's exactly what Scott needs to have success, similar to how Eddie Jordan ran the O and Lawerence Frank the D for the nets because Byron couldn't. I'd look to revamp our assistant pool just because its crap outside Madsen really
would you give Nash a try?
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Re: WT: Thibs May be available 

Post#103 » by Jedi32 » Sat May 30, 2015 4:21 am

kblo247 wrote:
LApwnd wrote:
Sofa King wrote:I wish the Lakers hired Steve Kerr seeing how the Dubs are playing. Steve Kerr will be the Zen Master 2.0

helps that the roster was already made for him....I highly doubt Kerr would have any more success than Scott with the roster we had. I'd take thibs as an asst. for D but Scott O kinda blows to, I'd prefer we find an asst. that can create better flowing offense. I never liked any of Scotts teams even the winning one with Nets or NOLA

He has common sense. He understands what Scott doesn't, and it's not solely a both talent.

He isn't a micromanaging dictator. That is what he learned from Phil letting Cleamons, Hamblen, and Tex a manage the team during practices and in huddles. It's what Scott did in his only coaching success with Frank and Jordan before he became touchy and got in his feelings that Jordan and Frank were more liked and respected, so he stuck to yes men. Gentry, Adams, Walton, and Collins. Gentry was a former head coach so he knows what it is to fail, succeed, and everything between similar to Cleamons. He went got his tell it to him straight up whether he wants to hear it or not guy in Adams, much like how Phil had tex, and tex would call Phil out when he crossed the line or even insult Kobe or Shaq to their face if needed. He got a guy who is smart and can mix it up with guys in practice, knows the game, and has helped a team win before in Luke which is like how Phil kept hodges, Shaw, and the like around. And lastly he got his over the top obsessive scout who will document everything about an upcoming opponent from hours over film in Collins, which is what Hamblen did. Kerr even lets them run a practice; Scott hasn't relented power or his voice since jersey and that's a vast reason he wears so fn thin on everyone everywhere he goes. It also is why his D and his O have historically sucked multiple times.


He knows roles and rotations. You don't just decide to shake things up in 20 game increments. No you see what works, who subs best for who, and what the team needs. Scott benched Lin and Booz after his magical 20 game number and let the media explain it to them. He shuffled price, Tarik, Sacre, Kelly, Wes and the like in and out based on numbers of games played over actual chemistry or feel. Kerr on the other hand made GSW get reserve charts who are the opposite of his starters in Livingston and Barbosa. Kerr set Iggy down and explained how he needed him to come off the bench and lead defensively and needed Barnes to start, while telling Barnes to settle for a smaller offensive role with the starters. He talked Bogut into a management plan, cut Lee in favor of a stretch 4 in the mold of odom/Horry/Kukoc in draymond green, and he cycles Speights and EZili over the way Jackson overused JO to he dropped dead. Steph and crew played a great year with little injuries because he managed them well, and he didn't run them ragged like Scott admitted to over using Kobe to offset his own shortcomings. He set a bar and said show me, and his team responded.

And the the biggest difference is just personality. Kerr is a PC guy, but he is also a guy who can explain himself without being insulted. Scott is abrasive, dismissive, and rubs people wrong every stop from players to management because he's well a douche. If Scott learned to communicate at all with Kidd, Martin, Jefferson, Kittles, Tyson, Peja, Bonzi, west, Kyrie, waiters, Thompson, Nick, Lin, Booz, and a number of guys everywhere he's been, he would actually have had a job stuck, get defensive effort, and not be number 2 all time for losses by a coach who coached 1000 games.


They are just worlds apart because they are wired different. Kerr knows when to not get in his own way because he's not threatened. His time as a gm may have helped him, as well as pop and Phil, but make no mistake, Kerr is better because Kerr gets it

Kerr just inherited a loaded roster
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Re: WT: Thibs May be available 

Post#104 » by DEEP3CL » Sat May 30, 2015 9:13 am

kblo247 wrote:
LApwnd wrote:
Sofa King wrote:I wish the Lakers hired Steve Kerr seeing how the Dubs are playing. Steve Kerr will be the Zen Master 2.0

helps that the roster was already made for him....I highly doubt Kerr would have any more success than Scott with the roster we had. I'd take thibs as an asst. for D but Scott O kinda blows to, I'd prefer we find an asst. that can create better flowing offense. I never liked any of Scotts teams even the winning one with Nets or NOLA

He has common sense. He understands what Scott doesn't, and it's not solely a both talent.

He isn't a micromanaging dictator. That is what he learned from Phil letting Cleamons, Hamblen, and Tex a manage the team during practices and in huddles. It's what Scott did in his only coaching success with Frank and Jordan before he became touchy and got in his feelings that Jordan and Frank were more liked and respected, so he stuck to yes men. Gentry, Adams, Walton, and Collins. Gentry was a former head coach so he knows what it is to fail, succeed, and everything between similar to Cleamons. He went got his tell it to him straight up whether he wants to hear it or not guy in Adams, much like how Phil had tex, and tex would call Phil out when he crossed the line or even insult Kobe or Shaq to their face if needed. He got a guy who is smart and can mix it up with guys in practice, knows the game, and has helped a team win before in Luke which is like how Phil kept hodges, Shaw, and the like around. And lastly he got his over the top obsessive scout who will document everything about an upcoming opponent from hours over film in Collins, which is what Hamblen did. Kerr even lets them run a practice; Scott hasn't relented power or his voice since jersey and that's a vast reason he wears so fn thin on everyone everywhere he goes. It also is why his D and his O have historically sucked multiple times.


