The Tobias Harris Situation

[tiderulz]

Michael Scotto @MikeAScotto
Sources: Tobias Harris would prefer not to return to the Orlando Magic and play for Scott Skiles, who previously coached him in Milwaukee.

random un-named source. Must be true

[Magic_Kingdom]

Michael Scotto @MikeAScotto
Sources: Tobias Harris would prefer not to return to the Orlando Magic and play for Scott Skiles, who previously coached him in Milwaukee.

If true, I assume the Magic had to know this when they hired Skiles, or at least had a pretty good idea. It's not totally surprising because Skiles's reputation is he won't give you minutes if you don't play defense, and Tobias does not play defense.

I don't think the Magic intend to re-sign Tobias, despite what Hennigan has been saying. If they valued him near the price he wants, they would've extended him, just like they did Vucevic. The last 2 drafts they used a #4 pick and a #5 pick on small forwards. I'm sure the hope is to work a sign-and-trade so they don't lose him for nothing.

[tiderulz]

Michael Scotto @MikeAScotto
Sources: Tobias Harris would prefer not to return to the Orlando Magic and play for Scott Skiles, who previously coached him in Milwaukee.

If true, I assume the Magic had to know this when they hired Skiles, or at least had a pretty good idea. It's not totally surprising because Skiles's reputation is he won't give you minutes if you don't play defense, and Tobias does not play defense.

I don't think the Magic intend to re-sign Tobias, despite what Hennigan has been saying. If they valued him near the price he wants, they would've extended him, just like they did Vucevic. The last 2 drafts they used a #4 pick and a #5 pick on small forwards. I'm sure the hope is to work a sign-and-trade so they don't lose him for nothing.

been shown before that Harris does play defense.

[mhectorgato]

Michael Scotto @MikeAScotto
Sources: Tobias Harris would prefer not to return to the Orlando Magic and play for Scott Skiles, who previously coached him in Milwaukee.

random un-named source. Must be true

Bonjour

[eyriq]

Michael Scotto @MikeAScotto
Sources: Tobias Harris would prefer not to return to the Orlando Magic and play for Scott Skiles, who previously coached him in Milwaukee.

If true, I assume the Magic had to know this when they hired Skiles, or at least had a pretty good idea. It's not totally surprising because Skiles's reputation is he won't give you minutes if you don't play defense, and Tobias does not play defense.

I don't think the Magic intend to re-sign Tobias, despite what Hennigan has been saying. If they valued him near the price he wants, they would've extended him, just like they did Vucevic. The last 2 drafts they used a #4 pick and a #5 pick on small forwards. I'm sure the hope is to work a sign-and-trade so they don't lose him for nothing.

been shown before that Harris does play defense.

The issue is far from clear and IMO the "tweener that can't defend a position" narrative has a lot more evidence than the "most underrated free agent, average defender" narrative.

[magicfan217]

I can't see why we would not have traded him at the deadline if we didn't intend to match. Makes no sense.


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[tiderulz]

If true, I assume the Magic had to know this when they hired Skiles, or at least had a pretty good idea. It's not totally surprising because Skiles's reputation is he won't give you minutes if you don't play defense, and Tobias does not play defense.

I don't think the Magic intend to re-sign Tobias, despite what Hennigan has been saying. If they valued him near the price he wants, they would've extended him, just like they did Vucevic. The last 2 drafts they used a #4 pick and a #5 pick on small forwards. I'm sure the hope is to work a sign-and-trade so they don't lose him for nothing.

been shown before that Harris does play defense.

The issue is far from clear and IMO the "tweener that can't defend a position" narrative has a lot more evidence than the "most underrated free agent, average defender" narrative.

IMO, he shook the "tweener" label, playing SF very well last year, and defended at an average level at worse.

[Rick Rolled]

Orlando Magic Dish ‏@Magic_PRDish 3s3 seconds ago
The @OrlandoMagic have extended a qualifying offer to @tobias31. Magic have right to match any offer sheet he may sign with another team.

[Tayswagzzz]

Orlando Magic Dish ‏@Magic_PRDish 3s3 seconds ago
The @OrlandoMagic have extended a qualifying offer to @tobias31. Magic have right to match any offer sheet he may sign with another team.

Very nice. I'm all for trying to keep Tobias.

[rcklsscognition]

Michael Scotto @MikeAScotto
Sources: Tobias Harris would prefer not to return to the Orlando Magic and play for Scott Skiles, who previously coached him in Milwaukee.

Who freaking cares? 90% of us would rather work with a different boss. I don't believe this guy either, plus, if you trace the Tobias Harris situation back to it's sauces, it is all based on two things:

One random team executive saying Tobias is worth 10-14 million. That's one executive, not a GM necessarily, but just some random executive, like a scout or something possibly, who told one reporter this tidbit.

Then also that he doesn't like Skiles because of his time in Milwaukee thus we probably won't retain him.

The only real information we have is our GM saying we're doing whatever it takes to bring him back. Yet no one in the media believe them for some reason. While other GMs aren't saying the same yet they're assumed to be keeping their guys.

[mojosodope]

If true, I assume the Magic had to know this when they hired Skiles, or at least had a pretty good idea. It's not totally surprising because Skiles's reputation is he won't give you minutes if you don't play defense, and Tobias does not play defense.

I don't think the Magic intend to re-sign Tobias, despite what Hennigan has been saying. If they valued him near the price he wants, they would've extended him, just like they did Vucevic. The last 2 drafts they used a #4 pick and a #5 pick on small forwards. I'm sure the hope is to work a sign-and-trade so they don't lose him for nothing.

been shown before that Harris does play defense.

