OKC Thunder Offseason 2015

[Andre Roberstan]

Perry Jones is worse than Jeff Green. He's not good. He's one of the worst rebounders ever for someone 6'10" or taller, inconsistent from three, loose handles, etc. He's awful.

PJ3 is very talented with a very good base skill set to work with and expand on. People tend to forget that GMs were drooling over this guy before his injury and his subsequent devaluing being on this roster.... which many expected given he is a tweener and stuck behind KD and Ibaka.

Its good to see him moving on to a team that can put him in the forefront, the Celtics got a steal.
He is going to thrive on that team as long as he is given proper minutes per game and i imagine if he is not already starting, he will be by the end of the first quarter of the season. I suspect he will reach a value and offering abilities similar to GWall in his heyday.

There've been quite a few guys that GMs were drooling over that turned into a fat load of nothing in the NBA. I admire your optimism though. But prime Crash? Really?

[bondom34]

Looks like Novak's staying:

http://www.si.com/nba/2015/07/15/nba-summer-league-kevin-durant-enes-kanter-deron-williams-thunder-nets

Think about Oklahoma City’s second unit: It’s Kanter, Nick Collison, Kyle Singler, D.J. Augustin and the loser of the Dion Waiters/Andre Roberson battle. Not to mention Mitch McGary (who Oklahoma City execs are very high on), Steve Novak (who OKC has taken off the trading block, I’m told) and Josh Huestis, last year’s first round pick who is a strong candidate to be part of the team this season. In the middle of a snake bitten season, Thunder GM Sam Presti turned Reggie Jackson (who didn’t want to be in OKC anyway) and Kendrick Perkins into Kanter, Singler and Augustin, three players the Thunder would not have been able to sign outright due to cap considerations.

Also, Mannix expects Kanter off the bench too.

SMH at the Morrow disrespect.

I didn't even realize it .

[Bravenewworld]

Very interesting, but I'd caution against taking anything about college defenses as gospel on how Donovan will run things. College teams don't tend to be as good at exploiting the cracks in defenses as pro teams, so you'll see things like presses and zones that are rarely used or only situationally used in the NBA. I think you can get a sense of Donovan's tendencies, but as far as specifics the pro game is different.

The reason Donovan has been sought after by GMs is because he already runs an NBA system. Something most college coaches don't do, or really, cant do. Most coaches in the NCAA don't have the tools to run a system that would translate to the NBA, Coach K, Bill Self, Izzo, and a handful of other coaches are the only ones i can think of.

Just the 3pt line difference is huge in terms of how team defenses run. It's more ground to cover, more angles for you to slip passes through.

In terms of college ball, the new 3pt line, no. Coaches have been preparing for the 3pt line to be the same as the NBA for years now and if you watch a lot of college ball you'll notice this on offense and defense.
Not only that, the difference between distance is basically one step. This is not going to be something to make or break your system between college and pro's.

Not saying that Donovan's defense won't have the same tendencies. Just...let's be careful before we say that's exactly how things will run. Stevens is on record as saying he had to adjust his thinking on some things when he came to the NBA because he couldn't run them at the higher level.

Im not sure what you're referencing here, I looked for it but could not find this.
The only thing i could find was him in an interview talking about adjusting to American ball when he went from NZ to Pitt.

[spearsy23]

Perry Jones is worse than Jeff Green. He's not good. He's one of the worst rebounders ever for someone 6'10" or taller, inconsistent from three, loose handles, etc. He's awful.

PJ3 is very talented with a very good base skill set to work with and expand on. People tend to forget that GMs were drooling over this guy before his injury and his subsequent devaluing being on this roster.... which many expected given he is a tweener and stuck behind KD and Ibaka.

Its good to see him moving on to a team that can put him in the forefront, the Celtics got a steal.
He is going to thrive on that team as long as he is given proper minutes per game and i imagine if he is not already starting, he will be by the end of the first quarter of the season. I suspect he will reach a value and offering abilities similar to GWall in his heyday.

It's just outright trolling at this point.

[spearsy23]

Just the 3pt line difference is huge in terms of how team defenses run. It's more ground to cover, more angles for you to slip passes through.

In terms of college ball, the new 3pt line, no. Coaches have been preparing for the 3pt line to be the same as the NBA for years now and if you watch a lot of college ball you'll notice this on offense and defense.
Not only that, the difference between distance is basically one step. This is not going to be something to make or break your system between college and pro's.

It's one step at every point in the line, that's a significant area difference. And on top of that you add the inability of college kids to shoot. Colleges aren't preparing for a deeper three at all, they're packing the paint and letting kids brick jumpers at a historically poor rate.

Not saying that Donovan's defense won't have the same tendencies. Just...let's be careful before we say that's exactly how things will run. Stevens is on record as saying he had to adjust his thinking on some things when he came to the NBA because he couldn't run them at the higher level.

