JOSH SMITH to Clippers

Post #121 » by **thanumba2clippersfan** » Sat Jul 18, 2015 11:08 pm

I'm glad that we signed Josh Smith and for a good deal too. This makes our bench more versatile and more athletic. I really like the pieces we've added this off season.

Post #122 » by **og15** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 3:01 am

I forgot about Moteijunas on Houston for some reason, but Smith picking the Clippers is made even clearer when you consider that the SF spot in Houston has Ariza/Brewer and the PF spot has Jones / Moteijunas, meaning that minutes aren't necessarily a given on Houston.

On the other hand, here at the least he's getting all the backup PF minutes, at the least. There he actually might not necessarily be the designated first PF off the bench each night with DMo and a Jones there.

Roscoe Sheed · Post #123 » by **Roscoe Sheed** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 4:34 am

mattd13 wrote:we know what jamal brings. he will win some games. he just needs to be watched. the bigger concern will be what Austin and lance bring. those two need to step up and preform every night for us to get deep in the playoffs. my biggest concern is a long term injury to a key player. most always struggle when they return late in the season.

If Jamal stays, Doc should just have him play back up point- he is actually a good passer when he wants to be- in that role he is a much better player than when he is in shoot first mode. I'm serious- he be fairly effective as a ball handler and distributor. Now, whether he would want to play that role is another question.

Angel strike1 · Post #124 » by **Angel strike1** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:17 am

Why u all set on dumping Jamal for trash?

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mattd13 · Post #125 » by **mattd13** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 11:15 am

I agree with roscoe concerning jamal. I believe at this point in his career he will be happy to fill a role on this team.

Post #126 » by **og15** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 1:34 pm

Roscoe Sheed wrote:
mattd13 wrote:we know what jamal brings. he will win some games. he just needs to be watched. the bigger concern will be what Austin and lance bring. those two need to step up and preform every night for us to get deep in the playoffs. my biggest concern is a long term injury to a key player. most always struggle when they return late in the season.

If Jamal stays, Doc should just have him play back up point- he is actually a good passer when he wants to be- in that role he is a much better player than when he is in shoot first mode. I'm serious- he be fairly effective as a ball handler and distributor. Now, whether he would want to play that role is another question.

Jamal isn't a PG though, it's been tried many times to no avail. He has the handles and the passing ability, but not the mentality. Even with that, the bigger issues is that he can't defend PG's'.

If he's willing to accept a non defined role where his minutes fluctuate highly, then I have no issues with keeping him on the team, but then he's like a 10th man on the roster rotation wise.

A part of me feels that it is a bit unfair to him, but if he accepts the role, sure. To me it is nice as an organization to see these situations and try and get a player into a more suitable situation with another team of you believe their role will decrease to a level they won't be happy with. Just try and get them to a different conference if you don't want them on a competitor.

playaloc916 · Post #127 » by **playaloc916** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 3:16 pm

og15 wrote:A part of me feels that it is a bit unfair to him, but if he accepts the role, sure. To me it is nice as an organization to see these situations and try and get a player into a more suitable situation with another team of you believe their role will decrease to a level they won't be happy with. Just try and get them to a different conference if you don't want them on a competitor.

Agreed. Same thing with David Lee. Instead of occasionally getting minutes, but mostly sitting on the bench due not fitting the system, the Warriors trade him to a team where he may get significant minutes. I see the same situation with Jamal. I think deep down he still feels like a major contributor, so I'm not sure if he would take a significantly reduced role well. I don't see him as a Willie Green type, who is really professional and won't sulk if he only gets garbage minutes and DNP's. Better to move him while he is still somewhat fresh off his reputation of being decent scorer.

With the amount we are discussing Jamal in various threads, he should have his own thread, lol.

Dynamix · Post #128 » by **Dynamix** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 5:14 pm

playaloc916 wrote:With the amount we are discussing Jamal in various threads, he should have his own thread, lol.

