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Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall?

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Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#1 » by LittleOzzy » Wed Aug 19, 2015 4:17 pm

The season is not even over, and already the musical chairs are in motion. The Tigers and Red Sox hired new general managers. The Brewers and Angels are looking for new ones. The Phillies and Mariners could make changes, and surely one or two surprise openings will emerge.

Amid this volatile climate, the contract of Blue Jays general manager Alex Anthopoulos expires at the end of October, according to major-league sources.

If the Jays are not careful, they could lose an executive who almost singlehandedly has revived baseball --€“ and baseball business --€“ in Toronto.

Rival owners surely notice the spikes in the Jays' TV ratings and attendance since Anthopoulos' moves at the nonwaiver deadline. The owners of the Jays, Rogers Communications, surely notice as well, but for almost a year now, Rogers' plan has not exactly been clear.

It is not known whether the Jays are talking to Anthopoulos about an extension. It is known that they want a club president to replace the outgoing Paul Beeston. They talked to the Orioles' Dan Duquette and White Sox's Ken Williams about that job last offseason, and according to sources had at least some level of conversation about or with Dave Dombrowski, whom the Red Sox hired as president of baseball operations on Tuesday night.

Could Anthopoulos, a native Canadian, have met the same fate as the Red Sox's Ben Cherington, who stepped down rather than remain GM under Dombrowski? In theory, the answer is yes. The timing, though, was not right. The Jays did not want to take such a drastic step, sources say, and Dombrowski previously had worked for Red Sox owner John Henry with the Marlins, accelerating their discussions.

Still, the questions remain: What will happen to Anthopoulos? And could Anthopoulos opt to become a free agent rather than continue working for an ownership that has little knowledge of baseball and seemingly little direction?

The Jays would be foolish to find out.

Before last offseason, Anthopoulos had not exactly distinguished himself as GM; the Jays had averaged 79 wins in his first five seasons. But in November, Anthopoulous signed free-agent catcher Russell Martin and traded for third baseman Josh Donaldson. Then, at the deadline, he traded for shortstop Troy Tulowitzki and left-hander David Price. And now, look at this team.


The difference in the Jays' television ratings is perhaps more astonishing --€“ and probably more meaningful to Rogers, a media company that relies on cable and wireless subscriptions for the bulk of its profits.

According to Rogers, 3.14 million people were tuned in to Rogers Sportsnet last Friday night when Tulowitzki engaged in his classic game-ending battle with Yankees closer Andrew Miller. That's almost nine percent of the population of Canada, which is approximately 35 million.

The Jays-Yankees game that night averaged 2.03 million viewers, making it the most-watched program in Sportsnet history, surpassing even Maple Leafs hockey games. Since the deadline, Jays broadcasts are averaging 1.27 million viewers, raising the season average to a record level for the club.


http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/toronto-blue-jays-alex-anthopoulos-gm-dave-david-price-troy-tulowitzki-josh-donaldson-081915
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#2 » by North_of_Border » Wed Aug 19, 2015 4:50 pm

Jays have to get AA back. All this talk of Rogers not knowing the baseball part, but know they see what he has done on the business part. They have to get this guy locked up.

I wouldnt be surprosed if the Brewers or Mariners offered him the President + GM role.... Then the Jays are in trouble.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#3 » by Michael Bradley » Wed Aug 19, 2015 5:10 pm

AA will get another GM job if the Jays are not interested, so for the first time since Gillick, a GM that the Jays have employed will actually have leverage. Rogers might be more open to bringing AA back if the team makes and succeeds in the playoffs, but at that point, AA's value will also increase to other teams. It will be interesting to see how it shakes down.

Since Ed Rogers will presumably be directly involved, I'm preparing myself for the worst case situation.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#4 » by 0 - 100 » Wed Aug 19, 2015 5:16 pm

I posted this earlier...AA should continue to run baseball ops for the jays. Rogers just needs a new business man to oversee Skydome and all other business ventures.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#5 » by LLJ » Wed Aug 19, 2015 5:25 pm

Ironically though, I think AA may have already secured a very good chance at an extension even if he doesn't make the playoffs. Rogers doesn't *really* care about winning, they care about money. And so far, that has already been accomplished this season. AA likes making splashy moves, which is a ticket seller in this city.

