OT- How long does the team retain rights to draft choice

[buriat]

If an American player is drafted in the second round how long does the team maintain rights to him if he doesn't make the roster? At some point do they have an option to sign with another NBA team? Does any action the player or team takes influence any timeline other than making the roster?

[HartfordWhalers]

If an American player is drafted in the second round how long does the team maintain rights to him if he doesn't make the roster? At some point do they have an option to sign with another NBA team? Does any action the player or team takes influence any timeline other than making the roster?

A team needs to offer what is called the minimum qualifying offer to retain a players rights. That offer is the first year player minimum contract fully unguaranteed.

Often you see players take guaranteed money in Europe over a fully unguaranteed deal, so teams can keep a players rights despite not signing the player. But the team needs to offer that offer.

As long as you keep offering that offer, the team can keep a player's rights until they retire. (If a player skips playing anywhere for 3 years(?) they can re-enter the draft, but that has never happened).

If a guy wants to force the issue, they can always take the unguaranteed offer and if they don't make the team they are formally cut, and -- unless waiver claimed by a different team -- an unrestricted free agent.

[buriat]

Thanks for the information. I am trying to understand how a team manages second rounders and options an agent of a second rounder would have. Why wouldn't a second rounder sign a non guaranteed contact and if he doesn't make it then go to Europe. Wouldn't that in effect make him a free agent the following year?

For example isn't Jordan Mc Rae going to be in exactly the same spot this year as all the other second rounders picked in this draft? He gained nothing by spending time in New Zealand and lost opportunity to make money in a better league? Won't that be the case for many second rounders particularly when a team has multiple draft choices with limite roster spots? I am not understanding what a player gains by not signing a non guaranteed contact? Is it because if he signs it , there are restrictions about where he can play even if the player doesn't make the Team.


It seems to me that a player would be better off not being drafted in the second round if the team has all the cards . Then he could go to wherever he has the best chance to make the team? I must be missing something.

[Sixerscan]

I don't think Jordan McRae wants to play in Europe. I think he wants to play in the NBA.

He is working out at the Sixers' facility every day right now with the current Sixer players. As long as the Sixers have his rights, they have every incentive to help him develop as a basketball player. He's also much more on the Sixers radar than some random guy in Europe.

I assume they recommended he to go to Australia because they play fewer games so he would have more opportunity to develop his skill, versus some European team where they might pay a little more but no one cares about his future.

[HartfordWhalers]

Thanks for the information. I am trying to understand how a team manages second rounders and options an agent of a second rounder would have. Why wouldn't a second rounder sign a non guaranteed contact and if he doesn't make it then go to Europe. Wouldn't that in effect make him a free agent the following year?

For example isn't Jordan Mc Rae going to be in exactly the same spot this year as all the other second rounders picked in this draft? He gained nothing by spending time in New Zealand and lost opportunity to make money in a better league? Won't that be the case for many second rounders particularly when a team has multiple draft choices with limite roster spots? I am not understanding what a player gains by not signing a non guaranteed contact? Is it because if he signs it , there are restrictions about where he can play even if the player doesn't make the Team.


It seems to me that a player would be better off not being drafted in the second round if the team has all the cards . Then he could go to wherever he has the best chance to make the team? I must be missing something.

Excellent questions.

Most European leagues have a limited number of slots for 'foreigners'. What this means is it is a competive market, and even if the guaranteed pay is less than the 500k unguaranteed required tender, it still usually is guaranteed and thus for a guy that has a good chance of being cut attractive. After all, by contrast the Dleague is roughly 50k a year.

But, with the limited number of spots in Europe, and the European season starting earlier than the NBA, if you try for the NBA and are cut in October, you are almost surely out of luck for Europe.

So, for a player like McRae, the options might be:
1) Sign in Australia, make 250k (I'm not sure what he made, just throwing out a number), have the Sixers organization happy with you and feeling positive towards bringing you in next year if it goes well.
2) Sign in the US, make 500k if not cut, 50k if cut, with no organization invested in your future.

Maybe at 250k only for Europe it looks a coin toss (while at 450 it ooks like a great idea), but if the organization is one where you feel like you will get forward further in general that has a lot of monetary value -- see Thannis going to the dleague instead of forcing the issue for the Knicks for instance. Especially for guys drafted 50-60 that were really close to having no team willing to invest in them. And they can force the issue and sign the q/o next year if they don't get a better offer from the team.

[buriat]

Thanks. I gather McRae and any second rounder has to decide what is the best route for them to get to NBA and a bigger pay check in Europe might not be that route even if it is a better league. Do second rounders generally sign non guaranteed contracts initially and try to make the team. Does McRae and other non contracted players have to pay their own expenses till they finally get a contract or get cut?


.

[dbodner]

As long as you keep offering that offer, the team can keep a player's rights until they retire. (If a player skips playing anywhere for 3 years(?) they can re-enter the draft, but that has never happened).

I think after 3 seasons of playing in non-nba leagues, a player can then take a year off completely from basketball, and then become a free agent. I don't recall going back to the draft. But this is off of memory and a little hazy.