Hopefully it will be the "Jamal got traded" thread.

Quake Griffin · Post #129 » by **Quake Griffin** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 5:22 pm

og15 wrote:
Roscoe Sheed wrote:
mattd13 wrote:we know what jamal brings. he will win some games. he just needs to be watched. the bigger concern will be what Austin and lance bring. those two need to step up and preform every night for us to get deep in the playoffs. my biggest concern is a long term injury to a key player. most always struggle when they return late in the season.

If Jamal stays, Doc should just have him play back up point- he is actually a good passer when he wants to be- in that role he is a much better player than when he is in shoot first mode. I'm serious- he be fairly effective as a ball handler and distributor. Now, whether he would want to play that role is another question.

Jamal isn't a PG though, it's been tried many times to no avail. He has the handles and the passing ability, but not the mentality. Even with that, the bigger issues is that he can't defend PG's'.

If he's willing to accept a non defined role where his minutes fluctuate highly, then I have no issues with keeping him on the team, but then he's like a 10th man on the roster rotation wise.

A part of me feels that it is a bit unfair to him, but if he accepts the role, sure. To me it is nice as an organization to see these situations and try and get a player into a more suitable situation with another team of you believe their role will decrease to a level they won't be happy with. Just try and get them to a different conference if you don't want them on a competitor.

I think I'm the first person to say try Jamal at the backup 1 this season….thought he had the handles and passing ability to do it.

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then Games 1 and 2 in Houston happened.

nickhx2 · Post #130 » by **nickhx2** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 5:25 pm

feel like i'm all talked out of jamal crawford but at least i can say this

jamal as a PG has been a failure everywhere he's gone and every time he's tried it. portland is exhibit A. we've seen it numerous times on the clips as exhibit B.

just cause you have the ability to do something doesn't mean you have the ability to actually execute it. it's the story of jamal crawford, everyone.

Post #131 » by **og15** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:19 pm

playaloc916 wrote:
og15 wrote:A part of me feels that it is a bit unfair to him, but if he accepts the role, sure. To me it is nice as an organization to see these situations and try and get a player into a more suitable situation with another team of you believe their role will decrease to a level they won't be happy with. Just try and get them to a different conference if you don't want them on a competitor.

Agreed. Same thing with David Lee. Instead of occasionally getting minutes, but mostly sitting on the bench due not fitting the system, the Warriors trade him to a team where he may get significant minutes. I see the same situation with Jamal. I think deep down he still feels like a major contributor, so I'm not sure if he would take a significantly reduced role well. I don't see him as a Willie Green type, who is really professional and won't sulk if he only gets garbage minutes and DNP's. Better to move him while he is still somewhat fresh off his reputation of being decent scorer.

With the amount we are discussing Jamal in various threads, he should have his own thread, lol.

Lol, he really should. Lindecision for example might have been thinking my reasoning for wanting to move Jamal is because of dislike, but it isn't. Yes, I have had issues with his fit and role, but part of that is one Doc and also the lack of other options on the roster that he allowed to happen. If the team built the roster a different way it could make sense to keep him, but you have Redick / Stephenson, both younger at SG position, and there aren't minutes at the other positions, neither do you want to play Jamal at PG or SF on defense. Yes, Stephenson is questionable, but you have to make choices.

With the current roster, you've on paper relegated Jamal to a role of inconsistent minutes and a 3rd SG. The options are to hope he agrees to have this undefined role where he could range from 0 to 15 minutes each night and be happy, or to move him so that the guy isn't stuck in a position where he's having to bite his tongue every day about his minutes.

You know how the media is "so Jamal, how do you feel about your new role and the lack of minutes when you have been a large contributor in previous seasons?" Not to mention that from the outside looking in and without any word from Jamal, what we know from him suggests that he won't be happy. Do what is right for the man, and yes, for the team also, trade him to somewhere he can actually get time and contribute to a winning situation, and look to get something of value for the current roster.