He knows roles and rotations. You don't just decide to shake things up in 20 game increments. No you see what works, who subs best for who, and what the team needs. Scott benched Lin and Booz after his magical 20 game number and let the media explain it to them. He shuffled price, Tarik, Sacre, Kelly, Wes and the like in and out based on numbers of games played over actual chemistry or feel. Kerr on the other hand made GSW get reserve charts who are the opposite of his starters in Livingston and Barbosa. Kerr set Iggy down and explained how he needed him to come off the bench and lead defensively and needed Barnes to start, while telling Barnes to settle for a smaller offensive role with the starters. He talked Bogut into a management plan, cut Lee in favor of a stretch 4 in the mold of odom/Horry/Kukoc in draymond green, and he cycles Speights and EZili over the way Jackson overused JO to he dropped dead. Steph and crew played a great year with little injuries because he managed them well, and he didn't run them ragged like Scott admitted to over using Kobe to offset his own shortcomings. He set a bar and said show me, and his team responded.

And the the biggest difference is just personality. Kerr is a PC guy, but he is also a guy who can explain himself without being insulted. Scott is abrasive, dismissive, and rubs people wrong every stop from players to management because he's well a douche. If Scott learned to communicate at all with Kidd, Martin, Jefferson, Kittles, Tyson, Peja, Bonzi, west, Kyrie, waiters, Thompson, Nick, Lin, Booz, and a number of guys everywhere he's been, he would actually have had a job stuck, get defensive effort, and not be number 2 all time for losses by a coach who coached 1000 games.


They are just worlds apart because they are wired different. Kerr knows when to not get in his own way because he's not threatened. His time as a gm may have helped him, as well as pop and Phil, but make no mistake, Kerr is better because Kerr gets it
C'mon man it's apples and oranges trying to compare Scott and Kerr. Kerr walked into a room with diamonds laid out on the table, Scott walked in a dark room because it was no power in it to begin with.

I'm not going to debate all of your post, it's very factual but to a degree it's a reason Scott is the way he is. He got burned by probably letting assistants like Jordan and Frank have too much say so. This is an age old battle with coaches, assistants have to show a certain amount of loyalty...Frank and Jordan showed none. You have to remember every assistant in the NBA wants to be a head one day.

The best way to do that is to undermine the head coach, this happens on every level of ball from high school to AAU to college to the pros. Now I'm not saying it's an excuse for Byron to do some of the things he did...I'll let it be known I was pissed at a lot of it, especially Boozer's situation.

Time will tell if Byron can one day find that comfort zone of letting his assistant actually carry the work load, all a coach has to do is come up with the philosophy of how the team should play. If the assistants buy into that so will the players.

As for Kerr...it's all cute now, us being fans of teams that have won titles, we know what breaks them up. Hell it happens in every sport once a team wins. We'll see if the Warriors want to play that game, winning titles takes money.

It's a bunch of underlying problems waiting to attack like acid....
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SmartWentCrazy wrote:It's extremely unlikely that they end up in the top 3.They're probably better off trying to win and giving Philly the 8th pick than tanking and giving them the 4th.
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Re: WT: Bulls Fire Thibodeau 

Post#105 » by kblo247 » Sat May 30, 2015 11:50 pm

Jedi32 that's like saying Phil inherited one from Doug Collins and ignoring this same squad had hit a wall and needed to be taught and rallied to actually win. Kerr did what Phil did with Chicago and even la
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Re: WT: Bulls Fire Thibodeau 

Post#106 » by Sedition » Sun May 31, 2015 12:49 am

As great a coach as Thibs may be, I'm not so sure he's the right coach for this team from a culture standpoint. The grind it down style of play may go over well in the east/midwest where they appreciate gritty play and defense, but my gut feeling is that the fans here will tire of his uninventive offense and playing style relatively quickly. No doubt he's a talented coach, but the I'm sure that management realizes that their business is entertainment, and they are selling a product to a different demographic than exists in a no-nonsense city like Chicago.
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Re: WT: Bulls Fire Thibodeau 

Post#107 » by DEEP3CL » Sun May 31, 2015 1:34 am

Might as well kill the Thibs talk, Gentry to Pels sews up the last opening. Like I said gonna be awhile before he coaches again. This makes two years in a row that coaches have been fired and the owners of those teams put in clear detail why they were fired. Both Jackson and Thibs had the same issues in terms of working with the upper management, and if management of other teams see how it unraveled...why would they put their foot in that fire ?

Thibs will get back on, just not for a few years. The next coaching openings down the line could come from Toronto, Philadelphia and from any other team that grows antsy from another early playoff exit.
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SmartWentCrazy wrote:It's extremely unlikely that they end up in the top 3.They're probably better off trying to win and giving Philly the 8th pick than tanking and giving them the 4th.
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Re: WT: Bulls Fire Thibodeau 

Post#108 » by john248 » Mon Jun 1, 2015 10:54 pm

Well, Scott will be here for at least another year as the majority of us already knew even before that Thibs rumor.

As for Mike Brown, we all know about his stagnant offense and his reputation as a defensive coach. The problem with him was he never evolved as the league evolved, so his defensive schemes were dated. The Lakers had to learn the hard way which is generally the case with retread coaches.

Thibs isn't a retread head coach. His defensive philosophies are still what the league looks to. He'll get a job sooner than later since he is still regarded as someone with a great basketball mind. The only thing that will keep him from a job is if he wants to keep the Bulls on the hook for the remainder of his contract and just collect checks. Plenty of far lesser coaches are in the league including Scott.
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