PC Board OT thread

[bondom34]

Very classless. I like the Clippers and DJ, but this is bush league

It's also quite entertaining for Neutral fans, you got Doc and Cuban coming to houston, Paul and griffin planning to meet him, Parsons flying in, and then immediately thereafter Reddick is gonna drive his car there or something. Ekpe Udoh is just tweeting his reactions to this whole deal.

It's a circus.

I am very entertained by the internet today.

Here's a mean one:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/EricPincus/status/618849153867628545[/tweet]

[PaulieWal]

Reading on Twitter that he's pretty much going back to the Clips at this point.

Hopefully this changes the whole "moratorium" on new signings rule.

[Texas Chuck]

Reading on Twitter that he's pretty much going back to the Clips at this point.

Hopefully this changes the whole "moratorium" on new signings rule.

yeah as soon as Ramona Shelbourne tweeted that Jordan called Doc I knew it was probably really bad for Dallas. Pretty gutted if this happens.

[PaulieWal]

Reading on Twitter that he's pretty much going back to the Clips at this point.

Hopefully this changes the whole "moratorium" on new signings rule.

yeah as soon as Ramona Shelbourne tweeted that Jordan called Doc I knew it was probably really bad for Dallas. Pretty gutted if this happens.

I agree.

Waiting for the Cuban letter declaring how the Mavs will win another title before CP/DJ even make the WCF .

[Texas Chuck]

Yeah well at least Cuban has an extra $80M to cover the fine because I expect an epic rant out of him.

[sp6r=underrated]

my guess is the 2nd meeting with the Lakers was probably a favor to his agent--especially in light of the reports that got out about LMA hating the Lakers' presentation. His agent is going to have to work with the Lakers in the future and probably wanted to keep that relationship in a good place.

I think people really underestimate just how much influence these agents have. I mean we might as well call Dallas the Fegans instead of the Mavericks for instance. I could easily see LMA giving the Lakers a 2nd meeting as a favor to his agent. I mean he met with several teams I don't think he was ever seriously considering--again including my Mavs. I don't think poorly of him for it. Just like I didn't with Dwight or Melo or Deron or any of the big-time FA's we struck out on.

Regardless of whether Jordan signs with Dallas or re-signs with Los Angeles the actions of the last few hours have proven you correct that Jordan’s agent was pushing him hard to sign with Dallas.

Agents perform a vital service as most athletes are similar to most people in being god awful negotiators. Agents still should act on their client’s desires if it disagrees with what the agent perceives to be in their best interest. They should urge them to reconsider if their goal is illogical but it is the player’s decision in the end.

In this case it appears Fagan was determined to get Jordan in Dallas regardless of whether Deandre wanted to go there in the first place.

Los Angeles remains a legitimate contender if they can get him to return. Los Angeles not making the CF the last few years is mainly a product of them getting brutally unlucky in their post-season draw. I ran the number on this a while ago and no team in NBA history has been more unlucky with regards to caliber of teams they face in the first few rounds after taking into account regular season performance. Despite this they have not been decisively outplayed in any series over the last two years and knocked out the team that won the title the year before and the title the year after.

This club could win a title with Deandre. It is a shame they get labeled pretenders due to the lopsided conferences. It reminds of when people would sleep on Dallas for most of the last decade.

[PaulieWal]

This club could win a title with Deandre. It is a shame they get labeled pretenders due to the lopsided conferences. It reminds of when people would sleep on Dallas for most of the last decade.

I agree with most of your post but disagree with this. I don't think the Clips are contenders even with DJ. Their bench is a major handicap and even if they had beaten the Rox they would have run out of steam against the Warriors in the CF.

Until they get an actual bench and can find more rest for CP/Blake in the playoffs I don't think they are realistically going to win 4 rounds. And CP is already 30 right? Austin Rivers as a backup isn't going to cut it.

