Is Kieff dogging it?

[carey]

Yeah... well, TT only gets paid if James wants him too. Clearly he isn't worth a max but if James says he will bolt if TT isn't paid then Cleveland probably does it. I'm surprised it's dragging out. James & Paul can't be happy.

[saintEscaton]

And please spare me the bulls**t "I want him gone because he is a criminal". Many of the stupid and completely talantless people, who are being called "rappers" in the USA have served real jail time and too many people are kissing their a***s. If someone needs a guide on how not to be a basketball fan, said person only needs to scroll through a Suns' forum.

[bwgood77]

It's actually not that surprising. Thompson and Bledsoe are both represented by Rich Paul. This sort of scorched earth negotiating style seems to be Paul's modus operandi. It worked out well for Bledsoe. And it will work out well for Thompson. If he signs the qualifying offer, he'll be an unrestricted free agent next summer when an unprecedented number of teams have max-level salary space. If the Cavs cave, he gets his max money and gets to stay with Cleveland. The only way it backfires is if TT suffers a catastrophic injury next season before he signs a long-term deal. It's time to re-visit the narrative that the Suns somehow botched the Bledsoe negotiations last summer. It wasn't the Suns. It was dealing with Rich Paul. This is what he does to get his clients paid.

I was going to say the same. If he can stay healthy, this is a smart decision, because he will REALLY be overpaid next summer. Hopefully not by us though. I doubt Ryan would want to deal with Rich Paul anyway.

[NavLDO]

It's actually not that surprising. Thompson and Bledsoe are both represented by Rich Paul. This sort of scorched earth negotiating style seems to be Paul's modus operandi. It worked out well for Bledsoe. And it will work out well for Thompson. If he signs the qualifying offer, he'll be an unrestricted free agent next summer when an unprecedented number of teams have max-level salary space. If the Cavs cave, he gets his max money and gets to stay with Cleveland. The only way it backfires is if TT suffers a catastrophic injury next season before he signs a long-term deal. It's time to re-visit the narrative that the Suns somehow botched the Bledsoe negotiations last summer. It wasn't the Suns. It was dealing with Rich Paul. This is what he does to get his clients paid.

I was going to say the same. If he can stay healthy, this is a smart decision, because he will REALLY be overpaid next summer. Hopefully not by us though. I doubt Ryan would want to deal with Rich Paul anyway.

I'm surprised no one has come up with this scenario, in light of what's going on with TT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=omlrrqu

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Tucker / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len

Or, I like this one even better!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ph8plkt

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len / Mozgov

Gives Cleveland:

Bledsoe / Williams / Dellavadova
Tucker / Shumpert
Bron / R. Jefferson / J. Jones
Love / Kieff / (J. Jones) / (Tucker)
Varejao / (Kieff)

They'd have a very versatile, but more importantly, win NOW team.

Kieff > TT
Bled = Irving
Tucker > Harris

That leaves having to replace Mozgov...shouldn't be that hard, especially considering, in a pinch, playing small ball, Tucker can play the 4, Kieff can play the 5.

Yeah, we lose a bit with Thompson vice Kieff, but gain Mozgov, and with Len able to play some PF, it appears, we should be in decent shape. I actually like that for both teams.

[Saberestar]

Bled = Irving...??
I think that every GM in the league would take Irving over Bledsoe...they are not on the same level.

[bwgood77]

Spoiler:

It's actually not that surprising. Thompson and Bledsoe are both represented by Rich Paul. This sort of scorched earth negotiating style seems to be Paul's modus operandi. It worked out well for Bledsoe. And it will work out well for Thompson. If he signs the qualifying offer, he'll be an unrestricted free agent next summer when an unprecedented number of teams have max-level salary space. If the Cavs cave, he gets his max money and gets to stay with Cleveland. The only way it backfires is if TT suffers a catastrophic injury next season before he signs a long-term deal. It's time to re-visit the narrative that the Suns somehow botched the Bledsoe negotiations last summer. It wasn't the Suns. It was dealing with Rich Paul. This is what he does to get his clients paid.

I was going to say the same. If he can stay healthy, this is a smart decision, because he will REALLY be overpaid next summer. Hopefully not by us though. I doubt Ryan would want to deal with Rich Paul anyway.