[HartfordWhalers]

Thanks. I gather McRae and any second rounder has to decide what is the best route for them to get to NBA and a bigger pay check in Europe might not be that route even if it is a better league. Do second rounders generally sign non guaranteed contracts initially and try to make the team. Does McRae and other non contracted players have to pay their own expenses till they finally get a contract or get cut?


.

Most fall into two camps.
-- Signing 2-3 year deals with 1-2 guaranteed.
-- Signing the min unguaranteed possibly for multiple years, and often cut before camp ends.
-- Never signed (I didn't count this as a camp).

There are a few exceptions. KJ McDaniels and Glenn Robinson 3 both decided to not sign the "Signing 2-3 year deals with 1-2 guaranteed" and instead bet on themselves. The teams each just offered the min q/o then, and both players took it.

In terms of expenses, teams give summer league players and camp invites per diems.

[HartfordWhalers]

As long as you keep offering that offer, the team can keep a player's rights until they retire. (If a player skips playing anywhere for 3 years(?) they can re-enter the draft, but that has never happened).

I think after 3 seasons of playing in non-nba leagues, a player can then take a year off completely from basketball, and then become a free agent. I don't recall going back to the draft. But this is off of memory and a little hazy.

Was thinking you would bail me out of posting it and looking it up.

51. What if the team and their drafted player can't agree to a contract? What options does the player have? How long does the team keep his draft rights?

The player's options are limited. What happens depends on a number of factors:

If the player is already under contract to, or signs a contract with a non-NBA team, the team retains the player's draft rights for one year after the player's obligation to the non-NBA team ends. Essentially, the clock stops as long as the player plays pro ball outside the NBA. Players are not included in team salary during the regular season while the player is under contract with a non-NBA team.
If the player goes on to play college ball after he was drafted, then the team retains the player's draft rights until one year following the draft the player would have entered had he not declared early. For example, if a team drafts a college sophomore in 2012 and he returns to college and plays intercollegiate basketball, then they retain his draft rights until the 2015 draft. Note that the NCAA rules state that players lose their NCAA eligibility if they are drafted, so the player currently cannot return or go on to play college ball. This rule exists in the CBA in the event the NCAA rules ever change.
If the player was eligible to play in college before he was drafted but does not go on to play college basketball, then the team retains the player's draft rights until the draft the player would have entered had he not declared early. For example, if a team drafts a college sophomore in 2012 and he does not return to college and play intercollegiate basketball, they retain his draft rights until the 2014 draft.
For all other players, the team retains the player's draft rights until the date of the next draft.
In any of the above cases, if the team does not sign the player in the allotted time, the player can enter the next draft. If the team that selects the player in the next draft doesn't sign him either, he becomes a rookie free agent on the date of the following draft.

When a team signs a first round draft pick within three years after he is drafted, they use the salary scale for the year in which he signs (usually the player signs in the same year he is drafted). After three years they have the option of either using the salary scale or signing him as if he was a free agent -- using their cap room or any available exception, with the standard raises. They can only do the latter if the player did not play intercollegiately in the interim. Such a contract must be for at least three seasons, and the salary in the first season must be greater than 120% of the applicable rookie scale amount.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm

So it is a year off for a college senior, more for younger guys which is where I was getting that 3 years I guess? But again, I haven't seen it happen as why not force the issue with the required tender?

[903124]

They can even retain the rights after the player retires and some teams trade these kind of players around. Unless the team waive the rights they are still here. Per RealGM the oldest player whose right is not waived he is drafted in 1986.
http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/draft-rights

[buriat]

Thanks again fellows. It will be a lot easier Now to understand what what exactly is happening when Sixers are negotiating with their second rounders. I assume they will trade some but still will have McRae and whoever they don't trade to deal with.

[Ericb5]

They can even retain the rights after the player retires and some teams trade these kind of players around. Unless the team waive the rights they are still here. Per RealGM the oldest player whose right is not waived he is drafted in 1986.
http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/draft-rights

Wouldn't they then have to be offering him that qualifying offer every year? If he is retired, why wouldn't he just accept it, and then get cut?


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[903124]

They can even retain the rights after the player retires and some teams trade these kind of players around. Unless the team waive the rights they are still here. Per RealGM the oldest player whose right is not waived he is drafted in 1986.
http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/draft-rights

Wouldn't they then have to be offering him that qualifying offer every year? If he is retired, why wouldn't he just accept it, and then get cut?


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

i don't think they are related to qualifying offer.

What is a qualifying offer?
For a team to make one of their players a restricted free agent, they must submit a qualifying offer to the player by June 30. This offer must be a one year offer for 125% of the player's previous salary or the player's minimum salary plus $175,000 (whichever is greater). If a player agrees to this offer, they play under a one-year contract and become an unrestricted free agent the following year. If not, he becomes a restricted free agent.

Those player are unsigned player whose his original team can have the rights to sign them first. Only unsigned first round pick consume cap hold and related to qualifying offer.