Discussing Other Teams' Moves Part 5

barelyawake · Post #581 » by **barelyawake** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 4:54 pm

The "NBA is getting smaller" is a matter of timing. The Spurs are going to win the championship because they got Aldridge. AD and the other young bigs are about to prove the "NBA is getting smaller" is a myth.

Kanyewest · Post #582 » by **Kanyewest** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 4:57 pm

barelyawake wrote:You are saying that Aldridge was never an option because of our GM and coach (not because of the moves we could have made; cap or talent). Well then, you've identified the problem. Shouldn't the owner recognize that as well?

Yes we should have won the lottery back in 1998 and fired the guy who didn't take Tony Parker and Manu.

barelyawake · Post #583 » by **barelyawake** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 5:06 pm

Kanyewest wrote:
barelyawake wrote:You are saying that Aldridge was never an option because of our GM and coach (not because of the moves we could have made; cap or talent). Well then, you've identified the problem. Shouldn't the owner recognize that as well?

Yes we should have won the lottery back in 1998 and fired the guy who didn't take Tony Parker and Manu.

Because a couple of almost forty year old guys playing one last year is more of a selling point than years of Wall, Beal and in all likihood (with Aldridge) KD, especially when signing a multi-year contract. As Indy said, it's the coach and the GM. And you can hire those with winning records.

closg00 · Post #584 » by **closg00** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 5:58 pm

barelyawake wrote:The problem is not focusing on what creates champions. My draft board for the past years have been: Buy a pick and get Gobert; Draft Drummond; buy a pick and draft Marc Gasol, etc etc... Every single year I have outlined how to get a star big here: Don't trade for Gortat tank for a big; Don't resign Gortat, trade for Chandler, let him expire, and go after Aldridge or Love; trade Nene and clear out space to go after West and Aldridge.

All of those options also allow us to go after KD. The problem is management doesn't take risks.

Ok... enough... I'm repeating myself again...

What you wrote is worth repeating because a Grunfeld managed team is a treadmill team..perpetually.

long suffrin' boulez fan · Post #585 » by **long suffrin' boulez fan** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 6:06 pm

closg00 wrote:
barelyawake wrote:The problem is not focusing on what creates champions. My draft board for the past years have been: Buy a pick and get Gobert; Draft Drummond; buy a pick and draft Marc Gasol, etc etc... Every single year I have outlined how to get a star big here: Don't trade for Gortat tank for a big; Don't resign Gortat, trade for Chandler, let him expire, and go after Aldridge or Love; trade Nene and clear out space to go after West and Aldridge.

All of those options also allow us to go after KD. The problem is management doesn't take risks.

Ok... enough... I'm repeating myself again...

What you wrote is worth repeating because a Grunfeld managed team is a treadmill team..perpetually.

Yep, the only question is whether the machine is on the lowest or the second lowest setting.

Kanyewest · Post #586 » by **Kanyewest** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 6:27 pm

barelyawake wrote:
Kanyewest wrote:
barelyawake wrote:You are saying that Aldridge was never an option because of our GM and coach (not because of the moves we could have made; cap or talent). Well then, you've identified the problem. Shouldn't the owner recognize that as well?

Yes we should have won the lottery back in 1998 and fired the guy who didn't take Tony Parker and Manu.

Because a couple of almost forty year old guys playing one last year is more of a selling point than years of Wall, Beal and in all likihood (with Aldridge) KD, especially when signing a multi-year contract. As Indy said, it's the coach and the GM. And you can hire those with winning records.

Like Flip Saunders? Guys like Pop don't grow on trees. I wouldn't mind getting a new GM though. BTW, I think Leonard is regarded as a better player than Wall. Although I think Wall could do better within the Spurs organization.

JAR69 · Post #587 » by **JAR69** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 6:53 pm

David Lee for Gerald Wallace

https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/618491584137408512

keynote · Post #588 » by **keynote** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 6:57 pm

i wonder if the C's will buy Lee out.

Post #589 » by **nate33** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 6:59 pm

JAR69 wrote:David Lee for Gerald Wallace

https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/618491584137408512

Interesting. Wallace has a $10.1M expiring contract.

I wonder if Wittman offered Nene straight up for Lee? GSW doesn't have much need for Nene with Bogut, Ezeli, Speights and Green already manning the front line, so they probably would rather have the extra $3M in cap savings. That extra $3M converts to like $10.5M in out-of-pocket savings for ownership once the luxtax is factored. Nene isn't $10.5 better than Wallace.

Post #590 » by **nate33** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 7:02 pm

keynote wrote:i wonder if the C's will buy Lee out.

In general, I think the Celtics are interested in winning ball games. They're not trying to tank. So from that perspective, they'd probably be disinclined to buy him out. On the other hand, they already have a ton of developing young frontcourt players. If they don't buy out Lee, they ought to try and trade some other young players.

Post #591 » by **Rafael122** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 7:05 pm

nate33 wrote:
JAR69 wrote:David Lee for Gerald Wallace

https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/618491584137408512

Interesting. Wallace has a $10.1M expiring contract.

I wonder if Wittman offered Nene straight up for Lee? GSW doesn't have much need for Nene with Bogut, Ezeli, Speights and Green already manning the front line, so they probably would rather have the extra $3M in cap savings. That extra $3M converts to like $10.5M in out-of-pocket savings for ownership once the luxtax is factored. Nene isn't $10.5 better than Wallace.