I'm surprised no one has come up with this scenario, in light of what's going on with TT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=omlrrqu

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Tucker / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len

Or, I like this one even better!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ph8plkt

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len / Mozgov

Gives Cleveland:

Bledsoe / Williams / Dellavadova
Tucker / Shumpert
Bron / R. Jefferson / J. Jones
Love / Kieff / (J. Jones) / (Tucker)
Varejao / (Kieff)

They'd have a very versatile, but more importantly, win NOW team.

Kieff > TT
Bled = Irving
Tucker > Harris

That leaves having to replace Mozgov...shouldn't be that hard, especially considering, in a pinch, playing small ball, Tucker can play the 4, Kieff can play the 5.

Yeah, we lose a bit with Thompson vice Kieff, but gain Mozgov, and with Len able to play some PF, it appears, we should be in decent shape. I actually like that for both teams.

First of all, Cleveland is not trading Irving. He is far better than Bledsoe. I used to think he was overrated, but the guy can take over a game and they simply won't trade him.

I think if we did get Thompson, which I think is highly doubtful since Rich Paul is the agent, then we would have to play him with PJ and Len and play Telly and Warren with Chandler....for spacing purposes.

But I'm not even sure you can trade for someone on the QO unless you are talking about a S&T, but then you are talking a max contract for him.

I say no.

[saintEscaton]

It's actually not that surprising. Thompson and Bledsoe are both represented by Rich Paul. This sort of scorched earth negotiating style seems to be Paul's modus operandi. It worked out well for Bledsoe. And it will work out well for Thompson. If he signs the qualifying offer, he'll be an unrestricted free agent next summer when an unprecedented number of teams have max-level salary space. If the Cavs cave, he gets his max money and gets to stay with Cleveland. The only way it backfires is if TT suffers a catastrophic injury next season before he signs a long-term deal. It's time to re-visit the narrative that the Suns somehow botched the Bledsoe negotiations last summer. It wasn't the Suns. It was dealing with Rich Paul. This is what he does to get his clients paid.

I was going to say the same. If he can stay healthy, this is a smart decision, because he will REALLY be overpaid next summer. Hopefully not by us though. I doubt Ryan would want to deal with Rich Paul anyway.

I'm surprised no one has come up with this scenario, in light of what's going on with TT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=omlrrqu

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Tucker / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len

Or, I like this one even better!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ph8plkt

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len / Mozgov

Gives Cleveland:

Bledsoe / Williams / Dellavadova
Tucker / Shumpert
Bron / R. Jefferson / J. Jones
Love / Kieff / (J. Jones) / (Tucker)
Varejao / (Kieff)

They'd have a very versatile, but more importantly, win NOW team.

Kieff > TT
Bled = Irving
Tucker > Harris

That leaves having to replace Mozgov...shouldn't be that hard, especially considering, in a pinch, playing small ball, Tucker can play the 4, Kieff can play the 5.

Yeah, we lose a bit with Thompson vice Kieff, but gain Mozgov, and with Len able to play some PF, it appears, we should be in decent shape. I actually like that for both teams.

GM Lebron's reaction.

[NavLDO]

I was going to say the same. If he can stay healthy, this is a smart decision, because he will REALLY be overpaid next summer. Hopefully not by us though. I doubt Ryan would want to deal with Rich Paul anyway.

I'm surprised no one has come up with this scenario, in light of what's going on with TT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=omlrrqu

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Tucker / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len

Or, I like this one even better!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ph8plkt

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len / Mozgov

Gives Cleveland:

Bledsoe / Williams / Dellavadova
Tucker / Shumpert
Bron / R. Jefferson / J. Jones
Love / Kieff / (J. Jones) / (Tucker)
Varejao / (Kieff)

They'd have a very versatile, but more importantly, win NOW team.

Kieff > TT
Bled = Irving
Tucker > Harris

That leaves having to replace Mozgov...shouldn't be that hard, especially considering, in a pinch, playing small ball, Tucker can play the 4, Kieff can play the 5.

Yeah, we lose a bit with Thompson vice Kieff, but gain Mozgov, and with Len able to play some PF, it appears, we should be in decent shape. I actually like that for both teams.

GM Lebron's reaction.

Naw...he get's his 'little buddy'!!! That's worth more than an overpaid TT!

But fine, no one likes my specific scenario--very few typically do --but there could be something there, so long as we don't over pay TT.

[RunDogGun]

Spoiler:

I was going to say the same. If he can stay healthy, this is a smart decision, because he will REALLY be overpaid next summer. Hopefully not by us though. I doubt Ryan would want to deal with Rich Paul anyway.