That said, if AA bolts, I could see him succeeding quite well on a team with better ownership. He thinks big, and that always plays well in sports in the right environment with the right resources.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#6 » by EastBayBoy » Wed Aug 19, 2015 5:52 pm

If last offseason is any indication ( going after Duquette / Williams) Ed Rogers will royaly **** this up and this offseason will be a total s*** show if he has his way.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#7 » by Hoopstarr » Wed Aug 19, 2015 6:26 pm

It would obviously suck to lose AA, but Dan Evans is a great GM in waiting right here in the organization.

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=23978
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#8 » by Raps in 4 » Wed Aug 19, 2015 6:45 pm

AA has been the best Toronto sports GM of the past 20 years. I've been a fan of his long before the recent hoopla. He's always been a terrific scout, restocking our farm system seemingly overnight after the Ricciardi era. He's also not afraid to go all in (something you can only do with a great farm system). The guy is an elite baseball GM by any standard.

He's going to be extremely hard to replace if we do decide to let him go. I know I'll stop following the team if we **** this up. There is nothing more frustrating than following a team run by an imbecile (especially after you've grown accustomed to someone competent running things).
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#9 » by Michael Bradley » Wed Aug 19, 2015 6:54 pm

If the Jays hire someone internally, then my money is on either LaCava (perennial GM candidate) or Tinnish (Canadian). Depends on who they hire as the team president, though. A veteran will likely have his own guys in mind.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#10 » by Rhettmatic » Wed Aug 19, 2015 7:47 pm

Shi Davidi is advocating promoting AA to president:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/anthopoulos-a-potential-fit-as-blue-jays-next-president/

At this point it’s reasonably safe to assume Anthopoulos, whose contract expires Oct. 31, will be offered some sort of extension, at minimum to continue on as GM. He’s earned it, and in some ways, he may be the club’s most important free agent, one sure to be seriously considered for the general manager vacancies in Milwaukee, Anaheim and surely others.

But there are multiple reasons having him assume a president of baseball operations role might be the right long-term play, especially if the ownership at Rogers Communications Inc., reaches the conclusion that the baseball side of the team is in good shape.

If they deem it is, why set up the potential for dysfunction by adding a layer above Anthopoulos that may or may not share his philosophies? Does this kitchen need more cooks?


Intriguing is that at last week’s owners meetings in Chicago, Anthopoulos travelled alone to represent the Blue Jays. Beeston sent him in his place, and whether there’s something to be read into that isn’t clear, but it marks a noteworthy departure from the norm.

At minimum, it represents some sort of emergence for Anthopoulos, who’s generally been kept away from higher level type functions by Beeston, who’s handled all the club’s planning sessions and strategy work with ownership. That’s meant little exposure at those levels for Anthopoulos, who may be viewed by some as an extension of Beeston.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#11 » by tecumseh18 » Wed Aug 19, 2015 8:36 pm

EastBayBoy wrote:If last offseason is any indication ( going after Duquette / Williams) Ed Rogers will royaly **** this up and this offseason will be a total s*** show if he has his way.


Yeah, I see AA jumping ship, and the Jays giving Stroman to the O's in exchange for Duquette.

Is there a worse scenario? If so, I would assume that instead.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#12 » by Schad » Wed Aug 19, 2015 8:39 pm

There would be something deeply Blue Jays about the organization pushing AA to go for it at all costs, and then having him use that as a springboard to get a GM position somewhere a little less prone to meddling.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#13 » by Yosemite Dan » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:00 pm

When did AA all of a sudden become one of the best GM's in the league. Because he gave up some prize prospects for a rental pitcher and a player with health issues on a long and expensive contract? He went for it and kudos to him for having the balls to do it but that hardly makes him an elite GM. If the Jays win it or at least go far into the playoffs then he deserve any accolades he gets just for striking when the iron was hot but this team could just as likely lose in the WC game or miss the playoffs entirely. He did what most GM's could do but wouldn't because they know the long term ramifications of gambling like that.

Then what are we left with if the Jays crap out this year. The pitching staff will be a shambles because Price is as good as gone as is Buerhle and while Martin is playing somewhat well this year, paying him 60 million over 3 years in his mid 30's will more than likely bite them in the butt along with the Tulo deal.