[Texas Chuck]

Agents perform a vital service as most athletes are similar to most people in being god awful negotiators. Agents still should act on their client’s desires if it disagrees with what the agent perceives to be in their best interest. They should urge them to reconsider if their goal is illogical but it is the player’s decision in the end.

In this case it appears Fagan was determined to get Jordan in Dallas regardless of whether Deandre wanted to go there in the first place.

Agree with all of this. I don't excuse Jordan who is a grown man, but no question where Fegan wanted him to go.

[sp6r=underrated]

Agents perform a vital service as most athletes are similar to most people in being god awful negotiators. Agents still should act on their client’s desires if it disagrees with what the agent perceives to be in their best interest. They should urge them to reconsider if their goal is illogical but it is the player’s decision in the end.

In this case it appears Fagan was determined to get Jordan in Dallas regardless of whether Deandre wanted to go there in the first place.

Agree with all of this. I don't excuse Jordan who is a grown man, but no question where Fegan wanted him to go.

I'll partially defend Jordan here. Jordan hired an agent because he recognized that he lacked the education and business skills to determine which contract is the best offer. It was reasonable for him to assume that the advice Fegan offered was based on the goals of Jordan rather than Fegan. It appears Fegan didn't give the proper advice.

Jordan deserves criticism for creating an echo chamber in his life in which Fegan's voice is the only one he heard. He should have had other individuals in his life with education and experience to provide him advice as well.

[PaulieWal]

I think it's clear that Fegan did want DJ to go to Dallas but again DJ is a grown man and it's not like he was being forced by Fegan. By all accounts Dallas' pitch to him was much better than the Clippers'. Dallas may have lied about making him the focal point of their offense but I can't excuse DJ for this flip-flop.

I hope the NBA looks into eliminating this moratorium period for free agents ASAP.

[Texas Chuck]

WEll obviously I'm biased a bit but I think Dallas was an acceptable choice if Jordan really hated playing with Chris Paul. I don't know how real any of that actually is, but I could see choosing a good organization like Dallas and playing with your buddies Parsons and Matthews in your home state. Especially with Dallas selling him on the idea of being the man here in a way he never could with Paul and Blake.

Basketball wise its not close that the Clippers were the better choice, but sometimes other things factor in. So I don't know that Fegan was giving him bad advice, but I agree its slimy if Fegan pushed his own agenda(and he probably did).

[sp6r=underrated]

This club could win a title with Deandre. It is a shame they get labeled pretenders due to the lopsided conferences. It reminds of when people would sleep on Dallas for most of the last decade.

I agree with most of your post but disagree with this. I don't think the Clips are contenders even with DJ. Their bench is a major handicap and even if they had beaten the Rox they would have run out of steam against the Warriors in the CF.

Until they get an actual bench and can find more rest for CP/Blake in the playoffs I don't think they are realistically going to win 4 rounds. And CP is already 30 right? Austin Rivers as a backup isn't going to cut it.

Warriors were a GOAT level team so almost all legitimate contenders, including clubs that won a title would have been underdogs against them. They decisively outplayed the Rockets by point differential despite missing Paul for the first two games. If it wasn't for one of the weirdest quarters in NBA history that series would be looked on as a demolition. A very credible argument can be made they were the second best club in the NBA based on regular season numbers and post-season performance.

The RS numbers and their PS play when you evaluate each individual series the last two years makes me confident that they could win a title if they got lucky for once in getting in the weaker side of the WC bracket rather than landing title contenders in the first round. That this has occurred for two straight years to a club that won 56 and 57 games respectively is grossly unfair.

[sp6r=underrated]

I am not sure why this grown man comment means Jordan is doing something dishonorable here. Reversing decisions based on further contemplation is a regular part of adulthood. I think all of us have done that since reaching legal age and will continue to do so in the future.

[PaulieWal]

This club could win a title with Deandre. It is a shame they get labeled pretenders due to the lopsided conferences. It reminds of when people would sleep on Dallas for most of the last decade.