It looks like they're gonna stretch Wallace, makes me wonder if they could have done that w/Nene?

dckingsfan · Post #592 » by **dckingsfan** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 7:07 pm

nate33 wrote:
keynote wrote:i wonder if the C's will buy Lee out.

In general, I think the Celtics are interested in winning ball games. They're not trying to tank. So from that perspective, they'd probably be disinclined to buy him out. On the other hand, they already have a ton of developing young frontcourt players. If they don't buy out Lee, they ought to try and trade some other young players.

C: Zeller
PF: Lee, Olynyk, Sullinger

So, guessing they will try to move Olynyk or Sullinger? Hmmm, interesting... And they have a boatload of guards... they should probably talk to the 76ers.

keynote · Post #593 » by **keynote** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 7:09 pm

nate33 wrote:
keynote wrote:i wonder if the C's will buy Lee out.

In general, I think the Celtics are interested in winning ball games. They're not trying to tank. So from that perspective, they'd probably be disinclined to buy him out. On the other hand, they already have a ton of developing young frontcourt players. If they don't buy out Lee, they ought to try and trade some other young players.

I don't think we're good trading partners. The C's should be looking to consolidate some of their young, average players in a trade for a single, more valuable piece. All we can offer is dead salary and a pick -- and I'm not that interested in giving up a pick for the likes of Olynyk or Sully.

Post #594 » by **nate33** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 7:12 pm

Rafael122 wrote:
nate33 wrote:
JAR69 wrote:David Lee for Gerald Wallace

https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/618491584137408512

Interesting. Wallace has a $10.1M expiring contract.

I wonder if Wittman offered Nene straight up for Lee? GSW doesn't have much need for Nene with Bogut, Ezeli, Speights and Green already manning the front line, so they probably would rather have the extra $3M in cap savings. That extra $3M converts to like $10.5M in out-of-pocket savings for ownership once the luxtax is factored. Nene isn't $10.5 better than Wallace.

It looks like they're gonna stretch Wallace, makes me wonder if they could have done that w/Nene?

If they're going to stretch him, then the answer to your question is no. Why stretch Nene's $13M when they can stretch Wallace's $10M instead?

jivelikenice · Post #595 » by **jivelikenice** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 7:43 pm

They're apparently not stretching him.

sfam · Post #596 » by **sfam** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 8:51 pm

barelyawake wrote:You are saying that Aldridge was never an option because of our GM and coach (not because of the moves we could have made; cap or talent). Well then, you've identified the problem. Shouldn't the owner recognize that as well?

I cannot envision a positive scenario that would have gotten Aldridge to come here. We just aren't the Cats Meow for FA destinations. That changes if KD comes here, just as it changed for Cleveland when Lebron came.

sfam · Post #597 » by **sfam** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 8:58 pm

barelyawake wrote:
Kanyewest wrote:
barelyawake wrote:You are saying that Aldridge was never an option because of our GM and coach (not because of the moves we could have made; cap or talent). Well then, you've identified the problem. Shouldn't the owner recognize that as well?

Yes we should have won the lottery back in 1998 and fired the guy who didn't take Tony Parker and Manu.

Because a couple of almost forty year old guys playing one last year is more of a selling point than years of Wall, Beal and in all likihood (with Aldridge) KD, especially when signing a multi-year contract. As Indy said, it's the coach and the GM. And you can hire those with winning records.

Its the coach, GM, proven high quality talented players and a track record of contending for a championship every year and winning it like 30-40% of the time. The Wizards had no shot. I'd love it as much as the next fan if Ernie had a religious conversion and decided the spend the rest of his years in a mountain monastery in Tibet. Its probably not happening until at least after 2016.

Post #598 » by **LyricalRico** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 9:55 pm

barelyawake wrote:The "NBA is getting smaller" is a matter of timing. The Spurs are going to win the championship because they got Aldridge. AD and the other young bigs are about to prove the "NBA is getting smaller" is a myth.

Lots of other teams seem to agree. Philly is rebuilding and they keep drafting bigs, not guards. Dallas' #1 FA target and eventual signing was a center. Heck, even Cleveland - the team that just lost to GS's small-ball strategy - could end up spending close to half a billion dollars on their frontcourt over the next 5 years ($100M+ for Love, $100M or close for Thompson, $200M for LeBron possibly under the new cap, $30M for Verajao, plus Mozgov's new contract).

That's why we're holding on to Nene!

queridiculo · Post #599 » by **queridiculo** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 11:20 pm

nate33 wrote:
queridiculo wrote:The longer this offseason goes on the more foolish the Oubre selection over Porter is looking.

Why?

Meant to write Portis.

barelyawake · Post #600 » by **barelyawake** » Tue Jul 7, 2015 11:25 pm

sfam wrote:
barelyawake wrote:You are saying that Aldridge was never an option because of our GM and coach (not because of the moves we could have made; cap or talent). Well then, you've identified the problem. Shouldn't the owner recognize that as well?

I cannot envision a positive scenario that would have gotten Aldridge to come here. We just aren't the Cats Meow for FA destinations. That changes if KD comes here, just as it changed for Cleveland when Lebron came.

No that changes when people stop acting like this is 1987 and Abe Pollin is the owner. Have you ever been to San Antonio? We are not Cleveland. I'm so sick of this has been mentality that says free agents don't want to come here. It's nonsense. Our team plus West and Aldridge is better than the Spurs plus West and Aldridge. Period. What else is there to sell (besides the coach and the GM, which are changeable)? We have a better city. We have a better future. This ho-hum we are the Wizards bs needs to stop, at all levels. Major market teams do not act this way.