While "going for it" this year might make him look genious as of this moment, it could go south very quickly and then it will be back to people saying he's incompetant and never should have thrown his eggs all in one basket. Let's see how the Jays finish this year before we say what a great job he's doing because guys like Tulo aren't exactly on fire right now and we gave up a pitcher for him who has ace material. A few weeks in August does not make a great GM nor a bad one. AA has made some great moves like Donaldson but he has also had a few bad ones and you are what your record says you are and his record so far as GM hasn't said much.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#14 » by ldnk » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:36 pm

I agree that I think AA is somewhat of a mixed bag. He has done some really nice things:
- Vernon Wells trade
- Donaldson trade

He has some meh trades with big names
- Reyes/Johnson/Buehrle for Hech/Marisnick/Alvarez/Nicolino/Escobar
- Tulowitzski trade (pending future performances)
- Price (pending future performance)

He has a trade that I still don't like
- Dickey for Synderman/D'Arnaud

I don't think AA is this miracle worker of untold worth. The Jays aren't exactly at the bottom of the league in terms of spending (although based on market we should be near the top). He's built mostly inconsistent rosters that aren't good enough to win but not bad enough to really tank out. This is the first year where the team might actually have it in them to win and that is exciting.

I don't think the Jays fall apart if the lose AA. I think it would be the wrong move to go in another direction but I don't think it's the end of the world. I also find that age is somewhat overrated when it comes to assessing management anymore because so much technology is involved in the game that I think it has become more of a younger man's game anyway.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#15 » by Schad » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:38 pm

Yosemite Dan wrote:When did AA all of a sudden become one of the best GM's in the league. Because he gave up some prize prospects for a rental pitcher and a player with health issues on a long and expensive contract? He went for it and kudos to him for having the balls to do it but that hardly makes him an elite GM. If the Jays win it or at least go far into the playoffs then he deserve any accolades he gets just for striking when the iron was hot but this team could just as likely lose in the WC game or miss the playoffs entirely. He did what most GM's could do but wouldn't because they know the long term ramifications of gambling like that.

Then what are we left with if the Jays crap out this year. The pitching staff will be a shambles because Price is as good as gone as is Buerhle and while Martin is playing somewhat well this year, paying him 60 million over 3 years in his mid 30's will more than likely bite them in the butt along with the Tulo deal.

While "going for it" this year might make him look genious as of this moment, it could go south very quickly and then it will be back to people saying he's incompetant and never should have thrown his eggs all in one basket. Let's see how the Jays finish this year before we say what a great job he's doing because guys like Tulo aren't exactly on fire right now and we gave up a pitcher for him who has ace material. A few weeks in August does not make a great GM nor a bad one. AA has made some great moves like Donaldson but he has also had a few bad ones and you are what your record says you are and his record so far as GM hasn't said much.


AA did his best work prior to this season, and has long been well-regarded around the league. I disagree with his all-in push as well, but that was only possible because of the excellent work he did in building up our asset base. It's why when you've played the "AA will never be a GM of another team and is here just because he's cheap and Canadian" card, people pushed back...he was always in demand, but now that demand may simply be increasing from 'will, in time, get a position if fired' to 'will have teams lining up to outbid us'.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#16 » by Wo1verine » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:58 pm

Give me a president who wants to spend BIG dollars and get rid of the 5 year max contract policy!

Tim Leiweke would be the best option but obviously not realistic unfornately.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#17 » by Schad » Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:28 am

Wo1verine wrote:Give me a president who wants to spend BIG dollars and get rid of the 5 year max contract policy!

Tim Leiweke would be the best option but obviously not realistic unfornately.


The president doesn't make that call. They can push for more spending, but the budget is decided further up the food chain.

Additionally, we have a fun dynamic where our chairman (Ed Rogers) is all but at war with the corporate President & CEO of our parent company. Ed does the hiring, but he likely doesn't get final say on the budget. Hence the fear, shared by some of us, that corporate might give Ed and a spend-big president of his choosing just enough rope to allow them to pull the noose shut at a later point.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#18 » by Michael Bradley » Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:10 am

ldnk wrote:I agree that I think AA is somewhat of a mixed bag. He has done some really nice things:
- Vernon Wells trade
- Donaldson trade

He has some meh trades with big names
- Reyes/Johnson/Buehrle for Hech/Marisnick/Alvarez/Nicolino/Escobar
- Tulowitzski trade (pending future performances)
- Price (pending future performance)

He has a trade that I still don't like
- Dickey for Synderman/D'Arnaud

I don't think AA is this miracle worker of untold worth. The Jays aren't exactly at the bottom of the league in terms of spending (although based on market we should be near the top). He's built mostly inconsistent rosters that aren't good enough to win but not bad enough to really tank out. This is the first year where the team might actually have it in them to win and that is exciting.

