OKC Thunder Offseason 2015

[Bravenewworld]

If we hadn't brought Dion in and Lamb kept getting that PT/putting up the numbers he was he would be worth at least a late first. Dion cost us a first and probably keeps us from moving up, PLUS made it so we were in the tax this year. I didn't mind the move at the time, but it's royally f*cked us this offseason.

That is absolutely ridiculous and insane. You two have got to stop with your Lamb delusions.
No one, would have given up a first round pick, 1 or 30, for Lamb.

I hate to break this to you, but before we even got Waiters, Lamb was getting DNPs while Westbrook was out and we needed someone to play. But because he is so inconsistent and unreliable, he didnt get those minutes, a 38 year old Fisher did. Once we got Roberson, what happened to Lambs minutes then? Cut again?
Its the world against Lamb apparently.
Its never on Lamb, its never the fact that he is a crap player who wont be in the NBA in a couple years.
Its always Waiters taking his minutes (who, they would brought in anyone to do this).
Morrow taking his minutes (Who was brought in before Waiters to take Lamb's minutes.
Roberson taking his minutes(Who was brought in before Morrow and Waiters to take Lambs minutes).
Brooks not playing him enough. If only they would have fired Brooks a year earlier, then maybe Lamb would have had that Walt Disney like Magical season.

[Bravenewworld]

BTW, apparently its official.

We got Barnes from Horncats for Lamb.
Horncats also got Batum for Vonleh and Henderson.


So there is Lamb's value.
A guy who most likely would have been cut. Thats pretty far from a first.

[spearsy23]

If we hadn't brought Dion in and Lamb kept getting that PT/putting up the numbers he was he would be worth at least a late first. Dion cost us a first and probably keeps us from moving up, PLUS made it so we were in the tax this year. I didn't mind the move at the time, but it's royally f*cked us this offseason.

That is absolutely ridiculous and insane. You two have got to stop with your Lamb delusions.
No one, would have given up a first round pick, 1 or 30, for Lamb.

I hate to break this to you, but before we even got Waiters, Lamb was getting DNPs while Westbrook was out and we needed someone to play. But because he is so inconsistent and unreliable, he didnt get those minutes, a 38 year old Fisher did. Once we got Roberson, what happened to Lambs minutes then? Cut again?
Its the world against Lamb apparently.

This would only be funnier coming from Joest. I went back and read your 'scouting report' earlier, apparently Dion is consistent, a good shooter, and almost as athletic as Vince Carter. You sticking with that?

[Pillendreher]

I don't see it being official. Source?

[Bravenewworld]

If we hadn't brought Dion in and Lamb kept getting that PT/putting up the numbers he was he would be worth at least a late first. Dion cost us a first and probably keeps us from moving up, PLUS made it so we were in the tax this year. I didn't mind the move at the time, but it's royally f*cked us this offseason.

That is absolutely ridiculous and insane. You two have got to stop with your Lamb delusions.
No one, would have given up a first round pick, 1 or 30, for Lamb.

I hate to break this to you, but before we even got Waiters, Lamb was getting DNPs while Westbrook was out and we needed someone to play. But because he is so inconsistent and unreliable, he didnt get those minutes, a 38 year old Fisher did. Once we got Roberson, what happened to Lambs minutes then? Cut again?
Its the world against Lamb apparently.

This would only be funnier coming from Joest. I went back and read your 'scouting report' earlier, apparently Dion is consistent, a good shooter, and almost as athletic as Vince Carter. You sticking with that?

Maybe you should care less about what i say about Waiters and more on this Lamb situation you seem to be devastated about.
Get some of that baby shampoo out and clean that vagina, get that damn sand out.

[spearsy23]

Maybe you should care less about what i say about Waiters and more on this Lamb situation you seem to be devastated about.
Get some of that baby shampoo out and clean that vagina, get that damn sand out.

You seem to forget that I don't think Lamb is good.

[Pillendreher]

Woah. Easy there.

[Bravenewworld]

I don't see it being official. Source?

I could tell you, but i'd have to kill you.

[Bravenewworld]

Maybe you should care less about what i say about Waiters and more on this Lamb situation you seem to be devastated about.
Get some of that baby shampoo out and clean that vagina, get that damn sand out.

You seem to forget that I don't think Lamb is good.

And you've sure done a great job of showing that by throwing a fuss the second something is said about him, his value, etc.

[spearsy23]

Maybe you should care less about what i say about Waiters and more on this Lamb situation you seem to be devastated about.
Get some of that baby shampoo out and clean that vagina, get that damn sand out.

You seem to forget that I don't think Lamb is good.

And you've sure done a great job of showing that by throwing a fuss the second something is said about him, his value, etc.