Im not sure what you're referencing here, I looked for it but could not find this.
The only thing i could find was him in an interview talking about adjusting to American ball when he went from NZ to Pitt.

Brad Stevens.

[Bravenewworld]

Perry Jones is worse than Jeff Green. He's not good. He's one of the worst rebounders ever for someone 6'10" or taller, inconsistent from three, loose handles, etc. He's awful.

PJ3 is very talented with a very good base skill set to work with and expand on. People tend to forget that GMs were drooling over this guy before his injury and his subsequent devaluing being on this roster.... which many expected given he is a tweener and stuck behind KD and Ibaka.

Its good to see him moving on to a team that can put him in the forefront, the Celtics got a steal.
He is going to thrive on that team as long as he is given proper minutes per game and i imagine if he is not already starting, he will be by the end of the first quarter of the season. I suspect he will reach a value and offering abilities similar to GWall in his heyday.

There've been quite a few guys that GMs were drooling over that turned into a fat load of nothing in the NBA. I admire your optimism though. But prime Crash? Really?

He's still very young, very talented and most GMs and coaches would understand he was stuck behind players he would never get time above and ultimately in a position he cannot control.

As for GWall, yah. High defense, athletic, high rebounder at the 3, fairly poor shooter but will score mostly in the post, right outside of the post or with alley oops. Production wise he will probably never make it passed 16/17/18.
Its a best case scenario for him, but i think he can reach that point. Like GWall i question where he would fit in on a contending team or near contending team.

[Bravenewworld]

Perry Jones is worse than Jeff Green. He's not good. He's one of the worst rebounders ever for someone 6'10" or taller, inconsistent from three, loose handles, etc. He's awful.

PJ3 is very talented with a very good base skill set to work with and expand on. People tend to forget that GMs were drooling over this guy before his injury and his subsequent devaluing being on this roster.... which many expected given he is a tweener and stuck behind KD and Ibaka.

Its good to see him moving on to a team that can put him in the forefront, the Celtics got a steal.
He is going to thrive on that team as long as he is given proper minutes per game and i imagine if he is not already starting, he will be by the end of the first quarter of the season. I suspect he will reach a value and offering abilities similar to GWall in his heyday.

It's just outright trolling at this point.

Right.
Because if you're not willing to suggest the same thing, its trolling.

[Bravenewworld]

It's one step at every point in the line, that's a significant area difference. And on top of that you add the inability of college kids to shoot. Colleges aren't preparing for a deeper three at all, they're packing the paint and letting kids brick jumpers at a historically poor rate.

Again, the differences for coaches running an NBA system, is not going to be a make or break thing.

And the colleges that are "packing the paint" are the very few (mostly major and a handful of mid majors) that manage to get quality big men. Most teams in college do not work around their bigs, rather bigs become an afterthought or side focus. The majority run what would be the NBA equivalent of 4 guards and they play "stretch ball" or "small ball". This is something that is not done by choice but by limitations. If you're a skilled 6'9+ player, chances are the high mid-majors and "elites" are going after you and there's what? 347 teams in division 1... and all but maybe 30 or so are forced to run the above mentioned systems.

Brad Stevens.

That explains it.
Im not sure if that is a good comparison for Donovan though.Donovan is far more experienced, has a better system that is more diverse and set for the NBA.

[Soonerule]

I think PJ and Lamb both needed a fresh start. They both possess the physical tools to play in this league and the teams they are going to will afford them a better opportunity to hone their skills on the court so it is up to them whether they succeed or fail.

[Soonerule]

It's one step at every point in the line, that's a significant area difference. And on top of that you add the inability of college kids to shoot. Colleges aren't preparing for a deeper three at all, they're packing the paint and letting kids brick jumpers at a historically poor rate.

Again, the differences for coaches running an NBA system, is not going to be a make or break thing.

And the colleges that are "packing the paint" are the very few (mostly major and a handful of mid majors) that manage to get quality big men. Most teams in college do not work around their bigs, rather bigs become an afterthought or side focus. The majority run what would be the NBA equivalent of 4 guards and they play "stretch ball" or "small ball". This is something that is not done by choice but by limitations. If you're a skilled 6'9+ player, chances are the high mid-majors and "elites" are going after you and there's what? 347 teams in division 1... and all but maybe 30 or so are forced to run the above mentioned systems.

Brad Stevens.

That explains it.
Im not sure if that is a good comparison for Donovan though.Donovan is far more experienced, has a better system that is more diverse and set for the NBA.

I'm not overly concerned with Donovan making the transition from an X's and O's standpoint. I think he has done his homework. Over the years he has accumulated a pretty vast pool of information during his discussions with successful NBA coaches looking for aspects of the pro game that would benefit him at Florida that will serve him very well in OKC. The adjustment to working with paid athletes vs college kids will be his biggest hurdle.

[Soonerule]

He's still very young, very talented and most GMs and coaches would understand he was stuck behind players he would never get time above and ultimately in a position he cannot control.
.