The issue is far from clear and IMO the "tweener that can't defend a position" narrative has a lot more evidence than the "most underrated free agent, average defender" narrative.

Crap like this is why I really hope we don't match. Its apparent he will continue to be the scapegoat for the teams larger and more significant problems at whatever price he is retained at.

He's not a good fit and there are apparently people like you who think just like you and will continue to not allow him to be anything other than what you labeled him.

I think we are better off coninuing to develop through the draft until we can officially break out of the lottery

[BadMofoPimp]

If true, I assume the Magic had to know this when they hired Skiles, or at least had a pretty good idea. It's not totally surprising because Skiles's reputation is he won't give you minutes if you don't play defense, and Tobias does not play defense.

I don't think the Magic intend to re-sign Tobias, despite what Hennigan has been saying. If they valued him near the price he wants, they would've extended him, just like they did Vucevic. The last 2 drafts they used a #4 pick and a #5 pick on small forwards. I'm sure the hope is to work a sign-and-trade so they don't lose him for nothing.

been shown before that Harris does play defense.

The issue is far from clear and IMO the "tweener that can't defend a position" narrative has a lot more evidence than the "most underrated free agent, average defender" narrative.

I bet Harris would be adequate on defense in a solid Coaches team defensive scheme. If SVG can make Hedo look good, then Harris should look solid with a good defensive coach.

[eyriq]

been shown before that Harris does play defense.

The issue is far from clear and IMO the "tweener that can't defend a position" narrative has a lot more evidence than the "most underrated free agent, average defender" narrative.

I bet Harris would be adequate on defense in a solid Coaches team defensive scheme. If SVG can make Hedo look good, then Harris should look solid with a good defensive coach.

This could prove prophetic!

[Magic_Kingdom]

If true, I assume the Magic had to know this when they hired Skiles, or at least had a pretty good idea. It's not totally surprising because Skiles's reputation is he won't give you minutes if you don't play defense, and Tobias does not play defense.

I don't think the Magic intend to re-sign Tobias, despite what Hennigan has been saying. If they valued him near the price he wants, they would've extended him, just like they did Vucevic. The last 2 drafts they used a #4 pick and a #5 pick on small forwards. I'm sure the hope is to work a sign-and-trade so they don't lose him for nothing.

been shown before that Harris does play defense.

The issue is far from clear and IMO the "tweener that can't defend a position" narrative has a lot more evidence than the "most underrated free agent, average defender" narrative.

I think that is why there is such a split on Tobias. If you like him, and your standard is relatively low -- at least an average defender -- then you think he does play defense. If he doesn't pass the eye test for you (in terms of simply guarding his man), and you think he's capable of being a much better defender, then it's natural to conclude that he is under-performing on the defensive end. If you are in the latter group and your name is Scott Skiles, then there will be an issue between player and coach. I don't think defensive stats or analytics can reliably show how good of an individual defender someone is. There are way too many variables. So Tobias is in the eye of the beholder.

[Rick Rolled]

Q

John Ariemma
@stevekylerNBA so harris doesn't want to play for skiles now?

A

Steve Kyler ‏@stevekylerNBA 56s56 seconds ago
I have talked to him directly - he has no issues with Skiles, is about being wanted by the franchise and winning.

[Neon1]

Q

John Ariemma
@stevekylerNBA so harris doesn't want to play for skiles now?

A

Steve Kyler ‏@stevekylerNBA 56s56 seconds ago
I have talked to him directly - he has no issues with Skiles, is about being wanted by the franchise and winning.

Same. The city too, also was frustrated by putting all of his efforts into the community and everything to bust his ass on the floor, but still gets mostly crap from the fans. He says he's moved past it though and knows that there's always going to be a group of unhappy fans nomatter the effort put in.

[rcklsscognition]

BTW, that is the angle Kyler and Basketball Insiders has been working regarding Tobias all season. Their opinion is that Tobias wants to be the guy, the Magic are undecided if he is their guy, and thus, they're going to let him go because of that. They are not interested in matching just to have him to trade later since they don't want him.

I do get that feeling too from watching them shower Oladipo with praise and give him the world, meanwhile Tobias has been toiling away for the team/city and doesn't get much love.

[MagicFan101]

Michael Scotto @MikeAScotto
Sources: Tobias Harris would prefer not to return to the Orlando Magic and play for Scott Skiles, who previously coached him in Milwaukee.

random un-named source. Must be true

To be fair, they are always random and unnamed sources. If they didn't not remain unnamed then this person would not remain in the business.

Isn't the sacred code of journalism to never name your sources?

Still, that doesn't mean this person has reputable sources. I would like to see this from Woj or someone of that stature before I give it any real thought.

[MagicFan101]

been shown before that Harris does play defense.

The issue is far from clear and IMO the "tweener that can't defend a position" narrative has a lot more evidence than the "most underrated free agent, average defender" narrative.

I bet Harris would be adequate on defense in a solid Coaches team defensive scheme. If SVG can make Hedo look good, then Harris should look solid with a good defensive coach.

If Harris could facilitate like Hedo and show us a bit more on defense then my attitude towards him would flip in a hurry.

Skiles is a hard nosed coach who gets guys to play a team game with a focus on defense. So sure, it could happen.

[Orlwillbeback]

If we lose harris then hezonja no doubt starts at the 3. Much less depth with harris gone.