Everything I've ever said has been centered around 'lamb is a mediocre bench player.' Hell, I literally said that a page ago. Lamb is a below average player who is young. If he'd gotten consistent pt he would have put up ten points per game and a team from 25-30 would have been willing to take a flyer on him. We should know all about that, we did it this year for a worse player.

[Bravenewworld]

But then, for some reason, you get offended when someone says that its insane to think a player like that warrants a first round pick, even late.
A guy who just got ditched for nothing.
And team who gave up a guy, they were cutting anyway.
That is the value this guy held.... im just saying, thats a far cry from "first round pick value".
So why is it that when i mention this, you cant simply say "maybe i overvalued him", no, you gotta try to start an argument and as always you try to bring it back to Waiters, even though you know i think its utter basketball ignorance to judge where he is going in his development after 40 games. But you just gotta try to argue.

[spearsy23]

But then, for some reason, you get offended when someone says that its insane to think a player like that warrants a first round pick, even late.
A guy who just got ditched for nothing.
And team who gave up a guy, they were cutting anyway.
That is the value this guy held.... im just saying, thats a far cry from "first round pick value".

Do you just not read well? I specifically said, 'if he'd kept getting pt.' He didn't, instead Waiters came in and tanked BOTH of their values. If we'd never made the trade for Dion we wouldn't be desperate to cut salary, Lamb would have continued putting up the numbers he put up for the first 25 games, and we wouldn't have a logjam at the position.

[Bravenewworld]

But then, for some reason, you get offended when someone says that its insane to think a player like that warrants a first round pick, even late.
A guy who just got ditched for nothing.
And team who gave up a guy, they were cutting anyway.
That is the value this guy held.... im just saying, thats a far cry from "first round pick value".

Do you just not read well? I specifically said, 'if he'd kept getting pt.' He didn't, instead Waiters came in and tanked BOTH of their values. If we'd never made the trade for Dion we wouldn't be desperate to cut salary, Lamb would have continued putting up the numbers he put up for the first 25 games, and we wouldn't have a logjam at the position.

He didnt get play time, because he sucks.
It was not Waiters that did that, it was him.
Lamb, did not have a value before Waiters,that is why we brought in a total of five guards to attempt to take his spot. Waiters, Morrow, Roberson, Butler, the white guy.... oh and the dual guard. So thats six.
Six players who have been brought in to play that position, all brought in after him to replace him, with Waiters being the last one of the whole list being brought in and you think its because when Waiters joined, Lambs playtime got cut...
Lamb's value did not drop this season, it was the exact same, nothing.

[spearsy23]

So why is it that when i mention this, you cant simply say "maybe i overvalued him", no, you gotta try to start an argument and as always you try to bring it back to Waiters, even though you know i think its utter basketball ignorance to judge where he is going in his development after 40 games. But you just gotta try to argue.

Dion Waiters has been in the league for 3 years. Dion Waiters has been the same player for three years.

The post you originally responded to was about Waiters. You're the one who wants to argue about him. The dude sucks. He can't shoot, can't pass, is an idiot, and plays average defense. Jeremy Lamb also sucks, maybe slightly less than Waiters, maybe the same amount, but definitely not more. The only difference is that Lamb doesn't keep getting excuses made and minutes handed.

[spearsy23]

But then, for some reason, you get offended when someone says that its insane to think a player like that warrants a first round pick, even late.
A guy who just got ditched for nothing.
And team who gave up a guy, they were cutting anyway.
That is the value this guy held.... im just saying, thats a far cry from "first round pick value".

Do you just not read well? I specifically said, 'if he'd kept getting pt.' He didn't, instead Waiters came in and tanked BOTH of their values. If we'd never made the trade for Dion we wouldn't be desperate to cut salary, Lamb would have continued putting up the numbers he put up for the first 25 games, and we wouldn't have a logjam at the position.

He didnt get play time, because he sucks.
It was not Waiters that did that, it was him.
Lamb, did not have a value before Waiters,that is why we brought in a total of five guards to attempt to take his spot. Waiters, Morrow, Roberson, Butler, the white guy.... oh and the dual guard.
Lamb's value did not drop this season, it was the exact same, nothing.

Which is why he was a part of the trade for Brooke Lopez that Presti ultimately turned down?

[Bravenewworld]

So why is it that when i mention this, you cant simply say "maybe i overvalued him", no, you gotta try to start an argument and as always you try to bring it back to Waiters, even though you know i think its utter basketball ignorance to judge where he is going in his development after 40 games. But you just gotta try to argue.

Dion Waiters has been in the league for 3 years. Dion Waiters has been the same player for three years.

The post you originally responded to was about Waiters. You're the one who wants to argue about him. The dude sucks. He can't shoot, can't pass, is an idiot, and plays average defense. Jeremy Lamb also sucks, maybe slightly less than Waiters, maybe the same amount, but definitely not more. The only difference is that Lamb doesn't keep getting excuses made and minutes handed.