I'm surprised no one has come up with this scenario, in light of what's going on with TT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=omlrrqu

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Tucker / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len

Or, I like this one even better!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ph8plkt

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len / Mozgov

Gives Cleveland:

Bledsoe / Williams / Dellavadova
Tucker / Shumpert
Bron / R. Jefferson / J. Jones
Love / Kieff / (J. Jones) / (Tucker)
Varejao / (Kieff)

They'd have a very versatile, but more importantly, win NOW team.

Kieff > TT
Bled = Irving
Tucker > Harris

That leaves having to replace Mozgov...shouldn't be that hard, especially considering, in a pinch, playing small ball, Tucker can play the 4, Kieff can play the 5.

Yeah, we lose a bit with Thompson vice Kieff, but gain Mozgov, and with Len able to play some PF, it appears, we should be in decent shape. I actually like that for both teams.

First of all, Cleveland is not trading Irving. He is far better than Bledsoe. I used to think he was overrated, but the guy can take over a game and they simply won't trade him.

I think if we did get Thompson, which I think is highly doubtful since Rich Paul is the agent, then we would have to play him with PJ and Len and play Telly and Warren with Chandler....for spacing purposes.

But I'm not even sure you can trade for someone on the QO unless you are talking about a S&T, but then you are talking a max contract for him.

I say no.

i think a trade would need his permission once he signs the QO. But why would an agent want him to be traded? He would lose his bird rights, for now only the Cavs have that. Even if he gets traded to a contender, they would most likely be over the cap the following year, or unable to give him a big payday. That would leave only teams well under the cap to give him the money he wants.

I just don't think he has enough game to pull off a Monroe, but who knows?

[bwgood77]

Spoiler:

I'm surprised no one has come up with this scenario, in light of what's going on with TT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=omlrrqu

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Tucker / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len

Or, I like this one even better!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ph8plkt

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len / Mozgov

Gives Cleveland:

Bledsoe / Williams / Dellavadova
Tucker / Shumpert
Bron / R. Jefferson / J. Jones
Love / Kieff / (J. Jones) / (Tucker)
Varejao / (Kieff)

They'd have a very versatile, but more importantly, win NOW team.

Kieff > TT
Bled = Irving
Tucker > Harris

That leaves having to replace Mozgov...shouldn't be that hard, especially considering, in a pinch, playing small ball, Tucker can play the 4, Kieff can play the 5.

Yeah, we lose a bit with Thompson vice Kieff, but gain Mozgov, and with Len able to play some PF, it appears, we should be in decent shape. I actually like that for both teams.

First of all, Cleveland is not trading Irving. He is far better than Bledsoe. I used to think he was overrated, but the guy can take over a game and they simply won't trade him.

I think if we did get Thompson, which I think is highly doubtful since Rich Paul is the agent, then we would have to play him with PJ and Len and play Telly and Warren with Chandler....for spacing purposes.

But I'm not even sure you can trade for someone on the QO unless you are talking about a S&T, but then you are talking a max contract for him.

I say no.

i think a trade would need his permission once he signs the QO. But why would an agent want him to be traded? He would lose his bird rights, for now only the Cavs have that. Even if he gets traded to a contender, they would most likely be over the cap the following year, or unable to give him a big payday. That would leave only teams well under the cap to give him the money he wants.

I just don't think he has enough game to pull off a Monroe, but who knows?

I think he will get overpaid next summer but I don't think it should or will be us. The only circumstance I see it happening is if we can't get any other PF and Len and Warren develop great 3 pt range. That's a lot to hope for. I hope they develop that range, but I'd still probably rather have a PF that can also hit from deep if need be.

[RunDogGun]

Spoiler:

First of all, Cleveland is not trading Irving. He is far better than Bledsoe. I used to think he was overrated, but the guy can take over a game and they simply won't trade him.

I think if we did get Thompson, which I think is highly doubtful since Rich Paul is the agent, then we would have to play him with PJ and Len and play Telly and Warren with Chandler....for spacing purposes.

But I'm not even sure you can trade for someone on the QO unless you are talking about a S&T, but then you are talking a max contract for him.

I say no.

i think a trade would need his permission once he signs the QO. But why would an agent want him to be traded? He would lose his bird rights, for now only the Cavs have that. Even if he gets traded to a contender, they would most likely be over the cap the following year, or unable to give him a big payday. That would leave only teams well under the cap to give him the money he wants.

