Atlanta Hawks 2015 Draft Thread

[PandaKidd]

THJ COULD be very good, maybe. hes a young talent. They obviously believe in him more than any of the Portis/Oubre guys

[Hawk Eye]

Another problem I have is that if it only took two future 2nds to get washington from #19 to #15 then why couldn't we give up #50, #59, and the 17' MIN 1st WITH #15 to swoop in at #9 or #10 for Winslow.

[td00]

I like what we did last night, unlike what we've done under Ferry overall.

There was no one IMO going to help us this upcoming season left after 15...

I agree that no one we could have drafted would have helped us much next year...

but you can't only draft with the very next season in mind. At some point you have to actually acquire talent for future use. Even if (ATLANTA Braves style) we know that talent might simply be moved in the future in trade.

Mack, Korver, Bazemore, Thabo are all fit great on our system. But at this point have little to no trade value. None can take over a game. None are the future SG for this long term either. Our entire rotation is filled with stop gap players and over achieving role players.

That's a risky approach to roster building.

This is the first year since '08 we haven't brought a draft pick to camp. Based on our draft slots and successes, I'm totally okay with a different approach. Keeping our FAs is a priority this time.
Unless we're trading up in the draft, hard to get thrilled about some of our selections. The last pick I was sorta excited about was Al.
Our track record for draft choices ranks us near the bottom of the league for quite some time. I was okay when LD went with vets for the most part also.

Its time to win and whatever it takes to get there is fine. Free agents are more impactful than rooks. If we can get a star to actually come here will be when our fortunes will improve.

I believe in Bud/Wilcox for our efforts.

[Geaux_Hawks]

I think the issue everyone is having with the trade last night is that we could have given up less and still got THJ, while also drafting a quality prospect(Oubre). I wanted Oubre after pretty much the obvious picks were gone.

I like the possibility of THJ becoming a contributor, but what is essentially our 15th pick for THJ, I can't agree with. Those 2nds aren't enough for me either.

Oubre was a lottery talent that just fell right to us, and we trade him to a team in our division.

As it's been said before, we have to eventually start drafting talent and develop it into a high quality contributor.

[Jamaaliver]

THJ COULD be very good, maybe. hes a young talent. They obviously believe in him more than any of the Portis/Oubre guys

I agree. He could be good. I actually proposed a trade that would bring him over to us just a few weeks back.

But, I'm not sure Wes believes in THJ more BIG-PICTURE than any other player drafted after 14 last night.

I suspect they think he can contribute more IMMEDIATELY than other young collegiates. This draft move was about acquiring short term, immediate help. That's a strategy very much in line with Ferry's 1st round drafting (outside of 2013.)

Older, experienced guys with low ceilings.

We're fighting to stay relevant now, future be damned.

There be both benefits and drawbacks to such a strategy. But if Oubre develops into a top talent 5 years from now IN THE DIVISION...that'll be a tough pill to swallow.

[Jamaaliver]

Its time to win and whatever it takes to get there is fine. Free agents are more impactful than rooks. If we can get a star to actually come here will be when our fortunes will improve.

I believe in Bud/Wilcox for our efforts.

I suppose. And time will tell.

But a number of top talents have been moved in the last 10 years...and almost always have gone for young prospects and picks.

Chris Paul, Kevin Garnett, Ray Allen, Jason Kidd, Rasheed Wallace, Dwight Howard, Carmelo, James Harden, Pau Gasol.

We've proven unable to attract top Free Agents, now we seem resigned to toss away young draftees and picks without even attempting to accumulate and combine them in trade for top talents.

If we win 52 games and lose in the 2nd round next year...there will be legitimate doubt in Bud and Wes's approach of focusing on short term at the cost of the big picture.

[PandaKidd]

FWIW everyone is hammering us on ESPN for the THJ pick. Just saying we gave up too much , hes atrocious on defense, doesnt see the fit.

[Jamaaliver]

FWIW everyone is hammering us on ESPN for the THJ pick. Just saying we gave up too much , hes atrocious on defense, doesnt see the fit.

Yeah, that's basically the market saying we overpaid. he was NOT valued that highly by anyone else.

Rules for overpaying

• The player is a transcendent talent that can't be duplicated
• There will likely be no other opportunity to acquire the player
• The move puts you over the top as a championship contender

This acquisition fits none of the above.

I wonder what Ressler is thinking today. All that good press effectively turned to dust after the first big move of the post-Ferry Hawks.

[MaceCase]

I mean this team has taken an alright forward and turned him into a multiple All Star, turned an one dimensional vet into one of the deadliest weapons in the league, took a scrappy hustle guy and turned him into one of the top 3&D players, took another 3&D guy that plenty thought had zero left in the tank and made him a valuable and well missed cog, worked an undrafted nobody thought to be end of the bench fodder into the rotation, found a 30 year old Euro rookie and made him a valuable rotation piece even if fans are baffled by his lack of boxscore production, found another guy out of the Patriot league who we believe to be even more valuable, and the list just goes on.

