ImageImageImageImageImage

Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today

Moderators: j4remi, NoLayupRule, HerSports85, GONYK, Jeff Van Gully, dakomish23, Deeeez Knicks, mpharris36

DickGrayson
Veteran
Posts: 2,941
And1: 2,080
Joined: Jan 15, 2015

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#201 » by DickGrayson » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:44 pm

NoLayupRule wrote:
DickGrayson wrote:http://dailyknicks.com/2015/05/31/repor ... th-knicks/

Embrace it.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_STOxlMYqI[/youtube]

Winslow is awfully damn good but he's gonna see a very different defense in the NBA and his post up / drive through won't work so well either


I believe these players will adjust and improve. Russell can only drive effectively to one side, once NBA defenses pick that up, Russell will struggle, but that's apart about being a rookie. I don't think Russell or Winslow will have the same game 3-5 years from now. These fellas are still learning and maturing. I can't lose my faith in gym rats. I use to be a S&C coach at Manhattan College, worked with Chris Smith and even Danny Green's brother. Lazy guys suffer trying to get through the NBA learning curves. Guys like Towns, Mudiay and Winslow love the grind, challenges and hard work.

We're very lucky to be in this draft.
User avatar
GONYK
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 66,919
And1: 45,535
Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Location: Brunson Gang
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#202 » by GONYK » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:47 pm

Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Sark wrote:

As it's been said before, winning is not in your control. Losing is.


Say it as often as you like. Doesn't make it true.



Then we should just make ourselves go 82-0 next year.


It is just as likely as going 0-82
User avatar
Deeeez Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 49,243
And1: 55,148
Joined: Nov 12, 2004

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#203 » by Deeeez Knicks » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:47 pm

I’d at least rather have Winslow then WCS. I think he’d be a good F complement to Melo.
Mavs
C: Horford | Goga | Paul Reed |
PF: Lauri Markkanen | Randle | Tucker
SF: Trey Murphy | Trent | Anderson | Simone
SG: Vassell | Trent | Livingston
PG: Spida | Mann | Deuce
Greenie
RealGM
Posts: 58,966
And1: 30,697
Joined: Feb 25, 2010

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#204 » by Greenie » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:47 pm

Ok. My dream team for June 2nd:

WCS/O'Quinn/Hollins
Gibson/Biyombo/Amundson
Anthony/McDaniels/Asdfghjkl
Green/McLemore/Shved
Joseph/Galloway/McCallum
User avatar
NoLayupRule
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 48,099
And1: 11,028
Joined: Dec 06, 2002
Location: Playoffs Fool!
Contact:

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#205 » by NoLayupRule » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:48 pm

DickGrayson wrote:
NoLayupRule wrote:
DickGrayson wrote:http://dailyknicks.com/2015/05/31/repor ... th-knicks/

Embrace it.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_STOxlMYqI[/youtube]

Winslow is awfully damn good but he's gonna see a very different defense in the NBA and his post up / drive through won't work so well either


I believe these players will adjust and improve. Russell can only drive effectively to one side, once NBA defenses pick that up, Russell will struggle, but that's apart about being a rookie. I don't think Russell or Winslow will have the same game 3-5 years from now. These fellas are still learning and maturing. I can't lose my faith in gym rats. I use to be a S&C coach at Manhattan College, worked with Chris Smith and even Danny Green's brother. Lazy guys suffer trying to get through the NBA learning curves. Guys like Towns, Mudiay and Winslow love the grind, challenges and hard work.

We're very lucky to be in this draft.

good points

I don't see these guys sitting on a contract and not improving their games either

Shooting, of all things, is the most improvable skill
that and free throw shooting
User avatar
GONYK
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 66,919
And1: 45,535
Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Location: Brunson Gang
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#206 » by GONYK » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:50 pm

NoLayupRule wrote:
DickGrayson wrote:
NoLayupRule wrote:Winslow is awfully damn good but he's gonna see a very different defense in the NBA and his post up / drive through won't work so well either


I believe these players will adjust and improve. Russell can only drive effectively to one side, once NBA defenses pick that up, Russell will struggle, but that's apart about being a rookie. I don't think Russell or Winslow will have the same game 3-5 years from now. These fellas are still learning and maturing. I can't lose my faith in gym rats. I use to be a S&C coach at Manhattan College, worked with Chris Smith and even Danny Green's brother. Lazy guys suffer trying to get through the NBA learning curves. Guys like Towns, Mudiay and Winslow love the grind, challenges and hard work.

We're very lucky to be in this draft.

good points

I don't see these guys sitting on a contract and not improving their games either

Shooting, of all things, is the most improvable skill
that and free throw shooting


That is the strongest argument for Mudiay yet :lol:
User avatar
K_ick_God
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 80,879
And1: 43,336
Joined: Oct 10, 2003
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#207 » by K_ick_God » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:56 pm

Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Sark wrote:

As it's been said before, winning is not in your control. Losing is.


Say it as often as you like. Doesn't make it true.



