2015 Pistons draft (poll)

[Redeemed]

I didnt put Justice Winslow because I think he will be draft before 8th pick.

you should take out Hezonja too then, the top7 is kind of clear at this point.
I voted for Oubre considering Hezonja wont be there.

I think he would be the most likely one to drop out of that top 7 of yours if one did, I would imagine it will go like this.

Wolves- KAT
Lakers- Okafor
Sixers- Russell
Knicks- Mudiay
Magic- Winslow
Kings- WCS
Denver- Hezonja
Detroit- Johnson/ Porzingis etc..

Basically if one of theses teams in the top7 take WCS or Turner then it will throw off your top 7 and teams reach for guys in the top 7 every year throwing off mocks.

I'm sure a lot of what we're hearing is smokescreens and gamesmanship; however, Trey Lyles name keeps popping up as a potential selection for the Knicks and some are predicting Porzingis to the Magic. If any of the rumors are true we could end up with a major shake up after the 3rd pick, something like this:

Wolves- KAT
Lakers- Okafor
Sixers- Russell
Knicks- Lyles (this would be insane...though I believe he has a tremendously high ceiling)
Magic- Porzingis (I think there's a strong chance of this happening)
Kings- WCS (Kings have been pining for a PF all season)
Denver- Mudiay (I think the Nuggets would go for Mudiay and get rid of Lawson)

I think it's highly unlikely things will shake out like the above. The Knicks would probably look to trade down before selecting Lyles with the 4th pick and would 5 through 6 really pass on Winslow?

[Redeemed]

I didnt put Justice Winslow because I think he will be draft before 8th pick.

you should take out Hezonja too then, the top7 is kind of clear at this point.
I voted for Oubre considering Hezonja wont be there.

why wouldn't Hezonja be there? he shows a ton of promise, but he's not by far better than other players. Fact if anything, he's a bigger risk coming out of international style play. He's not clearly on a different tier

Hezonja is proficient outside shooter toted as being this ruthless competitor who holds his teammates to a high standard (that's the good). He's also said to be a poor defender with suspect ballhandling skills. He could definitely drop out of the top 7.

[jakebernat]

i want to bring myself to love porzingis as a prospect, but i just can't deal with frail players who let themselves get pushed around. it's hard to break those "soft" habits after so long. i just have too many horrible memories of austin daye and charlie v.

as for hezonja, he's going to have an elite stroke with superb athleticism, but at this stage, he doesn't have much else to offer. his offense isn't all that well-rounded as he seems to fall in love with his jumper. i've seen too many highlights of him spotting up behind the 3-point line, literally no other movement off the ball, and shooting the second he touches the ball. that's just bad basketball, i don't care if it goes in. his attitude rubs me the wrong way too. that might be irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, but i just don't care for a kid thinking his s/hit don't stink because he can get hot from 3 and throw down a windmill. if we ended up with him, obviously i'd root for his success and hope that SVG would bring him along correctly, but there's just too many negatives for my liking.

so, in my opinion, that leaves portis and johnson as the two best players available. i like both prospects a great deal and think they both bring the defensive versatility that SVG is looking to add to the team. portis might be the better fit for the roster, but johnson might be the better overall prospect, especially if he can refine his perimeter game, and for that reason, i'd take stanley at 8.

[A_dub06]

i want to bring myself to love porzingis as a prospect, but i just can't deal with frail players who let themselves get pushed around. it's hard to break those "soft" habits after so long. i just have too many horrible memories of austin daye and charlie v.

as for hezonja, he's going to have an elite stroke with superb athleticism, but at this stage, he doesn't have much else to offer. his offense isn't all that well-rounded as he seems to fall in love with his jumper. i've seen too many highlights of him spotting up behind the 3-point line, literally no other movement off the ball, and shooting the second he touches the ball. that's just bad basketball, i don't care if it goes in. his attitude rubs me the wrong way too. that might be irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, but i just don't care for a kid thinking his s/hit don't stink because he can get hot from 3 and throw down a windmill. if we ended up with him, obviously i'd root for his success and hope that SVG would bring him along correctly, but there's just too many negatives for my liking.