I don't think the Jays fall apart if the lose AA. I think it would be the wrong move to go in another direction but I don't think it's the end of the world. I also find that age is somewhat overrated when it comes to assessing management anymore because so much technology is involved in the game that I think it has become more of a younger man's game anyway.


I believe by AA's own admission he doesn't pay much attention to the draft and leaves it up to the scouting team (I thought I read that somewhere). That might be why he has no issues using the prospects as capital rather than trying to build around them. If the Jays were to keep the same scouting team and simply promote someone like LaCava, then I'm not sure there would be a substantial difference. Might be better, might be worse, but the scouting/drafting would remain fairly consistent in that scenario. AA also did a complete 180 in terms of player evaluation in the off-season, focusing on framing (Martin), WAR (Donaldson), and defense (Saunders) for seemingly the first time in his tenure. He's either learned his lesson or there are smart minds already in the Jays organization that helped him out. I wouldn't be against internal promotion, to be honest.

If they go outside the organization and nuke the scouting team ala JP Ricciardi in 2002, then the fear of the unknown will definitely be a factor.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#19 » by Yosemite Dan » Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:27 am

Schad wrote:
Yosemite Dan wrote:When did AA all of a sudden become one of the best GM's in the league. Because he gave up some prize prospects for a rental pitcher and a player with health issues on a long and expensive contract? He went for it and kudos to him for having the balls to do it but that hardly makes him an elite GM. If the Jays win it or at least go far into the playoffs then he deserve any accolades he gets just for striking when the iron was hot but this team could just as likely lose in the WC game or miss the playoffs entirely. He did what most GM's could do but wouldn't because they know the long term ramifications of gambling like that.

Then what are we left with if the Jays crap out this year. The pitching staff will be a shambles because Price is as good as gone as is Buerhle and while Martin is playing somewhat well this year, paying him 60 million over 3 years in his mid 30's will more than likely bite them in the butt along with the Tulo deal.

While "going for it" this year might make him look genious as of this moment, it could go south very quickly and then it will be back to people saying he's incompetant and never should have thrown his eggs all in one basket. Let's see how the Jays finish this year before we say what a great job he's doing because guys like Tulo aren't exactly on fire right now and we gave up a pitcher for him who has ace material. A few weeks in August does not make a great GM nor a bad one. AA has made some great moves like Donaldson but he has also had a few bad ones and you are what your record says you are and his record so far as GM hasn't said much.


AA did his best work prior to this season, and has long been well-regarded around the league. I disagree with his all-in push as well, but that was only possible because of the excellent work he did in building up our asset base. It's why when you've played the "AA will never be a GM of another team and is here just because he's cheap and Canadian" card, people pushed back...he was always in demand, but now that demand may simply be increasing from 'will, in time, get a position if fired' to 'will have teams lining up to outbid us'.


Where do you find evidence that he is "in demand" by other teams. You would think if he was, then the Jays would have signed him to an extension before the season for fear of losing him. Bottom line is he has had a less than steller record as GM without really being close to getting into the playoffs while having a top 10 payroll for the majority of his tenure. Sure he has built a nice minor league system but so have alot of other GM's with better W-L records over the last half decade. We' are not the only team with good prospects.

If the Jays do a September swoon and miss the playoffs, I don't see how any other team would be lining up for his services. All they would see is a GM who managed a team for 5 years and couldn't get them into the playoffs despite making big gambles in 2 of those years.

It's very similar to the Raptors with Colangelo. Many people on this board were against firing him because it was the "who can we get that's gonna be better" despite BC having close to no success as GM and many people thought he would be gobbled up by another team within weeks if we canned him. We managed to do better with Ujiri (at least for now). If we lose AA i think we'll survive because with virtually no success with him, how could it get any worse?