I think some people are being hypercritical. He's not a terrible player, but my tune has stayed the same. He's an above average regular season contributor. In the playoffs though, he's not an efficient enough scorer, actually inefficient and doesn't bring value in any other way and therefore becomes a negative player because he actually hurts your offense and was already negative on defense.

illastrate · Post #132 » by **illastrate** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:59 pm

Angel strike1 wrote:Why u all set on dumping Jamal for trash?

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Addition by subtraction. The makeup of this team is different from last year's and while Smith and Lance have be known to be inefficient, their unique skillsets and all-around play should be put to use rather than give mins to an inefficient Jamal who is a one-trick pony.

nickhx2 · Post #133 » by **nickhx2** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 7:06 pm

yup.

anyway i know i'm probably the most outspoken crawford hater one might find but i can admit at least to seeing the value of unleashing him on bad regular season teams.

he'd never go for that though and his ability to make and1 mixtapes of bad regular season teams isn't worth having over a legit backup center, especially when he shouldn't be touched in the playoffs (and doc inevitably plays him 25 mins a game anyway)

mattd13 · Post #134 » by **mattd13** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 7:15 pm

I think you will see more of jamal than you think early in the season. I believe doc will bring lance along slowly until he shows he can get the job done. plus Austin will have to be consistent to be effective and I have my doubts on that also. if jamal starts out strong look out. I put some of the blame on doc for the things jamal does.

JayClips92 · Post #135 » by **JayClips92** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:02 pm

mattd13 wrote:I think you will see more of jamal than you think early in the season. I believe doc will bring lance along slowly until he shows he can get the job done. plus Austin will have to be consistent to be effective and I have my doubts on that also. if jamal starts out strong look out. I put some of the blame on doc for the things jamal does.

If Jamal starts out strong maybe that'll make his trade value go up?

Mr Gametime · Post #136 » by **Mr Gametime** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 4:04 am

I think Josh Smith was the steal signing of the off season, am I the only one in here that thinks he should be starting over Paul Pierce?

mttwlsn16 · Post #137 » by **mttwlsn16** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 8:50 am

Angel strike1 wrote:Why u all set on dumping Jamal for trash?

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Bc as much as I do like Jamal, when he's hot he's amazing and seems like a good guy, he's more often a negative than a positive. He's an inefficient chucker and if we could move him for another legit big man off the bench that would be a plus.

Rip'nTheCourt · Post #138 » by **Rip'nTheCourt** » Fri Jul 24, 2015 11:54 am

Mr Gametime wrote:I think Josh Smith was the steal signing of the off season, am I the only one in here that thinks he should be starting over Paul Pierce?

You are giving Josh Smith way too much credit. With too large a role he can be an absolute rotation killer.

Clemenza · Post #139 » by **Clemenza** » Sat Jul 25, 2015 12:39 am

Our depth and athleticism is going to be crazy this season! Bout time Doc woke the f*ck up and smelled the coffee. Now we can fight fire with fire!

madmaxmedia · Post #140 » by **madmaxmedia** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:50 pm

mttwlsn16 wrote:
Angel strike1 wrote:Why u all set on dumping Jamal for trash?

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Bc as much as I do like Jamal, when he's hot he's amazing and seems like a good guy, he's more often a negative than a positive. He's an inefficient chucker and if we could move him for another legit big man off the bench that would be a plus.

There were times 1-2 years ago where he'd carry the scoring load of the 2nd unit on his back, and often made the 2nd unit look better than it probably really was. He is a chucker extraordinaire, but that also means he can get a decent shot attempt off almost any time.

I think age is catching up to him though. He can probably still fill this role on another team, hopefully we find a trade that works out for everyone.

If you are seriously thinking of yourself as a title contender, you don't want him on your second unit. If you are an up-and-comer who is lacking in scoring punch off the bench, he can help a lot still IMO.