I just don't think he has enough game to pull off a Monroe, but who knows?

I think he will get overpaid next summer but I don't think it should or will be us. The only circumstance I see it happening is if we can't get any other PF and Len and Warren develop great 3 pt range. That's a lot to hope for. I hope they develop that range, but I'd still probably rather have a PF that can also hit from deep if need be.

Maybe, but I just don't think he has enough game to get the money he wants.

But I forgot his agent is Paul, so maybe he will want a trade. I just think it's a dumb move to say it will be his final season with a team, at this point.

[Moochthemonkey]

Every other team's fans firmly believe they could/should get a solid player for scrubs (see Lakers' fans). However, the Suns' so called "fans" seem to be the only ones insisting on throwing away a very solid starter for scrubs/nothing. If people thinking like that were running the FO, in one year the Suns wouldn't be able to beat a highschool team.

There is a lot to like about your post. IIRC you were the only poster on this forum back in 2013 who predicted the Suns would have decent season when just about everyone else left them for dead. I want to come to this forum and read logical yet optimistic comments about the team. As a fan, homerism and overrating/being loyal to players is welcomed to a certain degree (not saying you are one, just generalizing here). If I read anymore hateful, snarky comments during the tail end of last season I would have blown a fuse! I'm sure the organization and players would appreciate such level of support too.

On the contrary, if the fanbase was a bunch of "yes-men" then would the FO have as much incentive to spend and improve the team? Criticism keeps the organization in check. It drives players to prove people wrong. So my somewhat tangential point is any sports team needs to have a balance of homers, haters, and people in between.

And please spare me the bulls**t "I want him gone because he is a criminal". Many of the stupid and completely talantless people, who are being called "rappers" in the USA have served real jail time and too many people are kissing their a***s. If someone needs a guide on how not to be a basketball fan, said person only needs to scroll through a Suns' forum.

What does the work they do have to do with anything? If you make good music or play good basketball then you make good music and play good basketball, criminal or not.

But as for the "I want him gone because he is a criminal"...well I'm waiting for more evidence to be released/plea bargain/sentence until I make such judgment. Only God can judge people, that and the presiding judge in his case, and a jury of assigned peers, which no one on this forum are on. If he is guilty, then not only do I want him gone, but I want him to be suspended from the NBA, locked up and/or serve the necessary punishment. I think most sane people would wish for the appropriate justice to be served too.

[Moochthemonkey]

I was going to say the same. If he can stay healthy, this is a smart decision, because he will REALLY be overpaid next summer. Hopefully not by us though. I doubt Ryan would want to deal with Rich Paul anyway.

I'm surprised no one has come up with this scenario, in light of what's going on with TT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=omlrrqu

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Tucker / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len

Or, I like this one even better!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ph8plkt

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len / Mozgov

Gives Cleveland:

Bledsoe / Williams / Dellavadova
Tucker / Shumpert
Bron / R. Jefferson / J. Jones
Love / Kieff / (J. Jones) / (Tucker)
Varejao / (Kieff)

They'd have a very versatile, but more importantly, win NOW team.

Kieff > TT
Bled = Irving
Tucker > Harris

That leaves having to replace Mozgov...shouldn't be that hard, especially considering, in a pinch, playing small ball, Tucker can play the 4, Kieff can play the 5.

Yeah, we lose a bit with Thompson vice Kieff, but gain Mozgov, and with Len able to play some PF, it appears, we should be in decent shape. I actually like that for both teams.

GM Lebron's reaction.

Doesn't mean anything. Just a leaked image of Lebron playing a cameo role in the sequel to Jurassic World.

[sunstrooper]

What does the work they do have to do with anything? If you make good music or play good basketball then you make good music and play good basketball, criminal or not.

But as for the "I want him gone because he is a criminal"...well I'm waiting for more evidence to be released/plea bargain/sentence until I make such judgment. Only God can judge people, that and the presiding judge in his case, and a jury of assigned peers, which no one on this forum are on. If he is guilty, then not only do I want him gone, but I want him to be suspended from the NBA, locked up and/or serve the necessary punishment. I think most sane people would wish for the appropriate justice to be served too.