Then we should just make ourselves go 82-0 next year.


Sark, the Lakers won more games and got a higher pick. So did the Sixers. This will never be a rare occurrence with the way the odds are set -- in fact the Knicks had a greater chance of falling back than staying at 2 or improving to 1.
User avatar
NoLayupRule
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 48,099
And1: 11,028
Joined: Dec 06, 2002
Location: Playoffs Fool!
Contact:

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#208 » by NoLayupRule » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:56 pm

GONYK wrote:
NoLayupRule wrote:
DickGrayson wrote:
I believe these players will adjust and improve. Russell can only drive effectively to one side, once NBA defenses pick that up, Russell will struggle, but that's apart about being a rookie. I don't think Russell or Winslow will have the same game 3-5 years from now. These fellas are still learning and maturing. I can't lose my faith in gym rats. I use to be a S&C coach at Manhattan College, worked with Chris Smith and even Danny Green's brother. Lazy guys suffer trying to get through the NBA learning curves. Guys like Towns, Mudiay and Winslow love the grind, challenges and hard work.

We're very lucky to be in this draft.

good points

I don't see these guys sitting on a contract and not improving their games either

Shooting, of all things, is the most improvable skill
that and free throw shooting


That is the strongest argument for Mudiay yet :lol:

yeah, its why I can't worry to much about him

Hee seems to have everything but shooting right now and even his shooting mechanics seem to be pretty solid

Ill bet as draft night nears we hear a lot more talk about him rising and Russell or Okafor dropping
User avatar
Sark
RealGM
Posts: 19,274
And1: 16,051
Joined: Sep 21, 2010
Location: Merry Pills
 

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#209 » by Sark » Tue Jun 2, 2015 6:58 pm

GONYK wrote:
Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Say it as often as you like. Doesn't make it true.



Then we should just make ourselves go 82-0 next year.


It is just as likely as going 0-82



It's a lot more possible to go 0-82, than it is 82-0. I shouldn't have to explain why.
User avatar
Sark
RealGM
Posts: 19,274
And1: 16,051
Joined: Sep 21, 2010
Location: Merry Pills
 

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#210 » by Sark » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:00 pm

KnicksGod wrote:
Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Say it as often as you like. Doesn't make it true.



Then we should just make ourselves go 82-0 next year.


Sark, the Lakers won more games and got a higher pick. So did the Sixers. This will never be a rare occurrence with the way the odds are set -- in fact the Knicks had a greater chance of falling back than staying at 2 or improving to 1.



And the Wolves won fewer, and got the #1 pick. What's your point? That was the spot we held all season long. We fumbled at the 1 yard line.
User avatar
K_ick_God
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 80,879
And1: 43,336
Joined: Oct 10, 2003
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#211 » by K_ick_God » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:00 pm

Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Sark wrote:

Then we should just make ourselves go 82-0 next year.


It is just as likely as going 0-82


It's a lot more possible to go 0-82, than it is 82-0. I shouldn't have to explain why.


Effectively it's not. You can't throw games and have it fly under the radar. There's a 0% chance of either happening.
User avatar
GONYK
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 66,919
And1: 45,535
Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Location: Brunson Gang
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#212 » by GONYK » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:01 pm

Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Sark wrote:

Then we should just make ourselves go 82-0 next year.


It is just as likely as going 0-82



It's a lot more possible to go 0-82, than it is 82-0. I shouldn't have to explain why.


Tell that to the Sixers. They have been trying for 2 years.

So really, the odds of either happening are at 0%. That is why it has never happened.
User avatar
K_ick_God
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 80,879
And1: 43,336
Joined: Oct 10, 2003
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#213 » by K_ick_God » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:05 pm

Sark wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:
Sark wrote:

Then we should just make ourselves go 82-0 next year.


Sark, the Lakers won more games and got a higher pick. So did the Sixers. This will never be a rare occurrence with the way the odds are set -- in fact the Knicks had a greater chance of falling back than staying at 2 or improving to 1.



And the Wolves won fewer, and got the #1 pick. What's your point? That was the spot we held all season long. We fumbled at the 1 yard line.


There isn't some God of the Odds who says, 'This year, whoever has the most balls will get the 1st pick." You'd have a 1 in 4 chance always. If the Wolves or the Knicks or anybody had enough spins with the most balls, they'd still get the top spot only 25% of the time. You think the Wolves stole the Knicks' winning ball by dropping behind us late? That's not how it works.
User avatar
CoolKids
RealGM
Posts: 14,447
And1: 2,650
Joined: Feb 17, 2009
Location: The Bronx
     

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#214 » by CoolKids » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:06 pm

greenhughes wrote:Ok. My dream team for June 2nd:

WCS/O'Quinn/Hollins
Gibson/Biyombo/Amundson
Anthony/McDaniels/Asdfghjkl
Green/McLemore/Shved
Joseph/Galloway/McCallum

that team wouldnt crack 75 ppg
User avatar
Sark
RealGM
Posts: 19,274
And1: 16,051
Joined: Sep 21, 2010
Location: Merry Pills
 

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#215 » by Sark » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:07 pm

KnicksGod wrote:
Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
It is just as likely as going 0-82


It's a lot more possible to go 0-82, than it is 82-0. I shouldn't have to explain why.


