Suns Offseason Thread 3: Spurned for the Spurs

[TASTIC]

So....Tucker and Leuer on the trade block?

Leuer is a bit bigger/younger/more athletic than Mirza, but I'd rather any extra PF/C minutes go to Kieff and Len...

Hawks could use a starting SF with Carroll gone, Tucker would be perfect there too. I like Muscala but having lost Antic they'll need him to stick around. Bazemore's a great chemistry guy and also a solid defender/ok 3pt shooter - I'd send Tucker there for Baze (wait just saw he's a FA).

Would the Pacers want him - could start him alongside PG13 and they can both be SFs trying to play PF! I'd trade him for Solomon Hill - Az product and has upside as a defender.

[asudevil]

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q26

26. How do exceptions count against the cap? Does being under the cap always mean that a team has room to sign free agents? Do teams ever lose their exceptions?

If a team is below the cap, then its Disabled Player, Bi-Annual, Mid-Level (either the Taxpayer or Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level, whichever applies to the team) and/or trade exceptions are added to their team salary, and the league treats the team as though they are over the cap1. This is to prevent a loophole, in a manner similar to free agent amounts (see question number 39). A team can't act like it's under the cap and sign free agents using cap room, and then use their Disabled Player, Bi-Annual, Mid-Level and/or trade exceptions. Consequently, the exceptions are added to their team salary (putting the team over the cap) if the team is under the cap and adding the exceptions puts them over the cap. If a team is already over the cap, then the exceptions are not added to their team salary. There would be no point in doing so, since there is no cap room for signing free agents.

So being under the cap does not necessarily mean a team has room to sign free agents. For example, assume the cap is $58 million, and a team has $51.5 million committed to salaries. They also have a Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception for $5 million and a trade exception for $5.5 million. Even though their salaries put them $6.5 million under the cap, their exceptions also count toward their team salary, increasing their total to $62 million, or $4 million over the cap. So the team actually has no cap room to sign free agents, and instead must use its exceptions to sign players.

Teams have the option to renounce their exceptions in order to reclaim their cap room. So in the example above, if the team renounced their Traded Player and Mid-Level exceptions, then the $10.5 million is taken off their team salary, which then totals $51.5 million, leaving them with $6.5 million of cap room which then can be used to sign free agent(s).

Starting January 10 (February 10 in 2011-12) of each season, the Mid-Level (Non-Taxpayer, Taxpayer and Room), Bird (Larry Bird, Early Bird and Non-Bird) and Bi-Annual exceptions begin to pro-rate2 (reduce in value). For example, if there are 170 days in the season, then these exceptions reduce in value each day by 1/170 of the amount remaining on January 10. So if a team had a $5 million Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception and spent $1 million before the start of the season, then on January 10, and each day thereafter, it would reduce in value by 1/170 of $4 million, or $23,529. If the team signs another player on February 1 for $1 million, the daily pro-ration would still be 1/170 of $4 million.

A team's exceptions may be lost entirely, or the team may never receive them to begin with. This happens when their team salary is so low that when the exceptions are added to the team salary, the sum is still below the salary cap. If this happens when the exceptions arise, then the team doesn't get their exceptions at all. If the team salary ever drops below this level during the year, then any unused portions of their exceptions are lost (and do not return if the team salary increases).

For example, assume there is a $58 million salary cap, and during the offseason a team has $50 million committed to salaries, along with a Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception for $5 million, a trade exception for $2.5 million, and an unrenounced free agent whose free agent amount is $2 million. Their salaries and exceptions total $59.5 million, or $1.5 million over the cap. What if their free agent signs with another team? The $2 million free agent amount comes off their cap, so their team salary (including their remaining exceptions) drops to $57.5 million. This total is below the cap so the team loses its Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level and trade exceptions.

There is logic behind this. The whole idea behind an "exception" is that it is an exception to the rule which says a team cannot go over the salary cap. In other words, an exception is a mechanism which allows a team to function above the cap. If a team isn't over the cap, then the concept of an exception is moot. Therefore, if a team's team salary ever drops this far, its exceptions go away. A rule of thumb is that a team may have either exceptions or cap room, but it can't have both at the same time. However, a team in this situation does qualify to use the Room Mid-Level exception (see question number 25).

[Kerrsed]

Where's the 2K16 cover with Leuer on it?

I think McD should have his own 2K16 cover as well!

[RunDogGun]

So....Tucker and Leuer on the trade block?

Leuer is a bit bigger/younger/more athletic than Mirza, but I'd rather any extra PF/C minutes go to Kieff and Len...

Hawks could use a starting SF with Carroll gone, Tucker would be perfect there too. I like Muscala but having lost Antic they'll need him to stick around. Bazemore's a great chemistry guy and also a solid defender/ok 3pt shooter - I'd send Tucker there for Baze (wait just saw he's a FA).

Would the Pacers want him - could start him alongside PG13 and they can both be SFs trying to play PF! I'd trade him for Solomon Hill - Az product and has upside as a defender.

But why? Why trade a starter and another bench guy for a bench guy?

I say roll with what we got, get them in the gym. If we can land a star player, and moving Tucker or Morris is the key, then sure.