I understand your concerns regarding the two, although I believe they will both turn out to be good prospects. A guy I played ball with for a few years went on to become a contracted European ball writer/scout for the GSW. In a nutshell he said that Porzingis is the real deal although for NBA standards his body is 2-3 years away from being ready. Hezonja could develop into an all-star but he must learn to stay focused and not zone out on defence. Draft express even said that he's a capable defender when is the locked in.





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[Blkbrd671]

you should take out Hezonja too then, the top7 is kind of clear at this point.
I voted for Oubre considering Hezonja wont be there.

why wouldn't Hezonja be there? he shows a ton of promise, but he's not by far better than other players. Fact if anything, he's a bigger risk coming out of international style play. He's not clearly on a different tier

Hezonja is proficient outside shooter toted as being this ruthless competitor who holds his teammates to a high standard (that's the good). He's also said to be a poor defender with suspect ballhandling skills. He could definitely drop out of the top 7.

If any 19 year old were to come to my job and try to set the standard, he has another thing coming. That's my problem with his attitude, and rubbing players the wrong way. As a 19 year old, who's not clearly better than all other players, he shouldn't be holding anyone to anything. Especially when your only playing one side of the court effectively. I think he'll thrive as a SG at the NBA level

[Pharaoh]

why wouldn't Hezonja be there? he shows a ton of promise, but he's not by far better than other players. Fact if anything, he's a bigger risk coming out of international style play. He's not clearly on a different tier

Hezonja is proficient outside shooter toted as being this ruthless competitor who holds his teammates to a high standard (that's the good). He's also said to be a poor defender with suspect ballhandling skills. He could definitely drop out of the top 7.

If any 19 year old were to come to my job and try to set the standard, he has another thing coming. That's my problem with his attitude, and rubbing players the wrong way. As a 19 year old, who's not clearly better than all other players, he shouldn't be holding anyone to anything. Especially when your only playing one side of the court effectively. I think he'll thrive as a SG at the NBA level

I seriously doubt he'd come into the locker room and cause problems with his mouth/attitude.

It's an unknown environment and I'm sure SVG & the coaches would let him know the deal before opening day.

IF Mario's work ethic is there he'll earn respect from his team mates.

Arrive early, push himself to win every drill/contest, stay late & repeat.

It's not that hard! IF you wanna be the best you cannot be out-worked.

IF Mario has that drive and we can draft him then you do it. If he's full of hot air you don't - the drama is knowing if he's full of it!

With all the physical tests and game film might show something it will always be the mental side of things that makes the difference

[Blkbrd671]

Hezonja is proficient outside shooter toted as being this ruthless competitor who holds his teammates to a high standard (that's the good). He's also said to be a poor defender with suspect ballhandling skills. He could definitely drop out of the top 7.

If any 19 year old were to come to my job and try to set the standard, he has another thing coming. That's my problem with his attitude, and rubbing players the wrong way. As a 19 year old, who's not clearly better than all other players, he shouldn't be holding anyone to anything. Especially when your only playing one side of the court effectively. I think he'll thrive as a SG at the NBA level

I seriously doubt he'd come into the locker room and cause problems with his mouth/attitude.

It's an unknown environment and I'm sure SVG & the coaches would let him know the deal before opening day.

IF Mario's work ethic is there he'll earn respect from his team mates.

Arrive early, push himself to win every drill/contest, stay late & repeat.

It's not that hard! IF you wanna be the best you cannot be out-worked.

IF Mario has that drive and we can draft him then you do it. If he's full of hot air you don't - the drama is knowing if he's full of it!

With all the physical tests and game film might show something it will always be the mental side of things that makes the difference

or draft a player with a equally high ceiling if not higher with no character issues or mental

[Pharaoh]

What exactly are the character issues? What's been seen or heard about Mario that is such a turn off?