My point is that he is being paid to play basketball and what he does in his spare time is non of my business (and i think it is noone's business). In short - as long as he didn't murder, rape or rob anyone, or sold drugs (and he didn't do any of that), i don't care much that he got in a fight. Many people get in a fight, being drunk or loosing their nerves about something. Not a good thing, but it happens, sometimes without intention. As i understand it, what you are telling me is basically that if you (for example) get drunk on a Sat evening and get in a fight with a guy, who (for example) tries to hit on your gf/wife, you should be fired from your work, renounced by your gf/wife and kids (if any), thrown out of your house etc., and you'll be ok with that. Maybe it is a cultural difference, but i don't see things the same as you.
About me bashing other fans - i stand by my opinion. Again, maybe it's a cultural thing, but in my eyes noone who wants half of the team traded every other week (and again the next week), or who thinks the team is trash because the Suns don't have a whining bitch-clown on the roster (known as "superstars" by some of you), can be called a fan of this team. You say criticism is needed and i can't agree more. However, the criticism on this board is exclusively focused on "why don't they just trade x for y", "z needs to be waived" and "the coach is bad - fire him". For most of the people here blowing away the roster/coaching staff is the ultimate and the only answer to any problem. In my view, that cannot be a real fan's stance towards his/her favorite team.
I, for example, would like to criticise the team for not moving without the ball on offense, for relying exclusively on iso plays, for constantly missing defensive rotations, for getting themselves crowding the paint after 2 screens and leaving at least 2 shooters open on the perimeter. Things, that if corrected (imo) would lead to improvement game-wise and wins-wise.

[TASTIC]

I don't want anything to do with Tristan Thompson or Rich Paul.

We got what we wanted from Paul with Bledsoe, ZERO chance I go close to a max deal for Thompson.

I've typed til my fingers bled on the General board about how incredibly overrated TT is, won't do it here as well!

I wonder if a 3-way is possible that lands us Terrence Jones? Maybe involve Indy in there as they'd love Kieff at the 4 I imagine.

[JohnWall2]

Forget TT. Lets just trade Markieff and Bledsoe for Kyrie + filler. Add first rounders if we have to. Be well worth it.

[Frank Lee]

Come on trooper.... its not just a fight ... it was an ambush by 3-5 on one... then a basket of lies followed ... 'We don't know that guy"
Call it the final straw and now the assclown wants no part of this organization. Well news flash, he isn't wanted here, if you believe the outline presented by McDuh as to the ideal suns player.

Bury the dead and move on. It wont be pretty, but it will be effective. McDuh has made his mistakes, and holding onto this problem child would be another one.

I think the hold up is Sarver. He is hell bent on the playoffs and wont sign off on anything that takes us away from that. Reality says we aren't that good anyway, Keif or no Keif. Now its up to McDuh to once again fire up the damage control department. He has done so so in that area....and looks like will be getting some more experience

[jcsunsfan]

maybe Kieff is just going through the stages of grief at being separated from his brother.

Denial: initial silent period.
Anger: Twitter wars
Bargaining: Trying to get his agent to force the Suns to trade him. Brothers trying to figure out how they can manipulate their way to the same team again.
Depression: maybe entering this stage.
Acceptance: he can get here unless he holds long term bitterness against the team.

People grieve when lifelong dreams are shattered. It may well be that playing their careers together was a naive dream, but one the Suns gave them hope could come true.

The piling on by the media, especially Gambo, doesn't help. Hopefully mgmt will be patient and only make a deal that is a good one.

[Frank Lee]

gambo took offense to the fan base comments. Bravo.... and please... don't waste the sympathy card on these unjustified prima-donnas.

Get a deal done and move on. Its not the end of the world to lose Keif. Heck, we traded theGORTAT for a mid round pick (that turned into nothing) and many were OK with that.

[sunstrooper]

As far as my opinion goes about players demanding trades and who they wanna play with - when you are paid millions to play a game, you stfu and do what you are told by coaching staff and FO and wear a huge smile on top of that. Now, I'm an economic analyst and know about value added and the rest of it, so no point in explaining that to me. Anyway, I believe these guys don't have the moral right to act like that in the face of all the hard working people paying their insane (and undeserved imo salaries) with hard earned money. Moreover, Kieff really needs to think about how the Suns as an organisation took the extra step and got Marcus without really needing him and how if another team had drafted Kieff the two would only meet each other when their respective teams play.
In short, I would keep Kieff in any case - no matter what he says or wants, step on his neck and make him honor his 8 million dollars contract. Too bad contracts in the NBA are so much in players' favor.