[Moochthemonkey]

Yes...well more than likely.

wait, I'm confused af now lol.

They could have still signed Teletovic with the remaining cap space (which includes the Dragic trade exception), and kept the exception per my reasoning above.

Why would they renounce the trade exception then, if it can be used as a tool to acquire another player, if needed?

Thanks for your explanations, btw.

because he is saying they count against the cap. So we didn't have the space, it was being taken up by the TPE. If we signed Knight right after Chandler, then we would still have it, but then to get Tele, we would need the Nets, and most likely lose an asset. So renounce the TPE, gain that cap space that was a cap hold, and sign Tele without any issues.

According to my (incorrect?) calculations though, we did have the space:

PJ Tucker $5,500,000
Alex Len $3,807,120
Tyson Chandler $12,177,986
Markieff Morris $8,000,000
TJ Warren $2,041,080
Archie Goodwin $1,160,160
Eric Bledsoe $13,500,000
Devin Booker $1,773,200
Brandon Knight $8,900,000 Cap hold
Jon Leuer $1,035,000
Jerel McNeal $ 845,059
Goran Dragic TPE $ 5,500,000

Total = $64,239,604
Cap Room = $5,760,396

just enough to sign Teletovic and sign Weems using the Mid-level. But I suppose this is all moot, if Weems was signed before Teletovic.

[gaspar]

TPE is useless if you are under the cap. You can absorb the salary by using the cap space the same way you can do it by using a trade exception. You can sign free agents only by using cap space (or MLE, BAE etc.).

[Moochthemonkey]

Just...disregard my posts.

good thing I'm not an accountant lol

[Kerrsed]

[MrMiyagi]

McD,

Please just get Terrence Williams. It'll be easier this way.

Sincerely,
The Phoenix Suns RealGM Community

[Moochthemonkey]

how would you feel if Terrence Williams married Boxy

[Qwigglez]

Got you by 8 hours bro

Spoiler:

Actually by a few months...Man I didn't realise my Mirza mancrush had surpassed my Anthony Randolph one!

Dang I thought I started the Mirza fan club but you got me beat! At least you And1'd me

[gaspar]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EttdgtC1KCI[/youtube]

[Kerrsed]

how would you feel if Terrence Williams married Boxy

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VV1XWJN3nJo[/youtube]

[Mr-Al]

wish it was a two year deal with Mirza

on a one year deal you can't really be a trade asset and you could just as easily be gone the next summer.

chances are he flourishes here and gets due for a lot more money, two year deal would have been much better

We're not going all in on any of our FA signings because we know they aren't the guys who will get us over the top. We want to maintain flexibility to get a star FA next year, think if we turned that cap space into DeMar DeRozan? who likely ends up being the cream of the FA crop (outside of Durant).

Also, think about it like this, you make the playoffs this year, go hard after a top tier FA next offseason, and all of a sudden you look like a top-4 or 5 team in the conference (in other words, in the conversation for a title), meaning those role players will be more likely to return to the team to continue the winning project.

I also don't think that Teletovic is going to perform SO well that we'll feel like we HAVE to sign him at all costs.

Yeah.. Demar DeRozan

Great. I'm not sure I'd want that guy even if they were giving him away for free

Besides Durant and Hortford, who we aren't getting, next year's free agents suck pretty much all around

[SunsFanSSOL]

DeRozan sucks.

[Mr-Al]

I'll take one Perry Jones for free please

[Years90Suns]

I believe Mirza is a really good move.
This new style of playing goes much in this direction: players who can switch, penetrate, pass and, overall, shoot from everywhere.
The bad thing with Morris and Mirza is that they hardly find a bad shot, which our coaches should correct.
Other than that, I think they are good players in good contracts. We have 2 PFs that can share minutes.

Then Len adding that corner shot to make big men pay for not being able to go outside to defend him is good news. That is how the game will be player more and more. Expect GSW to defend Len using Green, for example. The game is not played as Chandler plays it any more, although I am happy with his signing. But he is one dimensional player.

Guards that can penetrate, forwards that can switch and shoot, bigs that can hit from outside, then leaving space inside for otherplayers to go to the rim, or allowing wings to cut and receive under the basket.

[Saberestar]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EttdgtC1KCI[/youtube]

After hearing this interview it is clear that Marcus was a cancer in the locker room.
Right now it seems that Markieff is painful with Marcus out of the team and McDonough thinks that with time he will understand that this is a great oportunity for both. He said that training camp is in 2/3 months, a ton of time to think about this and assimilate the changes.

[TASTIC]

Got you by 8 hours bro

Spoiler:

Actually by a few months...Man I didn't realise my Mirza mancrush had surpassed my Anthony Randolph one!

Dang I thought I started the Mirza fan club but you got me beat! At least you And1'd me

I knew I liked Weems when he was younger cos I was living in Toronto when he was traded there...but yikes, CALLED him too! haha. Also 'fluid' and 'Josh Howard' featured far too much in my commentary!

[JMac1]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EttdgtC1KCI[/youtube]

A very well spoken, articulate, and pragmatic guy; in short............he is calm, cool ,and collective. I like to hear him speak and explain the process, it makes complete sense. I trust this guy will do what's best for the team.