I'm starting my scouting this weekend so might as well get him out if the way first.

From what I've seen/read so far Johnson is my pick simply due to defensive potential

[Redeemed]

What exactly are the character issues? What's been seen or heard about Mario that is such a turn off?

I'm starting my scouting this weekend so might as well get him out if the way first.

From what I've seen/read so far Johnson is my pick simply due to defensive potential

The book on Mario is that he's an intense competitor who gets after his teammates (like Kobe does) if they do not bring it. That's what I've read on him. I'm a fan of selecting Johnson because of his on the ball defense. The experts say he loses focus when it comes to off the ball defense and gets beat backdoor. It only takes once for SVG to see that before the F bombs come out the rook starts paying attention. I'd like get either Johnson or Winslow.

[Pharaoh]

What exactly are the character issues? What's been seen or heard about Mario that is such a turn off?

I'm starting my scouting this weekend so might as well get him out if the way first.

From what I've seen/read so far Johnson is my pick simply due to defensive potential

The book on Mario is that he's an intense competitor who gets after his teammates (like Kobe does) if they do not bring it. That's what I've read on him.

Surely there's more to it than that?

Cause that's what I'd be looking for:

A guy that is driven to be the best and is willing to work at it every day.

If he's all talk though people see through that and that's the type you don't want

[ufsports]

I voted for Henzoja because I'm a huge fan of his. I'm prolly biased because in my only 2K association he turned into a superstar and he's the only player whose highlights I've seen. I'm really fine with any of them and I'm just glad we have a great pick in the draft!

[whitehops]

What exactly are the character issues? What's been seen or heard about Mario that is such a turn off?

I'm starting my scouting this weekend so might as well get him out if the way first.

personally I don't even factor in off-court things when I evaluate prospects. the only thing one would have to go off of was reports and it is near impossible to gauge anything accurately that way. teams have psychologists that listen/participate in the interviews and they would determine what the prospect's mental makeup is.

my advice would be to just stick to what you see/read about their on-court ability.

[Pharaoh]

If the worst thing you can say about a prospect is that he's too intense, too driven, holds himself and team mates to a higher standard...that's not an insult!

I'm hoping someone can provide some real info about why Mario should be avoided due to character issues

[Blkbrd671]

What exactly are the character issues? What's been seen or heard about Mario that is such a turn off?

I'm starting my scouting this weekend so might as well get him out if the way first.

From what I've seen/read so far Johnson is my pick simply due to defensive potential

A 19 year old player that is known to check out on Defense, yelling at his teammates to play harder.

Its funny how we value offense so highly, when the NBA is a 2 way game and teams that contend typically have good defense as oppose to high power offense. Having said that, SJ is much more than a potentially great defender. He's versatile, his physical attributes are unique for his position, his offensive game is not as further along, however he definitely can score the ball, and is increasing his offensive skill set. Also high character and relationship with our core players already.

[Blkbrd671]

What exactly are the character issues? What's been seen or heard about Mario that is such a turn off?

I'm starting my scouting this weekend so might as well get him out if the way first.

personally I don't even factor in off-court things when I evaluate prospects. the only thing one would have to go off of was reports and it is near impossible to gauge anything accurately that way. teams have psychologists that listen/participate in the interviews and they would determine what the prospect's mental makeup is.

my advice would be to just stick to what you see/read about their on-court ability.

That's unforunate as SVG has said he values high character. I am sure the rockets will rethink their approach after Royce White fiasco. Prospects are coached to pass character evals and interviews and media sessions. As that can be the difference between 1st and 2nd round pick. The fact that he's known to check out defensively, but is also known to get after teammates, makes me think he's a hypocrite. You must lead by example. When you combine the character reports with, the fact he's been playing against Euro comp, he doesn't show much ability to create his shot, he's not as appealing. Especially in this draft with other prospects at his position who's concerns are more development driven and have been playing against comp more similar to the NBA style.