What I'm trying to say is that basically everyone at some point in time has questioned the value of each and every one of this team's acquisitions on their individual merits yet somehow their abilities have meshed seamlessly into a collectively successful team. I can get questions over asset management in turning the 15th pick into just Hardaway Jr., two 2nds and minuscule cap savings but I can't get outright questioning whether Hardaway Jr.'s talent level has any merit. Just a year ago quite a few lamented that the team had drafted such busts as Dennis and Bebe over him, Plumlee, Wroten, Perry Jones etc. I don't see how in the span of two years opinions have changed to the opposite extreme, the likely proper evaluation lies far to the middle.

I hope that you're right, but the difference is that all those other moves were low/no cost. Millsap, DeMarre, Thabo, Pero, and Bazemore were all EXTREMELY cheap FA signings, where we didn't give up any assets.

Would I be okay with signing THJ as a FA? Sure, why not. But trading a salary-controlled mid-round rookie for him seems like a massive overpay.

Except...that he himself is also a salary controlled mid-round rookie...or at least he's still on his rookie deal. So you essentially traded two years of salary control for two years of actual NBA experience. That to me is not a "massive" overpay, the team didn't trade a 1st for Corey Brewer here.

[Hawk Eye]

Anyone else think THJ will just end up becoming John Jenkins 2.0 for us?

[WhateverBro]

I know you guys are disappointed in the Hardaway trade, and I would be that too if I was a Hawks fan. Especially considering who you got with the 50th pick: Marcus Eriksson. I haven't seen anyone of you discussing that pick so I thought I'd chime in with my thoughts considering I've seen him play plenty.

First off, he's a great, and I mean GREAT shooter. He's insanely good as a spot up shooter, but can also shoot it off the dribble. He's most likely the best shooter in the draft. He has good size for his position, 6'7 with a 6'8 wingspan for a SG. He's ok at handling the ball and a decent defender but needs improvements in those aspects of his game. Hard worker. He has a nice floater going to the basket and doesn't hesitate to attack the basket.

The downsides is that he's pretty unathletic and doesn't give you much else but shooting / scoring at this point in his career. He also suffered a torn ACL in the first game of the last season, which is probably why you were able to get him at the 50th pick. I think that he would be taken in the first round if he had been healthy and played all season for Barcelona. I'm not sure Barcelona would've played Hezonja before him during this season to be honest. They're really high on Eriksson.

Anyway, he's a perfect fit for your system since he moves well off the ball and can shoot it like few others can. He's a Korver type of player which fits nicely in your offense.. Which is why I'm puzzled by the trade for Hardaway.. It doesn't really make sense.. I know that Eriksson is staying another year in Barcelona but still.. I would take him over Hardaway to be honest. He has way more potential and is a much better fit on your team. We'll see what happens, but the fact that your team took Eriksson shows that they have done their homework.. He didn't play at all this year and fell off pretty much every draft board there was, yet, your team remembered what he has shown in the ACB and during the youth tournaments for his national team.

To give you an idea of how good of a shooter he is:

He was 37.5 % from three at 5.6 attempts per game in the spanish ACB as a 20 year old.

Over 26 games in both u-18 and u-20 european championship, he hit a total of 40.3 % of his threes.

Small sample, but during eurocamp in 2014, he hit 57.1 % of his threes, at 4.7 attempts per game over three games.

Here's a video of him at 16? I think, hitting 78 out of 80 threes in 5 mins. In street clothes, lol.
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCP3vHF6Sos[/youtube]

[td00]

The only slam dunk we could have done was to move someone in our rotation, and combine that with our top draft choice.

Ainge said the cost to move up was ridiculous, and NY was one of those who valued that pick very high. I heard Bud say they took a different route once they heard players he coveted were gone. Any guesses which players Bud was looking at? I'm thinking Kaminsky was his guy, but who knows at this point.

Out of Jamaal's FA list listed above, we really only had a slim shot at Gasol. So basing it on just what Bud has accomplished, unless DMC and Sap go elsewhere, we're not going to know which FAs would consider us this summer either. I'm not going to base any of the previous Knight or Sund regimes. Those are past mistakes that should not be put on Bud.
Bud has done more for this franchise in 2 years than any previous regimes put together.

The value of a draft trade will be evaluated years from now. Again, there wasn't anyone in Bud's eyes that was cracking our rotation.

[Jamaaliver]

If we can get a star to actually come here will be when our fortunes will improve.

But a number of top talents have been moved in the last 10 years...and almost always have gone for young prospects and picks. Chris Paul, Kevin Garnett, Ray Allen, Jason Kidd, Rasheed Wallace, Dwight Howard, Carmelo, James Harden, Pau Gasol.

Out of Jamaal's FA list listed above, we really only had a slim shot at Gasol.

Oops...wasn't attempting to list Free Agents Stars. But instead big stars acquired via trading valuable prospects and draft picks.

I was basically lamenting that all these missed 1st rounders could have been lumped together eventually had they been packaged.