Effectively it's not. You can't throw games and have it fly under the radar. There's a 0% chance of either happening.



When a boxing fight is fixed, do they say "knock him out in the 5th" or do they say "take a fall in the 5th"? Why do you think they choose the latter? It's basic common sense to know that you can make yourself lose anytime you want.

I'm not saying that 0-82 is likely. I am saying it's more likely than 82-0. Not to say that either will ever happen, but the odds of a winless season are greater than the odds of a perfect season.

Losing a few more games was in our control. Winning more games was not. And that's the bottom line. We had the worst record in the bag, until we fcked it up at the end. And it's crap like that which will guarantee another decade of irrelevance for this franchise.
User avatar
Sark
RealGM
Posts: 19,274
And1: 16,051
Joined: Sep 21, 2010
Location: Merry Pills
 

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#216 » by Sark » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:08 pm

GONYK wrote:
Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
It is just as likely as going 0-82



It's a lot more possible to go 0-82, than it is 82-0. I shouldn't have to explain why.


Tell that to the Sixers. They have been trying for 2 years.

So really, the odds of either happening are at 0%. That is why it has never happened.



The odds of each are not 0%, just because they never happened.
User avatar
GONYK
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 66,919
And1: 45,535
Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Location: Brunson Gang
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#217 » by GONYK » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:12 pm

Sark wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:
Sark wrote:
It's a lot more possible to go 0-82, than it is 82-0. I shouldn't have to explain why.


Effectively it's not. You can't throw games and have it fly under the radar. There's a 0% chance of either happening.



When a boxing fight is fixed, do they say "knock him out in the 5th" or do they say "take a fall in the 5th"? Why do you think they choose the latter? It's basic common sense to know that you can make yourself lose anytime you want.

I'm not saying that 0-82 is likely. I am saying it's more likely than 82-0. Not to say that either will ever happen, but the odds of a winless season are greater than the odds of a perfect season.

Losing a few more games was in our control. Winning more games was not. And that's the bottom line. We had the worst record in the bag, until we fcked it up at the end. And it's crap like that which will guarantee another decade of irrelevance for this franchise.


Bad example. Boxing is one person vs. one person. The tanking boxer only needs to control himself.

Basketball is 12 vs 12 vs the probability of baskets falling on a certain night.
User avatar
GONYK
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 66,919
And1: 45,535
Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Location: Brunson Gang
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#218 » by GONYK » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:14 pm

Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Sark wrote:

It's a lot more possible to go 0-82, than it is 82-0. I shouldn't have to explain why.


Tell that to the Sixers. They have been trying for 2 years.

So really, the odds of either happening are at 0%. That is why it has never happened.



The odds of each are not 0%, just because they never happened.


Effectively, it is.

I get what you are saying logically, but there is no real way to account for all the variables in every game.
User avatar
K_ick_God
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 80,879
And1: 43,336
Joined: Oct 10, 2003
   

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#219 » by K_ick_God » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:15 pm

Sark wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Sark wrote:

It's a lot more possible to go 0-82, than it is 82-0. I shouldn't have to explain why.


Tell that to the Sixers. They have been trying for 2 years.

So really, the odds of either happening are at 0%. That is why it has never happened.


The odds of each are not 0%, just because they never happened.


0% for each. For a team to throw a whole season, as you're claiming, would require there to be an incentive for the team to expose itself to investigation and punishment for throwing games. What would that incentive be? A 25% chance of winning the lottery? You have a 25% chance to get the top pick and an 85% of having any pick taken away? Don't say it wouldn't be obvious for a team to lose 0-82 on purpose. It would be.

For it to randomly happen despite good faith of the owner/GM and coach -- which would defeat the purpose of what you're supposing (you have more control over losing than winning, as you say) -- would be practically 0.
kane2021
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 17,005
And1: 6,067
Joined: Oct 03, 2008
Location: It's OK to feel that way. Just sick of hearing about it all the time.

Re: Draftexpress drops Mudiay down to pick #6 today 

Post#220 » by kane2021 » Tue Jun 2, 2015 7:16 pm

I know this is going to sound incredibly silly. But the knicks need a high flier at the 2 that gets a lot of highlight reel dunks and finishes. Exciting players like that get a lot of exposure and TV time. ESPN shoves them down your throat all day long. That makes more fans want to watch that players team. More televised games brings more positive exposure. The way the game is played today,... big athletes are at an advantage because all they have to do is get near the rim and jump. Guys like that also control the crowd and that influences teammates, and like it or not,.. the refs. Its the stuff manufactured stars are made of. I have always felt that one of the reasons carmelo does not get as much love (and calls) as others is because he is a more grounded player.
Image

Never underestimate the strength of knowledge.

Bring back the physical game and send the softies home.

Return to New York Knicks