[Kilo]

Is Hezonja's team still alive? IIRC if his team made it all the way to the finals it could be mid June before he's free to come to the States. Could only have 5-6-7 days between end of his season and the draft to get to the States and work out for teams.

[MrBigShot]

One of the biggest knocks on Austin Rivers coming into the NBA was the notion that he was so overconfident and arrogant, as if he believed he was already a star. Flash forward to now, and that clearly wasn't the case. He was never a bad teammate or a locker room cancer in NO, and in LA he's been solid off the bench in the playoffs.I agree 100% with Pharaoh...maybe if we had a push over coach like Brian Shaw it could be an issue, but Stan is a no-non sense guy who commands a locker room. Nothing I've heard about Hezonja thus far would dissuade me from taking him if I felt he was BPA.

His defense is a real concern though...dude plays defense like Kobe has for the last few years. Mostly undisciplined and lazy, mixed in with some promising man to man defense at times.

[coordinator0]

Is Hezonja's team still alive? IIRC if his team made it all the way to the finals it could be mid June before he's free to come to the States. Could only have 5-6-7 days between end of his season and the draft to get to the States and work out for teams.

Yeah, they're in the semifinal round of the ACB playoffs right now. That's a best of five series and those games start in a couple of days. I'm not sure how many games the finals go if Barcelona makes it that far though.

[sc8581]

One of the biggest knocks on Austin Rivers coming into the NBA was the notion that he was so overconfident and arrogant, as if he believed he was already a star. Flash forward to now, and that clearly wasn't the case. He was never a bad teammate or a locker room cancer in NO, and in LA he's been solid off the bench in the playoffs.I agree 100% with Pharaoh...maybe if we had a push over coach like Brian Shaw it could be an issue, but Stan is a no-non sense guy who commands a locker room. Nothing I've heard about Hezonja thus far would dissuade me from taking him if I felt he was BPA.

His defense is a real concern though...dude plays defense like Kobe has for the last few years. Mostly undisciplined and lazy, mixed in with some promising man to man defense at times.

Austin Rivers had a couple nice games but overall he was terrible in the playoffs and regular season.

[Blkbrd671]

One of the biggest knocks on Austin Rivers coming into the NBA was the notion that he was so overconfident and arrogant, as if he believed he was already a star. Flash forward to now, and that clearly wasn't the case.

WHAT!? if anything austin rivers is a clear example of how long its takes for guys with holes in their game and arrogance to develop into productive players. Idk if your just recalling the few good games he's has yet to justify NOL picking him where he was picked.

He was never a bad teammate or a locker room cancer in NO, and in LA he's been solid off the bench in the playoffs.I agree 100% with Pharaoh...maybe if we had a push over coach like Brian Shaw it could be an issue, but Stan is a no-non sense guy who commands a locker room. Nothing I've heard about Hezonja thus far would dissuade me from taking him if I felt he was BPA.

SVG commands the lockeroom and has stated, he's looking for players with high character. While there's nothing i have read that indicates that Hez is Royce White. The fact that he's known to get on his teammates backs, but has clear holes in his game makes me worry.

SVG values chemistry highly, and its clear it effects our young team. do we really want to risk that drafting a player who's not clearly better than the other players available? its one thing if he's on a different tier , nothing about Hez game for me puts him on a higher tier and the questions about Defense and his game translating from Euro play further more drops him below other players.
The final nail on the coffin for me is that hez doesn't look like he can guard a SF in the nba and would be more effective at the 2. The only thing about hez game that is ready for the nba level is shooting(which rookies tend to be poor at) and dunking, which strength wise he'll have trouble attacking the rim.

His defense is a real concern though...dude plays defense like Kobe has for the last few years. Mostly undisciplined and lazy, mixed in with some promising man to man defense at times.

he struggles against Euro players defensively who aren't as physical and big as nba players. You combine that with his size and "WORK HARD " attitude towards his teammates, i dont' see how there isn't a concern. If Hez was clearly the BPA @8, it be one thing, fact is he's not.