Fun History Fact: Pistons actually acquired Rasheed Wallace from us for the pick that gave us Josh Smith!!!! 4 Months later...Pistons won a title.

Stars can be acquired via trade, but we have to have assets other teams covet.

[td00]

Anyone else think THJ will just end up becoming John Jenkins 2.0 for us?

Not at all; Jenkins hurt us in the development area in multi-years. Hardaway gets a make-or-break shot here in a one year audition.
The deal is good for us in that we've got what 2 major pieces in the backcourt recovering from major injuries.

Hardaway has done a good job for his team, despite the results. I gotta think he's very excited to leave NY, who is not contending anytime soon.

It won't take long to like this guy; if he is close to what Bud thinks he is, we are going to be thrilled to have him. He'll be a great complement to Baze and will give us depth in case Korver struggles.

[MaceCase]

I know you guys are disappointed in the Hardaway trade, and I would be that too if I was a Hawks fan. Especially considering who you got with the 50th pick: Marcus Eriksson. I haven't seen anyone of you discussing that pick so I thought I'd chime in with my thoughts considering I've seen him play plenty.

First off, he's a great, and I mean GREAT shooter. He's insanely good as a spot up shooter, but can also shoot it off the dribble. He's most likely the best shooter in the draft. He has good size for his position, 6'7 with a 6'8 wingspan for a SG. He's ok at handling the ball and a decent defender but needs improvements in those aspects of his game. Hard worker. He has a nice floater going to the basket and doesn't hesitate to attack the basket.

The downsides is that he's pretty unathletic and doesn't give you much else but shooting / scoring at this point in his career. He also suffered a torn ACL in the first game of the last season, which is probably why you were able to get him at the 50th pick. I think that he would be taken in the first round if he had been healthy and played all season for Barcelona. I'm not sure Barcelona would've played Hezonja before him during this season to be honest. They're really high on Eriksson.

Anyway, he's a perfect fit for your system since he moves well off the ball and can shoot it like few others can. He's a Korver type of player which fits nicely in your offense.. Which is why I'm puzzled by the trade for Hardaway.. It doesn't really make sense.. I know that Eriksson is staying another year in Barcelona but still.. I would take him over Hardaway to be honest. He has way more potential and is a much better fit on your team. We'll see what happens, but the fact that your team took Eriksson shows that they have done their homework.. He didn't play at all this year and fell off pretty much every draft board there was, yet, your team remembered what he has shown in the ACB and during the youth tournaments for his national team.

To give you an idea of how good of a shooter he is:

He was 37.5 % from three at 5.6 attempts per game in the spanish ACB as a 20 year old.

Over 26 games in both u-18 and u-20 european championship, he hit a total of 40.3 % of his threes.

Small sample, but during eurocamp in 2014, he hit 57.1 % of his threes, at 4.7 attempts per game over three games.

Here's a video of him at 16? I think, hitting 78 out of 80 threes in 5 mins. In street clothes, lol.
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCP3vHF6Sos[/youtube]

I'm sure they like his potential and ability but are also banking on the likelihood that he works to regain his luster overseas. I imagine that if he pans out they'd certainly put him in the pipeline of guys to consider for the future roster much like they've done with Muscala and are now doing with Tavares. The team is in a bit of a cap crunch to either retain our FAs or pursue others though so it becomes clearer why they weren't thrilled in investing an extra 300k in cap into a pick who is likely to spend most of his first two seasons in the DLeague rather than contributing to the roster.

[tbhawksfan1]

With #15 (acquired through trade) and 2 seconds the Hawks come away from the draft with............

The seconds will play in Europe and the first was given away. The future seconds aren't woth discussing and Hardaway improves the team about as much as a 1.5 million a year FA.

These moves are supposedly win now move that do nothing to help us win now. Anyone that thinks THJ would have made a difference in the playoffs...well

I fear a FAcy of re-signing our 2 big UFA, add a min contract or 2 and trot the same team out next season with only a couple of new third stringers.

Looks like a 2-5 seed and less playoff success than 2015. With aging Carroll and Sap signed to bloated deals. I really don"t want to go the next few years with Sap/Horf as our frontcourt

[tbhawksfan1]

Recent Hawks firsts:

2013; Bebe traded for nothing
2014, Payne traded for nothing
2015 #15 traded for nothing

[Jamaaliver]

Recent Hawks firsts:

2013; Bebe traded for nothing
2014, Payne traded for nothing
2015 #15 traded for nothing

To be fair, we did get solid value out of the Dennis Schroder pick in 2013. That one looks like a contributor that can also bring back good value in trade.

And even John Jenkins looked like he was capable of being a rotation guard before being buried alive on Bud's bench. (NOTE: Passing on Festus Ezeli and Draymond Green in that 2012 draft does appear to be a huge mistake. Considering we needed size and Jenkins had been projected as a 2nd round pick by many.)

[tbhawksfan1]

Not trying to be fair, want value from our draft and trades. We got neither in all the above. We were deemed the loser in all of those trades

[DirtybirdGA]

New writers, same song. Lol