And despite him showing slow growth, the base skill sets he is working with is far more valuable than Lamb and something we should work on before we dismiss him.
Again, ive said this a billion times but it seems not to seep into that thick skull.
Waiters, for his age, has put up impressive numbers that most players his age do not. The skill set he has is ideal for how OKC develops players and given his skill set and what weve seen him post in his past, its worth the development time to see what he becomes. And as we've already seen, he is capable of having great moments. Which is far more then we can say about Lamb. Who again, was in no way shape or form, better than Waiters or even close to Waiters. If he was consistent with his defense, id give him that, but he was horrible inconsistent with his defense.

And what are you talking about Lamb does not get excuses made? Its all ive heard on these forums. WTF do you think you just did with the first round pick thing. Its an excuse for his crap play.

[Bravenewworld]

Which is why he was a part of the trade for Brooke Lopez that Presti ultimately turned down?

I got some news for you.... Nets turned that trade down, Presti did not.
Why did they turn it down? Because they felt Lopez had higher value.

[Pillendreher]

Waiters, for his age, has put up impressive numbers that most players his age do not.

Yeah. Not every young player gets that many minutes while being that bad of a player. If you're one of the worst players in the league and you're getting 30 minutes per night, then yeah, that's impressive, but not in a good way.

[spearsy23]

So why is it that when i mention this, you cant simply say "maybe i overvalued him", no, you gotta try to start an argument and as always you try to bring it back to Waiters, even though you know i think its utter basketball ignorance to judge where he is going in his development after 40 games. But you just gotta try to argue.

Dion Waiters has been in the league for 3 years. Dion Waiters has been the same player for three years.

The post you originally responded to was about Waiters. You're the one who wants to argue about him. The dude sucks. He can't shoot, can't pass, is an idiot, and plays average defense. Jeremy Lamb also sucks, maybe slightly less than Waiters, maybe the same amount, but definitely not more. The only difference is that Lamb doesn't keep getting excuses made and minutes handed.

And despite him showing slow growth, the base skill sets he is working with is far more valuable than Lamb and something we should work on before we dismiss him.
Again, ive said this a billion times but it seems not to seep into that thick skull.

You literally type things just to read your own posts, don't you? If you actually paid attention to anything anyone else said you'd know that I am completely against dumping Waiters. I actually had that discussion with Bondom in this freaking thread.

Waiters, for his age, has put up impressive numbers that most players his age do not.

If by 'numbers' you solely mean points, then yeah, you're right. Sorry we're not all savvy basketball fans that realize points are how you measure players.

The skill set he has is ideal for how OKC develops players and given his skill set and what weve seen him post in his past, its worth the development time to see what he becomes. And as we've already seen, he is capable of having great moments.

well this sure is a far cry from what you've been preaching all season.

Which is far more then we can say about Lamb. Who again, was in no way shape or form, better than Waiters or even close to Waiters.

I've asked this so many times, but what does Waiters do better than Lamb? You've never responded to this. You always disappear or clam up at this point. I've broken it down several times and Waitets is a better ball-handler and (by the eye test) defender. That's it. Lamb is a better shooter and rebounder, neither are good passers.

If he was consistent with his defense, id give him that, but he was horrible inconsistent with his defense.

RAPM has Lamb as a better defender. On/off for Dion has him as better while here but the same as Lamb while in Cleveland. Opponent PER greatly favors Lamb. I think calling them a push may actually be fair, Dion certainly isn't ahead by any large margin.

And what are you talking about Lamb does not get excuses made? Its all ive heard on these forums. WTF do you think you just did with the first round pick thing. Its an excuse for his crap play.

How did anything I type excuse his play? Excuses are what you've been making for Dion all year. "The Cavs offense was a mess, he'll do much better here." "Scoring 15 points on 14 shots would have people talking about how great KD is." "Well we've only seen him for 40 games." "At least he's consistent." "Those are flaws all young players have." "There has been too much inconsistency in the lineups for him to do well."

Those are all variations of things you've said in relation to Dion.

Which is why he was a part of the trade for Brooke Lopez that Presti ultimately turned down?

I got some news for you.... Nets turned that trade down, Presti did not.
Why did they turn it down? Because they felt Lopez had higher value.

You're right, they did turn it down, but you're wrong about the reason. It's because they couldn't find a taker for Perk's contract. In fact they refused to include Charlotte because they preferred Lamb to Lance Stephenson. http://sports.yahoo.com/news/sources--thunder-in-serious-discussions-to-acquire-brook-lopez-from-nets-170834007.html

[Pillendreher]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/DarnellMayberry/status/614072183019536384[/tweet]

Let's hope there's more than that.