I agree with most of your post but disagree with this. I don't think the Clips are contenders even with DJ. Their bench is a major handicap and even if they had beaten the Rox they would have run out of steam against the Warriors in the CF.

Until they get an actual bench and can find more rest for CP/Blake in the playoffs I don't think they are realistically going to win 4 rounds. And CP is already 30 right? Austin Rivers as a backup isn't going to cut it.

Warriors were a GOAT level team so almost all legitimate contenders, including clubs that won a title would have been underdogs against them. They decisively outplayed the Rockets by point differential despite missing Paul for the first two games. If it wasn't for one of the weirdest quarters in NBA history that series would be looked on as a demolition. A very credible argument can be made they were the second best club in the NBA based on regular season numbers and post-season performance.

The RS numbers and their PS play when you evaluate each individual series the last two years makes me confident that they could win a title if they got lucky for once in getting in the weaker side of the WC bracket rather than landing title contenders in the first round. That this has occurred for two straight years to a club that won 56 and 57 games respectively is grossly unfair.

I am not disagreeing with you that they should have beat the Rox but even then game 7 they were tired. Blake, Redick, and CP looked pretty done in that game.

My only point is I don't buy them as contenders with or without DJ. They are a very good team with him and can definitely make the WCF with the right breaks but ultimately they need to have more than 4 NBA players to win 4 rounds. Can Lance and PP change that a bit? That remains to be seen.

[PaulieWal]

I am not sure why this grown man comment means Jordan is doing something dishonorable here. Reversing decisions based on further contemplation is a regular part of adulthood. I think all of us have done that since reaching legal age and will continue to do so in the future.

Grown man comment means he had all the time in the world before announcing his decision. He should have taken more time if he needed it. He announced his decisions on Friday and by Monday he already calling Doc again.

I think you and I have talked about player empowerment before and I am all for it. We also discussed Lebron going back to the Cavs with Gilbert's letter I believe but I just can't support this.

Further contemplation can be done during the recruitment process. I do think what he did was a little bit "dishonorable" here though I don't even think it's really dishonorable but he did screw over the Mavs IMO. If he doesn't tell them that he's coming there maybe they could have done a S&T for Hibbert or go after Lopez? I don't see how he doesn't deserve some blame there.

Edit: And to be clear the equivalent here would be that we have two job offers, pick one, tell the 2nd company no and then try to change our mind. In most cases in the real world the 2nd company will not give you another chance to accept their offer. If anything DJ is benefiting from playing in the NBA where he can do this sort of thing without any repercussions.

[Texas Chuck]

I am not sure why this grown man comment means Jordan is doing something dishonorable here. Reversing decisions based on further contemplation is a regular part of adulthood. I think all of us have done that since reaching legal age and will continue to do so in the future.

I used that term in response to your comments about Fegan controlling where he went. I think Jordan is a grown man and can make his own decisions even if his agent is trying to steer him in a specific direction.

Ultimately I respect his right to re-think this decision. But I think he has to take ownership of the fiasco this has become.

[bondom34]

Yep, I like Paulie's analogy to taking one job and backing out. I went to the trade board and missed the convo here now.

[Texas Chuck]

If Jordan chooses LA like it looks like he will, and Cuban commences with tanking--as he would have to do at this point, I'd guess Rick Carlisle will be available soon.

[RSCD3_]

If Jordan chooses LA like it looks like he will, and Cuban commences with tanking--as he would have to do at this point, I'd guess Rick Carlisle will be available soon.

What GM will back out of his commitment to hire Carlisle lol.

Recently hired coaches are probably sweating buckets as we speak.

[PaulieWal]

If Jordan chooses LA like it looks like he will, and Cuban commences with tanking--as he would have to do at this point, I'd guess Rick Carlisle will be available soon.

Carlisle to the Cavs, Blatt to Dallas. LeBron gets a coach he can finally respect lol.