All i see is a GM who took chances last month because he was worried about his job, hardly sounds like a guy who would be confident about other GM opportunities. I find it weird that people are calling him this great GM now when he wouldn't have thrown all his eggs in one basket like this if he had 3 years left on his contract.
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Re: Will Blue Jays' Anthopoulos be the next GM domino to fall? 

Post#20 » by EastBayBoy » Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:48 am

Yosemite Dan wrote:
Schad wrote:
Yosemite Dan wrote:When did AA all of a sudden become one of the best GM's in the league. Because he gave up some prize prospects for a rental pitcher and a player with health issues on a long and expensive contract? He went for it and kudos to him for having the balls to do it but that hardly makes him an elite GM. If the Jays win it or at least go far into the playoffs then he deserve any accolades he gets just for striking when the iron was hot but this team could just as likely lose in the WC game or miss the playoffs entirely. He did what most GM's could do but wouldn't because they know the long term ramifications of gambling like that.

Then what are we left with if the Jays crap out this year. The pitching staff will be a shambles because Price is as good as gone as is Buerhle and while Martin is playing somewhat well this year, paying him 60 million over 3 years in his mid 30's will more than likely bite them in the butt along with the Tulo deal.

While "going for it" this year might make him look genious as of this moment, it could go south very quickly and then it will be back to people saying he's incompetant and never should have thrown his eggs all in one basket. Let's see how the Jays finish this year before we say what a great job he's doing because guys like Tulo aren't exactly on fire right now and we gave up a pitcher for him who has ace material. A few weeks in August does not make a great GM nor a bad one. AA has made some great moves like Donaldson but he has also had a few bad ones and you are what your record says you are and his record so far as GM hasn't said much.


AA did his best work prior to this season, and has long been well-regarded around the league. I disagree with his all-in push as well, but that was only possible because of the excellent work he did in building up our asset base. It's why when you've played the "AA will never be a GM of another team and is here just because he's cheap and Canadian" card, people pushed back...he was always in demand, but now that demand may simply be increasing from 'will, in time, get a position if fired' to 'will have teams lining up to outbid us'.


Where do you find evidence that he is "in demand" by other teams. You would think if he was, then the Jays would have signed him to an extension before the season for fear of losing him. Bottom line is he has had a less than steller record as GM without really being close to getting into the playoffs while having a top 10 payroll for the majority of his tenure. Sure he has built a nice minor league system but so have alot of other GM's with better W-L records over the last half decade. We' are not the only team with good prospects.

If the Jays do a September swoon and miss the playoffs, I don't see how any other team would be lining up for his services. All they would see is a GM who managed a team for 5 years and couldn't get them into the playoffs despite making big gambles in 2 of those years.

It's very similar to the Raptors with Colangelo. Many people on this board were against firing him because it was the "who can we get that's gonna be better" despite BC having close to no success as GM and many people thought he would be gobbled up by another team within weeks if we canned him. We managed to do better with Ujiri (at least for now). If we lose AA i think we'll survive because with virtually no success with him, how could it get any worse?

All i see is a GM who took chances last month because he was worried about his job, hardly sounds like a guy who would be confident about other GM opportunities. I find it weird that people are calling him this great GM now when he wouldn't have thrown all his eggs in one basket like this if he had 3 years left on his contract.


comparing BC to AA has zero relevance. Colangelo was/is total garbage. AA is not. Colangelo's only big deal was bringing in Hedo on an huge contract. Other than that he gave up huge contracts to bad players (Kapono, Fred Jones etc.) other than that he traded for role players. He would add draft picks to every trade for no reason. AA brought in stars to help this team actually compete for a title ( Tulo, JD, Price) signed superstar players to team friendly contracts (EE and Bautista). People would compare AA trading prospects to AA trading draft picks, but you can't, BC never stocked young talenet. AA, 2 years after trading the farm away in the Marlins trade, restocked it to be a top 10farm system. Therefore, AA is actually a good GM where Colangelo was not. I don't recall people advocating to keep BC after the first initial honeymoon phase where the raps got knocked out in the first round in the first couple years. If i remember correctly, from all of his moves people were aware he was alright with mediocrity with all the moves he made. Its quite evident AA is the opposite, and is looking to be a title contender, which could be seen with all the trades hes made over the years.

In regards to your point " if he was in demand, the Jays should have signed him" that is kind of difficult if your owner, Ed Rogers is meddling in baseball / operations an area he has zero knowledge about.

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