This season, considering KD's injury, especially in the final months of the season being the exception. I have wondered if PJ, and Lamb for that matter, got themselves in the doghouse being too chummy with Reggie. Sometimes there are lines that get crossed there is no coming back from. They both needed fresh starts.

[slick_watts]

PJ3 is very talented with a very good base skill set to work with and expand on. People tend to forget that GMs were drooling over this guy before his injury and his subsequent devaluing being on this roster.... which many expected given he is a tweener and stuck behind KD and Ibaka.

What talents does Perry Jones have? Be specific.

[TBOKED]

PJ's Talent = Reggie's and Lamb's doghouse buddies

The evil triumvirate is no more.

WB won't get left hanging in those high fives and knuckle bumps. Lol

[TBOKED]

Funny. Didn't even read the above doghouse post. Someone already went down that path. Truth though. Well said.

[Bravenewworld]

PJ3 is very talented with a very good base skill set to work with and expand on. People tend to forget that GMs were drooling over this guy before his injury and his subsequent devaluing being on this roster.... which many expected given he is a tweener and stuck behind KD and Ibaka.

What talents does Perry Jones have? Be specific.

None.
Absolutely none.
That is why he was a lottery pick for most of the year until an injury and even after that injury was still a first round pick by a team that has clearly shown they know how to draft.

[Bravenewworld]

He's still very young, very talented and most GMs and coaches would understand he was stuck behind players he would never get time above and ultimately in a position he cannot control.
.

This season, considering KD's injury, especially in the final months of the season being the exception. I have wondered if PJ, and Lamb for that matter, got themselves in the doghouse being too chummy with Reggie. Sometimes there are lines that get crossed there is no coming back from. They both needed fresh starts.

That was obviously a big deal. According to reports in the locker room PJ, Lamb and Reggie had their little pack going on with Reggie being the inciter of issues. As a result it really divided the locker room and created some minor issues. Luckily we had Westbrook and i can imagine what the locker room would have been like if RJ decided to step out of line with RWB there... i know people like him and he would have been like a pit bull on that situation and RJ would have been quickly put in his place. There would still be issues floating around though.
Hell, at this point Reggie's ego is past Voyager 1, how that man convinced Detroit to pay him 20 a year is beyond me.

I think there is an obvious difference between Lamb and PJ.
Lamb has far more of a shot. We needed a SG and instead of doing what Brooks wanted, he did what he wanted and when we drastically needed him he instead had issues and got DNPs.
Outside of last season for some short periods, PJ never really got that chance. We need a back up SF but how well is one going to develop when KD is commanding 37mpg. The PF position was his secondary and that was taken up even further. I was far more impressed with PJ when he did get playing time. Lamb i just.... winced every time he had the ball. Every game he played he would try to dribble left, watch the ball as he dribbled, when he looked up to drive he would lose the ball. At least once every game he played. Im sure anyone reading this is tried of me saying this, but i have big problem with 3rd year NBA players who still have to watch the ball while they dribble. That is a big development issue for me.

[slick_watts]

None.
Absolutely none.
That is why he was a lottery pick for most of the year until an injury and even after that injury was still a first round pick by a team that has clearly shown they know how to draft.

Meaningless anecdotes. Jones has been in the NBA for three seasons. He's played 1500+ minutes. You claim he is skilled. What are some of his skills? You devote a lot of time to tap-dancing. Answer the question.

[slick_watts]

but i have big problem with 3rd year NBA players who still have to watch the ball while they dribble. That is a big development issue for me.

Clyde Drexler dribbled with his head down half his career. That's your argument, here?

[Bravenewworld]

None.
Absolutely none.
That is why he was a lottery pick for most of the year until an injury and even after that injury was still a first round pick by a team that has clearly shown they know how to draft.

Meaningless anecdotes. Jones has been in the NBA for three seasons. He's played 1500+ minutes. You claim he is skilled. What are some of his skills? You devote a lot of time to tap-dancing. Answer the question.

Self contradiction yes? You do get that even low minute players who have only gotten 1500 minutes in 3 seasons, are still skilled, right?

Honestly, I dont feel the urge to repeat myself or state the obvious.
Look for my previous post highlighting his skill set and what he can bring to the table. I posted multiple replies highlighting some of these aspects.
Or....
Go to the front page and read the article about him, they highlight his skill base with OKC.
ESPN has a short article that does the same.
Look up a scouting report.

Clyde Drexler dribbled with his head down half his career. That's your argument, here?

.... Really?
Someone really needs to explain the negative aspect of a guard needing to watch himself dribble?
Ask any coach, how about that? Go to Coach Nicks youtube page and ask him why.
Ask any Jr. High player... how about that?
You clearly just want to argue for the sake of arguing. No matter what i say you'll just want to argue with it so.... go ask someone else who you would feel is more qualified then myself.

[bondom34]

Well that was predictable.